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[Patch 3.11] General Discussion - Page 160

Forum Index > LoL General
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Dark_Chill
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada3353 Posts
September 16 2013 02:22 GMT
#3181
On September 16 2013 11:00 UniversalSnip wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2013 10:42 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
vayne deserves nothing for pushing 1 to bork and then tumbling around randomly under ulti

botrk the problem there


Not sure how much this holds true. Vayne uses bork really well, sure, but nerfing bork would probably make it look like a much less compelling option for everyone else (especially with Tri-force how it is now).
CUTE MAKES RIGHT
UniversalSnip
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
9871 Posts
September 16 2013 02:29 GMT
#3182
On September 16 2013 11:22 Dark_Chill wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2013 11:00 UniversalSnip wrote:
On September 16 2013 10:42 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
vayne deserves nothing for pushing 1 to bork and then tumbling around randomly under ulti

botrk the problem there


Not sure how much this holds true. Vayne uses bork really well, sure, but nerfing bork would probably make it look like a much less compelling option for everyone else (especially with Tri-force how it is now).

so? lol
"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12387 Posts
September 16 2013 02:30 GMT
#3183
how is orianna damage so high wow
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
September 16 2013 02:40 GMT
#3184
Honestly, 3.10a and 3.11 made such a HUGE shift in the metagame that it leaves me annoyed. Zac went from 100% pick/ban to being picked what? once or twice? Corki went from completely unpicked to 100% pick/ban.

Say what you want about teams needing to adjust, but honestly can you really say that teams were able to fully understand how to play with/against Corki with Triforce or play without Zac? I really don't think you can.
Cloud9157
Profile Joined December 2010
United States2968 Posts
September 16 2013 02:47 GMT
#3185
On September 16 2013 11:30 ETisME wrote:
how is orianna damage so high wow


When a 30 minute Orianna is actually doing 55 minute damage Orianna, she does a lot of damage.
"Are you absolutely sure that armor only affects the health portion of a protoss army??? That doesn't sound right to me. source?" -Some idiot
ShaLLoW[baY]
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Canada12499 Posts
September 16 2013 03:34 GMT
#3186
On September 16 2013 11:16 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2013 10:42 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
vayne deserves nothing for pushing 1 to bork and then tumbling around randomly under ulti


Like, if you don't think Vayne is a decently-high level AD carry in difficulty, and you don't like watching Vaynes in progames (which is 100% of what my balance complaints are about, because I know I'm not good enough for it to effect my games), then my only conclusion is you want the position to be eliminated from the game.


not at all, i just absolutely hate vayne and playing against her, maybe it's just my silver showing but she is guaranteed to get fed, and crushes the shit out of my bot lane every game

although, since i hit silver 1 suddenly i'm going legendary and carrying hard as shit as lee jungle, it's like everyone got worse in this league, which is awesome as the elise skin suddenly looks attainable
ALEXISONFIRE ARE FUCKING BACK (sAviOr for life)
FinestHour
Profile Joined August 2010
United States18466 Posts
September 16 2013 03:40 GMT
#3187
anyone in gold 2/1 wanna duo sometime add me
thug life.                                                       MVP/ex-
InfSunday
Profile Joined March 2013
United States735 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-09-16 03:54:53
September 16 2013 03:53 GMT
#3188
On September 16 2013 12:34 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2013 11:16 cLutZ wrote:
On September 16 2013 10:42 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
vayne deserves nothing for pushing 1 to bork and then tumbling around randomly under ulti


Like, if you don't think Vayne is a decently-high level AD carry in difficulty, and you don't like watching Vaynes in progames (which is 100% of what my balance complaints are about, because I know I'm not good enough for it to effect my games), then my only conclusion is you want the position to be eliminated from the game.


not at all, i just absolutely hate vayne and playing against her, maybe it's just my silver showing but she is guaranteed to get fed, and crushes the shit out of my bot lane every game


As a silver who plays Vayne a lot, and gets fed a lot, it's actually hilarious how badly people lane against her. It's like they don't know what she does. I'm Vayne - my early game isn't very good, unless you're an Ashe who walks right next to every wall all the time and lets me stun you every five seconds. It's hilarious, I'll get a kill with condemn at level three a lot of the time and the all chat just goes into "Vayne so op" - it's like, do you even know who I am? That's not being overpowered, that's just me using my champion how she should be used.

Just pick Draven/MF Leona bot against Vayne and laugh as she melts.

