EPTDating: How's your luck? - Page 1023
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We are extremely close to shutting down this thread for the same reasons the PUA thread was shut down. While some of the time this thread contains actual discussion with people asking help and people giving nice advice, it often gets derailed by rubbish that should not be here. The moderation team will be trying to steer this thread in a different direction from now on. Posts of the following nature are banned: 1) ANYTHING regarding PUA. If your post contains the words 'alpha' or 'beta' or anything of that sort please don't hit post. 2) Stupid brags. You can tell us about your nice success stories with someone, but posts such as 'lol 50 Tinder matches' are a no-no. 3) Any misogynistic bullshit, including discussion about rape culture. 4) One night stands and random sex. These are basically brags that invariably devolve into gender role discussions and misogynistic comments. Last chance, guys. This thread is for dating advice and sharing dating stories. While gender roles, sociocultural norms, and our biological imperative to reproduce are all tangentially related, these subjects are not the main purpose of the thread. Please AVOID these discussions. If you want to discuss them at length, go to PMs or start a blog. If you disagree with someone's ideologies, state that you disagree with them and why they won't work from a dating standpoint and move on. We will not tolerate any lengthy derailments that aren't directly about dating. | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10651 Posts
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Artisreal
Germany9234 Posts
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8614 Posts
On October 22 2018 05:09 Emnjay808 wrote: If I completely shut her out I’m afraid that she’ll go on a self-destructive streak. I’m not supposed to care but I do. you are a much better person than i am. id watch the self destruction and sleep like a baby | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16608 Posts
On October 22 2018 05:09 Emnjay808 wrote: If I completely shut her out I’m afraid that she’ll go on a self-destructive streak. I’m not supposed to care but I do. dude.... look out for #1. How long did she cheat on you? How many layers of total-bullshit were erected in order to facilitate the cheating? How many lies was she living to keep the dream alive? Does she party her ass off and use that as an excuse to be promiscuous? The answers to these questions requires ruthless honesty. Digging in and getting these answers is not for the faint of heart. However, doing so will provide you with the stepping stones you can use to climb to higher self esteem. One other thing about any one who cheats on you... keep this in mind. People who find it easy to lie to others are also very good at lying to themselves. That is the real danger is lying a lot. I could give a fuck about who I fuck over when I lie to them. I know that sounds harsh and brutal.. but that's me. My problem with lying to people a lot.. is that it becomes a lot easier to lie to myself.... and that's dangerous. So I don't bullshit people much... I'm generally considered a basically honest person... but the reason I'm honest has little to do with the reasons most people cite for not lying. When i get consumed by mediocrity ... this wakes me up... The cult-like following this guy has... is both scarey and exciting at the same time. | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
The first time a long term gf cheated on me when we were living together it took me like a year to get over her And it only came after I forgave her inside me and looked back rationally on all the things that lead to that and how I can learn from them. And you need to do that on your own without emotional attachment, no contact helps a lot, dating or at least interacting with many other women does too. And It just gets easier, this time around I hold no resentment whatsoever with my current ex, you just try to understand why people do the things they do and most of the time it makes sense, even if you disagree with it, forgive, learn, move on. She didn't cheat as far as I'm aware, maybe she did but major issue is she didn't communicate major things she minded so much she'd break off the relationship we could've worked on without facing that and trying. So I had no choice but to cut all contact and only give her a chance if she comes to me herself by initiating communication. I guess with cheating it's not as straight forward as when a girl tells you she's breaking up with you or wants a break, basically communicating she doesn't want to bother to get biggest thing you can give her and are offering - your time. She cheated but still wants you, wants to keep contact etc. But you just need to break the contact in this case also, not only for you, but also for her, as you will be able to rationally reflect much faster, come in peace with what happened, learn from it, forgive and maybe become friends one day when your heads clear and you know you'd never start with her again | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
And the lessons you get from breakups can be absolutely mind-blowing, and can not only change your relationships but life in general. It almost feels like using the women and the relationship and heartbreak to become a much better person they don't get to enjoy anymore. And you don't get those feeling hung up on her or resentful | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10651 Posts
In the end it’s something that time will heal. Some days are just harder than others. I do my best to focus on other things, but keeping busy 100% of the time just doesn’t happen. I do feel some progress in getting over everything, though. Establishing a platonic relationship is the only plans of interest I have with her. | ||
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Artisreal
Germany9234 Posts
