|
Leave the animal rights and treatment discussion out of this topic. Thanks. -Nyovne |
I have to say I'm really impressed by what the bear is capable of. Didn't know that it's possible, assuming that's exactly what happened.
|
As touching as the story is, "hugged the cub and then strangled it".
Come the fuck on.
|
At people who say everyone who is not vegan and gets discusted by this are hypocrits.
Man you guys sure are incapable of drawing a line. I find nothing wrong with myself that I ate an egg today that came from a chiken in a farm, but I do not accept bears handeled that way or animal testing, or how americans like to skin their animals alive. I am not a hypocrite saying taht. You can give me any case of animal handling and i can you is it rigth or wrong, in a black and white world.
|
I feel that too many people are going into this thread just looking for an argument, not really caring about the topic at hand, but more about being right. This kind of mindset is counter productive, and does not actually contribute in any way shape or form. I also recomend doing some research before posting, so you dont sound like a complete idiot. And to viewers like you, thank you.
|
On August 13 2011 01:50 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2011 01:46 CptCutter wrote:On August 13 2011 01:34 FabledIntegral wrote:On August 13 2011 01:00 xarthaz wrote:Uhh, chicken eggs? And cow milk? Face it, in essence they all employ animal slavery. The argument to support western animal farming is the differentiation of slavery and torture. It is claimed that while animals are slaves, that because no torture is used it is humane to keep them in such conditions. But this is blatantly contradictory, as torture cannot be differentiated from slavery. In essence, being the property of someone else is torture. Preventing action of the slave is an action of torture, just like an action of punishment is torture. On August 12 2011 16:46 Sworn wrote:On August 12 2011 14:55 Equity213 wrote:
They do this with chickens all over the world. They're kept in cages too small for them to move, and their beaks are cut off too or else they kill themselves with it. P Differences is the chickens are killed usually within a couple weeks not kept alive to be repeatedly harvested. Killing an animal and keeping one alive in extreme pain is very different. It depends on the degree. Sure, you can consider it "torture" to lock a human up in prison for life with some pretty shitty treatment. But compare that to putting him in a constant state of excruciating pain... completely different. Difference is like being locked away in Azkaban and becoming miserable to deatheaters (but also growing more numb the longer you're there), and being locked away in Azkaban and being constantly subject to the Crucio curse... c'mon... what's worse here... On August 13 2011 01:29 CptCutter wrote:
animals do not carry the intelligence for suicide. the bears wear iron vests to stop them from killing themselves? thats true but the reason is more likely that they want to stop the pain so poke at the wound simply because it hurts rather than trying to kill themselves.
stuff like this makes me very sad, how people with intelligence as low as this can do this to animals is amazing. at times, it makes me think that idiots(literal sense) must be psychopaths if they can do it. Bullshit where's your evidence for this? evidence for what? i had multiple points, at least say which one... The bolded part? :o
an interior motive of thought for suicide is required for it to even become an idea. how can an animal that has less intelligence than a toddler even form thoughts of suicide as an idea to even end its suffering? evidence should not be needed, logic alone should be enough...
by disagreeing with me you are saying that animals have enough intellect for this? bullshit, wheres your evidence?
|
On August 12 2011 15:11 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 15:08 Fission wrote:On August 12 2011 15:05 travis wrote:On August 12 2011 15:04 rift wrote:
Traditional Chinese medicine is a farce just like any other form of medicine lacking clinically-proven efficacy. Of course, people all over the world believe in imaginary deities and fictional history, so I'm sure this is considered completely rational to uneducated "practitioners". You're not the first expert on chinese medicine that's popped up here. I think it's stupid to suggest that natural medicine with thousands of years of history behind it has nothing to offer. Normally I agree with your posts, but this is pretty silly. There are ALOT of things that have been around for thousands of years that I don't think you'd really agree are legitimate. What about acupuncture? Is it nonsense?
one case doesn't justify the other. That's why we go by science. Everything is tested for truth.
|
I don't believe the bear consciously mercy killed it's baby. Most creatures just cannot think on such a level. Next we'll need evidence that the sky is blue.
