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On September 09 2012 00:09 Gorsameth wrote:
/facepalm watching oddone stream and hes thinking about Rengars jungle and cant decide if Q or W clears faster... How does someone with no idea of theorycrafting get to be one of the best players in the US ><
it was very first game with rengar I think, and yeah it's a legitimate question l0l
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Normal games are so fun with nasus.You let the idiots dance for 30 minutes and than come down and one shot their support lol.
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On September 09 2012 00:09 Gorsameth wrote:
/facepalm watching oddone stream and hes thinking about Rengars jungle and cant decide if Q or W clears faster... How does someone with no idea of theorycrafting get to be one of the best players in the US ><
i think theorycrafting is overrated compared to micro skill and teamfighting.
whenever i watch tsm i never feel like they're anything special, but they play really clean and they always win their teamfights, they just know how to manage them and focus properly.
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On September 09 2012 00:11 cLutZ wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2012 23:54 wei2coolman wrote:
How do you get a top laner that can scale better than a impossible to kill bruiser, and a 2nd ad carry? o.O, maybe kayle? Not better than Yorik. Better than Udyr, Nunu, WW, and hopefully better at diving carries than Nasus.
Oh. I read it wrong then, and btw WW's late game is beyond broken. and Nunu's late game not bad either. Prevents yorick from getting to your steroided up AD carry.
As far as TSM goes, everytime I watch them play, I don't really understand how they're so good, and get the results they do.
This is literally what happens 90% of the game. Other team goes balls deep against Regi, TOO magically happens to appear in time to save Regi's ass. Other team repeats this 5x over, until they set themselves behind, and TSM wins.
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On September 09 2012 00:11 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2012 00:09 Gorsameth wrote:
/facepalm watching oddone stream and hes thinking about Rengars jungle and cant decide if Q or W clears faster... How does someone with no idea of theorycrafting get to be one of the best players in the US >< It's a legitimate question.
It's a legitimate question until you actually play Rengar with W max and instaclear the small camps with a double W. The extra clear speed that Q gives you on buffs is rather small. The attack speed buff is good,but the extra damage per rank on Q is 30ish. W also gets lower CD for each rank, Q doesn't.
The only way Q max could come close is by building wriggles (extra ASP, more wriggles procs), but I don't think Rengar needs Wriggles.
On September 09 2012 00:16 kainzero wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2012 00:09 Gorsameth wrote:
/facepalm watching oddone stream and hes thinking about Rengars jungle and cant decide if Q or W clears faster... How does someone with no idea of theorycrafting get to be one of the best players in the US >< i think theorycrafting is overrated compared to micro skill and teamfighting. whenever i watch tsm i never feel like they're anything special, but they play really clean and they always win their teamfights, they just know how to manage them and focus properly.
Theorycrafting is definitely not a needed skill on a good player. However, a top team/top players should have someone who does the theorycrafting for them, if they are unable to do it themselves. Some strange items/skill choices you see pros do are just playstyles, some choices are mathematically worse than their alternative, but they manage to win anyway because they're pretty good at this game.
Having a coach role (one of the players or a separate coach) in a team who can figure out shit like that is probably a good solution.
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On September 09 2012 00:13 AsnSensation wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2012 00:09 Gorsameth wrote:
/facepalm watching oddone stream and hes thinking about Rengars jungle and cant decide if Q or W clears faster... How does someone with no idea of theorycrafting get to be one of the best players in the US >< it was very first game with rengar I think, and yeah it's a legitimate question l0l
Even when you theorycraft about it, it's still a tradeoff between better aoe damage vs better single target damage in the jungle. And for ganking things like having riven top or having vlad top make a big difference due to the defensive items the other team are likely to have early on.
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Qmax makes for stronger ganks, no? Unless you're playing rengar AP.
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On September 09 2012 00:23 wei2coolman wrote:
Qmax makes for stronger ganks, no? Unless you're playing rengar AP.
Isn't AP currently the only viable way to play him? Dat W trade too stronk.
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On September 08 2012 14:34 Slusher wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2012 13:20 xes wrote:
Fizz is kind of hard for Swain because of his heal debuff. He has the advantage but one misstep and you get fish'd and die.
Ryze can build Mercs and stack negatrons and still do a million damage. if you beat swain with Fizz you performed one of the hardest outplays in your life. it's not just his snare, it's his cost effective mana usage combined with his passive and his tankyness, FIzz combos are way to expencive to deal with a guy who can just e>q you over and over for free if he last hits correctly. Galio isn't unwinnable, he has to push to harass you(abuse your passive) and you can dodge his q pretty easily with q or just moving with good reactions. so basically you can freefarm vs. him, I've actually FB'd a galio before but I just think he was bad, but if he's pushed you can kill him with a gank, but you will probly have to rely on ganking side lanes if you want kills. Mainly it's a bad matchup because freefarm galio > freefarm Fizz in teamfights, and Galio can push hard enough to not put himself in danger after 1 minor purchase making it hard for you to gank without losing tower/exp but it's not a bad matchup in that he can push you out of lane from level 2 onward without pushing the lane, which Ryze and Swain both can do.
