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BlackFlag
499 Posts
On October 07 2011 23:30 Xenocryst wrote: no they're not human...... theyve gone too far to be considered human anymore.n Could you please stop? Reading this makes me sick. Your disvaluing of human life is disgusting. | ||
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scaban84
United States1080 Posts
On October 07 2011 23:33 Biff The Understudy wrote: It must be weird to live in a world where rich or powerful people don't abuse their power. Almost as if they weren't human. Is that what this is about? The rich and powerful abusing power? If so can you name some names? Or should we just throw everyone that makes over 100k a year into a well? What do you propose? This protest is nothing more than a mosh pit. A bunch of kids releasing all their pent up energy because they hate their parents and their jobs; because they still feel like the same loser they were when they left high school. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On October 07 2011 23:28 BlackFlag wrote: And I'm sick of people like you putting everyone that disagrees with you in a light as a stalinist that wants to build up a totalitarian state that oppresses everyone. You libertarians and conservatives always talk about freedom, but your freedom is only for those who can afford it. Apparently you're not listening carefully enough to what the "useful idiots" of Occupy Wallstreet are saying. Sure, not all of them are Marxists, but enough of them are to raise red flags. | ||
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BlackFlag
499 Posts
On October 07 2011 23:53 xDaunt wrote: Apparently you're not listening carefully enough to what the "useful idiots" of Occupy Wallstreet are saying. Sure, not all of them are Marxists, but enough of them are to raise red flags. You talk like it's the majority. I have no problem with raising red and black fans. I wrote it earlier, most of them are protesting capitalism without acknowledging it, because they view it as a good system that's just abused. I my opinion what we have now is the natural flow of the system. And it still has nothing to do with the fear mongering of picturing every leftist as a stalinist. | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On October 07 2011 23:52 scaban84 wrote: Is that what this is about? The rich and powerful abusing power? If so can you name some names? Or should we just throw everyone that makes over 100k a year into a well? What do you propose? This protest is nothing more than a mosh pit. A bunch of kids releasing all their pent up energy because they hate their parents and their jobs; because they still feel like the same loser they were when they left high school. What about something like the tax exempt status for cashing out conflict-of-interest stocks when joining the US government? Or do the poor also have $500 mil in stocks and the connections to join the US government? | ||
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scaban84
United States1080 Posts
On October 08 2011 00:02 Logo wrote: What about something like the tax exempt status for cashing out conflict-of-interest stocks when joining the US government? Or do the poor also have $500 mil in stocks and the connections to join the US government? Now we are getting somewhere! See how having a focus helps your cause? If everyone attacked Goldman Sachs whores then maybe we would have a movement. But unfortunately they are all out there calling for god knows what.... oh and kill the rich! | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On October 08 2011 00:06 scaban84 wrote: Now we are getting somewhere! See how having a focus helps your cause? If everyone attacked Goldman Sachs whores then maybe we would have a movement. But unfortunately they are all out there calling for god knows what.... oh and kill the rich! Yeah I mean we certainly agree on that. I just don't ever except anything that can be called 'masses' to have a good solid directed unified message. The whole thing about a person is smart, but people are stupid and all that. Still a plan of: "step #1 get a base of people motivated for change, step #2 present arguments for what and how that change should be" seems reasonable to me. Between Tea Party and OWS step #1 seems to be coming along. | ||
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scaban84
United States1080 Posts
Apparently there are some libertarians at the protest. Now this is something i can get behind! | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On October 08 2011 00:16 scaban84 wrote: http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/?-older-posts-libertarian-wall-street-protesters-demand-end-fed Apparently there are some libertarians at the protest. Now this is something i can get behind! Quite a few I think. I vaguely remember seeing some video footage of the event where a pretty good sized cheer when up when someone shouted something about Ron Paul. Hopefully there's sooner or later some good discussion about ending fed vs other courses of action for reform with an actual result from whichever side makes the better argument. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
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viOLetFanClub
Korea (South)390 Posts
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radiatoren
Denmark1907 Posts
Some used it as a union-assembly and the financial and political establishment was not a primary enemy, but rather seen as passive bystanders to the worsening of the crisis. The police removed the protesters in the end because "they could interfere with the election". Instead of focusing on playing the blame-game, why not accept that there must be a reason for the protests and there may be political and economic part of it? But the unrest is social and to raise issues for debate rather than a political or economic manifestation of specific opinions. | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On October 08 2011 00:24 xDaunt wrote: That Zero Hedge article raises a very important point that too many people overlook: Wall Street is predominantly in the pocket of the DEMOCRATS. Obama and other democrats' demagoguing of Wall Street is hypocrisy at its finest. Has OWS been showing any support or love for democrats? I haven't gotten that impression. I think many of the protesters lean democratic, but more for social issues than financial. Which is probably a bit of how we got into this mess. With social issues (gay rights, influence of religion, and all that) being so predominant it's hard to have finical issues, especially those not directly related to personal taxes, be a deciding factor for people. I mean if I can never vote for someone who supports Don't Ask, Don't Tell or opposes gay marriage then exactly how many options do I have when voting? (But yes I agree that both parties are probably equally deserve blame, which is probably why there's both a Tea Party and OWS). | ||
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emveepee
4 Posts
On October 08 2011 00:24 xDaunt wrote: That Zero Hedge article raises a very important point that too many people overlook: Wall Street is predominantly in the pocket of the DEMOCRATS. Obama and other democrats' demagoguing of Wall Street is hypocrisy at its finest. Well, if what you say is true, shouldn't they be lauded for standing up for something that could potentially cost them allies and campaign money? it sounds better than republicans trying to keep their campaign money flowing by making their allies and friends happy with keep lowering tax | ||