|
On August 13 2011 02:04 CptCutter wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2011 01:50 FabledIntegral wrote:On August 13 2011 01:46 CptCutter wrote:On August 13 2011 01:34 FabledIntegral wrote:On August 13 2011 01:00 xarthaz wrote:Uhh, chicken eggs? And cow milk? Face it, in essence they all employ animal slavery. The argument to support western animal farming is the differentiation of slavery and torture. It is claimed that while animals are slaves, that because no torture is used it is humane to keep them in such conditions. But this is blatantly contradictory, as torture cannot be differentiated from slavery. In essence, being the property of someone else is torture. Preventing action of the slave is an action of torture, just like an action of punishment is torture. On August 12 2011 16:46 Sworn wrote:On August 12 2011 14:55 Equity213 wrote:
They do this with chickens all over the world. They're kept in cages too small for them to move, and their beaks are cut off too or else they kill themselves with it. P Differences is the chickens are killed usually within a couple weeks not kept alive to be repeatedly harvested. Killing an animal and keeping one alive in extreme pain is very different. It depends on the degree. Sure, you can consider it "torture" to lock a human up in prison for life with some pretty shitty treatment. But compare that to putting him in a constant state of excruciating pain... completely different. Difference is like being locked away in Azkaban and becoming miserable to deatheaters (but also growing more numb the longer you're there), and being locked away in Azkaban and being constantly subject to the Crucio curse... c'mon... what's worse here... On August 13 2011 01:29 CptCutter wrote:
animals do not carry the intelligence for suicide. the bears wear iron vests to stop them from killing themselves? thats true but the reason is more likely that they want to stop the pain so poke at the wound simply because it hurts rather than trying to kill themselves.
stuff like this makes me very sad, how people with intelligence as low as this can do this to animals is amazing. at times, it makes me think that idiots(literal sense) must be psychopaths if they can do it. Bullshit where's your evidence for this? evidence for what? i had multiple points, at least say which one... The bolded part? :o an interior motive of thought for suicide is required for it to even become an idea. how can an animal that has less intelligence than a toddler even form thoughts of suicide as an idea to even end its suffering? evidence should not be needed, logic alone should be enough... by disagreeing with me you are saying that animals have enough intellect for this? bullshit, wheres your evidence?
1. All it needs to realize is that it's suffering and wants to die. It doesn't need to even "think" to want to die.
2. Evidence in this story.
3. I never claimed anything, by disagreeing I never said animals have enough intellect for this, that's you jumping to conclusions, something you're apparently good at. I have no idea, which is why I'm not making blanket statements.
|
The source looks pretty reputable, so I don't have any reason to believe this isn't true. Animals are certainly capable of all sorts of deviant behaviors, including cruelty, cannibalism, and suicide. The level of understanding necessary though, to be able to make an inference ("my cub is going to suffer") based on one's own experiences, and then make a conscious moral decision about that inference ("it is better for my cub to die than suffer") is truly outstanding, and I'm guessing that most animals would not be capable of it in the same situation. Still, it shows the great potential for animals, and how much smarter they are than we give them credit for.
|
On August 13 2011 01:56 Ravencruiser wrote:
As touching as the story is, "hugged the cub and then strangled it".
Come the fuck on.
Hey, I was once told that a puppy I was going to get died because its mother sat on it. The real question is whether or not the bear purposefully killed the cub, or whether it was just trying to protect it/help it.
|
On August 13 2011 02:07 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2011 02:04 CptCutter wrote:On August 13 2011 01:50 FabledIntegral wrote:On August 13 2011 01:46 CptCutter wrote:On August 13 2011 01:34 FabledIntegral wrote:On August 13 2011 01:00 xarthaz wrote:Uhh, chicken eggs? And cow milk? Face it, in essence they all employ animal slavery. The argument to support western animal farming is the differentiation of slavery and torture. It is claimed that while animals are slaves, that because no torture is used it is humane to keep them in such conditions. But this is blatantly contradictory, as torture cannot be differentiated from slavery. In essence, being the property of someone else is torture. Preventing action of the slave is an action of torture, just like an action of punishment is torture. On August 12 2011 16:46 Sworn wrote:On August 12 2011 14:55 Equity213 wrote:
They do this with chickens all over the world. They're kept in cages too small for them to move, and their beaks are cut off too or else they kill themselves with it. P Differences is the chickens are killed usually within a couple weeks not kept alive to be repeatedly harvested. Killing an animal and keeping one alive in extreme pain is very different. It depends on the degree. Sure, you can consider it "torture" to lock a human up in prison for life with some pretty shitty treatment. But compare that to putting him in a constant state of excruciating pain... completely different. Difference is like being locked away in Azkaban and becoming miserable to deatheaters (but also growing more numb the longer you're there), and being locked away in Azkaban and being constantly subject to the Crucio curse... c'mon... what's worse here... On August 13 2011 01:29 CptCutter wrote:
animals do not carry the intelligence for suicide. the bears wear iron vests to stop them from killing themselves? thats true but the reason is more likely that they want to stop the pain so poke at the wound simply because it hurts rather than trying to kill themselves.
