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[Champion] Nasus

Forum Index > LoL Strategy
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Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-09 14:08:57
July 20 2011 18:38 GMT
#1
[image loading]

Nasus, The Curator of the Sands.
http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Nasus_the_Curator_of_the_Sands

+ Show Spoiler [Patch Notes] +

v1.0.0.123 August 2011 Patch
# Attack range increased to 125 from 110
# Soul Eater lifesteal increased at earlier levels to 14/17/20% from 10/15/20%
# Wither

* Cooldown reduced to 15/14/13/12/11 seconds from 15 seconds at all ranks
* Mana cost reduced to 80 from 100
* Wither will now reach its max slow even if its duration is reduced (ie: by tenacity)

# Spirit Fire

* No longer has a 0.5 second delay before taking effect
* Now deals half of its damage initially and the other half over the duration -- initial 55/95/135/175/215 (+0.6 ability power) Magic Damage and 11/19/27/35/43 (+0.12 ability power) Magic Damage each second for the next 5 seconds




Introduction

Nasus is a strong tank who excels against auto attacker and melee champions. He is somewhat weak against poke or ranged nukes since he lacks real burst and hard cc or a gap closer.

+ Show Spoiler [Skills] +

Read about them in the wiki, this just gives some explanation on how you use them.

[image loading]
Passive: Soul Eater; 14/17/20% Lifesteal.
Makes his laning phase really solid. You leech off your Q as well, so you get some serious lifesteal when you start to stack Q. Synergy with high resists so favour those. (especially in lane combined with hp pots)

[image loading]
Q: Siphoning Strike:
Your bread and butter spell. Focus on stacking this up as much as possible. CDR becomes your best friend for both stacking it and spamming it later.

[image loading]
W: Wither:
Your main utility. Use it wisely. Aside from obvious situations like escaping ganks or chasing, you sometimes have to choose between using it on someone who is diving or using it to mitigate an AD carries damage.

[image loading]
E: Spirit fire.
Pretty high mana cost so avoid spamming this spell. The armour reduction is great for your Q's, and helps a lot if you have other physical dealers attacking the same target.

[image loading]
R: Fury of the Sands.
Gives a plethora of benefits. AoE %hp magic damage, range increase, health boost, stacking AD boost.
Health boost: Combined with your lifesteal, means resistances become far and away the best stat to stack.
Stacking AD boost: Means if you use this at the right time you are hitting like a truck with no items towards the end of 15 seconds. However its a trap to use it too early when a fight isnt guaranteed.



Skill order:
QWQE
R>Q>W>E>
You have the option of going E>W when you think you will be in situations with static 1v1. Jarvan with or against your team might be a good reason to max it since you will get the damage and armour reduction for the full duration when he casts his ultimate. If they have someone who is going to dive your carry placing spirit fire on them helps the both of you DPS him.
In lane phase this is also more useful than W sometimes against champions like rumble or other non attack speed reliant. (if you jungle is likely to gank W might still be better)

Summoner Skills:
[image loading]
[image loading]


[image loading] is viable also, ghost works well on nasus because you have no burst spell to abuse to flash, and you are generally tanky enough that ghost is as good as flash for getting away.
Teleport can be replaced with
[image loading] or [image loading] however TP side steps some of your main counters, like a pre-6 gank into push+tower dive, harassing you down early under your tower, or outroaming you. You usually just base buy the relevant resists+hp pots+green or pink ward(s) and tp straight back to lane. I tend to save tping around the map for later on when im more powerful and the loss in levels from losing farm is less noticeable. (1/3 of a level at 13 is nothing but 1 level at 6 is huge)

Masteries:
http://www.mobafire.com/league-of-legends/mastery-tree-planner#&tree1=1-0-3-0-4-0-0-0-1-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0&tree2=0-3-4-0-3-3-0-0-0-1-0-0-0-3-0-3-0-0-1&tree3=0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0&v=2
This is an EXAMPLE mastery build. You should adjust it based on the situation.
-Prioritise armour vs AD lanes, magic resist vs Magic damage lanes. (obvious)
-Take block mastery against ranged auto attackers, or generally champs that have to auto a lot (aatrox trynd etc)
-Regen against anyone who will harass you hard.
-Take the CC masteries based on amount and type of enemy CC.
-If you have a difficult lane you can take points out of the %resist mastery and put them into the block/regen etc and you are say against riven you can remove your magic resist and put it into -stun cc.
-Taking points out of offensive tree for more defensive sometimes might be a good idea also.



Runes:
Quints: Armour/MR whatever relevant to lane. (HP regen vs super hard auto attackers, AD if it's not that hard a lane, especially if you expect to have trouble last hitting under tower)
Marks: Arp/AD (Arp is better, but AD is needed for last hitting under tower effectively early on especially)
Seals: Flat armour.
Glyphs: Flat magic resist, or mr/lvl. CDR would be an option but there are too many easy ways to get it right now.

My personal recommendation for people who don't have a lot of pages is to have an 2 general pages for all top laners.
Armour seals, MR/lvl glyphs, AD reds, AD quints
Armour seals, flat MR glyphs, AD reds, MR/HP regen quints (magic damage guys tend to harass more)
If you play more agressive top laners the loss isn't that great but having the wrong runes on a passive tank laner sucks more.

Build:

Starting items:
[image loading] + 1x[image loading]
Dorans+1 pot is pretty safe and standard here. Regen and auto attack block makes it usually the best against any ranged champs, (worse than cloth+5 pots but you might not want to buy cloth vs magic guys for example and its best to just play passive early than burning the 4 extra pots), and against melee champs usually you won't have enough of a problem to need to waste money on a different build.
It's weakness is having no wards, however usually you intend to play passive. If you want to push early to help your jungle invade or something start rejuv bead or just pots+wards only.

[image loading] 5x[image loading] +1x [image loading] +1x[image loading]

[image loading] + 5x [image loading]

[image loading] +2x [image loading]

Rejuv is okay if you really want the ward, playing passive without a ward is risky but cloth and nullmagic are super ideal. Cloth+a ward is doable vs laners without much power early on.

Sample build:
[image loading]+[image loading]+[image loading]+[image loading]+[image loading]+[image loading]
+ Show Spoiler [Item Building] +


Boots:
[image loading]
or
[image loading]
get mercs against heavy cc, ninja tabi against heavy AD, when in doubt get whichever is best for laning phase.

[image loading]
Viable if you want to go for some kind of build where you don't get CDR but there are too many good CDR items for these to be worth it.

Damage: .
[image loading]
This is pretty good especally if you're unlikely to be focused but usually getting tankier is better
[image loading]
This is your best super lategame damage item because it means your q still hurts vs armour stackers.
[image loading]
Although I didn't like this originally, it turns out W is too valuable to a cooldown to use it on any target you want to focus and considering this covers both a slow and a sheen, and ghost covers movement speed, it kind of renders trinity obsolete these days. (Trinity still hurts more with autos because of the attack speed + crit that scales hard if your R has stacked up a lot of AD, usually not worth it.)

