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CorsairHero
Canada9491 Posts
On May 01 2015 04:53 maartendq wrote: Because seriously, who cares about the future of a kid you conceived yourself right? um..money that's suppose to go to the kid (if it's even yours), doesnt always go to the kid if you know what i mean. | ||
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Inertiaddict
United States126 Posts
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On May 01 2015 03:49 Chairman Ray wrote: On a slightly different note, in the US, is there any point for two individuals who both work and have health benefits to get married? The tax penalties are a pain in the butt. Uh, what? There are massive financial benefits to being married compared to being single. This post just screams "I am 14-19ish years old and have no clue what I am talking about, but because I am a teenager I think I know everything". Doesn't really matter. People who want longer commitments will find someone who feels the same and people who bounce around will bounce around. The only thing that should stop is cultural pressure for marriage as something defined in a very narrow and specific way and as something you must do or you are weird. Yea, a lot of threads talking about marriage/relationships end up like this on the internet; hipsters, nerds, or otherwise bitter individuals that want to make sweeping negative statements about relationships/marriage, usually born out of bitterness and immaturity. Marriage can be done for a lot of reasons. The problem is that most of the western world believes in marriage being done because of love, and people, in general, are really bad at this; if you want to marry truly for love/compatibility, you have to be really picky and make the right choice, or you'll end up bitter/unhappy/divorced. On the other hand, historically (and in many cultures still), marriages were arranged/pseudo-arranged and were more about convenience, political moves, financially motivated, etc. which actually makes it quite a bit easier. | ||
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Count9
China10928 Posts
On May 01 2015 05:35 Slaughter wrote: This post just screams "I am 14-19ish years old and have no clue what I am talking about, but because I am a teenager I think I know everything". Doesn't really matter. People who want longer commitments will find someone who feels the same and people who bounce around will bounce around. The only thing that should stop is cultural pressure for marriage as something defined in a very narrow and specific way and as something you must do or you are weird. I dunno, having a ton of friends who date in the 21-30 post college years, the saying "all the good ones are taken by now" rings pretty true, there seem to be way more crazies than at college age. It becomes very obvious why these people are single after the 3rd date when they can't hide the crazy as well. I actually feel pretty bad for one particular friend since he lost a ton of weight and did a lot to turn his life around but the last girls he dated were all crazy, or possessive, or some other red flag, can't imagine what would've happened if he married them. Granted, I live in Bay area, could just be a higher concentration of crazies here. | ||
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Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
Despite that, people have love as the ultimate drive behind their marriage. Of course, it helps that you still get those nice benefits, but that is more of an icing on the cake kind of scenario to these kind of couples. On the side of "eww marriage" topic, I don't foresee myself getting married anytime soon, if at all. Having 100% freedom is a pretty cool thing. | ||
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ComaDose
Canada10357 Posts
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Slaughter
United States20254 Posts
On May 01 2015 06:53 Count9 wrote: I dunno, having a ton of friends who date in the 21-30 post college years, the saying "all the good ones are taken by now" rings pretty true, there seem to be way more crazies than at college age. It becomes very obvious why these people are single after the 3rd date when they can't hide the crazy as well. I actually feel pretty bad for one particular friend since he lost a ton of weight and did a lot to turn his life around but the last girls he dated were all crazy, or possessive, or some other red flag, can't imagine what would've happened if he married them. Granted, I live in Bay area, could just be a higher concentration of crazies here. I could say the exact opposite. Pretty much the overwhelming amount of women I know who are 21-30 range are the opposite of this characterization. In the end a person's personal experience (or even the experience of 1 person + their group of friends) represents a tiny sample size (and maybe says something about where those people are looking?) that makes it silly to characterize a whole gender with those negative (or even positive) connotations. | ||
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zdfgucker
China594 Posts
On May 01 2015 05:42 Inertiaddict wrote: I'm well beyond my teenage years, and I don't know everything. I've just become a bit cynical and jaded, but I think I'm saving dating and kids for my next life, at this point. You generalise 50% of the population based on what seems to be a small sample size of teenage girls. You're not cynical, you're shallow. | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On May 01 2015 06:53 Count9 wrote: I dunno, having a ton of friends who date in the 21-30 post college years, the saying "all the good ones are taken by now" rings pretty true, there seem to be way more crazies than at college age. It becomes very obvious why these people are single after the 3rd date when they can't hide the crazy as well. I actually feel pretty bad for one particular friend since he lost a ton of weight and did a lot to turn his life around but the last girls he dated were all crazy, or possessive, or some other red flag, can't imagine what would've happened if he married