EPT[Patch 3.12] (j/k) Jinx General Discussion - Page 14
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Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
On October 02 2013 01:08 Seuss wrote: Tanky/CDR Olaf got nerfed. You need an additional 108 AD at level 18 to do the same damage with rank 5 E as you did before, you take more damage than before (both due to increased cost and loss of Spell Vamp), and you need to auto-attack twice each time for the cooldown to be equivalent. You get 80 AD while ulting, but that's for a mere 6 seconds. Axes also have a minimum range of 400 now, so you can't just sit on top of someone mashing Q and E anymore. I'm not sure what to make of the new Olaf yet, but his new incarnation seems strictly inferior as a jungler unless you can pull off a Meteos style and go Hydra. Na, Olaf didn't have a "flat" cost on his E, he only had flat damage, and a 40% of that damage cost. Since his E does less damage now, he actually takes less himself unless he builds a shitton of AD. Basically Olaf is weaker than before with 0 damage item, and comparatively stronger than before at 1, 2, etc. damage items builds. Since he can't survive without building tanky, the question becomes "How many can he afford, and which ones" and then "how comfortable is it to get in lane", because if his laning turns out to be too weak to afford building a damage item first and he has to build defense, then offense, it'd make him way weaker until mid/late game compared to before. The minimal distance on Q actually isn't too aggravating, if you're moving in the axe's direction you lose what, 0.5s, which becomes 1s if you take the time to drop an aa in-between? On a still target you lose the ability to chain axes, but if they try to run and don't zig-zag (kinda hard to do with the slow) it feels pretty natural. Think how Draven chases? Except that the axe doesn't lead you. And he's probably nerfed for jungle purposes, yeah. :/ | ||
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The_Unseen
France1923 Posts
On October 02 2013 02:48 Argoth. wrote: aaanndd EUW is having issues *Y u do dis to me | ||
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Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
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The_Unseen
France1923 Posts
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On October 02 2013 02:54 Osmoses wrote: Well they're both farm champs, I'd say nasus scales better, and either way settling into farm lane is hardly a "win". That's very debatable. Poppy becomes literally invincible and unpeelable and can literally one or two shot squishies, especially with new Triforce. She's been long acknowledged as one of, if not the strongest scaling late game carry, but never sees play because of how much farm she needs and how bad she is at getting said farm. | ||
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Dusty
United States3359 Posts
Bork Trinity olaf, on the otherhand, is fucking hilarious. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On October 02 2013 02:54 Osmoses wrote: Well they're both farm champs, I'd say nasus scales better, and either way settling into farm lane is hardly a "win". You don't know Poppy's lategame if you're making a definitive claim that Nasus scales better. | ||
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Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On October 02 2013 02:58 Alaric wrote: Na, Olaf didn't have a "flat" cost on his E, he only had flat damage, and a 40% of that damage cost. Since his E does less damage now, he actually takes less himself unless he builds a shitton of AD. Basically Olaf is weaker than before with 0 damage item, and comparatively stronger than before at 1, 2, etc. damage items builds. Since he can't survive without building tanky, the question becomes "How many can he afford, and which ones" and then "how comfortable is it to get in lane", because if his laning turns out to be too weak to afford building a damage item first and he has to build defense, then offense, it'd make him way weaker until mid/late game compared to before. The minimal distance on Q actually isn't too aggravating, if you're moving in the axe's direction you lose what, 0.5s, which becomes 1s if you take the time to drop an aa in-between? On a still target you lose the ability to chain axes, but if they try to run and don't zig-zag (kinda hard to do with the slow) it feels pretty natural. Think how Draven chases? Except that the axe doesn't lead you. And he's probably nerfed for jungle purposes, yeah. :/ You actually only need 108 bonus AD at level 18 to do equivalent/more damage to yourself. That's basically runes + masteries + ult. Moreover, you no longer have Spell Vamp to offset the cost. Unless you're last-hitting with it (lulz) you're taking more damage. I don't know enough about Olaf's laning to know how he'll work now, but all the Olafs that scared me on the rare occasions I played top maxed E first, which is now significantly weaker. Olaf may be forced into Herbivore status, maxing W so he can just sustain and farm forever. