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On September 23 2012 14:26 robjapan wrote:
Long may it continue!!
All the vast majority of people in the world want is peace, it's a real shame that we have such ugliness among us, but that is where we need to be strong and to tell those people NO, violence and hatred are wrong.
I've been here almost 10 years now, and all I've seen is friendly, kind, peace loving people.
No to hate, No to violence and a BIG YES to peace and friendship.
This is what I and the vast majority of Japanese people believe.
I agree and people should stop with all the Japan bashing or any country bashing in general.
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On September 24 2012 06:58 yaliu07 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2012 14:05 robjapan wrote:
well, in general Japanese people despise Ishihara and while he has "some" support, there is far far FAR greater support for pacifism and peace.
I can see the potential for it to happen in say 100 years and it is worrying to know your neighbour is building up a HUGE army... it has to be asked... why is China building such a big army... for what purpose does China require an army in a time of peace?
I agree history "can" repeat itself and it will if we let racist groups take control of our countries, I liked your post right up until the last bit, again Japan does NOT see itself as a victim, it is widely agreed within Japanese people that they were the aggressors. I am Chinese. And I am asking the same question that why is United States building a bigger army. For what purpose does United States require a bigger army in a time of peace? I will answer your question why China needs a big army after you answer why does United States need a bigger army?
America is involved in wars reguarly or are policing the world as some put it. They are spread out everywhere. It seems natural they would need a big army or they would collapse. China is however not involved in anything at the moment right?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_United_States
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On September 24 2012 11:21 b0mBerMan wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2012 14:26 robjapan wrote:
Long may it continue!!
All the vast majority of people in the world want is peace, it's a real shame that we have such ugliness among us, but that is where we need to be strong and to tell those people NO, violence and hatred are wrong.
I've been here almost 10 years now, and all I've seen is friendly, kind, peace loving people.
No to hate, No to violence and a BIG YES to peace and friendship.
This is what I and the vast majority of Japanese people believe. I agree and people should stop with all the Japan bashing or any country bashing in general.
Japanese Prime minister stated in an interview with WSJ today that there will be no good will payments to sex slaves that suffered under Japanese Imperialism, stating that all payments are done (something like couple hundred dollars -_-).
These old ladies who suffered at the age of 15 to 20s are almost all dead but some. When the last survivor passes away, they will never get an apology. They aren't even seeking legal payment, all they want is a heart felt apology. But no, of course Japanese gov't can't do that. A lot of seminars and concerts and information sessions regarding this issue is rejected in Japan.
Germany created a foundation named 'Rememberance, Responsibility, and Future' for all that suffered in WW2. Does Japan know what these three words mean? I never blame Japanese citizens (other than some assholes that exist in every country anyway) for the bad image of their country. I blame their gov't and leaders. It is truly embarassing to deny what they did.
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On September 24 2012 11:44 ExceeD_DreaM wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2012 11:21 b0mBerMan wrote:On September 23 2012 14:26 robjapan wrote:
Long may it continue!!
All the vast majority of people in the world want is peace, it's a real shame that we have such ugliness among us, but that is where we need to be strong and to tell those people NO, violence and hatred are wrong.
I've been here almost 10 years now, and all I've seen is friendly, kind, peace loving people.
No to hate, No to violence and a BIG YES to peace and friendship.
This is what I and the vast majority of Japanese people believe. I agree and people should stop with all the Japan bashing or any country bashing in general. Japanese Prime minister stated in an interview with WSJ today that there will be no good will payments to sex slaves that suffered under Japanese Imperialism, stating that all payments are done (something like couple hundred dollars -_-). These old ladies who suffered at the age of 15 to 20s are almost all dead but some. When the last survivor passes away, they will never get an apology. They aren't even seeking legal payment, all they want is a heart felt apology. But no, of course Japanese gov't can't do that. A lot of seminars and concerts and information sessions regarding this issue is rejected in Japan. Germany created a foundation named 'Rememberance, Responsibility, and Future' for all that suffered in WW2. Does Japan know what these three words mean? I never blame Japanese citizens (other than some assholes that exist in every country anyway) for the bad image of their country. I blame their gov't and leaders. It is truly embarassing to deny what they did.
Japan is a country of democracy. Their own politicians who got elected by their people is saying no such thing as "nanjing massacre" occurred and even if they do admit it happened, they will never formally acknowledge their own country's past atrocities. Now, why would japanese people elect these clowns into the government? Maybe because they also don't want to admit these past atrocities?
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On September 24 2012 11:47 TehPrime wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2012 11:44 ExceeD_DreaM wrote:On September 24 2012 11:21 b0mBerMan wrote:On September 23 2012 14:26 robjapan wrote:
Long may it continue!!
All the vast majority of people in the world want is peace, it's a real shame that we have such ugliness among us, but that is where we need to be strong and to tell those people NO, violence and hatred are wrong.
I've been here almost 10 years now, and all I've seen is friendly, kind, peace loving people.
No to hate, No to violence and a BIG YES to peace and friendship.
