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United States22883 Posts
Have you seen the teeth of Japanese and Chinese people? Neither country sets an example for dental hygiene.
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On May 10 2009 03:00 Jibba wrote:Have you seen the teeth of Japanese and Chinese people? Neither country sets an example for dental hygiene.
But they do for all of the sciences and arts.
(my point is - taking care of your teeth is a personal responsibility. and it is certainly less important than potentially risking any harmful effects on the population)
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United States22883 Posts
On May 10 2009 02:52 Pika Chu wrote:Interesting, i have a couple of questions. Romania does not introduce fluoride in either water or salt or other aliments. However, there is fluoride in the water, small and natural amounts (as they say) ~0.5mg/l - 0.8mg/l. Is that fluoride toxic also? Did some googling and found upon answers that fluoride does exist naturally in stuff and that the small amounts aren't bad but good as the human body has a small daily need of fluoride. How do you feel about that? Second question, i know that all the toothpaste we use is high in fluoride. Should we be worried about using it or does it actually help and it's good (since i guess a part of it still ends in your stomach)?
Dihydrogen monoxide is put into the water supply at a much greater concentration than fluoride and it's been scientifically proven that an overdose is lethal. You should google to find an alternative water source to avoid that too.
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On May 10 2009 02:20 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2009 23:24 TheFoReveRwaR wrote:On May 09 2009 19:58 Shizuru~ wrote:
fluoride works when apllied directly onto the teeth's surface, there is no need to ingest it, they put it in our water, saying its for the health for our teeth? its like saying putting some parts of shampoo in our water supply and saying it'll help our hair's look/health while people are gonna drink that water?
Hitler put fluoride into the water the Jewish drank in the concentration camp during the holocaust as a poison... Guess what!? When you drink water with small amounts of floride in it; it touches your teeth! Yes I know what a concept..things you drink touch your teeth, no fucking way!? Guess what? It works too, studies have clearly shown better tooth health in communities exposed to florided water. Think. Things. Through. And in case you missed it, that was idras point. *shakes head* You're really dense. The point is that it's recommended to ingest(swallow) the fluoride to help keep teeth healthy. You don't have to swallow something for it to touch your teeth. I mean fuck, toothpaste has fluoride - isn't optional shit with fluoride in it enough? No, it isn't - instead it's mandatory for fucking everyone like it or not. How can people not see there is something shady going on there? Absolutely ridiculous. Again, the entire point here is that it ISNT OPTIONALAnd finally - I am not saying they are trying to poison people. Really that doesn't seem impossible but I don't know. What I am saying is that the system is corrupt and people in power pretty much never give the tiniest fuck about the general populous.
Actually, if they're putting it in the water under the assumption that it's good for you, it would seem they do give a fuck
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United States22883 Posts
On May 10 2009 03:01 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2009 03:00 Jibba wrote:Have you seen the teeth of Japanese and Chinese people? Neither country sets an example for dental hygiene. But they do for all of the sciences and arts. (my point is - taking care of your teeth is a personal responsibility. and it is certainly less important than potentially risking any harmful effects on the population)
I get your point. My point is that no one makes you drink public water and it's just like any other public ordinance. You might not like the way it's done, but there's nothing mandatory about it and the protocol has been set by your area's constituency in some way or another. Most people are willing to take the risk with fluoride, you are not.
Part of your freedom entails the freedom to change locations, and also the ability to become a part of the policy making process.
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United States22883 Posts
On May 10 2009 02:20 travis wrote:
What I am saying is that the system is corrupt and people in power pretty much never give the tiniest fuck about the general populous.
I want you to go and meet your local city council people or whoever is in charge of the water treatment facilities. If you think the various board members and comptrollers are out to simply fuck over people and make a quick buck (wooooooo, $45,000/year salary!), you either live in Detroit or you've got a warped understanding of society.
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This news is some bullshit conspiracy theory.
Seriously, do you believe that if army guys would test some new stuff on the soldiers, and they would get sick or something, they would let them out instead of keeping the thing secret in their own medical facilities? Please...
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On May 10 2009 03:19 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2009 02:20 travis wrote:
What I am saying is that the system is corrupt and people in power pretty much never give the tiniest fuck about the general populous. I want you to go and meet your local city council people or whoever is in charge of the water treatment facilities. If you think the various board members and comptrollers are out to simply fuck over people and make a quick buck (wooooooo, $45,000/year salary!), you either live in Detroit or you've got a warped understanding of society.
This reasoning is flawed.
1.) those people weren't involved with the process that got fluoride in the water in the first place.
2.) those people are just doing their job, they aren't people who decide whether or not it is right for water to be fluoridated.
In short: those aren't the people I am talking about.
