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On April 21 2021 06:34 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:33 Stratos_speAr wrote:On April 21 2021 06:30 ChristianS wrote:On April 21 2021 06:20 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 21 2021 06:14 Artisreal wrote:
It's early and he stacked the odds pretty high against himself, but if a proper sentencing follows and takes all the appeal hurdles, can we call this the possible start of something historic? Worth remembering it took massive protests to get the charges filed/upgraded in the first place. So before people celebrate people should remember the police saw all the bodycams and city cams and didn't file charges until the bystander video went viral Yeah, I mean obviously this is one case of the system doing kinda sorta what it’s own rules say it should, and it’s quite possible this is more a “punish the one guy to shut everyone up” situation than a “start of a new era” situation. But like, this feels really big, right? I mean, I was already kinda preparing myself to think the acquittal didn’t *really* matter because this is just one case and no outcome here would meaningfully address the systemic problems. But hearing the news is hitting me a lot harder than I expected it to. Maybe I’m just letting myself get tricked into believing this really changes things? I don’t know what to think. Setting a precedent makes a big difference. It doesn't fix the system and it also doesn't address how other states will act (looking at you, Kentucky), but the precedent clearly exists now and can be applied, at least in Minnesota/the Midwest. what precedent tho? that you can't slowly choke someone for 10 minutes while a crowd with camera's are watching?
You gotta start somewhere... and I only half-mean that facetiously.
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On April 21 2021 06:31 Gorsameth wrote:
I don't think getting a conviction on the most blatant open cold blooded murder in recent history is some sort of landmark victory.
I also wouldn't read to much into 'the blue wall falling' when its this blatant.
Head of Chicago's Police Union called the cop that killed 13 year old Adam Toledo 'heroic'. This Chauvin conviction was just the bare minimum to keep society remotely functional imo.
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On April 21 2021 06:34 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:33 Stratos_speAr wrote:On April 21 2021 06:30 ChristianS wrote:On April 21 2021 06:20 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 21 2021 06:14 Artisreal wrote:
It's early and he stacked the odds pretty high against himself, but if a proper sentencing follows and takes all the appeal hurdles, can we call this the possible start of something historic? Worth remembering it took massive protests to get the charges filed/upgraded in the first place. So before people celebrate people should remember the police saw all the bodycams and city cams and didn't file charges until the bystander video went viral Yeah, I mean obviously this is one case of the system doing kinda sorta what it’s own rules say it should, and it’s quite possible this is more a “punish the one guy to shut everyone up” situation than a “start of a new era” situation. But like, this feels really big, right? I mean, I was already kinda preparing myself to think the acquittal didn’t *really* matter because this is just one case and no outcome here would meaningfully address the systemic problems. But hearing the news is hitting me a lot harder than I expected it to. Maybe I’m just letting myself get tricked into believing this really changes things? I don’t know what to think. Setting a precedent makes a big difference. It doesn't fix the system and it also doesn't address how other states will act (looking at you, Kentucky), but the precedent clearly exists now and can be applied, at least in Minnesota/the Midwest. what precedent tho? that you can't slowly choke someone for 10 minutes while a crowd with camera's are watching?
...Yea.
Have examples of this happening before with any kind of regularity?
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Things are as bad here as this being momentous would indicate, to be sure. Nevertheless...
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On April 21 2021 06:34 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:33 Stratos_speAr wrote:On April 21 2021 06:30 ChristianS wrote:On April 21 2021 06:20 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 21 2021 06:14 Artisreal wrote:
It's early and he stacked the odds pretty high against himself, but if a proper sentencing follows and takes all the appeal hurdles, can we call this the possible start of something historic? Worth remembering it took massive protests to get the charges filed/upgraded in the first place. So before people celebrate people should remember the police saw all the bodycams and city cams and didn't file charges until the bystander video went viral Yeah, I mean obviously this is one case of the system doing kinda sorta what it’s own rules say it should, and it’s quite possible this is more a “punish the one guy to shut everyone up” situation than a “start of a new era” situation. But like, this feels really big, right? I mean, I was already kinda preparing myself to think the acquittal didn’t *really* matter because this is just one case and no outcome here would meaningfully address the systemic problems. But hearing the news is hitting me a lot harder than I expected it to. Maybe I’m just letting myself get tricked into believing this really changes things? I don’t know what to think. Setting a precedent makes a big difference. It doesn't fix the system and it also doesn't address how other states will act (looking at you, Kentucky), but the precedent clearly exists now and can be applied, at least in Minnesota/the Midwest. what precedent tho? that you can't slowly choke someone for 10 minutes while a crowd with camera's are watching?
A bit more than that. The precedent that even a cop can't slowly choke a black someone for 10 minutes while a crowd with camera's are watching.
That is a pretty important precedent to set. One would think that it isn't a precedent which needs to be set, but one would forget that we are talking about the US here in this case.
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On April 21 2021 06:31 Gorsameth wrote:
I don't think getting a conviction on the most blatant open cold blooded murder in recent history is some sort of landmark victory.