This is what I and the vast majority of Japanese people believe. I agree and people should stop with all the Japan bashing or any country bashing in general. Japanese Prime minister stated in an interview with WSJ today that there will be no good will payments to sex slaves that suffered under Japanese Imperialism, stating that all payments are done (something like couple hundred dollars -_-). These old ladies who suffered at the age of 15 to 20s are almost all dead but some. When the last survivor passes away, they will never get an apology. They aren't even seeking legal payment, all they want is a heart felt apology. But no, of course Japanese gov't can't do that. A lot of seminars and concerts and information sessions regarding this issue is rejected in Japan. Germany created a foundation named 'Rememberance, Responsibility, and Future' for all that suffered in WW2. Does Japan know what these three words mean? I never blame Japanese citizens (other than some assholes that exist in every country anyway) for the bad image of their country. I blame their gov't and leaders. It is truly embarassing to deny what they did. Japan is a country of democracy. Their own politicians who got elected by their people is saying no such thing as "nanjing massacre" occurred and even if they do admit it happened, they will never formally acknowledge their own country's past atrocities. Now, why would japanese people elect these clowns into the government? Maybe because they also don't want to admit these past atrocities?
What you say is true too.
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On September 24 2012 11:47 TehPrime wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2012 11:44 ExceeD_DreaM wrote:On September 24 2012 11:21 b0mBerMan wrote:On September 23 2012 14:26 robjapan wrote:
Long may it continue!!
All the vast majority of people in the world want is peace, it's a real shame that we have such ugliness among us, but that is where we need to be strong and to tell those people NO, violence and hatred are wrong.
I've been here almost 10 years now, and all I've seen is friendly, kind, peace loving people.
No to hate, No to violence and a BIG YES to peace and friendship.
This is what I and the vast majority of Japanese people believe. I agree and people should stop with all the Japan bashing or any country bashing in general. Japanese Prime minister stated in an interview with WSJ today that there will be no good will payments to sex slaves that suffered under Japanese Imperialism, stating that all payments are done (something like couple hundred dollars -_-). These old ladies who suffered at the age of 15 to 20s are almost all dead but some. When the last survivor passes away, they will never get an apology. They aren't even seeking legal payment, all they want is a heart felt apology. But no, of course Japanese gov't can't do that. A lot of seminars and concerts and information sessions regarding this issue is rejected in Japan. Germany created a foundation named 'Rememberance, Responsibility, and Future' for all that suffered in WW2. Does Japan know what these three words mean? I never blame Japanese citizens (other than some assholes that exist in every country anyway) for the bad image of their country. I blame their gov't and leaders. It is truly embarassing to deny what they did. Japan is a country of democracy. Their own politicians who got elected by their people is saying no such thing as "nanjing massacre" occurred and even if they do admit it happened, they will never formally acknowledge their own country's past atrocities. Now, why would japanese people elect these clowns into the government? Maybe because they also don't want to admit these past atrocities?
I've never really understood nationalism. It's not much different here either, there are plenty of people who get angry and accuse the president of 'going around apologizing' just for admitting the fact that our country hasn't always made the most ethical choice in every situation.
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Everyone needs to calm down on sensitive issues like this
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*sigh*
These politicians get in power because they are good at their jobs, then at some point they say some stupid shit about the war, people go... woah.. you can't say shit like that, the guy apologizes and life moves on.
Then some forum wise ass finds a quote and says... OMG WHY IS HE IN POWER???
Someone said why does the US need a big army? because the US has signed agreements promising to protect various nations around the world, one of them being Japan.
This is their responsibility and they have to build and maintain an army to fulfill their agreements.
Ok go, why does China need a big army?
And the guy who said they gave a "few hundred dollars" where are these idiots pulling this shit from? right out their ass by the looks of it.
As an initial payment, it was around 350 million dollars, which mean around 3000 dollars each, the Japanese setup an additional fund in the 90s to further compensate these comfort women. They did this VOLUNTARILY.
I give up on this thread, people please, read about a situation before you comment about it,,,, :-/
Peace out guys, remember All you need is love!
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On September 24 2012 12:39 robjapan wrote:
Ok go, why does China need a big army?
We've already talked about it.
Nothing can be solved if we preach peace and love rhetoric for self-serving reasons but do not actually listen to each other.
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On September 24 2012 12:39 robjapan wrote:
*sigh*
These politicians get in power because they are good at their jobs, then at some point they say some stupid shit about the war, people go... woah.. you can't say shit like that, the guy apologizes and life moves on.
Then some forum wise ass finds a quote and says... OMG WHY IS HE IN POWER???
Someone said why does the US need a big army? because the US has signed agreements promising to protect various nations around the world, one of them being Japan.
This is their responsibility and they have to build and maintain an army to fulfill their agreements.
Ok go, why does China need a big army?
And the guy who said they gave a "few hundred dollars" where are these idiots pulling this shit from? right out their ass by the looks of it.
As an initial payment, it was around 350 million dollars, which mean around 3000 dollars each, the Japanese setup an additional fund in the 90s to further compensate these comfort women. They did this VOLUNTARILY.
I give up on this thread, people please, read about a situation before you comment about it,,,, :-/
Peace out guys, remember All you need is love!
Sort of an off topic question, but you aren't Japanese but believe that 'the soul is cleansed of the deeds of it body after death'?
It's just curious, is all. May I ask your cultural/religious background?
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I don't blame the Chinese for holding a grudge.
Whatever happened before can happen again, and China should remember precisely what happened during WWII to make sure that they won't be wronged again.
All this nonsense posted here about "peace" is a joke. A country can be nice and democratic when it's economy is doing decently, but when a country starts declining, NATIONALISM and war resurface, just like how it always does.