Edit: though I admit most of the other marksmen (hue) are more fun to watch in pro games.
Call me Sunday
jaybrundage
Profile Joined December 2009
United States3921 Posts
September 16 2013 05:12 GMT
#3189
On September 16 2013 12:53 InfSunday wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2013 12:34 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
On September 16 2013 11:16 cLutZ wrote:
On September 16 2013 10:42 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
vayne deserves nothing for pushing 1 to bork and then tumbling around randomly under ulti


Like, if you don't think Vayne is a decently-high level AD carry in difficulty, and you don't like watching Vaynes in progames (which is 100% of what my balance complaints are about, because I know I'm not good enough for it to effect my games), then my only conclusion is you want the position to be eliminated from the game.


not at all, i just absolutely hate vayne and playing against her, maybe it's just my silver showing but she is guaranteed to get fed, and crushes the shit out of my bot lane every game


As a silver who plays Vayne a lot, and gets fed a lot, it's actually hilarious how badly people lane against her. It's like they don't know what she does. I'm Vayne - my early game isn't very good, unless you're an Ashe who walks right next to every wall all the time and lets me stun you every five seconds. It's hilarious, I'll get a kill with condemn at level three a lot of the time and the all chat just goes into "Vayne so op" - it's like, do you even know who I am? That's not being overpowered, that's just me using my champion how she should be used.

Just pick Draven/MF Leona bot against Vayne and laugh as she melts.

Edit: though I admit most of the other marksmen (hue) are more fun to watch in pro games.

Just crushed a Vayne Janna lane with Blitz Corki. But then again my blitz crushes everylane H4 H4 H4

The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in battle.
obesechicken13
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States10467 Posts
September 16 2013 05:27 GMT
#3190
On September 16 2013 06:23 Ketara wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2013 04:42 obesechicken13 wrote:
On September 16 2013 04:34 Ketara wrote:
On September 16 2013 04:27 obesechicken13 wrote:
On September 16 2013 03:00 Ketara wrote:
On September 16 2013 02:53 onlywonderboy wrote:
On September 16 2013 02:52 ArchAngelSC wrote:
On September 16 2013 02:44 wei2coolman wrote:
On September 16 2013 02:41 Slusher wrote:
The live version is pretty situational on every champion not named vayne.

Twitch, Kog, and Trist, benefit pretty well off of BotRK.

I don't get why people build it on Trist as she already has a 90% aspd boost with her Q ... She needs damage not more aspd.

Helps round out her weak mid game.


BotRK isn't the bad item on Trist, PD is.

21 offense, BotRK and rank 5 Q gives her exactly 2.5 ASPD at 18.

Few months ago I did some Tristana math, the highest damage 4 item combo for Trist is actually BotRK, IE, LW, Ghostblade. Use the ghostblade active as soon as Q drops.

I don't believe your math.


You don't think 30 AD and 20 armor pen outdamages 15% crit, as a general statement?

Added some details to my last post. I don't believe your build gives the maximum dps.

Robot has a lot of flaws. For instance if you're shooting multiple targets you're not likely getting the most out of your botrk active. Most targets will be damaged so you're not hitting targets from full health. There are multiple targets with less than 2500 hp. Ghostblade active can be wasted if you get scared away from a fight. And burst damage from spells tends to favor the weaker dps build. In general a double PD build will blow any other AD carry build out of the water.


Okay. Lets do some simple math, looking at these builds.

I noticed that the way I was doing math for Attack Speed is incorrect, so I went into a custom game and got all the items to check the attack speeds. It took a long time so you BETTER APPRECIATE IT QQ

+ Show Spoiler [numbers] +

At level 18 Tristana has 100.5 base AD and base 1.12832 ASPD.
With runes (hybrid pen / armor / mr / lifesteal), 21/9/0 masteries and items, she's at the following:

Build A: (IE LW PD PD)
AD: 225.5
Arpen: 35%+8%+13.1
ASPD: 2.5 with Q, 2.09 without Q

Build B: (IE IE LW BotRK)
AD: 320.5
Arpen: 35%+8%+13.1
ASPD: 2.18 with Q, 1.59 without Q



Now, ignoring the BotRK passive altogether, lets look at some DPS totals vs. different armor amounts.