I also wouldn't read to much into 'the blue wall falling' when its this blatant.
looking at the case in a vaccum yeah. no big deal, next please. but this is happening in America and Rodney King is not that long ago.
or to not go back all that far...
https://heavy.com/news/2020/05/police-who-kill-blacks-rarely-convicted/
Philando Castile
Eric Garner
Freddie Gray
Sandra Bland
Michael Brown
... the list goes on. and those are just cases that made the news.
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On April 21 2021 06:36 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:31 Gorsameth wrote:
I don't think getting a conviction on the most blatant open cold blooded murder in recent history is some sort of landmark victory.
I also wouldn't read to much into 'the blue wall falling' when its this blatant.
Head of Chicago's Police Union called the cop that killed 13 year old Adam Toledo 'heroic'. This Chauvin conviction was just the bare minimum to keep society remotely functional imo.
Was the cop called "heroic" during this specific incident, when the cop killed Adam? Or was the cop perhaps called heroic some time in the past, during a different, unrelated incident where the cop actually did something good?
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This won't make being poc in the US easier all of a sudden.
My guess is:
- more attempts at disenfranchisement (in red parts of the country)
- more institutionalised a discrimination (in red parts)
- police trying to test out the waters with increasingly subversive and less blatant acts of racism
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On April 21 2021 06:37 Simberto wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:34 Gorsameth wrote:On April 21 2021 06:33 Stratos_speAr wrote:On April 21 2021 06:30 ChristianS wrote:On April 21 2021 06:20 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 21 2021 06:14 Artisreal wrote:
It's early and he stacked the odds pretty high against himself, but if a proper sentencing follows and takes all the appeal hurdles, can we call this the possible start of something historic? Worth remembering it took massive protests to get the charges filed/upgraded in the first place. So before people celebrate people should remember the police saw all the bodycams and city cams and didn't file charges until the bystander video went viral Yeah, I mean obviously this is one case of the system doing kinda sorta what it’s own rules say it should, and it’s quite possible this is more a “punish the one guy to shut everyone up” situation than a “start of a new era” situation. But like, this feels really big, right? I mean, I was already kinda preparing myself to think the acquittal didn’t *really* matter because this is just one case and no outcome here would meaningfully address the systemic problems. But hearing the news is hitting me a lot harder than I expected it to. Maybe I’m just letting myself get tricked into believing this really changes things? I don’t know what to think. Setting a precedent makes a big difference. It doesn't fix the system and it also doesn't address how other states will act (looking at you, Kentucky), but the precedent clearly exists now and can be applied, at least in Minnesota/the Midwest. what precedent tho? that you can't slowly choke someone for 10 minutes while a crowd with camera's are watching? A bit more than that. The precedent that even a cop can't slowly choke a black someone for 10 minutes while a crowd with camera's are watching. That is a pretty important precedent to set. One would think that it isn't a precedent which needs to be set, but one would forget that we are talking about the US here in this case. point taken
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In the trans community, we have a saying called "walking while trans". It's when police spot a trans woman on the street, accuse her of engaging in prostitution, and arrest her immediately and throw her in a men's prison. In there, the odds are that she will be beaten up and raped. I know of several people this has happened to. And it's obviously nowhere near what people of color go through.
I know my views are extreme compared to most, but I don't believe that policing, especially in the US, can be reformed. It inherently disproportionately targets people of color and queer people and no amount of training or regulations will ever be enough to fix it.
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On April 21 2021 06:38 Doublemint wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:31 Gorsameth wrote:
I don't think getting a conviction on the most blatant open cold blooded murder in recent history is some sort of landmark victory.
I also wouldn't read to much into 'the blue wall falling' when its this blatant.
looking at the case in a vaccum yeah. no big deal, next please. but this is happening in America and Rodney King is not that long ago. or to not go back all that far... https://heavy.com/news/2020/05/police-who-kill-blacks-rarely-convicted/ Philando Castile Eric Garner Freddie Gray Sandra Bland Michael Brown ... the list goes on. and those are just cases that made the news.
This is really important.
The Mohamed Noor trial set the precedent that a cop could be convicted in Minnesota, but the victim was a white woman. Would they convict a white man of killing a black man?
This is really important for these communities and it's a bit insulting to trivialize it. Now we need to move forward to convicting Potter, although I'm curious if people would be satisfied if she just plead guilty and avoided a trial.
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On April 21 2021 06:39 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:36 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 21 2021 06:31 Gorsameth wrote:
I don't think getting a conviction on the most blatant open cold blooded murder in recent history is some sort of landmark victory.
I also wouldn't read to much into 'the blue wall falling' when its this blatant.
Head of Chicago's Police Union called the cop that killed 13 year old Adam Toledo 'heroic'. This Chauvin conviction was just the bare minimum to keep society remotely functional imo. Was the cop called "heroic" during this specific incident, when the cop killed Adam? Or was the cop perhaps called heroic some time in the past, during a different, unrelated incident where the cop actually did something good?
This incident:
The head of the Chicago Police Union on Thursday said that the shooting of 13-year-old Adam Toledo was “justified” and called the officer’s actions “heroic.”
The remarks from Chicago Police Union President John Catanzara came hours after Chicago’s Office of Civilian Police Accountability released bodycam footage of the March 29 incident.