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On September 24 2012 12:39 robjapan wrote:
*sigh*
These politicians get in power because they are good at their jobs, then at some point they say some stupid shit about the war, people go... woah.. you can't say shit like that, the guy apologizes and life moves on.
Then some forum wise ass finds a quote and says... OMG WHY IS HE IN POWER???
Someone said why does the US need a big army? because the US has signed agreements promising to protect various nations around the world, one of them being Japan.
This is their responsibility and they have to build and maintain an army to fulfill their agreements.
Ok go, why does China need a big army?
And the guy who said they gave a "few hundred dollars" where are these idiots pulling this shit from? right out their ass by the looks of it.
As an initial payment, it was around 350 million dollars, which mean around 3000 dollars each, the Japanese setup an additional fund in the 90s to further compensate these comfort women. They did this VOLUNTARILY.
I give up on this thread, people please, read about a situation before you comment about it,,,, :-/
Peace out guys, remember All you need is love!
I give up on people like you. You are the one who needs to know about the situation before commenting at all. It is because of people like you that Japan cannot be forgiven even as of today.
First of all, the fund in 90s, specifically 'Asian Women's Fund' in 1994 was funded by Japanese only in operation, but the fund money came from donators only. There is a problem here that the fund money did not come directly from the Japanese Government. At the time, this fund by Murayama was criticized heavily by Koreans. In 'Asian Women's Fund' report, it states that the charity tried to compensate approximately 2 million dollars to Korean and Filipino (which is an amount that can't even be considered a compensation for life time of pain). This was rejected in Korea for obvious reasons because this really wasn't an apology. In Korea, people were infuriated at Japan's posture regarding this matter because they tried to evade being responsible by making it a public charity instead of a government compensated fund. In 1997, this fund stopped its activity in Korea.
Even after several years of fund being set up, only 9 women by the end of 1996 (All Filipino, out of 107 comfort women) took the compensation. Even these women stated that this fund compensation and apology from Japanese Gov't is a separate thing. Considering the number of known comfort women, the compensation made to them is pitiful and apology non-existent.
As for your 350 million compensation, that was a WAR COMPENSATION TO KOREA as a WHOLE for the war damages. That 350 Million dollars INCLUDES compensation for comfort women. but if 350 million was for the war damages, imagine how much it was set aside for the comfort women. NONE. They received none, and your claim is bogus.
There is a serious misunderstanding you are having right now. The apology made through fund and etc, regardless of the intention, is not enough. When one organization or a group commits a crime to another, the leader must express its apology. If the leader is dead, the successor must. At the time of the war, the leader was the king of Japan. Now that he is dead, the apology must be made by Akihiro, the current king, which never happened yet.
The compensation must be through the government not a public charity. This action of trying to pull away from responsibility is absolutely horrendous. Do you know in 2008, Japanese supreme court ordered its corporations (such as Mitsubishi that participated in slavery) to pay the comfort women 99 Yen each? The women sued these companies in 1998 because they were never paid for the work they did, and asked for compensation of 'welfare pension' that they were in at the time. 99 yen is all they were paid after all they went through.
The name 'comfort women' is technically wrong too. Hilary Clinton said it best recently. They were 'Sex Slaves'. They need to compensate these women before they all die (There aren't many left) and aside from the compensation, THEY NEED TO APOLOGIZE TRUTHFULLY.
These old ladies STILL to this day protest every Wednesday in front of the Japanese Embassy in Korea for the past 20 years.
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We(Chinese) do hold a grudge. However, we also moved forward. We have a 40 years relationship with Japan and China is second biggest trade partner with Japan.
But Japanese government tries to nationalize the island cause the protest in China. AGAIN, IT WAS JAPANESE GOVERNMENT TRIES TO NATIONALIZE THE ISLAND. We are NOT the trouble maker. We are victim in this incident.
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On September 23 2012 16:03 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2012 12:45 RavenLoud wrote:“The Imperialist Nation Is China”: What Japanese Internet Users Think About the Diaoyu Protests
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One Channel 2 discussion thread showed a map of a “unified” China that includes Japan, painted red. “Today's China is the world's most aggressive country,” responded one commenter. Another said, “No matter how you look at it, the imperialist nation is China.” Yet another, “ ‘Down with Japan’s imperialism!’—I don't want to hear that from some guys who have anachronistic territorial expansion ambitions.” In a separate discussion, a commenter wrote, “the next World War will be China vs. the world.” There were also calls for Japan to develop a stronger military of its own and not be so reliant on the U.S.-Japan security alliance. “As America’s power has gotten weaker, Japan must protect its own country.”
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Japanese commenters also raised the same question being asked all over the world: Are these protests even about Japan? People suggested the Chinese anger might be more related to domestic grievances. In response to attacks on Japanese and other foreign companies, one post said, “the gap between rich and poor in China is terrible, so the poor hate all the foreign companies because they're making money.”
The Japanese don't see China as a victim. China’s nationalism, as belligerent as it may appear, is rooted in a sense of suffering from a “century of humiliation” that goes back to the First Opium War and the British acquisition of Hong Kong in 1842. What some of the more rabid Chinese don’t appreciate, however, is that the rest of the world—especially Japan—does not see China as the underdog.