Tank Items:

[image loading]
Good tank item but doesn't give CDR and is a split resistance item so not great for lane either.
[image loading]
Against something like xerath with tons of spell pen for example or heavy poke teams this is worth it but I'd usually avoid it.
[image loading]
I usually get this after I maxed out my CDR or If im behind and need high EHP.
[image loading]
The mana helps in lane to deal with high mana costs and the constant mana drain of your Q. In an AD lane armour is your best friend because it scales with your lifesteal and health potions. The CDR helps stack your Q. Pretty perfect first item to get vs AD lanes.
[image loading]
If you're retarded tanky and want more damage to duel ADs with lifesteal this might be worth it but most likely thornmail is better.
[image loading]
The healing boost works on your lifesteal so its not a waste and its the easiest way to get mr while maxing your CDR.
[image loading]
Because it helps against lifesteal and it makes ADs cry when they realize you nearly have 300 armour even after they buy LW
Would normally only buy versus either heavy auto attackers who aren't getting LW (maybe aatrox and such) or against very heavy AD teams when its worth it to get combos such as IBG+Randuins+FH+Sunfire+Thornmail so even with LWs armour is still good and thornmail damage gets really high because based on their damage BEFORE it gets reduced and they are unlikely to have much MR



Play style:
Solo top. Mid lane is doable if it suits and jungle is okay but not optimal. (You won't get to stack a monster Q you are mostly W + E utility + R damage/tankiness.)

The most important thing to get right is balancing using Q offensively and just to farm. If in doubt, always just AFK Farm. Sometimes using it to harass will pay off later (mostly in conjunction with just auto hits, because your lifesteal means you don't need to out trade to "win" a trade). When its super farmed up you can use it to zone but make sure its worthwhile and you aren't missing too many stacks.

Level 1: You are strong level 1 because of 10% lifesteal and hit+Q combo. If you expect him to harass you early levels your level 1 auto hit+Q does a lot of damage and you should try to get it off if he is taking you lightly and just running past you to hit creeps.
Levels 2-5: Just try to let him push during these levels and farm. Just react to a gank with your W since its an easy kill. Don't get baited into good fights because you don't need to lose much hp before you can get tower dived.
Levels 6+. You have your ult+ghost to escape from nasty situations. Don't waste your mana in fights until you have either glacial or some mana pots or something if you plan a fight. You might want to stay in lane then TP back and buy and get wards and more pots. Don't overstay your welcome and die to a gank.
Guideline for Q farm:
At 20-25 minutes which is around when you have to start actually teamfighting you should have:
+200 if your laning has been difficult.
+300 if your laning has been manageable
+400 if your laning has basically let you free farm.
You ideally want +300 before you start fighting teamfights, farm two fold increases your effectiveness since it increases both your damage (q damage) and tankyness (items). However you're pretty strong even with a weak Q so don't pass up any opportunites. Nasus is cited as a lategame champ but really when AD carries and AP carries are really strong they stifle you. You can fight better than almost anyone with your Ult up as long as they stay in range, so don't pass up definite opportunites just because you are greedy for Q farm. At the same time don't waste time roaming around when you can farm a lane and push a tower down in ~5 Q's if they roam and you have TP up.

Lane match ups:
Have to take these on a case by case basis, but typically stack armour vs ADs and mr vs APs and rush frozen heart/spirit visage.

Teamfights:
You can't really initiate a fight as Nasus, what you can do is W a target and let him get poked, or if its a squishy someone else can engage on him.
Typically you want to go with the momentum as nasus, since you don't have any huge mobility or burst any decision is going to take time. If you choose to run after a low hp guy it might not be worth it if you catch him. Instead stick with the team and make the low hp guy come back to you if he wants to win the fight.

Dive squishy targets if the opportunity is there and there are no present threats that you have to deal with. A high damage target on your AD means its better to W and tank them, however you also don't want to miss an opportunity to burst a squishy if you have someone on your team who can jump them if you slow them. When in doubt you should just dive the AD carry, because you will win against tanks anyway. Just be careful not to overextend and get collapsed on.

+ Show Spoiler [Old Patch Notes] +

V3.6

Wither: Attack speed slow amount has been halved.

V3.02:

Siphoning Strike:
Fixed a bug where Siphoning Strike critical strikes were dealing more damage than intended.
Mana cost reduced to 20 at all ranks from 20/25/30/35/40.
Fury of the Sands:
Now increases attack range by 50 and cast range by 100 while active.
Mana cost reduced to 100 from 150.

V3.01:

Siphoning Strike:
Permanent damage bonus is now doubled to 6 when killing a champion, large minion or large monster

V1.0.0.123:

Range increased to 125 from 110.
Soul Eater: life steal increased at earlier levels to 14 / 17 / 20% from 10 / 15 / 20%.
Wither:
Cooldown reduced to 15/14/13/12/11 from 15 at all ranks.
Mana cost reduced to 80 from 100.
It will now reach its maximum slow even if its duration is reduced by crowd control reduction effects like Tenacity.
Spirit Fire:
No longer has a 0.5 second delay before appearing. It retains the 0.5 second casting time.
Now deals half damage initially and the other half over the duration instead of it just dealing damage per second:
New: Initial 55/95/135/175/215 (+0.6 per ability power) magic damage and 11/19/27/35/43 (+0.12 per ability power) magic damage each second for the next 5 seconds.
Old: Deals 20/34/48/62/76 (+0.2 per ability power) magic damage each second for the 6 seconds the area lasts.
Fixed a bug where Siphoning Strike sometimes gained extra lifesteal.


+ Show Spoiler [Changelog] +

9th November, 2013. Fixed a lot of the images and such but I won't mess around too much until season 4 comes around.
1st July, 2013: Rehashed whole guide should be up to date.



+ Show Spoiler [old guide] +

[image loading]


Nasus, The Curator of the Sands.
http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Nasus_the_Curator_of_the_Sands

+ Show Spoiler [Patch Notes] +

v1.0.0.123 August 2011 Patch
# Attack range increased to 125 from 110
# Soul Eater lifesteal increased at earlier levels to 14/17/20% from 10/15/20%
# Wither

* Cooldown reduced to 15/14/13/12/11 seconds from 15 seconds at all ranks
* Mana cost reduced to 80 from 100
* Wither will now reach its max slow even if its duration is reduced (ie: by tenacity)

# Spirit Fire

* No longer has a 0.5 second delay before taking effect
* Now deals half of its damage initially and the other half over the duration -- initial 55/95/135/175/215 (+0.6 ability power) Magic Damage and 11/19/27/35/43 (+0.12 ability power) Magic Damage each second for the next 5 seconds




Introduction

Nasus is a 'Tanky DPS' (AKA Bruiser) champion who specializes as an anti tank/bruiser because he has insane damage without having to build damage (bruisers generally can't get away with building a lot of crit or armour pen, the main counters to armour) and a huge movement/attack speed slow along with % based hp damage. (nice counter to warmogs atmas bruisers). He is well known as a very passive laner as in order to be strong in mid and lategame he has to spend the early game constantly using his Q to kill creeps meaning he can't use it to trade in lane without losing mid/lategame strength. He is the highest damage champion without any damage items in the game.

Things that Nasus is good at countering:
-Heavy Bruiser or melee comps, especially without an AD Carry, or one that is constantly under pressure from a champion like Annie or Akali.
-Laners that want to sit top all game and farm. Nasus benefits more from farm and becomes impossible to push out of the lane once he gets high level and some CDR. Low cooldown Q that can 1 shot creeps with high passive lifesteal makes him almost like lanewick. A lot of champions that try to farm for 20 minutes suddenly get pushed out of lane when Nasus has +400 damage on Q from farm and sheen.
-Assassins. Champions that are burst based and can't kill tanks very well. They get killed in a few Q's by Nasus and the slow hurts them.