Even if they circle around unpleasant stuff, just let them flow for a bit and see if it calms you down a bit. If it doesn't stop doing it but give it a whirl. Focus on breathing all the while and on relaxing (not dangling tho) your arms, shoulders and neck. I do it similarly when I'm stressed out, do stuff non stop to basically not think. But it drains me out after a couple of weeks. | ||
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waffelz
Germany711 Posts
On October 22 2018 16:12 LemOn wrote: And face reality and forgive (not tell her necessarily , but in your Heart) you absolutely must you can see a guy who posted here a lot -waffelz, who got messed up for years after a woman cheated on him, I'm not sure if he's recovered yet even. "Did you ever hear the tragedy of wafflez? I thought not. Its not a story the dating thread would tell...". Interesting to see that it left an somewhat lasting impression in here. I am still around, just lurking mostly though. To end your wonders, I still haven’t (fully) got back out of that tarpit but my current gf does a good job at nudging me in the right direction. Still feel like there are parts of me missing that I will never get back, but at least I am more aware on how I changed / it hurt me, even though I still occasionally get surprised. Also that shit hits you in spots you would never imagine. Depending on what your wounds are, constant positive experience that contradict your demons seems the best medicine it seems. I am not convinced that forgiving the other person is really a necessity though, you shouldn’t constantly look back on it, but that’s it in my opinion. No harm in seeing people the way they are. I can definitely second that one though: And the lessons you get from breakups can be absolutely mind-blowing, and can not only change your relationships but life in general. It almost feels like using the women and the relationship and heartbreak to become a much better person they don't get to enjoy anymore. The whole thing changed me a lot, so far that I still feel estranged at times. Overall not for the better though but shit happens. The whole "much better person they don't get to enjoy anymore" is a toxic mindset you should never acquire though in my opinion and directly contradicts your whole forgiving thing. You should never do something just out of spite for some ex / to show her. It sounds awesome at first and might be a nice motivation boost at times, but most of the time it is a) silly and b) it doesn’t really help with all that "letting it go" stuff. @Emnjay808 I definitely agree that you should cut ties, at least for the time being. Even if you plan on staying friends with her, being around her can screw with you, because it makes it harder to break out of certain habits. The longer you were together the more important I would say it is. I would also second that I find it really questionable to be friends with someone that cheated on you (or even others...), though I leave that up to you and I also have a less casual understanding of friendship so this might be not an issue for you. You definitely should give yourself some time off from her though and you can go back to being friends after you are through this. There is also a good chance that your desire to stay friends with her / your concern is just you justifying to yourself to still see her because you miss her. Also Artisreals advice is very important, you got to give yourself some time to let your thoughts wander, keeping you occupied all the time is also not a solution. | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
On October 22 2018 23:17 waffelz wrote: Overall not for the better though but shit happens. The whole "much better person they don't get to enjoy anymore" is a toxic mindset you should never acquire though in my opinion and directly contradicts your whole forgiving thing. You should never do something just out of spite for some ex / to show her. It sounds awesome at first and might be a nice motivation boost at times, but most of the time it is a) silly and b) it doesn’t really help with all that "letting it go" stuff. Jeez you are damaged I actually mean that I was an ass with them, and thanks to them I'm a better person and feel warmth towards them for helping me get there, even though I've never seen them since and they only got to invest a lot of time in that guy that was acting almost embarrassingly in retrospect. And forgive or let go internally you absolutely must, you're exhibit A for why you just have to do that to move on, you'll never be a complete person if you keep holding resentment | ||
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Dark_Chill
Canada3353 Posts
On October 23 2018 06:54 LemOn wrote: Jeez you are damaged I actually mean that I was an ass with them, and thanks to them I'm a better person and feel warmth towards them for helping me get there, even though I've never seen them since and they only got to invest a lot of time in that guy that was acting almost embarrassingly in retrospect. And forgive or let go internally you absolutely must, you're exhibit A for why you just have to do that to move on, you'll never be a complete person if you keep holding resentment I'm gonna side with Waffelz on this. Sure, there are reasons for cheating, but they're all bad reasons and make you a pretty heinous person. You don't have to forgive them, and telling someone to just "forget about them" is pretty tough and in no way an easy thing to do. I resent people who show up to places late or cancel without notification, but I'm not a lesser person because of it. That's not to say you can't take stuff away from cheating, but to tell that person, even in your mind, that what they did was okay is ridiculous to me. And definitely don't use cheating as an excuse to make yourself better to show up the other person. If you think that some of your character traits are problematic and could have influenced the cheating in your relationship, then work on those because it makes you a better person. Spite's a short-term, weak motivation. | ||