The sad thing is, many Chinese truly believe they were wronged by Japan. They cite not only Japan’s World War II-era behavior, but its failure to acknowledge the depth of suffering inflicted on the Chinese. After these protests, this legitimate grievance will be even less likely to be heard by Japan.
SourceThanks to the retards rioters and Ishihara for taking the world a few steps backwards I guess? Japan never cared. Saying that they did before is disingenuous. The rioters had a negative effect on Japan - obviously - but nothing was going to change their mind to begin with. The failure of Japan to properly mend its relations with other East Asian countries after the war is a fester in the wound. One day, all of East Asia is going to pay for it.
This is exactly my feelings as well.
The core of the problem has not been tackled, and Japan is not part of the solution.
Because of that, there is more chance of having another East Asian war than not in the far future.
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On September 24 2012 11:26 weishime wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2012 06:58 yaliu07 wrote:On September 23 2012 14:05 robjapan wrote:
well, in general Japanese people despise Ishihara and while he has "some" support, there is far far FAR greater support for pacifism and peace.
I can see the potential for it to happen in say 100 years and it is worrying to know your neighbour is building up a HUGE army... it has to be asked... why is China building such a big army... for what purpose does China require an army in a time of peace?
I agree history "can" repeat itself and it will if we let racist groups take control of our countries, I liked your post right up until the last bit, again Japan does NOT see itself as a victim, it is widely agreed within Japanese people that they were the aggressors. I am Chinese. And I am asking the same question that why is United States building a bigger army. For what purpose does United States require a bigger army in a time of peace? I will answer your question why China needs a big army after you answer why does United States need a bigger army? America is involved in wars reguarly or are policing the world as some put it. They are spread out everywhere. It seems natural they would need a big army or they would collapse. China is however not involved in anything at the moment right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_United_States
Who would you rather have someone fight for you, a person who has been through battle and has seen death, or someone who hasn't?
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2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
On September 24 2012 11:44 ExceeD_DreaM wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2012 11:21 b0mBerMan wrote:On September 23 2012 14:26 robjapan wrote:
Long may it continue!!
All the vast majority of people in the world want is peace, it's a real shame that we have such ugliness among us, but that is where we need to be strong and to tell those people NO, violence and hatred are wrong.
I've been here almost 10 years now, and all I've seen is friendly, kind, peace loving people.
No to hate, No to violence and a BIG YES to peace and friendship.
This is what I and the vast majority of Japanese people believe. I agree and people should stop with all the Japan bashing or any country bashing in general. Japanese Prime minister stated in an interview with WSJ today that there will be no good will payments to sex slaves that suffered under Japanese Imperialism, stating that all payments are done (something like couple hundred dollars -_-). These old ladies who suffered at the age of 15 to 20s are almost all dead but some. When the last survivor passes away, they will never get an apology. They aren't even seeking legal payment, all they want is a heart felt apology. But no, of course Japanese gov't can't do that. A lot of seminars and concerts and information sessions regarding this issue is rejected in Japan. Germany created a foundation named 'Rememberance, Responsibility, and Future' for all that suffered in WW2. Does Japan know what these three words mean? I never blame Japanese citizens (other than some assholes that exist in every country anyway) for the bad image of their country. I blame their gov't and leaders. It is truly embarassing to deny what they did.
I'm not sure the Comfort Women want just an apology at this point. They probably want more compensation and for the Japanese to bend over backwards. The Japanese government has given heart-felt apologies before to comfort women.
January 1, 1992: Prime Minister Kiichi Miyazawa. "[Concerning the comfort women,] I apologize from the bottom of my heart and feel remorse for those people who suffered indescribable hardships"
July 6, 1992. Chief Cabinet Secretary Koichi Kato. "The Government again would like to express its sincere apology and remorse to all those who have suffered indescribable hardship as so-called 'wartime comfort women,' irrespective of their nationality or place of birth. With profound remorse and determination that such a mistake must never be repeated, Japan will maintain its stance as a pacifist nation and will endeavor to build up new future-oriented relations with the Republic of Korea and with other countries and regions in Asia. As I listen to many people, I feel truly grieved for this issue. By listening to the opinions of people from various directions, I would like to consider sincerely in what way we can express our feelings to those who suffered such hardship"
August 4, 1993: Chief Cabinet Secretary Yōhei Kōno. "Undeniably, this was an act, with the involvement of the military authorities of the day, that severely injured the honor and dignity of many women. The Government of Japan would like to take this opportunity once again to extend its sincere apologies and remorse to all those, irrespective of place of origin, who suffered immeasurable pain and incurable physical and psychological wounds as comfort women"
August 31, 1994: Prime Minister Tomiichi Murayama. "Japan's actions in a certain period of the past not only claimed numerous victims here in Japan but also left the peoples of neighboring Asia and elsewhere with scars that are painful even today. I am thus taking this opportunity to state my belief, based on my profound remorse for these acts of aggression, colonial rule, and the like caused such unbearable suffering and sorrow for so many people, that Japan's future path should be one of making every effort to build world peace in line with my no-war commitment. It is imperative for us Japanese to look squarely to our history with the peoples of neighboring Asia and elsewhere. Only with solid basis of mutual understanding and confidence that can be built through overcoming the pain on both sides, can we and the peoples of neighboring countries together clear up the future of Asia-Pacific.... On the issue of wartime 'comfort women,' which seriously stained the honor and dignity of many women, I would like to take this opportunity once again to express my profound and sincere remorse and apologies. With regard to this issue as well, I believe that one way of demonstrating such feelings of apologies and remorse is to work to further promote mutual understanding with the countries and areas concerned as well as to face squarely to the past and ensure that it is rightly conveyed to future generations. This initiative, in this sense, has been drawn up consistent with such belief"
July 1995: Prime Minister Tomiichi Murayama. "The problem of the so-called wartime comfort women is one such scar, which, with the involvement of the Japanese military forces of the time, seriously stained the honor and dignity of many women. This is entirely inexcusable. I offer my profound apology to all those who, as wartime comfort women, suffered emotional and physical wounds that can never be closed"
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Canada2068 Posts
On September 23 2012 16:03 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2012 12:45 RavenLoud wrote:“The Imperialist Nation Is China”: What Japanese Internet Users Think About the Diaoyu Protests
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One Channel 2 discussion thread showed a map of a “unified” China that includes Japan, painted red. “Today's China is the world's most aggressive country,” responded one commenter. Another said, “No matter how you look at it, the imperialist nation is China.” Yet another, “ ‘Down with Japan’s imperialism!’—I don't want to hear that from some guys who have anachronistic territorial expansion ambitions.” In a separate discussion, a commenter wrote, “the next World War will be China vs. the world.” There were also calls for Japan to develop a stronger military of its own and not be so reliant on the U.S.-Japan security alliance. “As America’s power has gotten weaker, Japan must protect its own country.”