“I started my dissertation by saying it is 100 percent justified. That officer’s actions were actually heroic,”
thehill.com
On April 21 2021 06:41 plasmidghost wrote:
In the trans community, we have a saying called "walking while trans". It's when police spot a trans woman on the street, accuse her of engaging in prostitution, and arrest her immediately and throw her in a men's prison. In there, the odds are that she will be beaten up and raped. I know of several people this has happened to. And it's obviously nowhere near what people of color goo through.
I know my views are extreme compared to most, but I don't believe that policing, especially in the US, can be reformed. It inherently disproportionately targets people of color and queer people and no amount of training or regulations will ever be enough to fix it.
Extreme or not I agree completely.
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On April 21 2021 06:42 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:39 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 21 2021 06:36 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 21 2021 06:31 Gorsameth wrote:
I don't think getting a conviction on the most blatant open cold blooded murder in recent history is some sort of landmark victory.
I also wouldn't read to much into 'the blue wall falling' when its this blatant.
Head of Chicago's Police Union called the cop that killed 13 year old Adam Toledo 'heroic'. This Chauvin conviction was just the bare minimum to keep society remotely functional imo. Was the cop called "heroic" during this specific incident, when the cop killed Adam? Or was the cop perhaps called heroic some time in the past, during a different, unrelated incident where the cop actually did something good? This incident: Show nested quote +The head of the Chicago Police Union on Thursday said that the shooting of 13-year-old Adam Toledo was “justified” and called the officer’s actions “heroic.”
The remarks from Chicago Police Union President John Catanzara came hours after Chicago’s Office of Civilian Police Accountability released bodycam footage of the March 29 incident.
“I started my dissertation by saying it is 100 percent justified. That officer’s actions were actually heroic,” thehill.com
Oh. Yeah, fuck that then.
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On April 21 2021 06:42 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:39 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On April 21 2021 06:36 GreenHorizons wrote:On April 21 2021 06:31 Gorsameth wrote:
I don't think getting a conviction on the most blatant open cold blooded murder in recent history is some sort of landmark victory.
I also wouldn't read to much into 'the blue wall falling' when its this blatant.
Head of Chicago's Police Union called the cop that killed 13 year old Adam Toledo 'heroic'. This Chauvin conviction was just the bare minimum to keep society remotely functional imo. Was the cop called "heroic" during this specific incident, when the cop killed Adam? Or was the cop perhaps called heroic some time in the past, during a different, unrelated incident where the cop actually did something good? This incident: Show nested quote +The head of the Chicago Police Union on Thursday said that the shooting of 13-year-old Adam Toledo was “justified” and called the officer’s actions “heroic.”
The remarks from Chicago Police Union President John Catanzara came hours after Chicago’s Office of Civilian Police Accountability released bodycam footage of the March 29 incident.
“I started my dissertation by saying it is 100 percent justified. That officer’s actions were actually heroic,” thehill.comShow nested quote +On April 21 2021 06:41 plasmidghost wrote:
In the trans community, we have a saying called "walking while trans". It's when police spot a trans woman on the street, accuse her of engaging in prostitution, and arrest her immediately and throw her in a men's prison. In there, the odds are that she will be beaten up and raped. I know of several people this has happened to. And it's obviously nowhere near what people of color goo through.
I know my views are extreme compared to most, but I don't believe that policing, especially in the US, can be reformed. It inherently disproportionately targets people of color and queer people and no amount of training or regulations will ever be enough to fix it. Extreme or not I agree completely.
the good thing with such statements is that they are so outrageous, and beyond reason that those people expose themselves as basically inhuman. the very same inhumanity they would like to project onto others.
call it human error, lack of training, bad instinct... fear for life. or all of it.
but no, heroic. what a joke.
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Northern Ireland26354 Posts
Until the police review bodycam footage themselves when the next Chauvin-esque incident occurs, censure them and throw their boy/girl to the wolves of the criminal justice system we’re several light years away from good practice.
I can only sigh in relief at this verdict that the egregiousness of him walking free was avoided, it doesn’t particularly feel something to celebrate when your expectations are sitting in the gutter and something steps slightly over it.
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Well this is one of the most ghoulish things I've ever heard any elected official say. What the literal fuck?
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damn Sharpton still got it, nice speech. but I cringe at the hugging and no mask of all the church people... are they all vaccinated I wonder?
protestors outside all had masks in contrast lol.
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Pelosi needed to retire years ago. That she still has this much power and continues to say things this stupid on a regular basis is just ridiculous.
I'm glad that Chauvin was guilty on all counts. I was concerned he was going to get off easy on this. I've followed the court case since the start. The evidence was overwhelming but given this is the US justice system, I had my doubts.
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On April 21 2021 07:27 Ben... wrote:
Pelosi needed to retire years ago. That she still has this much power and continues to say things this stupid on a regular basis is just ridiculous.
I'm glad that Chauvin was guilty on all counts. I was concerned he was going to get off easy on this. I've followed the court case since the start. The evidence was overwhelming but given this is the US justice system, I had my doubts.
I wonder if the sentencing will be legit, or bullshit.
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EPT
