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Canada8036 Posts
On April 09 2009 08:24 Cpt.Cocaine wrote:
Mainstream gaming communities = immature morons
Niche gaming communities = polite and respectful
I'm not sure why it works that way. You go play something really mainstream like halo and people call eachother names, insult eachother's mothers, they bitch, they whine, they're sore losers. You go play something like starcraft of quake live and people have honor codes. They never say anything disrespectful, they always say GG before and after games - the digital equivalent of a bow or a handshake. They're polar opposites. And it has nothing to do with age. I've played with SC and QL players who were 13-14 and they were as mature as grown adults.
People are BM all the time in Starcraft. You can't tell me you've never run into someone like that on bnet or iccup... Also, if you have more people playing one game, statistically, you'll also have a higher number of asshats in that group. Like everyone has said, the anonymity of the Internet makes it perfect for people to try stupid shit they wouldn't do in real life.
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On April 09 2009 08:27 Resonance wrote:I'd say it's mainly just b/c they are anonymous. If you meet most of these people in real life they are probably pretty normal. Also has to do w/accountability imo. Look @ TL, if there weren't bans, people would be a lot more unpleasant (though a lot of you guys aren't really pleasant anyway  ). I do agree though that a lot of gamers are assholes.
Idra, Incontrol, Rekrul?
Bad mannered but incontrol and rekrul are really funny. I especially liked incontrol's "argument" with testie and his rant about zerg.
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It has to due simply with the anonymous aspect, if people have no fear of punishment they will do many things deemed inappropriate.
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On April 09 2009 08:32 Spazer wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2009 08:24 Cpt.Cocaine wrote:
Mainstream gaming communities = immature morons
Niche gaming communities = polite and respectful
I'm not sure why it works that way. You go play something really mainstream like halo and people call eachother names, insult eachother's mothers, they bitch, they whine, they're sore losers. You go play something like starcraft of quake live and people have honor codes. They never say anything disrespectful, they always say GG before and after games - the digital equivalent of a bow or a handshake. They're polar opposites. And it has nothing to do with age. I've played with SC and QL players who were 13-14 and they were as mature as grown adults. People are BM all the time in Starcraft. You can't tell me you've never run into someone like that on bnet or iccup... Also, if you have more people playing one game, statistically, you'll also have a higher number of asshats in that group. Like everyone has said, the anonymity of the Internet makes it perfect for people to try stupid shit they wouldn't do in real life.
I've run into them on bnet, but the thing is, they were always noobs. BGH NR10 players are pretty much the mainstream side of sc. Maybe there's more skilled players out there who are total jerks, I just can't say I've run into any of them yet.
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Said many times in this thread, but anonymity and no punishment at all for doing things like that are the reasons. Hence why I seem to mostly enjoy the communities of a) where you represent with your own name, b) are part of your subscription/pay for using them, c) are otherwise closed/invite only types, or d) small same minded people together (some small simulator scenes). From the ones that don't go into these categories (like this website) I tend to like the really strictly moderated ones where you simply get banned/warned for even such things as improper grammar. Maybe not for everyone, but does help on filtering the shit out.
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On April 09 2009 08:24 Cpt.Cocaine wrote:
Mainstream gaming communities = immature morons
Niche gaming communities = polite and respectful
I'm not sure why it works that way. You go play something really mainstream like halo and people call eachother names, insult eachother's mothers, they bitch, they whine, they're sore losers. You go play something like starcraft of quake live and people have honor codes. They never say anything disrespectful, they always say GG before and after games - the digital equivalent of a bow or a handshake. They're polar opposites. And it has nothing to do with age. I've played with SC and QL players who were 13-14 and they were as mature as grown adults.
Yes, but Starcraft and Quake are NOT niche or hardcore... they're mainstream too (still... and it even has to be that way because hardcore/niche in this context means no popularity and therefore no success and therefore no tournaments or public visibility) and do in fact suffer from the same problem: too many immature kids, sore losers, jerks, and other losers.