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Japanese commenters also raised the same question being asked all over the world: Are these protests even about Japan? People suggested the Chinese anger might be more related to domestic grievances. In response to attacks on Japanese and other foreign companies, one post said, “the gap between rich and poor in China is terrible, so the poor hate all the foreign companies because they're making money.”
The Japanese don't see China as a victim. China’s nationalism, as belligerent as it may appear, is rooted in a sense of suffering from a “century of humiliation” that goes back to the First Opium War and the British acquisition of Hong Kong in 1842. What some of the more rabid Chinese don’t appreciate, however, is that the rest of the world—especially Japan—does not see China as the underdog.
The sad thing is, many Chinese truly believe they were wronged by Japan. They cite not only Japan’s World War II-era behavior, but its failure to acknowledge the depth of suffering inflicted on the Chinese. After these protests, this legitimate grievance will be even less likely to be heard by Japan.
SourceThanks to the retards rioters and Ishihara for taking the world a few steps backwards I guess? Japan never cared. Saying that they did before is disingenuous. The rioters had a negative effect on Japan - obviously - but nothing was going to change their mind to begin with. The failure of Japan to properly mend its relations with other East Asian countries after the war is a fester in the wound. One day, all of East Asia is going to pay for it.
I don't understand how this guy gets away with spreading misinformation (and possibly China-Japan hatred) like this. He never even provides supporting information. Look at above post for apologies given to comfort women. If you don't take a country's apology at face value, then I don't quite know what to tell ya. For the umpteenth time:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_war_apology_statements_issued_by_Japan
I remember someone earlier in this thread complained that all Japan's apology amounted to was no weightier than a simple, "Excuse me, we may have done wrong." The Wikipedia page explicitly calls this a "tragic mistranslation".
This interpretation is inaccurate, however, and a tragic mistranslation. It has led to unnecessary misunderstandings regarding the extent and sincerity of the numerous apologies made by Japanese leaders. As Jeffrey Mok and Mitsuhiro Tokunaga clarify with their extensive research on this issue:
“The use of owabi was clearly appropriate in its formality and degree of imposition. Both the authoritative dictionaries from Beijing Waiguoyu Xuexiao Japanese-Chinese Dictionary and Iwanami Japanese-Chinese Dictionary categorized owabi as a formal and weighty apologetic word. It was also commonly used as an official and formal way of apology and carried the same degree of regret as other formal forms of apologetic words such as shazai, shinsha and chinsha. It was also noted that shazai use was limited to print and was rare. Both owabi and chinsha （陳謝）were commonly used as official and formal apologetic expression and neither was considered weaker than the other.”
Blaming wars on grudges that are 70 years old also doesn't sound very reasonable to me. You have to remember that it's the CCP in control and they're mostly rational, clear-minded people who definitely don't hold a grudge against Japan's war crimes in WW2--it's the nationalistic civilians who do. If you think the CCP will go to war because of public sentiment alone, then you're quite clueless about how politics work in China.
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On September 24 2012 13:52 Souma wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2012 11:44 ExceeD_DreaM wrote:On September 24 2012 11:21 b0mBerMan wrote:On September 23 2012 14:26 robjapan wrote:
Long may it continue!!
All the vast majority of people in the world want is peace, it's a real shame that we have such ugliness among us, but that is where we need to be strong and to tell those people NO, violence and hatred are wrong.
I've been here almost 10 years now, and all I've seen is friendly, kind, peace loving people.
No to hate, No to violence and a BIG YES to peace and friendship.