Nasus can basically 1v5 a team with champions like master yi, pantheon, shen ,akali,katarina, renekton, providing they are not already fed.

Things that counter Nasus:
-Laners that shut him down and stop him farming, or at least make him use his Q to trade to stop himself getting zoned.
-Kiting or CC based teams with a strong AD carry. Brand and TF are great against him. Nunu and amumu are good also as tanks against him. AD carries like tristana or vayne can stop him from getting close and melt him with good farm. However, Nasus does have his whither and can build tankier than other bruisers but he has no instant gap closer, hard cc or large burst damage compared to say, a nocturne with ghostblade or irelia with trinity that can lock him down and force him to use his skills to get away from you before doing any damage, or risk getting focused by the whole team.



+ Show Spoiler [Skills] +

Read about them in the wiki, this just gives some explanation on how you use them.

[image loading]

Passive: Soul Eater; 14/17/20% Lifesteal.
Great for early lane and in general. Lifesteal works on your Q which means that once you get farmed with high resists you are basically unkillable by most Tanky DPS and burst APs 1 on 1 assuming relatively even farm levels. A 10/0 irelia with 300 CS and 250 armour is obviously going to own you with attack speed + Hiten style, but someone like Jarvan IV who relies on high burst more than sustained damage can't do much to you. This means in teamfights you can choose to stay back and deal with divers and protect your carry or just ignore their tanks and go for their AD carry. This depends on how much they can CC you, and how tanky their divers are. If that Irelia just has a Trinity Force, mercs, and 2 gold items with something like FoN or wits end there's a good chance you can keep her away from your Ashe with your sheer damage output.

[image loading]

Q: Siphoning Strike: Deals your AD+A flat amount per rank. Gains 3 damage per creep killed with it. This is where most of your damage comes from. Since you won't be able to auto attack targets that much the burst damage is what you need and this also means you don't need a constant slow as much as some other champions. As long as you out run your opponent you will always be in range every ~2.5 seconds to Q them.

[image loading]
W: Wither: Movement AND Attack speed slow, increasing per second for 5 seconds. This can function as a run of the mill gap closer, a move to catch runners, a move to help initiate for your team, or an anti AD carry move which stops them from both running and attacking.
You often find yourself just using it to catch whoever you want to hit but try to put it on the target it shuts down the most.
Udyr terrorizing your carry line? Whither stops him doing anything for 3-4 seconds assuming he has mercs. Need to deal with that Miss fortune? You can wither her and run to her while she can't do much damage to you.

[image loading]

E: Spirit fire. Delayed cast on a small area that does damage over time and armour reduction. Nasus' worst skill. If you can combo this with something like Jarvan ultimate it's great but in general you just put it down before your next Q to boost its damage.
This is amazing if someone is 1v1ing you and the fight is somewhat close, because the armour pen and damage adds up to a lot, especially when your ultimate is giving you extra attack damage.

[image loading]

R: Fury of the Sands. Health boost, AoE %hp magic damage about the radius of sunfire, the health drained per second value is added to your attack damage. This is one of the most powerful ultimates in the game for fighting straight up. Whether you are chasing, trying to peel a carry or straight up 1v1ing someone. This is especially good on someone like vlad with low resists and high health, since its effectively an AoE madreds bloodrazor that gives you AD. If you have some attack speed and combined with spirit fire it means your auto attacks start becoming as devastating as your Q. Your sustained damage shoots through the roof. The health boost is huge and is what makes you naturally tanky along with your passive.

Be careful using this skill as it only lasts 15 seconds if they can disengage and kite you back you just wasted it. Only use it when the fight is definitely going to happen.



Skill order:
QWQE
Q>W>E>R.
You have the option of going E>W when you think you will be in situations with static 1v1. Jarvan with or against your team might be a good reason to max it since you will get the damage and armour reduction for the full duration when he casts his ultimate. Also; if they have someone who is going to dive your carry placing spirit fire on them helps the both of you DPS him.

Summoner Skills:
[image loading] + [image loading]



[image loading] is great, but I don't like it anymore, flash is too good.
Teleport can be replaced with exhaust or ignite, teleport is just generally great for Nasus as you want to maximize your potential to farm while not being out of position for teamfights.

Masteries:
http://thefwcentral.com/lol/#&trees=0-3-0-1-0-4-0-0-0-1-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-1-3-0-4-3-0-1-0-0-0-3-3-2-0-1-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0
With the new mastery tree, I have a hard time justifying anything but 21 defense. He has the qualities of other tanks, wanting CDR, CC reduction and movement speed. You can switch around the masteries a bit depending on the lane opponent. For example obviously you get 3/3 magic resist against a magic damage lane. The health regen is optional and you can get indomitable, or max honour guard, or that evasion thing against AoE comps, etc. The 9 offense again is optional the magic pen is good for 1 point and the 4% cdr is very good on Nasus, but you can get the movement speed or mana regen in utility or just more in defense if you want.



Runes:
Quints: These are especially flexible. Good options include ArP, Armour, Health, Magic resist, Cooldown Reduction and Movement speed, flat or per level. My standard is getting armour against physical laners and magic resist against magical laners, since the laning phase is the most important for Nasus.
Marks: ArP. Very little other choice here.
Seals: Flat armour. Dodge is sometimes good but it's going to be removed anyway.
Glyphs: Flat magic resist, or magic resist per level. If they don't have threatening magic damage get CDR/Level if you decide your build needs it. The thing is normally if they don't have a lot of magic damage frozen heart is really good and that gives so much CDR that it's maxed with that, shurelyas, and masteries easily.

Situational: If you are versus a HARD AD LANE you should have
-Armour quints OR hp regen quints. (Use your own judgement)
-Get ninja tabi
-Get either cloth+5 or health regen+1 into philo.
-Get fast Glacial shroud for the CDR and armour and mana. (All very useful for Nasus in lane, without flat mana you generally can't afford to use W E and R in an engage without being totally oom for using Q for farming or killing them, or you won't have enough mana to ulti if you were farming for a long time.

Situational: If you are versus a HARD AP LANE you should have
-MR blues flat
-HP Regen quints flat or MR flat quints
-Start boots against a skillshot reliant ap, or health regen against others. Health regen is generally better than MR because they don't want to kill you with burst but harass over a long time which is where health regen shines.
Fast spirit visage is good here for your CDR core. SV+Shurelyas pretty much maxes your CDR at level 18 with masteries.
-Don't worry about getting zoned and farming at tower, they probably won't be able to get all the CS if they harass hadr.
Build:

Starting items:
[image loading]
+
[image loading]
Standard.

You can also open:
[image loading] + 5x
[image loading]


[image loading] +3x
[image loading]


[image loading] +2x
[image loading]



Cloth+5 is the only one you will probably feel like is better, and only for against early game sustainability against heavy physical harassers. It delays your philo stone though so do it only if you think you will be in trouble before your first back.


Item building strategy: Essentially you want be as hard to kill as possible while having a decent amount of damage. The way I go about it is to get the most efficient stats for damage while building mostly tank. CDR is the best stat for damage because it works on your Q and also gives great damage reduction from higher uptime on wither. Armour and magic resist are the best stats for staying alive since you get passive lifesteal and increased health from your ultimate, although sometimes its a more practical to get some health items since most of the armour and magic resist items scale off into regen or max mana past the chain mail and negatron components.

