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Haven't touched Jax (maybe 1 game) since s3, how is it "safe" to build him now?
Triforce as been nerfed, but it's still pretty good on him, so I assume phage->vamp->finish triforce could be a go-to starter, and with GA nerfed, get a belt into warmogs/sunfire/randuin's depending on needs?
On the damaging side, gunblade, zephyr, wit's, rageblade all seem pretty good, and on the defensive side FH/SV (once you get sustain)/wit's still work too I guess.
Re-reading this, it seems he doesn't have much appeal for negatron items, and if you go the zephyr route he won't get mercs either so he doesn't have many interesting MR sources (with wit's nerfed, it's a bit light for a single MR item). Maybe lean more toward gunblade/rageblade so he gets more MR from his ult?
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My core on him is Triforce/Gunblade/Giant's Belt, into Randuin's/Wit's End typically. Spirit Visage is quite good when coupled with Gunblade (or Warmogs), but you're right that none of the negatron items are that great for him. I usually want to build Warmogs on him, and about half the time I do- it doesn't really feel that great compared to just getting resistances though. I think the reason is between Triforce/Randuin's he already has a lot of hitpoints. In the right circumstances, Warmogs can be quite good, but I wouldn't get it every game.
I find getting Zehpyr extremely awkward, even though the item is awesome for Jax. Trinity Force/Gunblade are really hard to pass up, and if you get Zephyr you have to consider forgoing one of them unless you're absolutely crushing. I don't think leaning toward AP for the magic resistance really helps that much.
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After quite a lot of experimenting with TONS of different builds, i have found that Triforce is still the way to go with Jax. So my build would be flask-ward-1 pot. then into 1 or 2 dorans blades, then building a rageblade, pickaxe first, then into triforce either rushing sheen or phage first. after that i can build anything from a BotRK to a Randuins, or even a GA. My boots will be dependent on my laning partner and the enemy team composition.
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On January 23 2013 02:05 zer0das wrote:
My core on him is Triforce/Gunblade/Giant's Belt, into Randuin's/Wit's End typically. Spirit Visage is quite good when coupled with Gunblade (or Warmogs), but you're right that none of the negatron items are that great for him. I usually want to build Warmogs on him, and about half the time I do- it doesn't really feel that great compared to just getting resistances though. I think the reason is between Triforce/Randuin's he already has a lot of hitpoints. In the right circumstances, Warmogs can be quite good, but I wouldn't get it every game.
I find getting Zehpyr extremely awkward, even though the item is awesome for Jax. Trinity Force/Gunblade are really hard to pass up, and if you get Zephyr you have to consider forgoing one of them unless you're absolutely crushing. I don't think leaning toward AP for the magic resistance really helps that much.
i feel that an early belt can give you a massive advantage in the early game, especially if you are playing against a shen
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On January 30 2013 18:13 Jaydosu wrote:Show nested quote +On January 23 2013 02:05 zer0das wrote:
My core on him is Triforce/Gunblade/Giant's Belt, into Randuin's/Wit's End typically. Spirit Visage is quite good when coupled with Gunblade (or Warmogs), but you're right that none of the negatron items are that great for him. I usually want to build Warmogs on him, and about half the time I do- it doesn't really feel that great compared to just getting resistances though. I think the reason is between Triforce/Randuin's he already has a lot of hitpoints. In the right circumstances, Warmogs can be quite good, but I wouldn't get it every game.
I find getting Zehpyr extremely awkward, even though the item is awesome for Jax. Trinity Force/Gunblade are really hard to pass up, and if you get Zephyr you have to consider forgoing one of them unless you're absolutely crushing. I don't think leaning toward AP for the magic resistance really helps that much. i feel that an early belt can give you a massive advantage in the early game, especially if you are playing against a shen
Felt the same, but I wouldn't delay Phage or Sheen for it, unless I have to deal with massive jungle pressure. I also think that Triforce -> Gunblade leaves you far too squishy in most situations to really utilize it.