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waffelz
Germany711 Posts
On October 23 2018 06:54 LemOn wrote: Jeez you are damaged I actually mean that I was an ass with them, and thanks to them I'm a better person and feel warmth towards them for helping me get there, even though I've never seen them since and they only got to invest a lot of time in that guy that was acting almost embarrassingly in retrospect. Sorry, I misread that as the cliché "I am gonna show him/her what he/she is missing out on". My conversational English has gotten a bit worse. Realizing your own mistakes is always important ofc. and if you fucked it’s only fair to consider that when evaluating your friendship/whatever. And forgive or let go internally you absolutely must, you're exhibit A for why you just have to do that to move on, you'll never be a complete person if you keep holding resentment I can assure you, forgiveness for the ex that cheated on me has nothing to do with it. I might have hold resentment for her at some point during my emotional rollercoaster, but it was never a driving factor and never really a persistent one. I understand why you came to this armchair psychology conclusion since I don't think I posted much about this until when things where still pretty fresh and therefore lacked a lot of insight and help. The TL:DR of it would be that what I am still dealing with is more the general experience of what happened as well as the mindset it put me in and how it changed my view and behavior in a lot of sense, without the person involved being a big part of it other than what she mend to me at the time. On October 23 2018 07:18 Dark_Chill wrote: I'm gonna side with Waffelz on this. Sure, there are reasons for cheating, but they're all bad reasons and make you a pretty heinous person. You don't have to forgive them, and telling someone to just "forget about them" is pretty tough and in no way an easy thing to do. I resent people who show up to places late or cancel without notification, but I'm not a lesser person because of it. That's not to say you can't take stuff away from cheating, but to tell that person, even in your mind, that what they did was okay is ridiculous to me. And definitely don't use cheating as an excuse to make yourself better to show up the other person. If you think that some of your character traits are problematic and could have influenced the cheating in your relationship, then work on those because it makes you a better person. Spite's a short-term, weak motivation. Exactly. Cheating will always be a shitty thing. Various factors why it happen can make it less of a shitty thing, but in the end it is what it is. And there is no reason to just absolve someone who cheated for no reason, same as you wouldn’t lend someone money if they have a history of not paying you back. Ofc this doesn’t have the become a permanent factor when judging them, but as long as they haven’t done anything to redeem themselves or other factors make this stain on their personality less significant, you are absolutely free to still see them as someone you shouldn’t lend money too and are free to not like them. I don’t like to sugarcoat my or other people’s actions and prefer when people are hold accountable for their actions, especially when its stuff that isn’t punishable by law. | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
On October 23 2018 07:18 Dark_Chill wrote: I'm gonna side with Waffelz on this. Sure, there are reasons for cheating, but they're all bad reasons and make you a pretty heinous person. You don't have to forgive them, and telling someone to just "forget about them" is pretty tough and in no way an easy thing to do. I resent people who show up to places late or cancel without notification, but I'm not a lesser person because of it. That's not to say you can't take stuff away from cheating, but to tell that person, even in your mind, that what they did was okay is ridiculous to me. And definitely don't use cheating as an excuse to make yourself better to show up the other person. If you think that some of your character traits are problematic and could have influenced the cheating in your relationship, then work on those because it makes you a better person. Spite's a short-term, weak motivation. Saying what they did was okay in the lens of your value system and forgiving/letting go are two different things | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
On October 23 2018 16:43 waffelz wrote: Exactly. Cheating will always be a shitty thing. Various factors why it happen can make it less of a shitty thing, but in the end it is what it is. And there is no reason to just absolve someone who cheated for no reason, same as you wouldn’t lend someone money if they have a history of not paying you back. Ofc this doesn’t have the become a permanent factor when judging them, but as long as they haven’t done anything to redeem themselves or other factors make this stain on their personality less significant, you are absolutely free to still see them as someone you shouldn’t lend money too and are free to not like them. I don’t like to sugarcoat my or other people’s actions and prefer when people are hold accountable for their actions, especially when its stuff that isn’t punishable by law. Well yeah, it's a shitty thing to do to not give back money Doesn't mean you can't forgive the person, learn from it and never lend them the money again though. Believe me I was cheated on in a pretty elaborate brutal way during a very co-dependent relationship. I'd never even remotely consider being in a relationship with her again, hell I've never even spoken to her since besides one time... But the day when I started really moving on was the day I took deep breaths, and with the outbreath said to myself "I forgive you" over and over again and I meant it. And only then I got to realize that we were together for over 3 years but she saved me a lifetime of being with a person with incompatible values (cheating being the main one), what lead to it - the lack of communication, complacency, honesty, independence... It was a shit thing she did, but I hold no resentment towards her and when I think back I think of the good times and lessons I learned really. Compassion and being able to let go while standing firm behind your values are great qualities in my opinion | ||