In essence:
-Get 40% CDR or very close.
-Build tank items
-Get trinity force when you aren't in danger of dying fast.
-If they are all really tanky you can get a LW on top of trinity, 3 end game tank items still makes you very very tanky.
+ Show Spoiler [Item Building] +


Boots:
[image loading]
I get these almost every game now, there's just so many situations where you need these to do your job. If you suddenly get focused, you need to be able to get out. If you get tower dived or ganked, you want to be able to kite them. If you want to finish people off reducing the CC lets you get your wither off before they run out of range.
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Very good anti ranged AD because dodge and randuins/frozen heart are the only ways to take less damage from ranged AD once they get their last whisper. I dislike these unless they have very little CC or very heavy AD auto attackers (who generally also don't have a lot of CC). Alsoenerally CC is dangerous because of AP carrys who do insane damage with skillshots/aoe spells and if you are CC'd you can't avoid them.

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I used to get these more, you can still get them early and sell them if you don't want glacial or spirit visage/kindlegem or just instead of ninja tabi if they don't have much CC.

Damage: .
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This is a great item for Nasus although too many people get it before getting any tanky items which is really risky. Since nasus has no very fast way of getting in/out of a fight and no burst damage not being tanky means you can get chased off of a fight easily and you will end up doing less damage. It also depends on what they have as high damage carries have to target you while bruisers won't do any damage and have to go for their carries even if you rush trinity meaning its a good option.

If you rush trinity generally you get GA ASAP since its an anti-focus item which is exactly what you need since Nasus ult and passive mean you're pretty damn tanky over a long fight anyway.


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This is a great lategame item since Arpen is so good with your Q it removes the main counter to you lategame which is armour. I occasionally get it as a 6th item selling something else.

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This isn't awful but I find it hard to justify. You get a HoG early game and buy a randuins instead of this item and it just helps you so much more for a bit less damage. You don't need high auto attack damage on Nasus and it's better on people with short steriods like noct or xin who improve their total damage a lot more in that 8 seconds or so of ghostblade than nasus who constantly outputs the same damage with small differences from your ulti or spirit fire.

Tank Items:

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This is a fantastic item. Very cost effective and decently slot effective with health, armour and magic resist all in one item and also an aura. The only issues is your support might get it, it doesn't give CDR, and it doesn't give you any answer to farmed AD carries like randuins/FH.

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Technically health isn't that optimal of a stat, however warmogs is such a slot effective and cost effective item for the amount of sheer survivability it gives you. I sometimes get this lategame when they have void staffs/LW even though it won't be charged it's still a LOT of health and regen.


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Not as good as it used to be when it gave 15% CDR and was cheaper, however it gives lots of armour, some hp, and more importantly an anti ranged AD mini-wither if they attack you or you use the active. This means if a ranged AD is shooting at you he won't do as much damage and allows you to gap close easier if your whither is on CD. Randuins active+passive+wither gives you 3 slows which is really important. I get randuins after buying an early frozen heart when they have a lot of auto attackers. Or even just get it without having a HoG if they have a fed AD carry and you already have frozen heart but you don't need any more damage.

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Great item, magic resist and movement speed are the main stats you are looking at. The regen acquires more value at tower sieges also high regen+lifesteal+resists = unkillable. Usually get this after you have level 16 ultimate and a lot of resists and max CDR. You often want to rush the negatron really fast but don't want FoN until late. This is usually why people make Banshees but I uphold that it's a poor item on Nasus and I'd prefer to leave the negatron and get a kindle gem or giants belt as well if I really need HP.

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I really like this item now. The lack of health isn't the biggest problem on Nasus especailly in lane where flat health isn't that important, but flat mana is, since you have no mana sustain and every time you have having 425 extra mana from glacial makes a big difference. Glacial generally gives you everything you need to lane against physical laners. CDR helps you stack Q, mana gives you enough mana to use W and ultimate without having to back if you need to trade/fight, and armour reduces their damage and makes your regen from philo and lifesteal sustain a lot more. The only issue is it's quite expensive and gives no health which can be a problem if you think you're insanely tanky and then you lose most of your health from a combo from an AP carry.

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See no reason to get this instead of warmogs-->chain mail, Sunfire is good to add to your early game damage if you are mobile but lack some damage, Nasus lacks mobility and not damage. Seems popular since it works with his ultimate but I honestly don't like it.

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You get this if you already have warmogs and trinity (or just like 3k health from other items, with ulti draining their AD and giving you 600 health it gives you a LOT of AD and scales with the crit it and trinity gives) and you don't need to be any more tanky. It increases your damage quite a lot. Normally you will get atmas OR LW and not both, if any.


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Since you almost always want philo because you need health regen to lane, mana regen to spam Q and gold items to scale with your passive laning phase this is an amazing way to turn it into stats you need. (Some nice health, CDR, and movement speed, even more regen). Assuming your philo pays for itself even if you didn't have it for 25 minutes the sustain and extra Q farm it gives you makes it almost always pay for itself, its only 1400 for 330 health, 15 CDR, and some more health and regen AND the movement speed proc. It's insanely efficent.


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Seems inferior to Shurelya's and it's not that slot effective when you are already short on slots. Good if they have a lot fo magic damage, and you can get it on top of shurelyas to max out your CDR.



Sample build path I would typically take on Nasus games.
Health regen+1 pot-->Philo stone-->Boots 1 -->Glacial shroud-->Mercs-->Kindlegem-->Frozen Heart-->Shurelyas-->Sheen/Phage-->Negatron-->Trinity--->GA/FoN

Skyyart popularized this style of build, shurelyas/frozen heart core into trinity into fon.
-Get HoG If you intend on getting randuins later. If you need health usually kindlegem amounts to a higher gold value because of extra Q farm.

If you don't intend on getting frozen heart. (You can get randuins, shurelyas, maybe a spirit visage or just don't get totally maxed CDR) you might want to get a sheen for lane because not having any mana items kinda sucks on nasus.
Against bruisers in lane you can get phage, sheen, or zeal, or even the whole trinity fast, because all 3 items are good for bullying other bruisers; sheen for huge harass with Q, zeal for chasing and auto attacking them with ulti up draining AD, phage for chasing them when your wither is down and the hp helps you 1v1/survive ganks.
This kind of build path would be:
Health regen+1 pot-->Philo-->Sheen-->Phage-->Trinity-->Guardian Angel-->Shurelyas-->FoN
Trinity rush is strong but your team needs high damage to make sure you can't get focused and also watch your postioning. I've played as and against Nasus' who just slow someone and run in first instead of waiting for the team to get in range and we just instantly kill him and clean up. If you slow someone your team can damage them for free if they don't comitt to fighting. Your damage as a bruiser is much less than the carries so you DO NOT need to run into 5 people and basically trade the slowed guy for yourself if you're lucky.

Play style:
Solo top. Almost no exceptions.
Mid lane is the reserve case if top lane is unfarmable. (aka unwinnable if you are playing nasus, examples include Garen and Renekton 1-5, however with armour stack runes and cloth+5 start you can still farm.)
Duo bottom lane is bad because you get harassed so much that its very hard to farm like you can in a solo lane. Even vs a ranged AD top cloth+5 pots and the ability to W him and go kill him without a support to save him means you can kind of farm decently and if he attacks you too much he pushes his lane and makes your jungler able to gakn.

