• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 00:00
CEST 06:00
KST 13:00
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins EWC 202512Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 20259Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15
Community News
[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder2EWC 2025 - Replay Pack2Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced27BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams10Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0
StarCraft 2
General
Serral wins EWC 2025 #1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Greatest Players of All Time: 2025 Update Power Rank - Esports World Cup 2025 EWC 2025 - Replay Pack
Tourneys
FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $10,000 live event TaeJa vs Creator Bo7 SC Evo Showmatch Esports World Cup 2025 $25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced $5,000 WardiTV Summer Championship 2025
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune
Brood War
General
Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced Shield Battery Server New Patch BW General Discussion [BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China CSL Xiamen International Invitational [CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance
Strategy
Does 1 second matter in StarCraft? Simple Questions, Simple Answers [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
UK Politics Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Eight Anniversary as a TL…
Mizenhauer
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 599 users

[Patch 1.0.0.146: Late August] General Discussion - Page 162

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 160 161 162
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-09-13 00:40:52
September 13 2012 00:39 GMT
#3221
On September 13 2012 09:24 Bladeorade wrote:
Make a Champion:

AP-
Ryze Passive
Cass Q
TF W
Cass E
Ahri R

Late to the party op


get twitch passive, and pick a new q imo. the rest I really like.
Carrilord has arrived.
qanik
Profile Joined May 2010
Denmark1899 Posts
September 13 2012 00:43 GMT
#3222
Voyboy attempting the reginald build on gragas, needless to say, he is failing miserably.
Best Teemo World
Dandel Ion
Profile Joined November 2010
Austria17960 Posts
September 13 2012 00:45 GMT
#3223
On September 13 2012 09:43 qanik wrote:
Voyboy attempting the reginald build on gragas, needless to say, he is failing miserably.

What is the "Reginald build"?

getting dfg?
A backwards poet writes inverse.
barbsq
Profile Joined November 2009
United States5348 Posts
September 13 2012 00:46 GMT
#3224
On September 13 2012 09:45 Dandel Ion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 09:43 qanik wrote:
Voyboy attempting the reginald build on gragas, needless to say, he is failing miserably.

What is the "Reginald build"?

getting dfg?

pretty sure it's triple gp5. which is not a build developed by regi.
Look at this guy, constantly diluting himself! (╮°-°)╮┳━┳ ( ╯°□°)╯ ┻━┻
Simberto
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany11507 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-09-13 00:47:38
September 13 2012 00:46 GMT
#3225
On September 13 2012 09:33 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 07:48 UniversalSnip wrote:
The game used to have (at an estimate) literally twice or two and a half times more sustain than now between better, more common sources of healing and their multiplication with stronger resist items. cutting that down has been the single best category of improvement in the game since I started playing. Remember shit like

- Old morde. Did absolutely nothing except afk push, could not be killed in lane due to infinite shield, really couldn't even be usefully ganked.
- Old vlad, the true huehuehue. King of da heal.
- Many iterations of soraka, zero interaction in lane, carries teamfights with zero skill required, mash W and opponents can't get kills.
- Any tanky dps with old hog.
- Ad carries who were practically hybrid tanks in the midgame because doran's blade was that good and made you that bulky

It wasn't uncommon to have tournament games where 8-10 out of 10 players would be playing heroes with sustain that would be considered far, far above the curve of games today. And it was boring as shit. Nothing happened! It wasn't just a tournament thing, either, pub play was just the same way, even at my low noob level. It was just so hard to kill people it wasn't worth the effort half the time.



Let me just say, that of all those abilities, only Soraka W is the kind of "sustain" I would like to see more of. I Don't think Astral Blessing is weak, but its on a 20 Second Cooldown for 350 (+.45 AP). To compare, Annie's Q does 245 +.7 on a 4 second cooldown, meaning you could not outheal the damage (even accounting for resists). Also Viktor Q is 260 (+.65) on 5 second cooldown, Ryze Q 160 (+.4 AP + .065 Mana) 3.5 seconds (plus passive), Veigar 260 + .6, 4 seconds. . (As an aside there are not a lot of single target nukes in the game).

