EPT[Patch 1.0.0.153: Preseason Balance Update 1] GD - Page 52
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Sermokala
United States14220 Posts
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On December 18 2012 01:05 zulu_nation8 wrote: neo what is your problem? I'm not allowed to post more than once to argue a point? You argue such mundane points that it's kinda irritating. Especially when you're in the minority here. It's a mastery point here we're talking about and you can't seem to find any merit to a free ward. I can totally see where you're coming from where that 1 mastery point could be invested in something better but hell, it's like you're trying to convince us that it's never worth getting. It's perfectly ok for a Support who's already going deep in the Utility tree. TL;DR: there's zero strategic "discussion" whether or not someone gets Explorer's Ward. It's a matter of preference. If you can't accept that, there's no helping you. | ||
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Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
^^^^^^^^^^ why is there 0 strategic discussion about it? I see no reason why it should be a matter of preference. Care to elaborate? | ||
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
On December 18 2012 01:13 Requizen wrote: Kind of sucks for him if you decide to start Red or steal his Red instead if he's that predictable. People used to do that a lot season 2, going to enemy lee/shaco/shyv red if they started blue and went to your red. But now people are smarter that if they don't see you coming to your own red they'll tell their team to collapse without vision. | ||
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
Compare it's worth against the ward. I highly doubt the comparison is even close. | ||
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Sandster
United States4054 Posts
On December 18 2012 01:16 zulu_nation8 wrote: People used to do that a lot season 1, going to enemy lee/shaco/shyv red if they started blue and went to your red. But now people are smarter that if they don't see you coming to your own red they'll tell their team to collapse without vision. But you outnumber them either way. The moment you see Shaco with your explorer ward you collapse on him, or you go to his red and outnumber his team 4v3 while still having smite. Since your situation is about purple side, you will have mid/bot lane give you a hard smiteless blue. | ||
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clickrush
Switzerland3257 Posts
explorers ward is basicly 25 free gold from the start. I often use it somewhere in the early game to check brushes, mostly in lane. | ||
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
On December 18 2012 01:21 Sandster wrote: But you outnumber them either way. The moment you see Shaco with your explorer ward you collapse on him, or you go to his red and outnumber his team 4v3 while still having smite. Since your situation is about purple side, you will have mid/bot lane give you a hard smiteless blue. does not work even half the time in solo queue, and shaco is only played in solo queue. This is why people ban shaco. counter-counterjungling is not just basic math like 4>3. If say you have a vlad top vs an enemy darius, telling him to collapse is forcing him to lose lane. I understand if you go counter his red it's a 4v3 but it rarely works out in your favor. | ||
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WhiteDog
France8650 Posts
On December 18 2012 01:29 zulu_nation8 wrote: does not work even half the time in solo queue, and shaco is only played in solo queue. This is why people ban shaco. counter-counterjungling is not just basic math like 4>3. If say you have a vlad top vs an enemy darius, telling him to collapse is forcing him to lose lane. I understand if you go counter his red it's a 4v3 but it rarely works out in your favor. Why the fuck are we talking about Shaco ? If shaco makes it useless, then don't take explorer wards if you see the opponent Shaco and that's it ! You won. | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
As for the Explorer's Ward discussion, I thought about this for 5 whole minutes and it can be dumbed down into 2 whole points: 1. Is a "free" 60 second ward worth it? How can you ever say no? Free sight for zero ingame gold? Sign me up. 2. Is a 60 second ward worth a mastery point? My Support Masteries This is my Support page. Assuming you don't go Articifer like me, you technically have 2 points to put into Awareness or Expanded Mind. That's 3 additional mana per level (@2 points) or 1.25% additional exp. Might be me just seeing it as cutting hairs but with benefits so small, how is this not a preference issue? As for the Explorer's Ward itself, I see two application options here: 1. Invading, seeing as how the ward itself only lasts a minute, your team must be in reasonable distance to act on the intel the ward provide. So say you're invading enemy Blue buff as Blue side, you run over and Explorer Ward the Golem brush and stand back into Purple side's non-river tri-brush by the Bot Outer turret. 2. You see an aggressive Jungler like Xin. You'd set an Explorer's Ward at 2 min in anticipation of a level 2 gank. If a level 2 gank isn't coming, a full 3 minute ward is obviously a waste so early because if he isn't doing a level 2 gank, he's doing a jungling route and won't be coming for the next 3 minutes either. You would never use an Explorer's Ward your own Red in anticipation of a Shaco invade. Again, unless you're grouped as 5 already near your own red. | ||
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
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mr_tolkien
France8631 Posts
On December 18 2012 01:33 NeoIllusions wrote: No kid. THE RETURN. What do you guys think of Muramana btw ? Is it worth it if you don't build any other mana source ? I love to rush tear on many characters now that it is only 700g (it's just so good for its cost :o), but the Muramana seems kinda lackluster if your build is not tailored around it (Kha Zix anyone ?) | ||
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On December 18 2012 01:33 zulu_nation8 wrote: who else is gonna counterjungle you? Off the top of my head..Nunu, Shyvanna, LS, Olaf, pretty much anybody if you're playing Amumu. | ||
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Sermokala
United States14220 Posts
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
On December 18 2012 01:45 Gahlo wrote: Off the top of my head..Nunu, Shyvanna, LS, Olaf, pretty much anybody if you're playing Amumu. those people wont go from their blue to your red, except maybe nunu but it'd still be pretty dumb. Some may go their red to your red though. | ||
onlywonderboy
United States23745 Posts
On December 18 2012 01:42 mr_tolkien wrote: THE RETURN. What do you guys think of Muramana btw ? Is it worth it if you don't build any other mana source ? I love to rush tear on many characters now that it is only 700g (it's just so good for its cost :o), but the Muramana seems kinda lackluster if your build is not tailored around it (Kha Zix anyone ?) You could always built it into the Archangel's Staff instead. The active on it's upgrade (the mana shield) is pretty useful. I think a lot of people talk about Manamune instead of Archangel's because of how strong it is on Ryze. Other AP's can probably utilize the Archangel's stats better. | ||
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clickrush
Switzerland3257 Posts
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
I actually have yet to build Crucible on her, since I never really build Chalice, but I don't really feel that I need help keeping people alive. I usually get Aegis/Bulwark as my second support item, but I dunno. | ||
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