This is what I and the vast majority of Japanese people believe. I agree and people should stop with all the Japan bashing or any country bashing in general. Japanese Prime minister stated in an interview with WSJ today that there will be no good will payments to sex slaves that suffered under Japanese Imperialism, stating that all payments are done (something like couple hundred dollars -_-). These old ladies who suffered at the age of 15 to 20s are almost all dead but some. When the last survivor passes away, they will never get an apology. They aren't even seeking legal payment, all they want is a heart felt apology. But no, of course Japanese gov't can't do that. A lot of seminars and concerts and information sessions regarding this issue is rejected in Japan. Germany created a foundation named 'Rememberance, Responsibility, and Future' for all that suffered in WW2. Does Japan know what these three words mean? I never blame Japanese citizens (other than some assholes that exist in every country anyway) for the bad image of their country. I blame their gov't and leaders. It is truly embarassing to deny what they did. I'm not sure the Comfort Women want just an apology at this point. They probably want more compensation and for the Japanese to bend over backwards. The Japanese government has given heart-felt apologies before to comfort women. Show nested quote +January 1, 1992: Prime Minister Kiichi Miyazawa. "[Concerning the comfort women,] I apologize from the bottom of my heart and feel remorse for those people who suffered indescribable hardships"
July 6, 1992. Chief Cabinet Secretary Koichi Kato. "The Government again would like to express its sincere apology and remorse to all those who have suffered indescribable hardship as so-called 'wartime comfort women,' irrespective of their nationality or place of birth. With profound remorse and determination that such a mistake must never be repeated, Japan will maintain its stance as a pacifist nation and will endeavor to build up new future-oriented relations with the Republic of Korea and with other countries and regions in Asia. As I listen to many people, I feel truly grieved for this issue. By listening to the opinions of people from various directions, I would like to consider sincerely in what way we can express our feelings to those who suffered such hardship"
August 4, 1993: Chief Cabinet Secretary Yōhei Kōno. "Undeniably, this was an act, with the involvement of the military authorities of the day, that severely injured the honor and dignity of many women. The Government of Japan would like to take this opportunity once again to extend its sincere apologies and remorse to all those, irrespective of place of origin, who suffered immeasurable pain and incurable physical and psychological wounds as comfort women"
August 31, 1994: Prime Minister Tomiichi Murayama. "Japan's actions in a certain period of the past not only claimed numerous victims here in Japan but also left the peoples of neighboring Asia and elsewhere with scars that are painful even today. I am thus taking this opportunity to state my belief, based on my profound remorse for these acts of aggression, colonial rule, and the like caused such unbearable suffering and sorrow for so many people, that Japan's future path should be one of making every effort to build world peace in line with my no-war commitment. It is imperative for us Japanese to look squarely to our history with the peoples of neighboring Asia and elsewhere. Only with solid basis of mutual understanding and confidence that can be built through overcoming the pain on both sides, can we and the peoples of neighboring countries together clear up the future of Asia-Pacific.... On the issue of wartime 'comfort women,' which seriously stained the honor and dignity of many women, I would like to take this opportunity once again to express my profound and sincere remorse and apologies. With regard to this issue as well, I believe that one way of demonstrating such feelings of apologies and remorse is to work to further promote mutual understanding with the countries and areas concerned as well as to face squarely to the past and ensure that it is rightly conveyed to future generations. This initiative, in this sense, has been drawn up consistent with such belief"
July 1995: Prime Minister Tomiichi Murayama. "The problem of the so-called wartime comfort women is one such scar, which, with the involvement of the Japanese military forces of the time, seriously stained the honor and dignity of many women. This is entirely inexcusable. I offer my profound apology to all those who, as wartime comfort women, suffered emotional and physical wounds that can never be closed"
Again, Japan tries to end all issues regarding Comfort Women because of these apologies from ministers. Please read again what I wrote, and see who they need an apology from. Furthermore, Being consistent with apologies would be nice too. An apology and decision to compensate 99 yen (about 1 dollar) to each women doesn't match together very well. Certainly, Prime minister Noda thinks Japan has done everything regarding comfort women issues.
To the above poster, these women who suffered, taken at teenager's age, raped, murdered, tortured.. Some of these women are still alive. Yes, these Prime Ministers said such and such, but actions did not follow. They are all lip-service. An apology has to be made by the leader, the king, not a prime minister that changes every couple of years. These women are over 80 years of age and they are still protesting. Has any of these officials visited Korea and apologized in person to these women? No. All they've shown so far is disrespect. These women specifically stated in interviews that they aren't even looking forward to compensation, and if they DO get compensated, THEY WILL DONATE ALL THE MONEY to help women suffering in Congo. All they want is a heart felt apology, not some shit like 99 Yen compensation which is just demoralizing.
By the way, has Japan admitted to the atrocities by unit 731 and Maruta project?
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2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
On September 24 2012 13:58 ExceeD_DreaM wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2012 13:52 Souma wrote:On September 24 2012 11:44 ExceeD_DreaM wrote:On September 24 2012 11:21 b0mBerMan wrote:On September 23 2012 14:26 robjapan wrote:
Long may it continue!!
All the vast majority of people in the world want is peace, it's a real shame that we have such ugliness among us, but that is where we need to be strong and to tell those people NO, violence and hatred are wrong.
I've been here almost 10 years now, and all I've seen is friendly, kind, peace loving people.
No to hate, No to violence and a BIG YES to peace and friendship.