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Physician
United States4146 Posts
On May 10 2009 03:00 Jibba wrote:Have you seen the teeth of Japanese and Chinese people? Neither country sets an example for dental hygiene.
nope I've see the teeth of US people, everyday, sad sad story I tell u..
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so they are using soldiers as guinea pigs for their experiments? welcome to the US army.
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Dihydrogen monoxide is put into the water supply at a much greater concentration than fluoride and it's been scientifically proven that an overdose is lethal. You should google to find an alternative water source to avoid that too. I was hoping someone would bite, but no dice T_T.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
oh god no not dihydromonoxide!
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United States22883 Posts
On May 10 2009 03:29 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2009 03:19 Jibba wrote:On May 10 2009 02:20 travis wrote:
What I am saying is that the system is corrupt and people in power pretty much never give the tiniest fuck about the general populous. I want you to go and meet your local city council people or whoever is in charge of the water treatment facilities. If you think the various board members and comptrollers are out to simply fuck over people and make a quick buck (wooooooo, $45,000/year salary!), you either live in Detroit or you've got a warped understanding of society. This reasoning is flawed. 1.) those people weren't involved with the process that got fluoride in the water in the first place. 2.) those people are just doing their job, they aren't people who decide whether or not it is right for water to be fluoridated. In short: those aren't the people I am talking about.
Those ARE the people who decided to put fluoride in the water. Every single county in the goddamn country decides how to treat their own water. The federal government is completely irrelevant in this discussion, except when the EPA and CDC make suggestions (which, again, has nothing to do with "corrupt politicians.") Search Congress for a bill on fluoride and let me know what you come up with.
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You also need to keep in mind that bad teeth and poverty obviously correlate, by putting fluoride in the water you are helping out a huge part of the population. You need to realize that not everyone lives the way you do. In the times of our grandparents it was not uncommon to have most of your teeth removed at a relatively young age. Fluoridation of water in Holland for example is not necessary anymore in this day and age, but I honestly doubt this is the case for most of America.
The idea of fluoridation is appalling to most of us, but when I look at the big picture I can only conclude that it is definately for the greater good. Besides, I feel that a large reason for this fear is based on the fact that most of us have a decent knowledge about chemistry these days thanks to our schools, making the idea of adding chemicals to our water supplies extra appalling simply be being aware of some of the dangers, just like a med student is extra aware to all symptoms of disease at the beginning of his studies. I feel that things need to be relativated a little on this subject, if you look at how our bodies handle tons of chemicals each day, it's not as frightening and well within acceptable limits even if you feel it is unnecessary, you will never notice the consequences while you are arguing against something that can have noticable effects against the less fortunate people of your community.
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United States43989 Posts
On May 09 2009 19:58 Shizuru~ wrote:
Hitler put fluoride into the water the Jewish drank in the concentration camp during the holocaust as a poison...
Hitler put the lethal dose of fluoride into water because it was lethal. The government puts the safe dose of fluoride into water because it's good for you.
Schools sell kids candy bars. If Hitler poisoned Jews with chocolate (about 22lb per person is the lethal dose) would you insist that chocolate is dangerous?
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United States43989 Posts
On May 10 2009 03:01 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2009 03:00 Jibba wrote:Have you seen the teeth of Japanese and Chinese people? Neither country sets an example for dental hygiene. But they do for all of the sciences and arts. (my point is - taking care of your teeth is a personal responsibility. and it is certainly less important than potentially risking any harmful effects on the population)
For an American, maybe. Over here healthcare is a national responsibility and if you fuck your teeth up the bill hits the taxpayer.
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On May 10 2009 05:29 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2009 03:29 travis wrote:On May 10 2009 03:19 Jibba wrote:On May 10 2009 02:20 travis wrote:
What I am saying is that the system is corrupt and people in power pretty much never give the tiniest fuck about the general populous. I want you to go and meet your local city council people or whoever is in charge of the water treatment facilities. If you think the various board members and comptrollers are out to simply fuck over people and make a quick buck (wooooooo, $45,000/year salary!), you either live in Detroit or you've got a warped understanding of society. This reasoning is flawed. 1.) those people weren't involved with the process that got fluoride in the water in the first place. 2.) those people are just doing their job, they aren't people who decide whether or not it is right for water to be fluoridated. In short: those aren't the people I am talking about. Those ARE the people who decided to put fluoride in the water. Every single county in the goddamn country decides how to treat their own water. The federal government is completely irrelevant in this discussion, except when the EPA and CDC make suggestions (which, again, has nothing to do with "corrupt politicians.") Search Congress for a bill on fluoride and let me know what you come up with.
That's not what I am saying.
Government, both state and federal, make TONS of decisions where they themselves are completely ignorant of the topic. When the department of health (formerly USPHS) and the ADA both endorse fluoridation, why would state officials possibly argue? It isn't their responsibility to look into this stuff.