I played a game yesterday with a relatively weird teamcomp (Diana jungle, Akali mid, me top) where I was the tankiest dude around, so I went Triforce -> Warmog's -> Guardian Angel. It was awesome, because your damage is still respectable considering you only have a Triforce and the second I got a Vamp Scepter, they couldn't kill me any more no matter what.
Oh, about the Negatron items, I have found that Spirit Visage is really good if you manage to get some sustain in. CDR isn't half bad on the dude, being able to Q oh so often is really really neat for sticking to targets.
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Russian Federation798 Posts
I usually go with the normal Tri force build.
But I have had some success with Rage Blade and Frozen Mallet core with Randuins GA and Mercurial Scimitar. Makes it ridiculously easy to stick to anyone but I think you loose some tankiness with this build.
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rylais is a much better item on jax than mallet
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On January 30 2013 20:44 UniversalSnip wrote:
rylais is a much better item on jax than mallet
Have you done the math? On paper, mallet seems stronger, but then again, I go for ArP instead of MPen.
Oh, but honestly, I like neither of them too much.
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On January 30 2013 18:19 Shiv. wrote:Triforce -> Gunblade leaves you far too squishy in most situations to really utilize it.
I'm not saying straight up rush those items every game. Bilgewater cutlass/phage is what I aim to get first and foremost. Get enough resistances to not die instantly, then work towards Triforce/Gunblade. Getting tier 2 boots plus cutlass/phage is ~4k gold. Warden's Mail and some magic resistance is only 2-3k gold depending on how much you want? Which puts you around mid-game.
I never really feel like I'm not tanky enough- if we lose, its usually because someone royally screwed up their positioning and being slightly tankier isn't going to fix that.
I like getting an early Giant's Belt on jungle Jax, but if you're laning him I feel like its overkill in most situations.
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On January 30 2013 18:13 Jaydosu wrote:Show nested quote +On January 23 2013 02:05 zer0das wrote:
My core on him is Triforce/Gunblade/Giant's Belt, into Randuin's/Wit's End typically. Spirit Visage is quite good when coupled with Gunblade (or Warmogs), but you're right that none of the negatron items are that great for him. I usually want to build Warmogs on him, and about half the time I do- it doesn't really feel that great compared to just getting resistances though. I think the reason is between Triforce/Randuin's he already has a lot of hitpoints. In the right circumstances, Warmogs can be quite good, but I wouldn't get it every game.
I find getting Zehpyr extremely awkward, even though the item is awesome for Jax. Trinity Force/Gunblade are really hard to pass up, and if you get Zephyr you have to consider forgoing one of them unless you're absolutely crushing. I don't think leaning toward AP for the magic resistance really helps that much. i feel that an early belt can give you a massive advantage in the early game, especially if you are playing against a shen
Is Shen supposed to be a counter to jax? I found that barring jungle pressure, I can out damage his heals.
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Shen's a pain early on, but I feel like eventually Jax takes over if Shen doesn't build an advantage. It kind of depends on how laning goes more than anything.
That being said, if you're behind a Shen as Jax, you're going to have a really bad time.
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On January 30 2013 23:55 zer0das wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 18:19 Shiv. wrote:Triforce -> Gunblade leaves you far too squishy in most situations to really utilize it. I'm not saying straight up rush those items every game. Bilgewater cutlass/phage is what I aim to get first and foremost. Get enough resistances to not die instantly, then work towards Triforce/Gunblade. Getting tier 2 boots plus cutlass/phage is ~4k gold. Warden's Mail and some magic resistance is only 2-3k gold depending on how much you want? Which puts you around mid-game. I never really feel like I'm not tanky enough- if we lose, its usually because someone royally screwed up their positioning and being slightly tankier isn't going to fix that. I like getting an early Giant's Belt on jungle Jax, but if you're laning him I feel like its overkill in most situations.