This is what I and the vast majority of Japanese people believe. I agree and people should stop with all the Japan bashing or any country bashing in general. Japanese Prime minister stated in an interview with WSJ today that there will be no good will payments to sex slaves that suffered under Japanese Imperialism, stating that all payments are done (something like couple hundred dollars -_-). These old ladies who suffered at the age of 15 to 20s are almost all dead but some. When the last survivor passes away, they will never get an apology. They aren't even seeking legal payment, all they want is a heart felt apology. But no, of course Japanese gov't can't do that. A lot of seminars and concerts and information sessions regarding this issue is rejected in Japan. Germany created a foundation named 'Rememberance, Responsibility, and Future' for all that suffered in WW2. Does Japan know what these three words mean? I never blame Japanese citizens (other than some assholes that exist in every country anyway) for the bad image of their country. I blame their gov't and leaders. It is truly embarassing to deny what they did. I'm not sure the Comfort Women want just an apology at this point. They probably want more compensation and for the Japanese to bend over backwards. The Japanese government has given heart-felt apologies before to comfort women. January 1, 1992: Prime Minister Kiichi Miyazawa. "[Concerning the comfort women,] I apologize from the bottom of my heart and feel remorse for those people who suffered indescribable hardships"
July 6, 1992. Chief Cabinet Secretary Koichi Kato. "The Government again would like to express its sincere apology and remorse to all those who have suffered indescribable hardship as so-called 'wartime comfort women,' irrespective of their nationality or place of birth. With profound remorse and determination that such a mistake must never be repeated, Japan will maintain its stance as a pacifist nation and will endeavor to build up new future-oriented relations with the Republic of Korea and with other countries and regions in Asia. As I listen to many people, I feel truly grieved for this issue. By listening to the opinions of people from various directions, I would like to consider sincerely in what way we can express our feelings to those who suffered such hardship"
August 4, 1993: Chief Cabinet Secretary Yōhei Kōno. "Undeniably, this was an act, with the involvement of the military authorities of the day, that severely injured the honor and dignity of many women. The Government of Japan would like to take this opportunity once again to extend its sincere apologies and remorse to all those, irrespective of place of origin, who suffered immeasurable pain and incurable physical and psychological wounds as comfort women"
August 31, 1994: Prime Minister Tomiichi Murayama. "Japan's actions in a certain period of the past not only claimed numerous victims here in Japan but also left the peoples of neighboring Asia and elsewhere with scars that are painful even today. I am thus taking this opportunity to state my belief, based on my profound remorse for these acts of aggression, colonial rule, and the like caused such unbearable suffering and sorrow for so many people, that Japan's future path should be one of making every effort to build world peace in line with my no-war commitment. It is imperative for us Japanese to look squarely to our history with the peoples of neighboring Asia and elsewhere. Only with solid basis of mutual understanding and confidence that can be built through overcoming the pain on both sides, can we and the peoples of neighboring countries together clear up the future of Asia-Pacific.... On the issue of wartime 'comfort women,' which seriously stained the honor and dignity of many women, I would like to take this opportunity once again to express my profound and sincere remorse and apologies. With regard to this issue as well, I believe that one way of demonstrating such feelings of apologies and remorse is to work to further promote mutual understanding with the countries and areas concerned as well as to face squarely to the past and ensure that it is rightly conveyed to future generations. This initiative, in this sense, has been drawn up consistent with such belief"
July 1995: Prime Minister Tomiichi Murayama. "The problem of the so-called wartime comfort women is one such scar, which, with the involvement of the Japanese military forces of the time, seriously stained the honor and dignity of many women. This is entirely inexcusable. I offer my profound apology to all those who, as wartime comfort women, suffered emotional and physical wounds that can never be closed" Again, Japan tries to end all issues regarding Comfort Women because of these apologies from ministers. Please read again what I wrote, and see who they need an apology from. Furthermore, Being consistent with apologies would be nice too. An apology and decision to compensate 99 yen (about 1 dollar) to each women doesn't match together very well. Certainly, Prime minister Noda thinks Japan has done everything regarding comfort women issues. To the above poster, these women who suffered, taken at teenager's age, raped, murdered, tortured.. Some of these women are alive. Yes, these Prime Ministers said such and such, but actions did not follow. They are all lip-service. Apology has to be made by the leader, which is the king, not a prime minister, which changes every couple years. These women, which most of them are over 80, are still protesting. Has any of these officials visited Korea and apologized in person to these women? No. All they've shown so far is disrespect. By the way, has Japan admitted to the atrocities by unit 731 and Maruta project?
Wha'? The Emperor is NOT the leader of Japan, the Prime Minister is. The Emperor is merely a ceremonial role, and even then, he doesn't have nearly as much clout as Queen Elizabeth. The stature of the royal family in Japan has gotten to the point where a Princess attends a normal university and is not addressed as 'Princess' but merely as '-san'.
Anyway, while I would LOVE it if Japan's politicians shaped up and kept consistent to their apologies, as they rightfully should, the Comfort Women issue is blown way out of proportion. It's not an issue an entire country should hold a huge grudge against Japan for even though the Japanese have not done everything within their power to make things right. If every country held a grudge like that we'd never get anywhere in the international scene. At the very least, antagonizing Japan with all this hypocrisy is not going to make anything better in the long run. There's only one country in the world who has fully repented, ever, and that's Germany, and giving Japan special attention and trying to force them to swallow their pride generation after generation is going to do no one any good.
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On September 24 2012 13:58 ExceeD_DreaM wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On September 24 2012 13:52 Souma wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2012 11:44 ExceeD_DreaM wrote:On September 24 2012 11:21 b0mBerMan wrote:On September 23 2012 14:26 robjapan wrote:
Long may it continue!!