There are "normal" people in mainstream games as well but they get kind of buried in the flood of morons.
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On April 09 2009 19:40 0xDEADBEEF wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2009 08:24 Cpt.Cocaine wrote:
Mainstream gaming communities = immature morons
Niche gaming communities = polite and respectful
I'm not sure why it works that way. You go play something really mainstream like halo and people call eachother names, insult eachother's mothers, they bitch, they whine, they're sore losers. You go play something like starcraft of quake live and people have honor codes. They never say anything disrespectful, they always say GG before and after games - the digital equivalent of a bow or a handshake. They're polar opposites. And it has nothing to do with age. I've played with SC and QL players who were 13-14 and they were as mature as grown adults. Yes, but Starcraft and Quake are NOT niche or hardcore... they're mainstream too (still... and it even has to be that way because hardcore/niche in this context means no popularity and therefore no success and therefore no tournaments or public visibility) and do in fact suffer from the same problem: too many immature kids, sore losers, jerks, and other losers. There are "normal" people in mainstream games as well but they get kind of buried in the flood of morons.
Only way to avoid it is if something is inherently social. Only games that tend to fit that bill are arcade games (fighters, DDR, etc.). And it's not like the people in those communities are better people, they simply act in the way that someone acts when the opponent is standing a foot away and will remain there after the game has ended.
I don't believe something being niche / hardcore is what determines the manners, I think it has infinitely more to do with the age demographics that are playing games so far.
When the generations of "gamers" grow older and its no longer dominated by early teens, you'll see and upwards turn in manners I think. Til then, gotta share our space with people who are still growing and learning how not to behave
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the more anonymity there is, the more people tend to act like assholes
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i think it has to do with gamers having lack of skill to socialize making it more attractive for them to try the game at early age
which again enhancing the social skill difference even more
a circle that keeps growing just like icecream and diet lol
btw dk if it has anything to do in this forum but
somehow idra elo is the same as boxers!!!
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On April 09 2009 19:57 Trumpet wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2009 19:40 0xDEADBEEF wrote:On April 09 2009 08:24 Cpt.Cocaine wrote:
Mainstream gaming communities = immature morons
Niche gaming communities = polite and respectful
I'm not sure why it works that way. You go play something really mainstream like halo and people call eachother names, insult eachother's mothers, they bitch, they whine, they're sore losers. You go play something like starcraft of quake live and people have honor codes. They never say anything disrespectful, they always say GG before and after games - the digital equivalent of a bow or a handshake. They're polar opposites. And it has nothing to do with age. I've played with SC and QL players who were 13-14 and they were as mature as grown adults. Yes, but Starcraft and Quake are NOT niche or hardcore... they're mainstream too (still... and it even has to be that way because hardcore/niche in this context means no popularity and therefore no success and therefore no tournaments or public visibility) and do in fact suffer from the same problem: too many immature kids, sore losers, jerks, and other losers. There are "normal" people in mainstream games as well but they get kind of buried in the flood of morons. Only way to avoid it is if something is inherently social. Only games that tend to fit that bill are arcade games (fighters, DDR, etc.). And it's not like the people in those communities are better people, they simply act in the way that someone acts when the opponent is standing a foot away and will remain there after the game has ended. I don't believe something being niche / hardcore is what determines the manners, I think it has infinitely more to do with the age demographics that are playing games so far. When the generations of "gamers" grow older and its no longer dominated by early teens, you'll see and upwards turn in manners I think. Til then, gotta share our space with people who are still growing and learning how not to behave
I think so too... or rather: I'm fairly sure that's true, since I play some games which can now really be considered hardcore/niche like old RPGs, e.g. Nethack or Baldur's Gate... OK these are no multiplayer games, however if you go to forums or IRC channels about these games, or in the case of Nethack if you play on a "public server" which allows things like spectating and talking to others while they play their (single player) game, you'll find exactly ZERO stupid kids and you can have interesting discussions about the game without morons posting in the thread, and you'll also see almost zero grammatical or spelling mistakes because people actually care about what (and how) they're writing... it's amazing, really.