This makes sense. I can agree with it. What's your reasoning behind Cutlass+Phage? I always felt like the double slow was overkill and I REALLY enjoy having a sheen around the time I hit 9, cause it synergizes with the way Jax harasses like no other item does. That is actually the main reason I never really liked Gunblade after the nerf - Trinity takes care of your need to slow people and I cannot see myself winning lane without Sheen.
Considering Shen, he wins hard pre6, it gets even at about 6 and you overpower him around 9-11.
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On January 30 2013 22:54 Shiv. wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 20:44 UniversalSnip wrote:
rylais is a much better item on jax than mallet Have you done the math? On paper, mallet seems stronger, but then again, I go for ArP instead of MPen. Oh, but honestly, I like neither of them too much.
I love mallet. I get it because my build philosophy as most melees is that I should be using multiplicative scaling for tankiness.
I get just enough damage to clear creeps fine and an optional sunfire cape because it is a good item for tanks. Jax doesn't need much to clear fine and sunfire mallet is enough.
Also I think mallet and BotRK trade better than TriForce but I can't be sure.
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Cutlass/phage gives you a lot more sticking power than either item individually, while also giving you a good mix of health, vamp, and damage. I don't like building Rylai's or Frozen Mallet, but Triforce by itself seems somewhat lacking. Having a slow you can use whenever you feel like you need it is really nice. Somtimes I go BotRK if the enemy team is going crazy on the health stacking.
Sunfire Cape/Mallet seems like a lot of cash spent on health for Jax. What items do you get after that?
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On January 31 2013 02:19 zer0das wrote:
Cutlass/phage gives you a lot more sticking power than either item individually, while also giving you a good mix of health, vamp, and damage. I don't like building Rylai's or Frozen Mallet, but Triforce by itself seems somewhat lacking. Having a slow you can use whenever you feel like you need it is really nice. Somtimes I go BotRK if the enemy team is going crazy on the health stacking.
Sunfire Cape/Mallet seems like a lot of cash spent on health for Jax. What items do you get after that?
Tank stuff. Some MR since I have the armor and some more armor.
I do pretty well at 12-1400 but that's probably also just due to how strong Jax is as a champion and how easy (imo) he is to play.
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IBG for sure on jax. I have been doing hexdrinker/IBG/warmogs and having a lot of success. well rounded stats and tanky/damage
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On January 31 2013 02:00 obesechicken13 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 22:54 Shiv. wrote:On January 30 2013 20:44 UniversalSnip wrote:
rylais is a much better item on jax than mallet Have you done the math? On paper, mallet seems stronger, but then again, I go for ArP instead of MPen. Oh, but honestly, I like neither of them too much. I love mallet. I get it because my build philosophy as most melees is that I should be using multiplicative scaling for tankiness. I get just enough damage to clear creeps fine and an optional sunfire cape because it is a good item for tanks. Jax doesn't need much to clear fine and sunfire mallet is enough. Also I think mallet and BotRK trade better than TriForce but I can't be sure.
Sorry, it might be because I'm really tired, but I don't really understand the post? You get mallet for clearing creeps? What?
Or are you saying that you don't build any damage on Jax in general and just need SOME AD to clear and get that from mallet?
Considering Mallet/BotrK vs. Triforce, well, there's two things to consider about your statement. By the time you have Mallet AND BotrK, you are most certainly not trading with or harassing anyone any more, because laning phase should be over. Secondly, it's probably better than just trinity for sticking to an AD carry, for example, but that's sort of obvious, considering the combination is about 2k gold more expensive.
On January 31 2013 02:21 VayneAuthority wrote:
IBG for sure on jax. I have been doing hexdrinker/IBG/warmogs and having a lot of success. well rounded stats and tanky/damage
Haven't tried it for some reason, but it sounds awesome. A slow without delaying Sheen. Isn't your damage a little low without ANY attack speed, though?