All the vast majority of people in the world want is peace, it's a real shame that we have such ugliness among us, but that is where we need to be strong and to tell those people NO, violence and hatred are wrong.
I've been here almost 10 years now, and all I've seen is friendly, kind, peace loving people.
No to hate, No to violence and a BIG YES to peace and friendship.
This is what I and the vast majority of Japanese people believe. I agree and people should stop with all the Japan bashing or any country bashing in general. Japanese Prime minister stated in an interview with WSJ today that there will be no good will payments to sex slaves that suffered under Japanese Imperialism, stating that all payments are done (something like couple hundred dollars -_-). These old ladies who suffered at the age of 15 to 20s are almost all dead but some. When the last survivor passes away, they will never get an apology. They aren't even seeking legal payment, all they want is a heart felt apology. But no, of course Japanese gov't can't do that. A lot of seminars and concerts and information sessions regarding this issue is rejected in Japan. Germany created a foundation named 'Rememberance, Responsibility, and Future' for all that suffered in WW2. Does Japan know what these three words mean? I never blame Japanese citizens (other than some assholes that exist in every country anyway) for the bad image of their country. I blame their gov't and leaders. It is truly embarassing to deny what they did. I'm not sure the Comfort Women want just an apology at this point. They probably want more compensation and for the Japanese to bend over backwards. The Japanese government has given heart-felt apologies before to comfort women. Show nested quote +January 1, 1992: Prime Minister Kiichi Miyazawa. "[Concerning the comfort women,] I apologize from the bottom of my heart and feel remorse for those people who suffered indescribable hardships"
July 6, 1992. Chief Cabinet Secretary Koichi Kato. "The Government again would like to express its sincere apology and remorse to all those who have suffered indescribable hardship as so-called 'wartime comfort women,' irrespective of their nationality or place of birth. With profound remorse and determination that such a mistake must never be repeated, Japan will maintain its stance as a pacifist nation and will endeavor to build up new future-oriented relations with the Republic of Korea and with other countries and regions in Asia. As I listen to many people, I feel truly grieved for this issue. By listening to the opinions of people from various directions, I would like to consider sincerely in what way we can express our feelings to those who suffered such hardship"
August 4, 1993: Chief Cabinet Secretary Yōhei Kōno. "Undeniably, this was an act, with the involvement of the military authorities of the day, that severely injured the honor and dignity of many women. The Government of Japan would like to take this opportunity once again to extend its sincere apologies and remorse to all those, irrespective of place of origin, who suffered immeasurable pain and incurable physical and psychological wounds as comfort women"
August 31, 1994: Prime Minister Tomiichi Murayama. "Japan's actions in a certain period of the past not only claimed numerous victims here in Japan but also left the peoples of neighboring Asia and elsewhere with scars that are painful even today. I am thus taking this opportunity to state my belief, based on my profound remorse for these acts of aggression, colonial rule, and the like caused such unbearable suffering and sorrow for so many people, that Japan's future path should be one of making every effort to build world peace in line with my no-war commitment. It is imperative for us Japanese to look squarely to our history with the peoples of neighboring Asia and elsewhere. Only with solid basis of mutual understanding and confidence that can be built through overcoming the pain on both sides, can we and the peoples of neighboring countries together clear up the future of Asia-Pacific.... On the issue of wartime 'comfort women,' which seriously stained the honor and dignity of many women, I would like to take this opportunity once again to express my profound and sincere remorse and apologies. With regard to this issue as well, I believe that one way of demonstrating such feelings of apologies and remorse is to work to further promote mutual understanding with the countries and areas concerned as well as to face squarely to the past and ensure that it is rightly conveyed to future generations. This initiative, in this sense, has been drawn up consistent with such belief"
July 1995: Prime Minister Tomiichi Murayama. "The problem of the so-called wartime comfort women is one such scar, which, with the involvement of the Japanese military forces of the time, seriously stained the honor and dignity of many women. This is entirely inexcusable. I offer my profound apology to all those who, as wartime comfort women, suffered emotional and physical wounds that can never be closed" Again, Japan tries to end all issues regarding Comfort Women because of these apologies from ministers. Please read again what I wrote, and see who they need an apology from. Furthermore, Being consistent with apologies would be nice too. An apology and decision to compensate 99 yen (about 1 dollar) to each women doesn't match together very well. Certainly, Prime minister Noda thinks Japan has done everything regarding comfort women issues. To the above poster, these women who suffered, taken at teenager's age, raped, murdered, tortured.. Some of these women are still alive. Yes, these Prime Ministers said such and such, but actions did not follow. They are all lip-service. An apology has to be made by the leader, the king, not a prime minister that changes every couple of years. These women are over 80 years of age and they are still protesting. Has any of these officials visited Korea and apologized in person to these women? No. All they've shown so far is disrespect. These women specifically stated in interviews that they aren't even looking forward to compensation, and if they DO get compensated, THEY WILL DONATE ALL THE MONEY to help women suffering in Congo. All they want is a heart felt apology, not some shit like 99 Yen compensation which is just demoralizing. By the way, has Japan admitted to the atrocities by unit 731 and Maruta project?
When you don't know that Japan has an emperor and not a King I don't think it's very wise of you to continue participating in this debate.
Plus the emperor almost never makes official statements / speeches.
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