Problem is though that when you talk about competitive action multiplayer games, you need popularity and tournaments, so you need the game to be mainstream.
And once your game is in the "mainstream" then you'll inevitably have all those kids playing it... there is no solution. 
As an "older" player, you just have to live with it.
Another aspect is that teenagers also *much* prefer action games over turn-based ones or other games with slower gameplay. They want fast-paced action right away so they play either RTS or FPS, and define skill with mechanics as if it were a real sport.
Blizzard games or the various popular FPS games are perfect for this - constant fast-paced action without much thinking involved. That's why they are so immensely popular.
A game that doesn't stick to that formula, for example a turn-based game, won't ever be as successful because the biggest market (teenagers) prefers action.
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anonymity plays a huge part for sure, but also the whole ego thing and also a need to justify their commitment to the game, they need some sort of acknowledgment that all their time invested into this game really wasn't a waste of their time, just incase someone comes around and makes them realize they just spent 2 years on a game that really just blows, so they have to establish that this game is a well sought after game to be good at.
but mostly its anonymity.
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Sanya12364 Posts
People should just lower their expectations of their peers when playing online.
It'll keep them from being disappointed or frustrated.
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Anonymity is #1.
#2 is that gaming isn't exactly a social thing to begin with, so you're often dealing with people who lack social skills!
Combine the two, and it's real easy to understand why it happens.
Plus, being a dick online is such a release from the normal, respectful adult that most people pretend to be in real life. I was playing GTA4 freemode the other day online, and a bunch of kids were role playing some club shit, vip parking and all that jazz. I got all the guns I, head over, run over the 3 or 4 people outside, and shoot up the entire joint, and laugh at the chaos over the mic.
Sometimes it's just fun to be a dick.
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One clear answer:
Lack of Social Capacity
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On April 09 2009 08:32 ghostWriter wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2009 08:27 Resonance wrote:I'd say it's mainly just b/c they are anonymous. If you meet most of these people in real life they are probably pretty normal. Also has to do w/accountability imo. Look @ TL, if there weren't bans, people would be a lot more unpleasant (though a lot of you guys aren't really pleasant anyway ). I do agree though that a lot of gamers are assholes. Idra, Incontrol, Rekrul? Bad mannered but incontrol and rekrul are really funny. I especially liked incontrol's "argument" with testie and his rant about zerg.
actually rekrul and I are pretty bad examples cause we are like this in person as well.. ask anyone that knows us. IdrA is too to an extent he just shouldn't be because raw Darwinism holds that mice shouldn't be cocky around lions.
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On April 11 2009 01:03 {88}iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On April 09 2009 08:32 ghostWriter wrote:On April 09 2009 08:27 Resonance wrote:I'd say it's mainly just b/c they are anonymous. If you meet most of these people in real life they are probably pretty normal. Also has to do w/accountability imo. Look @ TL, if there weren't bans, people would be a lot more unpleasant (though a lot of you guys aren't really pleasant anyway ). I do agree though that a lot of gamers are assholes. Idra, Incontrol, Rekrul? Bad mannered but incontrol and rekrul are really funny. I especially liked incontrol's "argument" with testie and his rant about zerg. actually rekrul and I are pretty bad examples cause we are like this in person as well.. ask anyone that knows us. IdrA is too to an extent he just shouldn't be because raw Darwinism holds that mice shouldn't be cocky around lions. and "cubbies" shouldn't be so revealing around gays. they don't reproduce well.
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We aren't social adept. Gamers end up becoming drug dealers/dropouts/womanizers because they realize...
Well, I realized one day,
I've just been sitting on my fucking ass all day playing starcraft. I've got to do something! This doesn't necessarily justify gamers as non-douchebags but, most of us are anyways because of the harshness of people because of the mask we wear being on the internet. We can be anyone, sometimes, in real life even because our mind is still racing from being trapped in thinking about a game.
My thoughts! =]
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