"Winning a lane" as Nasus basically means you were able to farm without having to worry about the other dude so much. Once I found myself constantly Qing a Chogath to counter his own harass until a realized he can sustain it while we I am losing Q farm which is bad. Qing the enemy is actually a way to make it more risky for him to attack you instead of it being an attempt to push him off lane.

Level 1: You should have Q. You are strong level 1 because of 10% lifesteal and hit+Q combo. If you expect him to harass you early levels your level 1 auto hit+Q does a lot of damage and you should try to get it off if he is taking you lightly and just running past you to hit creeps.
Levels 2-5: You should stop harassing him after level 1 and 2, the top laner probably has his sustain spell now so it's useless anyway, but he should stop overextending and trying to boss you out of lane once you show him you are equal to his harass. If he tries to commit to a fight with burst you can follow it up with a wither, possibly an E and since he can't fight you with wither up even if he bursts you to 75% you can easily do that again to him while the 5 seconds of wither is up. If he just harasses you and doesn't commit to a fight just rely on your regen and lifesteal to keep you alive. If you can't respond to him attacking you just let him push the lane and farm at tower
Levels 6-9: You should have you philo, boots, more pots and a ward, so you are pretty safe. Use the health boost on R to survive ganks, the damage boost on R to help gank. (Wither is great for helping ganks, just try to chain it and not stack it on top of something like nunu snowball), and both of them to win any 1v1 fights they try to commit to.
Levels 9+: You should have philo+hog+cdr boots and just Qing every single creep and they shouldn't be able to harass you with your insane lifesteal off each Q. You can easily push their tower either 1 Q at a time or just spam Q on it if he leaves the lane. If you have been farming your Q well you can knock any melee out of lane here, even warwick possibly not udyr though.
Look out for any opportunities to teleport to turn the tides of a fight.
Guideline for Q farm:
At 20-25 minutes which is around when you have to start actually teamfighting you should have:
+200 if your laning has been difficult.
+300 if your laning has been manageable
+400 if your laning has basically let you free farm.
You ideally want +300 before you start fighting teamfights, its perfectly acceptable to try to split push or generally afk farm for a bit longer when you have your CDR items and want to catch up on farm. Farm two fold increases your effectiveness since it increases both your damage (q damage) and tankyness (items).

The worse your Q farm is the faster you should get sheen/trinity, since the % increase is higher.

Ideally you don't want to have to fight your lane opponent but if he does, the later the better. Lanewicks who think they are strong try to fight me and just get owned when my Q gets over 200 and I have sheen and ultimate, even if they are ahead on kills you are deceptively powerful. Once you notice you have an insane farm on your Q you can start to just Q harass people out of lane.
Lane match ups:

There are 2 types of lanes you worry about
HARD AD Lanes. (Lanes which will own you with high physical damage normally)
Use the rune/mastery/build set up and just ignore the guy and farm. Garen and Renek are cooldown based so try not to let them spam you every CD but don't bother trying to fight they HAVE to push their lane if they want to damage you. (Spin, Renek's Q/E). People like Irelia can't win a fight with high armour and wither on your side.
HARD AP Lanes (Lanes which own you with high magic damage normally)
Just avoid unnecessary damage and heal so much they run oom. Rumble is an exception but he HAS to push with Q to damage you. You can also fight him if he wastes his spells but no reason to risk it.
Not hard lanes: (Any tank, lane wick or something/0
FARMFARMFARMFARMFARM. You can rune/mastery as you please.

I forgot a couple actually:
Akali - Don't let her hit her Q's on your every time the mark is on, you might get zoned a bit but do your best
-Mordekaizer - run mass MR and just farm farm farm under tower and get your jungler to gank him.

Teamfights:

You initiate by Withering somebody but don't just go and dive in ahead of your team because you will take a lot of free damage. Even if its a tanky guy you slowed your carries can still poke them down and force a flash if they don't want to fight

If they initiate on your team you have to be aware of a few things:
-If they have someone like nocturne who just ulted onto your AD carry you want to just go for him ASAP, slowing him if his shield isn't on. You can use your next slow onto their AD if he's doing too much damage.
-If they have somebody like amumu who's job is to just CC your team, just try to avoid incidental AoE damage and if they try to run past your to go for the squishies you can go for theirs since amumu or amumu+their solo top will have to turn on you because they are relying on carries to do damage.

Also: The tankier your are the more you should go for carries because the point of being tanky is that you want to survive focus fire so you can easily let your carries do damage and kill everyone if they focus you but if they don't you still 4 shot their carries with a farmed Q. Even if you have a theoreticaly situation where both bruisers dive both carries you end up winning because Nasus rapes every bruiser in 1v1 if their carries die.
If you build more like a bruiser say trinity force and most of a GA then you have to stay back a bit until your whole team is in the fight so that you can't get focused fired before you go onto their squishies. If their bruisers overextend make sure to focus them fast though. (Overextend means attacking people that their carries are more than 2-3 seconds out of range to attack themselves. in general).

People say Nasus is weak to kiting but you just need to use your slow smartly and let your carries get in range instead of mindless diving in every time. Technically Nasus gets kited less than someone like Irelia because you slow for your team instead of having to commit with a hard gap closer. (Although irelia still has a solid slow and has the passive to get away if needed, so she's still a fantastic tank)
In teamfights its extremely hard to individually kite Nasus because his W is almost up constantly since the buff to him and assuming you are close to CDR capped. Obviously this is assuming the target doesn't have merc treads.

+ Show Spoiler [Old Patch Notes] +

* Base movement speed increased to 325 from 320
* Siphoning Strike damage bonus per kill increased to 3 from 2


+ Show Spoiler [Changelog] +

10th August, 2011;
Added lots of pictures to make the whole guide more readable. Removed some of the spiel and rambling. Changed/added comments about item builds.

6th September, 2011;
Added content for laning against hard opponents from what I learned in solo queue at higher elo
and recently watching wickds style of skipping gold/10 and just building to counter the enemy lane and teamcomp, with flat health regen quints and flat armour/mr runes.
Removed more of the BS and rambling and generalized and made things more concise.
Removed brutalizer/ghostblade based builds because I've never seen them work and have never found them useful compared to standard stuff.
29th November, 2011;
New masteries, cleaned up the whole guide up to "playstyle" and made everything up to date. Mostly using skyyart nasus build or trinity/ga type stuff. Very sucessful in plat in ranked games with Nasus, even though I normally play junglers.

dnastyx
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States2707 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-20 18:50:03
July 20 2011 18:47 GMT
#2
Trinity force: This is the most overrated item for Nasus and for good reason.


Er...I don't think that means what you think it means.