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waffelz
Germany711 Posts
On October 23 2018 17:29 LemOn wrote: Well yeah, it's a shitty thing to do to not give back money Doesn't mean you can't forgive the person, learn from it and never lend them the money again though. Believe me I was cheated on in a pretty elaborate brutal way during a very co-dependent relationship. I'd never even remotely consider being in a relationship with her again, hell I've never even spoken to her since besides one time... But the day when I started really moving on was the day I took deep breaths, and with the outbreath said to myself "I forgive you" over and over again and I meant it. And only then I got to realize that we were together for over 3 years but she saved me a lifetime of being with a person with incompatible values (cheating being the main one), what lead to it - the lack of communication, complacency, honesty, independence... It was a shit thing she did, but I hold no resentment towards her and when I think back I think of the good times and lessons I learned really. Compassion and being able to let go while standing firm behind your values are great qualities in my opinion Guess I misread you again for the most part, I am still firmly on you dont have to forgive though. As we both said you shouldnt actively hold grudges but still dont have to forgive them, especially depending on how malicious the thing was (like accidental vs actively trying to hurt you), as long as it is in line with your general beliefs as in its less of a personal and more of a matter of your principles. Different ways to look at things I guess. I think cheating and how to deal with it is a highly individual matter, if you can draw fruitful lessons from it and end up with a net benefit thats cool and all, but its not something that is always possible (ending with a net benefit that is, there is propably always something to learn from it). | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17898 Posts
On October 23 2018 17:22 LemOn wrote: Saying what they did was okay in the lens of your value system and forgiving/letting go are two different things Letting go and forgiving are also two different things. You don't have to forgive her to let go. You just have to realize/internalize/overcome that she, and that horrible thing she did, are not worth dwelling on. And you can do that without forgiving her for it. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16608 Posts
On October 22 2018 16:59 Emnjay808 wrote: I’m taking this as a learning experience. Everyone brings up amazing points and advice, I truly appreciate it. In the end it’s something that time will heal. Some days are just harder than others. I do my best to focus on other things, but keeping busy 100% of the time just doesn’t happen. I do feel some progress in getting over everything, though. Establishing a platonic relationship is the only plans of interest I have with her. here is some good "music therapy" for any guy who has been fucked over huge by a woman. I recommend Robert Plant's advice in the songs "Dazed and Confused" and "Babe I'm Gonna Leave You" ... Two of the greatest songs in the 60+ year history of the rock'n'roll genre. Interestingly, their first live event was 50 years ago today. On October 22 2018 16:59 Emnjay808 wrote: Establishing a platonic relationship is the only plans of interest I have with her. work on yourself first. invest in yourself .. and then bet on yourself. big thing is though... move on. Don't try to relive "the best times" because they are in the past and gone forever. On October 22 2018 15:55 LemOn wrote: no contact helps a lot, dating or at least interacting with many other women does too. i prefer the "no contact" method. i prefer to do hobbies i enjoy that may or may not involve women. Often it involves total solitude. That is , Starcraft, listening to Led Zeppelin, and working... i'm lucky because my profession is also my hobby. On October 22 2018 15:55 LemOn wrote: The first time a long term gf cheated on me when we were living together it took me like a year to get over her And it only came after I forgave her inside me and looked back rationally on all the things that lead to that and how I can learn from them. And you need to do that on your own without emotional attachment, +1. this is some good advice. big thing is though... move on. again, Don't try to relive "the best times" because they are in the past and gone forever. | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
On October 23 2018 19:54 Acrofales wrote: Letting go and forgiving are also two different things. You don't have to forgive her to let go. You just have to realize/internalize/overcome that she, and that horrible thing she did, are not worth dwelling on. And you can do that without forgiving her for it. See I'm a poker pro, and I studied behavioral economics and psychology and have done meditation for some 10 yeara. I guess that's why it's so much easier for me to forgive people, I see through the illusion of rationality, most decisions are entirely made, or heavily influenced by the sub conscious. Unless you are dating a psychopath at that breaking point of a relationship the uncontrollable part of the brain takes over and people do the worst things that can easily can be explained to make sense and forgiven also. And even if you are dating a psychopath hey - would you really hold it against them that they manipulate people by any means necessary to maximise their own gain? It's just in their nature | ||
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