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On January 31 2013 02:44 Shiv. wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2013 02:00 obesechicken13 wrote:On January 30 2013 22:54 Shiv. wrote:On January 30 2013 20:44 UniversalSnip wrote:
rylais is a much better item on jax than mallet Have you done the math? On paper, mallet seems stronger, but then again, I go for ArP instead of MPen. Oh, but honestly, I like neither of them too much. I love mallet. I get it because my build philosophy as most melees is that I should be using multiplicative scaling for tankiness. I get just enough damage to clear creeps fine and an optional sunfire cape because it is a good item for tanks. Jax doesn't need much to clear fine and sunfire mallet is enough. Also I think mallet and BotRK trade better than TriForce but I can't be sure. Sorry, it might be because I'm really tired, but I don't really understand the post? You get mallet for clearing creeps? What? Or are you saying that you don't build any damage on Jax in general and just need SOME AD to clear and get that from mallet? Considering Mallet/BotrK vs. Triforce, well, there's two things to consider about your statement. By the time you have Mallet AND BotrK, you are most certainly not trading with or harassing anyone any more, because laning phase should be over. Secondly, it's probably better than just trinity for sticking to an AD carry, for example, but that's sort of obvious, considering the combination is about 2k gold more expensive. Show nested quote +On January 31 2013 02:21 VayneAuthority wrote:
IBG for sure on jax. I have been doing hexdrinker/IBG/warmogs and having a lot of success. well rounded stats and tanky/damage Haven't tried it for some reason, but it sounds awesome. A slow without delaying Sheen. Isn't your damage a little low without ANY attack speed, though?
Yes I just like the AD on mallet since it lets me clear slightly faster.
You're right that laning phase should be over unless you're a pro at farming. That is actually important to consider, but after laning ends you can still have duels and the 200 heal, 100 damage from BotRK is hard to beat as is the sheer amount of tankiness and chasing capability that mallet provides. I'm not trying to compare a 5k gold item set to a 4k gold item, but rather how good they are with gold taken into consideration.how good they are individually.
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On January 31 2013 02:44 Shiv. wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2013 02:00 obesechicken13 wrote:On January 30 2013 22:54 Shiv. wrote:On January 30 2013 20:44 UniversalSnip wrote:
rylais is a much better item on jax than mallet Have you done the math? On paper, mallet seems stronger, but then again, I go for ArP instead of MPen. Oh, but honestly, I like neither of them too much. I love mallet. I get it because my build philosophy as most melees is that I should be using multiplicative scaling for tankiness. I get just enough damage to clear creeps fine and an optional sunfire cape because it is a good item for tanks. Jax doesn't need much to clear fine and sunfire mallet is enough. Also I think mallet and BotRK trade better than TriForce but I can't be sure. Sorry, it might be because I'm really tired, but I don't really understand the post? You get mallet for clearing creeps? What? Or are you saying that you don't build any damage on Jax in general and just need SOME AD to clear and get that from mallet? Considering Mallet/BotrK vs. Triforce, well, there's two things to consider about your statement. By the time you have Mallet AND BotrK, you are most certainly not trading with or harassing anyone any more, because laning phase should be over. Secondly, it's probably better than just trinity for sticking to an AD carry, for example, but that's sort of obvious, considering the combination is about 2k gold more expensive. Show nested quote +On January 31 2013 02:21 VayneAuthority wrote:
IBG for sure on jax. I have been doing hexdrinker/IBG/warmogs and having a lot of success. well rounded stats and tanky/damage Haven't tried it for some reason, but it sounds awesome. A slow without delaying Sheen. Isn't your damage a little low without ANY attack speed, though?
I find relentless assault to be enough personally, I would maybe add in zephyr after warmogs but ive never gotten there.
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I'd think BOTRK on Jax should pretty much be core - He's got the kit to make it work well (+AS, is autoattack reliant, desires sustain, benefits from added sticking power) and the buildup is deliciously smooth (can stop at Vamp, or stop at Bilgewater, or finish the whole thing before buidling pieces or all of warmogs)
Also, he really benefits a lot from warmogs being FOTM - the free resists from activating ulti multiply well with the HP, and his dodge is a sort of built-in counter to lifesteal (which can otherwise be a minor problem caused by running high HP+mediocre resists)
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EPT