You might also want to mention how ridiculously quickly Nasus can do 15 minute baron with his ultimate. You need your team nearby, but a lot of solo queue teams don't expect it.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-20 18:52:06
July 20 2011 18:48 GMT
#3
It's overrated, but its overrated for a good reason. It gives a lot of stats that are good on Nasus and everyone is like "oh just get Trinity force and it's all the damage I 'need' ". Sure it gives good damage. However, you do a lot of damage without trinity force. The most important thing is that you are tanky enough that can you run up to their squishies in teamfights to stop them raping your team. Or at least damaging someone tanky but being there to stop their DPS from attacking your carries without having to go through you. If they can afford to just kill you like any other tanky dps you are useless, while at least the other tanky dps are mobile enough that they are mobile enough that they can jump around and make it hard for them to be focused while using that jump to get away from damage and into your Ashe or Miss fortune who suddenly can't do any damage. Nasus has to tank them unless he withers them first and has to run up to them to be a threat. Often you want to help finish someone but their carries are on you so you need to be able to survive and to run away afterwards.
dnastyx
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States2707 Posts
July 20 2011 18:51 GMT
#4
It was just odd placement because you immediately went into a spiel about how good it was before you went back to "but I don't think it's that good" =P
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-20 18:55:53
July 20 2011 18:52 GMT
#5
Yeah it was a bit messy, but I had a hard time figuring out how to explain that its great for damage but damage is not what you need. In fact that line probably would have done it. Lol. But yeah, honestly, most Nasus I see generally build trinity force and then die to the ranged carry.

On July 21 2011 03:47 dnastyx wrote:

You might also want to mention how ridiculously quickly Nasus can do 15 minute baron with his ultimate. You need your team nearby, but a lot of solo queue teams don't expect it.


It's pretty gimmicky, but yes, Nasus ultimate works like Madreds Bloodrazor on neutrals so he can do it fast. It's more of "If we kill one we can do baron" when some teams are really really slow at baron there are some champions like Karthus who help do it insanely fast. Warwick is basically because he can tank it so nobody tanks any damage so they can't contest 4v5 I'm pretty sure.
Tadzio
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
3340 Posts
July 20 2011 19:23 GMT
#6
Do you have the experience to discuss Wit's End some? I've never seen it mentioned in any Nasus guides, but it's almost core for me (after sheen). It's like a poor-man's Bloodrazor and, imo, magnifies Nasus' ult, except it gives MR instead of armor. With Wither/ghost you can stick to anyone that doesn't have a stun and make use of the AS. Maybe it's more important in high elo to build expensive, dedicated tanky items asap, but I've never regretted building Wit's end after sheen. I've seen HotshotGG build nasus with Wit's end, so unless he was trolling, there must be some merit to the item that could be mentioned in your guide.

Good start, tho. A little more editing of the layout to avoid wall-of-text syndrome and your guide will be nice, I think.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-20 19:39:53
July 20 2011 19:37 GMT
#7
There are far better people to get wits end on, like udyr for example. It doesn't scale with your Q at all, doesn't scale with your E at all, you have no natural attack speed steroid the only thing it scales with is the attack damage portion of your ultimate. Wits end is flat out bad on nobody but I don't think its good on Nasus.

HotshotGG builds on nasus from what i've seen is terrible. I mentioned ninja tabi+frozen heart+eleisa's miricle as 5000 gold to save buying cdr boots, that build is not that tanky and not that much damage, don't like it at all.

Sorry for ninjaing your guide btw I requested it earlier and had it half written before I saw you wanted it but I'm like 500 elo higher than you so I hope it's not too much of a problem lol.

If you want to build wits end I'd recommend xin zhao, irelia, leona and udyr as top champions for it. Udyr is debateable since he isn't as sticky as the others, but its absurd for him damage wise.
Tadzio
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
3340 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-20 21:20:02
July 20 2011 20:26 GMT
#8
Whether there are better heroes for Wit's End shouldn't really matter, what's relevant is whether Nasus can use it. It gives you sustained damage output for significantly less than the cost of finishing trinity and it covers some of your MR concerns (40-65% of FoN's MR on a DPS item that costs less ain't shabby). Since most people get armor to mitigate nasus damage, the magic damage seems potent to me.

I know your guide advises against finishing trinity early, but you admit it's good on him if you're surviving and want damage. Why, then, is Wit's end after Sheen not at least an option? Is it that CDR is more important and Nasus should be building CDR items for damage?

Seems to me that you view Nasus as more of a Tank than a DPS hero, which is a fine way to approach him. But Wit's benefits both those roles and makes you less of a "Q-burst-then-kited" champ since you can get some auto-attacks in while Wither is still applied.

PS, I'm perfectly willing to hear that "Wits end only works for you cuz your opponents are horrible." Lol. I'm sure that's true with a lotta the champs I play. But hearing why something is bad or not-optimal would do a lot to help me get better, I think.

Edit: Also, can you explain in some more detail why rushing HoG is important? Nasus is a last-hitting machine and doesn't need the gold/10, imo. Does he need the health? Or do you advise it because you're building Randuin's most games and might as well be getting the extra gold/10 on your way?

Thanks!
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
July 20 2011 21:23 GMT
#9
Wits end helps you auto attack targets but Nasus' biggest problem is actually being in range to auto attack targets, whether its because he is in risk of dying or because he has trouble closing the gap. Wit's end doesn't solve your problems and provides a relatively minimal dps increase for 2000 where as 40% CDR is in the cost range of 2000 and significantly increases your DPS, especially so because its easier to Q every 2.4 seconds and take whatever auto hits you get over Qing every 4 seconds and not really getting any more auto hits since its sometimes based on your movement speed versus theirs if they are running instead of your actualy attack speed.

Trinity force adds damage but also helps you stay on your target for both Q and auto hits, wits end does neither and the damage increase is certainly not worth it over more pure tank items or trinity force. Last whisper lategame is far, far, far better for increasing your damage if you are wondering why I listed that.

"Need gold/10" is a weird thing to say. Supports don't "need" gold/10 to buy wards they are fine off base gold its just buying gold items gives them more stats while having enough gold to buy wards. Just because you get a lot of farm doesn't mean more gold isn't good. The more gold the better.

Gold/10 items are essentially items that are cost ineffective when you buy them and slowly become more cost effective as the gold earned subtracts the cost slowly. Most people seem to think of them as something you buy to actually gain gold, while generally you lose gold overall. Since Nasus has passive laning phase where you just farm having a cost ineffective item isn't a bad thing and it becomes cost effective when you actually start teamfighting.

The other way of thinking about it is Randuins is not cost effective but you really have no better option. If you buy the HoG fast you basically make the randuins around 600 gold cheaper if you buy Hog around 10 and randuins around 30 minutes. A 2400 randuins is an item you definitely want.
Tadzio
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
3340 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-20 22:20:03
July 20 2011 21:56 GMT
#10
cool thx.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-10 01:06:54
August 10 2011 00:54 GMT
#11
Updated guide so its actually readable. Good timing since the buffs will make people more interested. Will be testing out the Nasus changes. (while getting to 2k elo since Nasus (also, garen!!) is awesome and people wont flame me for picking him because he got buffed huehuehue) Perhaps E>W now. If I read it right, 40% CDR nasus will have a 5 second duration whither before tenacity (aka on all carries and squishies) with a 6.6 second or so cooldown. This will let you just ignore their ranged carry constantly spamming whither until you want to go kill her with perma slow on her. This will be pretty ridiculous.

Jungle Nasus? You need farm. Not a good idea but if you use builds like aegis+sheen+cdr boots into whatever you need you can get away with it.