stuff like this makes me very sad, how people with intelligence as low as this can do this to animals is amazing. at times, it makes me think that idiots(literal sense) must be psychopaths if they can do it. Bullshit where's your evidence for this? evidence for what? i had multiple points, at least say which one... The bolded part? :o an interior motive of thought for suicide is required for it to even become an idea. how can an animal that has less intelligence than a toddler even form thoughts of suicide as an idea to even end its suffering? evidence should not be needed, logic alone should be enough... by disagreeing with me you are saying that animals have enough intellect for this? bullshit, wheres your evidence? 1. All it needs to realize is that it's suffering and wants to die. It doesn't need to even "think" to want to die. 2. Evidence in this story. 3. I never claimed anything, by disagreeing I never said animals have enough intellect for this, that's you jumping to conclusions, something you're apparently good at. I have no idea, which is why I'm not making blanket statements.
realizing that it is suffering and wants to die requires a conscience and level of intelligence that animals do not have.
there is no evidence in the story for the bears actually commiting suicide, its like saying jesus' miracles were true because they are written in the bibles.
i think before i answer, i dont jump to conclusions.
|
just wait to see what happens to our world
|
On August 13 2011 02:12 Spacely wrote:
just wait to see what happens to our world
No, inform us instead.
|
I'm guessing that the mother bear was extremely stressed out at that point in time. I don't think that the mother would realize that her cub was going to experience the same torment, hence invoking the thought process that resulted in her killing her own cub in order to stop that from happening.
What simply happened was the mother bear ran over to the cub while being very protective instinctively, but actually killed the cub by accident while it was experiencing pent up frustration + mental stress.
Mothers killing cubs by accident do happen all the time. Panda bears do swipe at their own newborn if it was their first childbirth out of anxiety, and do end up killing them sometimes.
I don't have an explanation for the suicide afterwards, but I will attribute it to the fear of going through the pain again. It does seem extremely tragic from our perspective because we would easily empathize if it were 2 humans in that situation (i.e. we would infer that the mother will kill her own child in order to stop that child's suffering). It is kind of weird but I think it's fortunate that the mother bear didn't get to rationalize that thought.
|
People read into things what they want. The guy who reported this incident already thought what was going on was terrible.
I imagine what was actually seen was a grown bear escape it's cage, and go on a mild rampage, killing a cub with a 'bear crush' not a hug, and ultimately killing it's self by running into a wall as it attempted to run away from the staff truing to round it up.
|
On August 12 2011 14:55 ItsMeDomLee wrote:
Lololol. This kind of stuff happens everywhere. Everytime you eat KFC you're supporting animal cruelty!
Don't come into these threads and shed tears of ignorance. You're part of the problem.
I was gonna ask you to tell me what KFC does that is cruel, but then I did a simple good search and found:
http://www.kentuckyfriedcruelty.com/f-kfc_fried_videos.asp?c=kfcvg08&gclid=CKHSisCiyqoCFQs0QgodhX_K0w
(Rated R for reprehensible)
"Don't come into these threads and shed tears of ignorance."
I'm really not sure what to say to that... especially because that's what I want to do, lol. It really is very sad that this happened, and I hope this happening gets fully closed down.
|
|
|
what the hell? That is terrible!
|
On August 13 2011 02:05 muse5187 wrote:
I don't believe the bear consciously mercy killed it's baby. Most creatures just cannot think on such a level. Next we'll need evidence that the sky is blue.
The sky is actually not blue...
|
What a vile race of creatures human beings are ...
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