Swain is not that hard a MU for Fizz in my experience, with some practice, if you pay close attention to the animation you can pole his slow projectile E, which pretty much ruins his damage output and allows you to trade. Plus with a bit of jungle help you can gank swain really easily as his snare and slow are wont prevent you from closing on him and the heal debuff.
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On September 09 2012 00:23 wei2coolman wrote:
Qmax makes for stronger ganks, no? Unless you're playing rengar AP.
I actually think that W max is more damage than Q max unless you can stand still and hit a target freely with Q ASP buff up (most likely won't happen during a gank).
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Rengar W max is so so so soooooooooo good, doesn't matter if you're playing him AD or AP, lane or jungle. If you look up sipherdidus on NA, he has close to a 75% winrate on Rengar (he maxes W and goes AD in lane). The amount of sustain it gives you is absolutely ridiculous and combined with dblades/other lifesteal gives Rengar comparable (if not more) sustain to Nunu.
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On September 09 2012 00:27 zodde wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2012 00:23 wei2coolman wrote:
Qmax makes for stronger ganks, no? Unless you're playing rengar AP. I actually think that W max is more damage than Q max unless you can stand still and hit a target freely with Q ASP buff up (most likely won't happen during a gank).
The vast majority of Q dmg comes from the bonus AD and not from the base damage. Yes your aspd boost is a little less but the base damage between rank 5 W and Q is so big its well worth the trade-off.
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what happened to kayle? one moment people are talking about the age of brusiers is gone and the age of adc's like jax and kayle have come and then the next week you can't even find anyone talking about her.
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Because you can have both with Jayce. WHY COMPROMISE?
EDIT: half joking, but half serious at the same time.
Jayce has the benefits of kayle (ranged, can farm easily, fast ms buff), but also has a lot of benefits that bruisers have (huge chunking potential, strong cc, tanky, gap closer)
obviously he doesn't have kayles amazing ulti, but the tradeoffs is for a more well rounded champ.
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On September 09 2012 00:27 zodde wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2012 00:23 wei2coolman wrote:
Qmax makes for stronger ganks, no? Unless you're playing rengar AP. I actually think that W max is more damage than Q max unless you can stand still and hit a target freely with Q ASP buff up ( most likely won't happen during a gank).
Depends on the other 9 champions in the game. And you could defend maxing E is best for ganks as in a lot of situations you'll be wanting to cast 2 E's for longer cc. But I guess that would make your jungle clearing speed atrocious.
When comparing w & q don't forget q has a 6 second cooldown while W has a 15-11 second cooldown.
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On September 09 2012 00:37 Sermokala wrote:
what happened to kayle? one moment people are talking about the age of brusiers is gone and the age of adc's like jax and kayle have come and then the next week you can't even find anyone talking about her.
On September 09 2012 00:38 wei2coolman wrote:
Because you can have both with Jayce. WHY COMPROMISE?
Pretty much this...Jayce is basically an upgraded Kayle. Much harder to gank in lane and more utility (poke/disengage/speed buff/etc) late game.
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On September 08 2012 23:41 Slayer91 wrote:
Yorick is fine just pick udyr or nasus or warwick or nunu someone who can sustain his harass and laugh at him throwing ghouls at you and just ignore him and farm unless jungle comes then kill him.
Everyone just forgot about sustain laners because of out trade laners and laners who are hard to gank like irelia and jayce, and darius tho he's easy to gank.
Rumble vlad and yorick are still the strong harass laners but they all get fucked hard if they die once or twice early.
nasus is squishier than most people think early
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On September 09 2012 00:59 Kenpachi wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2012 23:41 Slayer91 wrote:
Yorick is fine just pick udyr or nasus or warwick or nunu someone who can sustain his harass and laugh at him throwing ghouls at you and just ignore him and farm unless jungle comes then kill him.
Everyone just forgot about sustain laners because of out trade laners and laners who are hard to gank like irelia and jayce, and darius tho he's easy to gank.
Rumble vlad and yorick are still the strong harass laners but they all get fucked hard if they die once or twice early. nasus is squishier than most people think early
That is why he is so fun to gank.
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Chaox/Xpecial are the theorycrafters on TSM, and they handle all the picks and bans as well.
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If ap rengar is so broken,why not just build him like ap amumu if you really want to jungle him that bad,just without the doran rings and build kages instead,max W,etc.
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EPT