Thoughts since I made the guide:
-"lite" builds with stuff like brutalizer have never worked out for me but I tested them in normals where I usually have to basically 1v5 so as expected (partially my fault since I just ignore my team iuntil I get the items I want in normals, haha) it didn't feel strong.
-Warmogs feels totally great still
-Shurelyas is AWESOME. I never, ever felt like it was wasted. I often forget to use the movement speed but its so damn cheap and the stats it gives are really good. CDR Boots+Shurelyas + Randuins + 0/9/21 might be my go-to set up, with mr/lvl runes. Staying at 36% CDR for a long time until I finish randuins.
Nasus is quite resilient in lane however don't get cocky trying to fight lanewicks until you get really tanky just keep farming. You don't want to die early for no reason because it hurts your far mand XP which you need more than anyone else in your game.
-Shurelyas +Whither is a decent initiate for your team if their positioning isn't fantastic. Obviously if they are ready with their amumu in front of everyone don't go for it, but if they try to poke tower drop a W and hit shurelyas and you're good to go.
-Nasus is a bit weird since he's a tank but needs a really good engage. Basically you want some follow through engage or something e.g arrow--> you go in or you go in-->annie flash tibbers an AP carry. I don't like so much playing with amumu as there is some kind of role overlap. Normally amumu makes their ranged AD wary of going in but you do that anyway. Perhaps if amumu builds a lot of AP like a boss?
face the payNe
Profile Joined December 2010
Portugal10 Posts
August 10 2011 01:33 GMT
#12
Pretty solid build for Nasus here.

Good job
APurpleCow
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States1372 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-10 03:40:00
August 10 2011 02:11 GMT
#13
Highly underrating Frozen Heart IMO. Allows you to get awesome ninja tabi/merc treads and still easily hit 40% CDR with 21 in utility, FH, and Shurelya's. FH's armor alone costs like 1500 gold, so the 20% attack speed reduction, 20% CDR, and 500 mana only cost 1200. Compare to CDR boots which give 15% CDR for 700. It's a goddamn steal, easily the best armor item in the game atm.

Must have.

philo+hog --> sheen --> glacial shroud+shurelya's+negatron --> frozen heart --> triforce.

only way.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-10 11:21:21
August 10 2011 11:14 GMT
#14
The problem is that the mana is essentially worthless. 20% CDR is costing close to 1200. (vs 15% for 700 on CDR boots, steal my ass) Not sure how good the attack speed slow on frozen heart is. Somebody told me its -20% additively and I suppose randuins is the same but its nearly twice as good. Randuins is pretty cost effective if you count gold farming with heart of gold and the reductions of active+passive together are a lot better.

I think your build is probably the best I've read on this site from someone else but I'm not convinced totally yet.

I recently thought of an idea:
The main problem with everyones fancy builds is that by the time they get CDR they are past the AFK farm stage, my build gets closing on 30% CDR at 10 minutes which lets me farm my Q really fast.

Solution: Buy CDR boots, sell them for mercs/tabi when I buy shurelyas. Should be the best answer I've come up with to the question of: I don't want CDR boots but I want them to farm Q early game.

Like, your build is an idealistic version where you don't get much health because Nasus doesn't "need it" and you aim to get 40% CDR but you end up being a whole lot squishier with no warmogs, the HoG is a dead end item, you are sporting a ton of mana for nothing and you are so slot capped you have to buy frozen heart trinity force, force of nature, shurleyas, and whatever your last item is all in 1 go off the negatron/sheen/philo. To boot, you don't get that delicious +400 Q at 20-25 minutes.
Shikyo
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Finland33997 Posts
August 10 2011 11:25 GMT
#15
By the way, my Nasus build is cdr boots -> shurelyas Reverie, gives 39% cdr with the masteries. HoG can be built if you're going to Randuins. I believe it's very important to get 40% cdr as with Nasus I build tank and Q is pretty much my only source of damage so I want it to be available as much as possible, not to mention that permawither is awesome. This build also gives enough mana regen to farm with Q.

After these items, I get negatron/chainmail if I'm not farming extremely fast, otherwise I just rush Triforce before anything(for instance in passive games where I can just freefarm top and hence get Triforce by 24min or so). After that I go for FoN and Randuins or Frozen heart whatever I feel like. I prefer Frozen Heart because then I can sell cdr boots for mercs and still maintain 40% cdr, which as I said is very important for Nasus.
League of Legends EU West, Platinum III | Yousei Teikoku is the best thing that has ever happened to music.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
August 10 2011 13:02 GMT
#16
The reason I don't do it that way is:

1: I want warmogs because it stops you from being instantly bursted down by a team. You'd be surprised how fast you can get killed when you don't have a hard engage.
2: I want to farm my philo stone a bit more.
3: I'd prefer to just rune/mastery a bit better for 40% cdr than to spend so much gold into frozen heart
.

BTW: If you're going ghostblade it might be an idea to get triple gold items. heh.

24 minute triforce isn't like triforce on Irelia who can just jump in and burst someone down and can easily run if you get CC'd. If you want to go in as Nasus you have to go in for a pretty long duration because you have to walk in, eat any CC they have and you don't want to run away with your ultimate on anyway. I don't really see the strength of it compared to getting a warmogs and being unkillable for a window of time that their carries are not farmed enough.
Makavw
Profile Joined April 2010
Croatia165 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-10 17:37:50
August 10 2011 17:37 GMT
#17
This buff hasnt helped nasus at all.
Sure you can dominate some normals but when it comes to ranked he is still crap.
He is a bad jungler and cant really compare to strong solo tops like irelia/jarvan/xin. His early game is still too weak and he cannot trade blows with just about anyone and he requires CDR to do dmg, unlike evrey other ad hero who doesnt need it.

I love nasus and he was my first "main" but he is still way to weak for serious play.
APurpleCow
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States1372 Posts
August 10 2011 20:28 GMT
#18
The problem is that the mana is essentially worthless. 20% CDR is costing close to 1200. (vs 15% for 700 on CDR boots, steal my ass) Not sure how good the attack speed slow on frozen heart is. Somebody told me its -20% additively and I suppose randuins is the same but its nearly twice as good. Randuins is pretty cost effective if you count gold farming with heart of gold and the reductions of active+passive together are a lot better.


I used to feel similarly about Frozen Heart and never got it on pretty much any hero. After all, how can an item that has 500 mana be cost efficient as a tank item?

Then I actually looked at the cost and the stats it gave--turns out an item that gives 500 mana IS cost efficient as a tank item. 20% CDR for 933 gold (using 15% for 700 as baseline), 99 armor for 1540 gold (chainmail), leaving only 300 gold for the -20% aspeed and mana. Considering how attack speed itself costs 1050 gold for 40%, placing it at 525 gold for 20% attack speed, and considering how Frozen Heart has a huge AoE that effects more than one champion, Frozen Heart would be an amazing armor item even if it gave 0 mana.

Yet, I find that the mana does help. When you're in lane, the mana of glacial shroud allows you to harass with Q+Spirit Fire+wither every time they're up, which is extreme harass that's pretty much impossible to withstand.

And, again, another benefit is that you don't have to get CDR boots if you go Frozen Heart and you don't have to go 9 in offense for 40% CDR. You get ninja/merc AND you get nimbleness while still hitting 40% CDR with Shurelya's.

I recently thought of an idea:
The main problem with everyones fancy builds is that by the time they get CDR they are past the AFK farm stage, my build gets closing on 30% CDR at 10 minutes which lets me farm my Q really fast.