It seems odd to me that a healer cannot outheal a single nuke from a single ability from a single spellcaster.



You need to consider that a healer can pretty easily use his heal on cooldown, while it is much harder for the nuke to be used nonstop, usually a trade happens, and then there is some downtime and positioning games where both sides try to make the next trade more beneficial for themselves, which makes a heal much more powerful then a nuke with the same stats.

Best Support:

Some Ranged Base
Janna passive?
Blitz Q
Soraka W
Ali Q
Ashe R
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
September 13 2012 00:47 GMT
#3226
AP should be

Morgana passive
Gragas Q
Xerath W
Zyra E
Zyra R

Always farm never die
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
September 13 2012 00:53 GMT
#3227
On September 13 2012 09:46 Simberto wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 09:33 cLutZ wrote:
On September 13 2012 07:48 UniversalSnip wrote:
The game used to have (at an estimate) literally twice or two and a half times more sustain than now between better, more common sources of healing and their multiplication with stronger resist items. cutting that down has been the single best category of improvement in the game since I started playing. Remember shit like

- Old morde. Did absolutely nothing except afk push, could not be killed in lane due to infinite shield, really couldn't even be usefully ganked.
- Old vlad, the true huehuehue. King of da heal.
- Many iterations of soraka, zero interaction in lane, carries teamfights with zero skill required, mash W and opponents can't get kills.
- Any tanky dps with old hog.
- Ad carries who were practically hybrid tanks in the midgame because doran's blade was that good and made you that bulky

It wasn't uncommon to have tournament games where 8-10 out of 10 players would be playing heroes with sustain that would be considered far, far above the curve of games today. And it was boring as shit. Nothing happened! It wasn't just a tournament thing, either, pub play was just the same way, even at my low noob level. It was just so hard to kill people it wasn't worth the effort half the time.



Let me just say, that of all those abilities, only Soraka W is the kind of "sustain" I would like to see more of. I Don't think Astral Blessing is weak, but its on a 20 Second Cooldown for 350 (+.45 AP). To compare, Annie's Q does 245 +.7 on a 4 second cooldown, meaning you could not outheal the damage (even accounting for resists). Also Viktor Q is 260 (+.65) on 5 second cooldown, Ryze Q 160 (+.4 AP + .065 Mana) 3.5 seconds (plus passive), Veigar 260 + .6, 4 seconds. . (As an aside there are not a lot of single target nukes in the game).

It seems odd to me that a healer cannot outheal a single nuke from a single ability from a single spellcaster.



You need to consider that a healer can pretty easily use his heal on cooldown, while it is much harder for the nuke to be used nonstop, usually a trade happens, and then there is some downtime and positioning games where both sides try to make the next trade more beneficial for themselves, which makes a heal much more powerful then a nuke with the same stats.

Best Support:

Some Ranged Base
Janna passive?
Blitz Q
Soraka W
Ali Q
Ashe R


Well, its in fact hard to find spells that turn out as favorably for Soraka as the spells I chose (single targets). I think people are seriously underestimating how often it is hard engages and instagibs that determine fights, and heals/shields are fairly impotent against that. I mean, Dig ran it successfully against CLG in regionals and people were seriously stoked to see something other than 2xAP or Bruiser comp. Then they tried it again and TSM said /lolstomp.
Freeeeeeedom
qanik
Profile Joined May 2010
Denmark1899 Posts
September 13 2012 00:54 GMT
#3228
On September 13 2012 09:45 Dandel Ion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 09:43 qanik wrote:
Voyboy attempting the reginald build on gragas, needless to say, he is failing miserably.

What is the "Reginald build"?

getting dfg?