+ Show Spoiler [conclusions] +

Build A: (IE LW PD PD)
DPS vs. 100(46.7) armor: 764.73 with Q, then 639.31
DPS vs. 200(106.5) armor: 543.27 with Q, then 454.17
DPS vs. 300(166.3) armor: 421.27 with Q, then 352.18

Build B: (IE IE LW BotRK)
DPS vs. 100(46.7) armor: 869.19 with Q, then 633.95
DPS vs. 200(106.5) armor: 617.48 with Q, then 450.36
DPS vs. 300(166.3) armor: 478.82 with Q, then 349.23


So as we can see, the IE LW PD PD build does less damage while Q is active, and after it goes down does less than 1% more, which will be overtaken by the BotRK passive no matter how much HP the target has. Also the build with BotRK has lifesteal and a BotRK active.


Moral of the story, screw Ghostblade I'm a baddie. I wonder what the numbers for IE PD LW BotRK would be on Trist in comparison.

Fk. lol double IE is broken for a 4 item comparison.
I think in our modern age technology has evolved to become more addictive. The things that don't give us pleasure aren't used as much. Work was never meant to be fun, but doing it makes us happier in the long run.
Flakes
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States3125 Posts
September 16 2013 05:35 GMT
#3191
On September 16 2013 09:30 ticklishmusic wrote:
Honestly, I think Corki's strength will normalize soon- he's not batshit OP. He's just following the usual trend:

Stage 1: Gets buffed, no one notices
Stage 2: Gets buffed people notice and winrate goes up
Stage 3: FOTM
Stage 4: People learn to deal with him
Stage 5: Winrate stabilizes

He is still pretty weak pre-6/ first back IMO. His passive isn't going to add significant damage, and his escape is still on a long CD. He has no long range harass or CC, and his only harassing skill costs a buttload of mana. That changes once he gets Sheen or hits 6, but he's pretty bully-able before then.

Stage 4+ only applies to games that don't get patched every 2-3 weeks
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
September 16 2013 05:41 GMT
#3192
Who cares if Corki is good, the important point is that Corki is boring.
Freeeeeeedom
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-09-16 06:59:43
September 16 2013 06:59 GMT
#3193
pfft. I for one, welcome Corki overlords. I'm just annoyed at the fact he became 100% pick/ban almost purely because of a last-minute Riot patch.

/tinfoil hat mode on
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
September 16 2013 07:22 GMT
#3194
On September 16 2013 14:41 cLutZ wrote:
Who cares if Corki is good, the important point is that Corki is boring.

Kog clearly the problem. Not corki.
liftlift > tsm
Itsmedudeman
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States19229 Posts
September 16 2013 07:24 GMT
#3195
When trinity force works on kogmaw...
wussleeQ
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States3130 Posts
September 16 2013 07:28 GMT
#3196
just got the rp from the amex card woo. ended up using my amazon account for the direct deposit. forgot i even had one from doing all those survey things for cash a few years back lol
BW -> League -> CSGO
Dusty
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States3359 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-09-16 07:34:42
September 16 2013 07:28 GMT
#3197
honestly have no idea why people build bork on vayne anymore anyways, bt trinity on vayne lets her 3 shot the enemy ad carry, its ridiculous.

edit: well, i guess 4 shot if you dont luck out and get a crit, but still. 4 shotting an ad carry with 2 items is just hilarious.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-09-16 07:44:31
September 16 2013 07:42 GMT
#3198
On September 16 2013 16:28 Dusty wrote:
honestly have no idea why people build bork on vayne anymore anyways, bt trinity on vayne lets her 3 shot the enemy ad carry, its ridiculous.

edit: well, i guess 4 shot if you dont luck out and get a crit, but still. 4 shotting an ad carry with 2 items is just hilarious.

Because BotRK gives you a powerful single item timing that translates into solo-killing potential against a lot of champs.

Trinity is a powerful fighting item, but doesn't have the same solo-kill usefulness that BotRK does, especially since it no longer carries a slow. With Vayne and Twitch in particular this suits their power curves because they are strong duelists/solo-killers at that 1-item timing, but would not necessarily be strong teamfighters even if you chose teamfight-focused items.
Moderator
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
September 16 2013 07:43 GMT
#3199
On September 16 2013 16:22 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 16 2013 14:41 cLutZ wrote:
Who cares if Corki is good, the important point is that Corki is boring.

Kog clearly the problem. Not corki.


LOL, hugs.
Freeeeeeedom
Itsmedudeman
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States19229 Posts
September 16 2013 07:53 GMT
#3200
Apparently TSM were winning a lot against the teams in group B.
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