them. Granted, I live in Bay area, could just be a higher concentration of crazies here. Think about the number of women that you know. Now think about the number of women that are in your state. Now the country. The fact is that when someone says that "pretty much every girl I know has X or Y wrong with them", the more likely explanation is that a combination of that person's personality, lifestyle choices, occupation, friends, and location result in the kind of girls/guys he/she is exposed to. Someone might be really unlucky and just not meet the right type of people even if they are around (or there just might not be ANY decent people around/single), but the vast majority of the time, not meeting decent girls/guys to date is an aggregate result of the various factors that make up your overall lifestyle. And for some counter-anecdotal evidence, the vast majority of people I meet that complain about stuff like this have some serious problems of their own (i.e. their own personality reflects the people that they complain about dating). | ||
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Thalandros
Netherlands1151 Posts
That said, I'm 17, and my opinion may change over the course of time. I was very much against getting married a couple of years back, now I ''wouldn't mind.'' Still not in favour though. I think you can love each other unconditionally without a paper saying so. | ||
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Inertiaddict
United States126 Posts
On May 01 2015 07:32 zdfgucker wrote: You generalise 50% of the population based on what seems to be a small sample size of teenage girls. You're not cynical, you're shallow. I wasn't really generalizing women as much as I was generalizing my feeling towards Marriage. I generalized the feelings that I have towards the women I've been with, sure, but I never said "most/all women are this or that". I guess I'm just waiting for the right one to impress me, but until then, it's not for me, and I do go through this with an open mind. | ||
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OuchyDathurts
United States4588 Posts
On May 01 2015 03:50 soul55555 wrote: Marriage is overrated it's better to be single. 50% of Marriages fail and your end up stuck paying child support and alimony. You can still make children without being married, and you're still responsible for paying child support if you didn't get married. So that really doesn't solve anything for you. Personally I see marriage as an legal agreement, at the end of the day its a piece of paper. It gives you some tax benefits, access to some things legally. But that piece of paper doesn't prove someones love. A married couple doesn't love each other more than a committed dating couple because they got a piece of paper involved. As someone who is mortified of commitment the idea of marriage is a nightmare to me. The only thing that trumps it would be having children, I have no desire for either. Long term committed relationship sure, marriage and kids scares the shit out of me. | ||
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oBlade
United States6037 Posts
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brickrd
United States4894 Posts
if you genuinely believe in your relationship and want to be with someone on a permanent basis, i don't see any reason to avoid marriage. you don't have to have an expensive reception or a religious ceremony (at least in my part of the world, thankfully) in order to get married. you don't have to invite anyone you don't want there. but it is a statement to society about what your relationship is, and it's a statement i consider worth making. if you're an adult with a job who buys groceries and uses public services, you are a part of society and so is your relationship. you and your SO can claim not to care what society thinks, and if that works for you then fine. but personally i have an active desire for the entire world to know my wife and i are committed to each other and that we aren't just "dating" or "having fun". i like having a ring to point to if someone is trying to flirt with me. i like that my wife can call me my husband to drop a hint if some creep is hitting on her. i just like being married to her. it's not what my parents want or what some religion wanted or what the government wanted, it's what i want. at the end of the day everyone can do whatever they want, but that's my take on it On May 01 2015 08:09 Inertiaddict wrote: I wasn't really generalizing women as much as I was generalizing my feeling towards Marriage. I generalized the feelings that I have towards the women I've been with, sure, but I never said "most/all women are this or that". I guess I'm just waiting for the right one to impress me, but until then, it's not for me, and I do go through this with an open mind. based on the way you talk about women there's a really strong chance you are actually the asshole in your relationships, dude On May 01 2015 08:27 oBlade wrote: It's a legal contract, anything about "love" or something is out of place. I defy anyone to put love into a contract. What's a marriage license, a love certificate? The rings are some kind of mystical artifact that transfer love? It's a legal way to be partners. nah dude it's also a social contract and there are thousands of years of history backing me up. i defy you to put love into anything, it's just love. why does a red shape with two bumps at the top mean love? why does smashing your lips into someone else's lips mean love? why does anything mean anything? the legality of marriage is the legality of marriage, but ignoring its place as a social ceremony is just plain ignorant. you can disagree with it or think it's silly, but saying it doesn't exist just makes you seem uninformed | ||
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killa_robot
Canada1884 Posts