The doran rings into RoA and have 100+ AP by 25mins mark.
Best Teemo World
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
September 13 2012 00:59 GMT
#3229
Meh. I've been delaying buying and trying Karma mid for months because they said (maybe three months ago) that a rework was under way for her. Shouldn't have listened to Riot's soon© I guess. :<
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
September 13 2012 01:00 GMT
#3230
On September 13 2012 09:47 Praetorial wrote:
AP should be

Morgana passive
Gragas Q
Xerath W
Zyra E
Zyra R

Always farm never die


except spellvamp blows with that kit
Carrilord has arrived.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
September 13 2012 01:01 GMT
#3231
On September 13 2012 09:47 Praetorial wrote:
AP should be

Morgana passive
Gragas Q
Xerath W
Zyra E
Zyra R

Always farm never die

"Best AP" without question should include Leblanc Ultimate and/or Zilean Rewind.

Both skills are balanced around the power of the skills they're being used with. So if you combine those with nukes that are significantly stronger than the skills they're normally paired with, you get a hero with drastically higher overall effectiveness.
Moderator
Navi
Profile Joined November 2009
5286 Posts
September 13 2012 01:10 GMT
#3232
On September 13 2012 08:58 Kouda wrote:
Navi playing with Scarra, WR, Ny, and Aphro.

Got hooked and FB'd. lol.

Nyjacky playing Karma mid btw.


fk scarra i pull a westdoor and pick mid b4 him so i can see more of his ad gragas
Hey! Listen!
Bladeorade
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1898 Posts
September 13 2012 01:10 GMT
#3233
On September 13 2012 09:39 Slusher wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 09:24 Bladeorade wrote:
Make a Champion:

AP-
Ryze Passive
Cass Q
TF W
Cass E
Ahri R

Late to the party op


get twitch passive, and pick a new q imo. the rest I really like.

Why Twitch Passive?

The whole point of Ryze passive is to spam everything lol. Stun QEQE Stun QEQE with 3 dashes op
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
September 13 2012 01:13 GMT
#3234
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/news/mid-september-patch-notes

Patch notes. No balance changes, but Syndra is coming, kill streaks are easier to get, and Riot Graves is imba vs Leona.
It's your boy Guzma!
mr_tolkien
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
France8631 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-09-13 01:18:22
September 13 2012 01:18 GMT
#3235
On September 13 2012 10:01 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2012 09:47 Praetorial wrote:
AP should be

Morgana passive
Gragas Q
Xerath W
Zyra E
Zyra R

Always farm never die

"Best AP" without question should include Leblanc Ultimate and/or Zilean Rewind.

Both skills are balanced around the power of the skills they're being used with. So if you combine those with nukes that are significantly stronger than the skills they're normally paired with, you get a hero with drastically higher overall effectiveness.

PANTHEON SPEAR. Oh how much would I dream of a LB ult on Panth... Double spear insta kill.
The legend of Darien lives on
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
September 13 2012 01:20 GMT
#3236
Syndra has arrived~

So many APs lately~
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
Prev 1 160 161 162
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 6h
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 278
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 4944
PianO 515
Leta 429
Zeus 339
zelot 91
Sexy 67
Noble 48
Aegong 39
Bale 22
Icarus 7
Dota 2
monkeys_forever837
League of Legends
JimRising 857
Counter-Strike
Coldzera 273
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox698
Other Games
summit1g14532
shahzam1218
C9.Mang0250
WinterStarcraft214
Maynarde180
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1321
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta98
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Doublelift6966
• Rush1324
• Stunt567
Other Games
• Scarra554
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6h
WardiTV European League
12h
PiGosaur Monday
20h
OSC
1d 8h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 12h
The PondCast
2 days
Online Event
2 days
Korean StarCraft League
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
Online Event
4 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 20 Non-Korean Championship
FEL Cracow 2025
Underdog Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
CC Div. A S7
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25

Upcoming

BSL 21 Qualifiers
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
HCC Europe
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.