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mappiechampion
Sweden155 Posts
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On October 08 2011 00:35 mappiechampion wrote: Does someone know if there is some Tea Party people joining up in the protests? If not, why aren't they joining? If not it's becase... well I'll just leave some quotes here: "It's a classic mob uprising. It's utterly incoherent. They're always left wing," conservative commentator Ann Coulter said in a Fox News interview. "OWS (Occupy Wall Street) reminds me of an out-of-control child having a temper tantrum," Tea Party Express Chairman Amy Kremer said. "Stop having a temper tantrum and channel your energy into effecting change." And these are biased quotes in that I could probably find the opposite quotes from OWS supporters, but I don't have any on hand. So basically mostly because people want to adopt US VS THEM mentality, because well I have no idea it's a fucking stupid thing to do. (both quotes I found via http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/10/06/tea.party.left/ ) | ||
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Phenny
Australia1435 Posts
On October 08 2011 00:16 scaban84 wrote: http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/?-older-posts-libertarian-wall-street-protesters-demand-end-fed Apparently there are some libertarians at the protest. Now this is something i can get behind! +1 It seems to have support from a lot of political view points, yet everyone kind of wants it to take a different direction so they'll either start arguing with each other now, or if this achieves something they'll be arguing later, lol. At first I thought it was just a bunch of closet socialists but now I don't really even know what to make of it. It seems most of the protesters are just after govt handouts but I would definitely like to see the awful parasitic banks go down (highly unlikely at best). | ||
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jmack
Canada285 Posts
On October 07 2011 13:22 scaban84 wrote: No one lied to the poor, the terms of a mortgage or credit card are in the contract. And many of the mortgage brokers truly believed the homes were great solid investment, hell the whole country thought home prices would continue to skyrocket. You cannot ignore the sub-prime borrowers' own greed when they took out these loans. They expected to make a fortune by flipping real estate, so cry me a river. No one cares when a stock speculator loses his shirt after investing in a speculative stock. Second you ignore the government's role in this great con. You have conveniently left out Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the Community Re-investment Act, the Federal Reserve manipulating interest rates. The government was encouraging this behavior. Remember that the government used taxpayer funds and bailed out AIG and BoA among others; keyword taxpayers, this does not include the poor. There are three guilty parties in this crisis. If you think only Corporations and their CEOs are to blame, you've played into their little game. And your last sentence makes no sense, it runs on and is mind-numbingly loaded. I fully acknowledge that the government not only participated but it's members greatly profited from the purposely crashed economy, there's a reason they get hired directly after their terms to become incredibly high paid.....CEOs (corporate board members) that's right. The people making decisions at the government are incredibly pro wall street because they are wall street. No one is denying the entire system is corrupt; as for TRICKING / LYING to the poor it happened quite a bit; often the terms of the contract were actually HIDDEN. (a.k.a. not even accessible to be read by the signer ). What about illegal foreclosures? What about the 16 trillion the fed gave away? http://www.lawyersandsettlements.com/case/chevy-chase-bank-tila-truth-in-lending-mortgage.html http://www.google.ca/search?aq=2&oq=audit federal rese&gcx=c&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=audit federal reserve 16 trillion http://www.creditinfocenter.com/mortgage/PointsRipOff.shtml http://lawsuits.lawinfo.com/MortgageLoanFraud/index.html Do some research man; and one of the protests demands is to reform political financing so they can get bribery out of their democracy. I also love the implication that Obama or any other Democrat could have started this or could be pulling the strings. It's absurd, if Obama had simply done ANY of the things he promised to do there would be no #OccupyWallStreet They're not out there as Dem v Rep man; it's humanity v corporatism. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On October 08 2011 00:33 Logo wrote: Has OWS been showing any support or love for democrats? I haven't gotten that impression. I think many of the protesters lean democratic, but more for social issues than financial. Which is probably a bit of how we got into this mess. With social issues (gay rights, influence of religion, and all that) being so predominant it's hard to have finical issues, especially those not directly related to personal taxes, be a deciding factor for people. I mean if I can never vote for someone who supports Don't Ask, Don't Tell or opposes gay marriage then exactly how many options do I have when voting? (But yes I agree that both parties are probably equally deserve blame, which is probably why there's both a Tea Party and OWS). OWS is a bit of a mixed bag. Liberal democrats (including Obama) are openly supporting it, and many of OWS's supporters are also part of the democratic base (like the unions that are taking part). If you look at what MSNBC and other liberal politicians are saying about OWS, they are trying to turn OWS into their liberal version of the Tea Party. This isn't to say that all elements of OWS are democrats. On October 08 2011 00:33 emveepee wrote: Well, if what you say is true, shouldn't they be lauded for standing up for something that could potentially cost them allies and campaign money? it sounds better than republicans trying to keep their campaign money flowing by making their allies and friends happy with keep lowering tax First off, I promise you that it is true. All you have to do is follow campaign contributions. As for the why, it's very simple. Democrats have backroom discussions with their Wall Street donors and say, "Hey, don't worry. Yes, we need to throw you under the bus publicly so that we get more votes and get elected, but once we're in charge, we'll take care of you." Basically, they'll say whatever they need to say to get votes (not that republicans are much better in this regard). That said, there have been some prominent Wall Street democrats who have recently come out publicly against the class warfare rhetoric coming from Obama and the democrats (Ted Leonsis being one who immediately comes to mind.) | ||
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jmack
Canada285 Posts
Great article by Paul Krugman, check it. | ||
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