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On October 02 2013 03:18 Osmoses wrote: I have played against it, and yeah it's beastly while her ulti is up, but Nasus has carried harder. The Poppy you played against probably wasn't very good or was behind. I think you're vastly underestimating the strength of 8 seconds of literal invicibility and invulnerability on a champion that can easily 2 shot your carry. She's also a absolute monster without her ult because her passive virtually nullifies burst and makes her deceptively tanky at all hp levels. Nasus is far more consistent and generally more useful. I wouldn't say he "carries harder" so much that he "carries more often." On October 02 2013 03:21 Seuss wrote: You actually only need 108 bonus AD at level 18 to do equivalent/more damage to yourself. That's basically runes + masteries + ult. Moreover, you no longer have Spell Vamp to offset the cost. Unless you're last-hitting with it (lulz) you're taking more damage. I don't know enough about Olaf's laning to know how he'll work now, but all the Olafs that scared me on the rare occasions I played top maxed E first, which is now significantly weaker. Olaf may be forced into Herbivore status, maxing W so he can just sustain and farm forever. Didn't most top-level Olafs max Q though? Either way I agree with your conclusion. Olaf's dueling power 1v1 seems so much weaker early in lane. He's a monster with levels and farms like always, but minimum range Q means it's harder to duel 1v1 with it. Lower E damage also means maxing E doesn't give you the lane presence it used to either. | ||
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emraaa
Germany505 Posts
On October 02 2013 03:18 Osmoses wrote: I have played against it, and yeah it's beastly while her ulti is up, but Nasus has carried harder. Farmed Poppy >>>>>>>> farmed Nasus , in every situation | ||
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Zaphod Beeblebrox
Denmark697 Posts
If the Poppy has no clue, its a really one sided lane though. You need to make sure to trade one Olaf E for two Poppy Q's to win trades, and that is doable due to how hard it is for Olaf to disengage from her - still hard to do though. Actually Poppy likes lanes with champions she can get a prolonged trade (5-6 seconds) against, because of her short cooldown Q and good follow up combo with E. Someone like Renekton or Riven who can disengage quickly after their combo can probably bully her hard. Nasus got beaten badly by Poppy the last time I checked (Poppy Q > Nasus Q until late game, and her kit is barely affected by wither). | ||
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Zess
Adun Toridas!9144 Posts
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EquilasH
Denmark2142 Posts
On October 02 2013 02:54 Osmoses wrote: Well they're both farm champs, I'd say nasus scales better, and either way settling into farm lane is hardly a "win". I don't think you've actually played a good Poppy if you say Nasus scales harder than Poppy. Nasus definitely scales hard but Poppy is on a different level when it comes to scaling. Edit: I'd like to think I know a lot about Poppy since Poppy and Riven were the 2 champions I carried myself to Diamond with in season 2 (I started playing Poppy at around 1900 rating and ever since 1900 rating Poppy and Riven were basically the only 2 champs I played until I reached Diamond). | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
Someone figure it out cuz I'm bad. | ||
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Fusilero
United Kingdom50293 Posts
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AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
On October 02 2013 03:36 jcarlsoniv wrote: Y'know, I would love if Poppy is actually viable. My first ever penta was with Poppy. Someone figure it out cuz I'm bad. Specifically, someone figure out Poppy mid because Soniv literally can play no other lane. + Show Spoiler + NO WALLS IN MID FK U DAWG + Show Spoiler +  | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On October 02 2013 03:40 AsmodeusXI wrote: Specifically, someone figure out Poppy mid because Soniv literally can play no other lane. + Show Spoiler + NO WALLS IN MID FK U DAWG + Show Spoiler + Dude, you kidding me? There's so many walls mid. Not only that, you have full access to BOTH RIVERS. Neo, lemme play it in IH pls - I maek werk | ||
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