Solution: Buy CDR boots, sell them for mercs/tabi when I buy shurelyas. Should be the best answer I've come up with to the question of: I don't want CDR boots but I want them to farm Q early game.


Eh, I prefer to just max Q. The cooldown gets pretty low at level 5.

Like, your build is an idealistic version where you don't get much health because Nasus doesn't "need it" and you aim to get 40% CDR but you end up being a whole lot squishier with no warmogs, the HoG is a dead end item, you are sporting a ton of mana for nothing and you are so slot capped you have to buy frozen heart trinity force, force of nature, shurleyas, and whatever your last item is all in 1 go off the negatron/sheen/philo. To boot, you don't get that delicious +400 Q at 20-25 minutes.


What? My build is extremely tanky. The only damage item is Sheen, which costs only 1260 gold. Nasus gets a free 450/600 health from his ultimate and has substantial life steal, so he should get mitigation instead of health and is very tanky with only a Chainmail+Negatron.

Shurelya's isn't exactly a tank item, but it does give 330 health and it is pretty cheap. Basically, my build only gets a Sheen and then goes pure tank until the Triforce. You say it wastes money on "tons of mana", but Sheen and Frozen Heart would both be great even if they gave 0 mana.

Also, I have no problems getting Q farmed. The cooldown is very low even without CDR, and CDR isn't that late in my build.


This buff hasnt helped nasus at all.
Sure you can dominate some normals but when it comes to ranked he is still crap.
He is a bad jungler and cant really compare to strong solo tops like irelia/jarvan/xin. His early game is still too weak and he cannot trade blows with just about anyone and he requires CDR to do dmg, unlike evrey other ad hero who doesnt need it.


He gained 40% more lifesteal at level 1, which does help his laning a bit. Once he gains a few levels, he has one of the best laning phases in the game.
clickrush
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Switzerland3257 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-10 20:37:53
August 10 2011 20:37 GMT
#19
On August 11 2011 02:37 Makavw wrote:
This buff hasnt helped nasus at all.
Sure you can dominate some normals but when it comes to ranked he is still crap.
He is a bad jungler and cant really compare to strong solo tops like irelia/jarvan/xin. His early game is still too weak and he cannot trade blows with just about anyone and he requires CDR to do dmg, unlike evrey other ad hero who doesnt need it.

I love nasus and he was my first "main" but he is still way to weak for serious play.


You cannot make a statement like X champ is not as good top as A/B/C champs.

In this case: Nasus is strong/weak against other opponents than xin/jarv/ire top. There are champs that can deal with being dominated in a lane while others cannot. For example Akali is very strong against some champions top and flat out dominates them while freefarming and punishing every lasthit they make but if she gets a bad matchup she is FUCKED same goes for other champs such as garen. In the other hand Singed is not very good in most matchups but he doesnt care about that because he can farm like a boss past a few levels and passively stack up his core other examples are vladimir and mb irelia.

Iam not sure whre nasus is in that relation but I would say he doesn't care too much about being the bitch in a lane as long as he can sustain himself early on and get a certain amount of farm. He is certainly not designed to dominate lanes but to stay there long enough to get stronger. If he actually does dominate then he probably gets completely out of control depending on his build and the other matchups.
oGsMC: Zealot defense, Stalker attack, Sentry forcefieldu forcefieldu, Marauder die die
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-10 20:52:17
August 10 2011 20:50 GMT
#20
On August 11 2011 05:28 APurpleCow wrote:
Show nested quote +
The problem is that the mana is essentially worthless. 20% CDR is costing close to 1200. (vs 15% for 700 on CDR boots, steal my ass) Not sure how good the attack speed slow on frozen heart is. Somebody told me its -20% additively and I suppose randuins is the same but its nearly twice as good. Randuins is pretty cost effective if you count gold farming with heart of gold and the reductions of active+passive together are a lot better.


I used to feel similarly about Frozen Heart and never got it on pretty much any hero. After all, how can an item that has 500 mana be cost efficient as a tank item?

Then I actually looked at the cost and the stats it gave--turns out an item that gives 500 mana IS cost efficient as a tank item. 20% CDR for 933 gold (using 15% for 700 as baseline), 99 armor for 1540 gold (chainmail), leaving only 300 gold for the -20% aspeed and mana. Considering how attack speed itself costs 1050 gold for 40%, placing it at 525 gold for 20% attack speed, and considering how Frozen Heart has a huge AoE that effects more than one champion, Frozen Heart would be an amazing armor item even if it gave 0 mana.

Yet, I find that the mana does help. When you're in lane, the mana of glacial shroud allows you to harass with Q+Spirit Fire+wither every time they're up, which is extreme harass that's pretty much impossible to withstand.

And, again, another benefit is that you don't have to get CDR boots if you go Frozen Heart and you don't have to go 9 in offense for 40% CDR. You get ninja/merc AND you get nimbleness while still hitting 40% CDR with Shurelya's.

Show nested quote +
I recently thought of an idea:
The main problem with everyones fancy builds is that by the time they get CDR they are past the AFK farm stage, my build gets closing on 30% CDR at 10 minutes which lets me farm my Q really fast.

Solution: Buy CDR boots, sell them for mercs/tabi when I buy shurelyas. Should be the best answer I've come up with to the question of: I don't want CDR boots but I want them to farm Q early game.


Eh, I prefer to just max Q. The cooldown gets pretty low at level 5.

Show nested quote +
Like, your build is an idealistic version where you don't get much health because Nasus doesn't "need it" and you aim to get 40% CDR but you end up being a whole lot squishier with no warmogs, the HoG is a dead end item, you are sporting a ton of mana for nothing and you are so slot capped you have to buy frozen heart trinity force, force of nature, shurleyas, and whatever your last item is all in 1 go off the negatron/sheen/philo. To boot, you don't get that delicious +400 Q at 20-25 minutes.


What? My build is extremely tanky. The only damage item is Sheen, which costs only 1260 gold. Nasus gets a free 450/600 health from his ultimate and has substantial life steal, so he should get mitigation instead of health and is very tanky with only a Chainmail+Negatron.

Shurelya's isn't exactly a tank item, but it does give 330 health and it is pretty cheap. Basically, my build only gets a Sheen and then goes pure tank until the Triforce. You say it wastes money on "tons of mana", but Sheen and Frozen Heart would both be great even if they gave 0 mana.

Also, I have no problems getting Q farmed. The cooldown is very low even without CDR, and CDR isn't that late in my build.

Show nested quote +

This buff hasnt helped nasus at all.
Sure you can dominate some normals but when it comes to ranked he is still crap.
He is a bad jungler and cant really compare to strong solo tops like irelia/jarvan/xin. His early game is still too weak and he cannot trade blows with just about anyone and he requires CDR to do dmg, unlike evrey other ad hero who doesnt need it.


He gained 40% more lifesteal at level 1, which does help his laning a bit. Once he gains a few levels, he has one of the best laning phases in the game.



Did you read the guide? I max Q first. More CDR puts it down to 2.4 seconds.

Nasus is not weak against irelia/jarvan/xin. He can trade okish with whither+Q. Mostly he just farms and lifesteals and if they try to deny you hard they are open to jungle ganks. After level 7-9ish if you didn't die you just farm and they can't stop you at all.
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