On May 01 2015 03:19 reki- wrote: Never get married in the USA (as a man) is what I'm thinking If you live in Canada you need to reduce that to "don't ever move in with a woman", because if you live with someone for I think 3 years you're considered married according to common law. On May 01 2015 06:42 Stratos_speAr wrote: Uh, what? There are massive financial benefits to being married compared to being single. Yea, a lot of threads talking about marriage/relationships end up like this on the internet; hipsters, nerds, or otherwise bitter individuals that want to make sweeping negative statements about relationships/marriage, usually born out of bitterness and immaturity. Marriage can be done for a lot of reasons. The problem is that most of the western world believes in marriage being done because of love, and people, in general, are really bad at this; if you want to marry truly for love/compatibility, you have to be really picky and make the right choice, or you'll end up bitter/unhappy/divorced. On the other hand, historically (and in many cultures still), marriages were arranged/pseudo-arranged and were more about convenience, political moves, financially motivated, etc. which actually makes it quite a bit easier. Half-true imo. Divorces themselves are the main reason marriage is considered a terrible idea now. People have been getting married and living with a single person for the rest of their lives for centuries, but it's only recently that divorces have been considered acceptable. | ||
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Glowsphere
United States170 Posts
While my OP became rather narrow, I'm interested in general about the topic of marriage. I'm 31 and so friends I grew up with are starting to marry and have kids. My view of marriage is that for the few that work out there seem to be way more that don't. My parents divorced when I was 7. They remain good friends to this day, and probably love each other more than many married couples. As I've grown older I, can understand better why they divorced; they came from different cultures and values. So I know of at least one instance where love existed and yet marriage failed. It makes me wonder at all the people who marry each other without love, and seemingly without any reason to replace it. I wonder too at the function of marriage among a mostly secular society. | ||
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Glowsphere
United States170 Posts
On May 01 2015 03:41 Fuchsteufelswild wrote: Question: What did the people who voted for "other" mean and what did the OP intend this to (be able to) mean? What sort of other practical concerns are there? Religious tradition, where the couple may love each other but marry to please their more strongly religious parents? For status in old times (and I guess potentially still now)? I guess by "other" I meant whatever wasn't love, kids, or money. I felt I couldn't come up on the spot with every reason people would marry (religion probably belonged on there), so I just put other for people who didn't like the choices. Practical concerns I guess would include money, house sharing, tax benefits, cultural solidarity if immigrants, and such things. | ||
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brickrd
United States4894 Posts
On May 01 2015 08:43 killa_robot wrote: i take issue with the argument that divorce rates are a reason not to get married. love and emotion are not possible to generalize across any percentage or demographic of people: a couple either works or it doesn't. i've been happily married for almost 3 years and can't imagine ever wanting anything but to be with my wife. i know of couples who loved each other until they died together in their 80's and 90's. marriage works for me and it worked for them - why make us responsible for the failed ones?If you live in Canada you need to reduce that to "don't ever move in with a woman", because if you live with someone for I think 3 years you're considered married according to common law. Half-true imo. Divorces themselves are the main reason marriage is considered a terrible idea now. People have been getting married and living with a single person for the rest of their lives for centuries, but it's only recently that divorces have been considered acceptable. then you get into the issue of how you define a "failed" marriage. i mean, i personally want to be married to my wife forever, of course, but if some other couple gets divorced then does that mean i view the time they spent on each other as a "failure"? it depends on a lot of things. did they grow as people during that time? did they have kids and do they love the kids? are the kids okay? are the divorcees going to be okay? seems to me the problem with marriage is the expectation of expense on the ring, reception, ceremony, etc. and how these things create an "anchor" on people who may change their hearts down the road. i'm not saying i think marriage shouldn't be forever, but realistically of course it's not going to work every time. why not just make it easier on the unfortunate souls for whom it doesn't work out? i've been let down by a lot of "friends" who turned out to be trash, but god help me if i don't keep trying to make friendship work too | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On May 01 2015 08:43 killa_robot wrote: If you live in Canada you need to reduce that to "don't ever move in with a woman", because if you live with someone for I think 3 years you're considered married according to common law. Half-true imo. Divorces themselves are the main reason marriage is considered a terrible idea now. People have been getting married and living with a single person for the rest of their lives for centuries, but it's only recently that divorces have been considered acceptable. I don't really buy this argument that divorce makes marriage less desirable. If anything, divorce being an option makes it easier for people to commit to a relationship because they know they can get out of it; that's all that divorce is, the option to choose to end the commitment you made. It doesn't really follow that having the ability to stop something would cause people to not do that thing at all. In fact, logic says that the exact opposite would happen. | ||
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NovaTheFeared
United States7232 Posts
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