On February 09 2011 08:31 oberon wrote: Why the hate on crit? Mathematically, maximum DPS comes from an even amount spent on AD, AS, crit, and pen, with some variation based on pen capping at opponents' armor. Just from theorycrafting, I'd assume crit > AS on Panth, because your goal is to hop on someone, murdelate them in about 5 hits of spear/auto/HSS, and then get out again, which seems like it would be improved much more by crit than AS. Not the case?
Probably a combination of HSS giving 100% crit chance if the opponent is below 15% HP and spear/HSS not using crit to deal more damage.
On February 08 2011 13:32 Zanzabar Haberdasher wrote: Do you think there is any merit to this build:
Longsword + pot Bruta Merc Treads GB Infinity Edge Randuins GA
I've tried the cleavers but IE's crit makes GB seem so much better in my eyes.
i think boots are just straight up #1 build right now tbh. sword could work but I think you'll lose to dshield vs. pretty much everyone imo. the only time I've ever opened longsword is on duo lanes.
I really dislike IE on Panth tbh. BC actually makes me like GB more than IE does for 2 reasons: 1. armor reduc synergizes well with the flat penetration (after 3 hits, effectively get 90 Armor Pen (25 runes, 20 GB, 45 BC)), which will dump on most characters you need to dump on. 2. The AS along with the GB active lets you hit critical mass on your AS. and there are 2 other reasons 3. 1000 gold cheaper lets you tank out 100 gold quicker. 4. AS and no money wasted on crit makes it stronger for solo pushing which is the #1 use of Pantheon late game.
I also think nerfed randuin's is no good on Panth. The only time I really advocated for it was when it was just broken. Nowadays GA is your go-to item for Armor and BV is your go-to item for MRes. More than GA is overkill in 99% of the games you'll see though because your passive along with judicious use of your W gives you a ton of extra physical durability.
Why the hate on crit? Mathematically, maximum DPS comes from an even amount spent on AD, AS, crit, and pen, with some variation based on pen capping at opponents' armor. Just from theorycrafting, I'd assume crit > AS on Panth, because your goal is to hop on someone, murdelate them in about 5 hits of spear/auto/HSS, and then get out again, which seems like it would be improved much more by crit than AS. Not the case?
>_<
AS helps for pushing. Crit Chance loses roughly 15% of it's value from HSS's passive portion (actually more in practice because attacks are more frequently used to finish your combo than abilities). AS speeds your attack animation which lets you animation cancel attacks easier (easier sticking and easier to sneak attacks into your combos.
I mean, your DPS theory there assumes autoattacking as primary source of damage, when in reality Panth does more damage from abilities than attacks, making both AS and Crit not great on him... but to the extent that you need one, AS is better and BC synergizes with penetration to rape low armor targets.
On February 09 2011 10:10 Juicyfruit wrote: Flat mana blues and a mixture of flat mp5 and scaling mp5 yellows have been working for me.
Do you really need that much mana/mana regen on Panth? I only run mp5/lvl blues but even without those I don't really run into mana regen problems.
I guess if you're spamming spear on CD in the early game, then you might, but I tend to wait till i can burst people and conserve mana while they're playing safe.
Once I hit the mid-late game, I generally don't have any mana problems.
i desperately need the mana when i'm playing pantheon. lvls 1-6 consist of me browbeating the shit out of whoever im laning against with a million-jillion spears, which means i run out of mana all the time if im not running excessive mp5 runes.
I find that I start pretty aggressive to establish early dominance with Panth in the lane, but then, as soon as they back off a little bit, I start to just play super-safe and just stay content to zone them with 'threat' of harassment, while free-farming. Because of that I'll use a lot of mana very quickly, but will be at full mana again before they're ready to try to pressure me back.
Then again, I'm a noob, so I'm probably playing against noobs who can't deal with Pantheon.. so..
Any thoughts on this? Obviously it tries to be as general as possible, but what are peoples' thoughts on the stuff that's somewhat Panth-specific?
Maxing HSS first was a big WTF for me, though I lol-ed when Dan mentioned that he maxed spear first vs Corki, because Corki could Valk out of stuns--Dan would know all about that.
On February 12 2011 03:26 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote: more like "teach a scrub to last hit"
I tried to watch the first episode. Then the caitlyn he was midding against tried to start a fight under dan's tower, lost the exchange, and dan went back. Dan then raped the caitlyn for the rest of the game. That wasnt the sad part. The sad part was that the caitlyn kept pushing the lane, doing all the work of zoning for dan. A blind retarded monkey could have done better.
Any thoughts on this? Obviously it tries to be as general as possible, but what are peoples' thoughts on the stuff that's somewhat Panth-specific?
Maxing HSS first was a big WTF for me, though I lol-ed when Dan mentioned that he maxed spear first vs Corki, because Corki could Valk out of stuns--Dan would know all about that.
i think the biggest thing to take away from that video is shield usage, he stresses a couple of times that the only times he really engages is when his shield is up, which is incredibly important, and something that the vast majority of panths i play with/against simply dont pay attention to
On February 12 2011 03:26 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote: more like "teach a scrub to last hit"
I tried to watch the first episode. Then the caitlyn he was midding against tried to start a fight under dan's tower, lost the exchange, and dan went back. Dan then raped the caitlyn for the rest of the game. That wasnt the sad part. The sad part was that the caitlyn kept pushing the lane, doing all the work of zoning for dan. A blind retarded monkey could have done better.
I mean, the Caitlyn was self-admittedly 700 Elo. I don't think most of what was actually demonstrated in the video was the take-away from that, more than what Dan himself was discussing.
On February 12 2011 03:39 gtrsrs wrote: panth is no-longer banworthy imo in fact i think he's a weak pick with urgot and renekton seeing a rise in power and popularity
I thought Panth was ban-worthy not based on power-level, but based on the fact that he abuses the hell out of idiocy from people who lane poorly against him and who overextend into jump ganks.
Any thoughts on this? Obviously it tries to be as general as possible, but what are peoples' thoughts on the stuff that's somewhat Panth-specific?
Maxing HSS first was a big WTF for me, though I lol-ed when Dan mentioned that he maxed spear first vs Corki, because Corki could Valk out of stuns--Dan would know all about that.
maxing HSS is fine, I just find it gimmicky. It's basically all-in on 1 shotting squishies.
I prefer 21 util and 9 defensive, but you can do w/e I guess.
Shield bit is true but I thought it was sorta obvious >_<.
On February 12 2011 03:39 gtrsrs wrote: panth is no-longer banworthy imo in fact i think he's a weak pick with urgot and renekton seeing a rise in power and popularity
I thought Panth was ban-worthy not based on power-level, but based on the fact that he abuses the hell out of idiocy from people who lane poorly against him and who overextend into jump ganks.
I like this description of Panth. The mistake punisher.
On February 12 2011 08:04 rwrzr wrote: I like this description of Panth. The mistake punisher.
I mean, it applies to a lot of the common bans. Rammus/Shaco are strong gankers that abuse early overextension. Rammus also takes advantage of tanks that don't eat the powerball for their carries. Shen rectifies an ally's mistake AND lets you abuse overextension with his ulti.
* Heartseeker Strike now deals damage slower - it takes 0.5 seconds longer to deal full damage * Grand Skyfall now has a small area near the center that deals full damage (previously it was impossible to deal full damage to any target)
EPT