And so we go back to why the department of health and ADA endorse fluoridation. Which is pretty simple.
The ADA endorsed fluoridation because they are dentists. They are interested in keeping teeth healthy, which fluoridation helps do. They are not, however, interested in researching the potential hazards of long term fluoride ingestion.
The department of health is a government body. It is political. Just like all the other government bodies, it's primary concern often gets swayed by lobbyists. Ask yourself who stood to profit from fluoridation? There certainly were groups who did. Where do you think fluoride comes from? It was originally a waste product. Fluoridation of water supplies allows big business to not only get rid of their waste, but to make MASSIVE profit doing so.
Why do you think some people are so vehement about this topic? WTF do they have to gain?
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On May 10 2009 02:10 Juicyfruit wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On May 10 2009 01:46 Shizuru~ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2009 23:24 TheFoReveRwaR wrote:On May 09 2009 19:58 Shizuru~ wrote:
fluoride works when apllied directly onto the teeth's surface, there is no need to ingest it, they put it in our water, saying its for the health for our teeth? its like saying putting some parts of shampoo in our water supply and saying it'll help our hair's look/health while people are gonna drink that water?
Hitler put fluoride into the water the Jewish drank in the concentration camp during the holocaust as a poison... Guess what!? When you drink water with small amounts of floride in it; it touches your teeth! Yes I know what a concept..things you drink touch your teeth, no fucking way!? Guess what? It works too, studies have clearly shown better tooth health in communities exposed to florided water. Think. Things. Through. And in case you missed it, that was idras point. *shakes head* You're really dense. uhm... let me repeat my points.... currently, they put fluoride into our water, so that when we drink it, it would touches our teeth and benefits our oral heatlh... my points is, since u don have to ingest(IE:DRINK) the fluoride for it to have it benefits, why put that thing into our drinking water when there's known side effects.... most of european countires doesn't have fluoride in their water supplies... and yet they don't have as much of an oral health issues as people who had fluoride in their water did. Show me an actual study somewhere that says fluoride doesn't benefit your teeth if you ingest it, because as far as I know, by ingesting the fluoride, your body incorporates that into your teeth. I mean, seriously, how often do you think the fluoride would stay in contact with your teeth if all you do is brush with fluoride. It'll barely do anything.
Juciyfruit that's completely wrong, by ingesting flouride you aren't doing shit for your teeth, your body just shits it out (so long as it's in small amounts). You know how teeth is made from a calcium compound, well acids break down calcium bound to chlorine atoms somewhat easily. However, acids have a harder time breaking down a harder compound made from flouride and calcium. Essentially a chemical reaction takes place very slowly when flouride is present that replaces the chloride in your teeth molecules to flouride which makes the teeth less prone to decay.
Chemistry FTW.
However I don't know of any long term studies concerning flouride over the long term... however... I haven't done any search at all on the topic so all i know is that
1) It helps teeth
2) i don't feel any adverse affects... so i kinda don't care it helps my teeth.
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That was strange talking about teeth stuff in this topic but on topic:
I think the new video has 2 consequences
1) True - possible - experimentation oh well there's obviously a goal at the end of the tunnel and I hope that it's for the betterment of mankind.
2) Not True - likely - media is stupid shit... medical records are very slowly updated (i once had a shot that wasn't updated for years until I had a large argument with a nurse that I did in fact receive the shot).
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United States43989 Posts
On May 10 2009 06:50 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2009 05:29 Jibba wrote:On May 10 2009 03:29 travis wrote:On May 10 2009 03:19 Jibba wrote:On May 10 2009 02:20 travis wrote:
What I am saying is that the system is corrupt and people in power pretty much never give the tiniest fuck about the general populous. I want you to go and meet your local city council people or whoever is in charge of the water treatment facilities. If you think the various board members and comptrollers are out to simply fuck over people and make a quick buck (wooooooo, $45,000/year salary!), you either live in Detroit or you've got a warped understanding of society. This reasoning is flawed. 1.) those people weren't involved with the process that got fluoride in the water in the first place. 2.) those people are just doing their job, they aren't people who decide whether or not it is right for water to be fluoridated. In short: those aren't the people I am talking about. Those ARE the people who decided to put fluoride in the water. Every single county in the goddamn country decides how to treat their own water. The federal government is completely irrelevant in this discussion, except when the EPA and CDC make suggestions (which, again, has nothing to do with "corrupt politicians.") Search Congress for a bill on fluoride and let me know what you come up with. Why do you think some people are so vehement about this topic? WTF do they have to gain?
I for one am on the payroll of big business in order to defend their dumping of toxic waste into the water supply on this particular forum. There's at least one of us for every forum, it's the only way to keep the masses quiet.
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EPT
