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Keep your off topic discussions out of this thread and show some damn respect! |
On July 23 2011 19:45 Tachion wrote:
So what was the reason behind the cops taking so long to show up? He was shooting on that island for an hour and a half? 2 hours? It sounds like people with cell phones were texting and calling like crazy once it started. I don't understand.
Bear in mind that a bomb had gone off in Oslo. Most, if not all availabloe resources were at that scene. They were not prepared for another emergency.
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Bloody hell. I'm stunned.
I'm so sorry for the family and friend of the victims. I hope all the injured recover soon.
My thoughts are with you Norway.
The world just doesn't make sense sometimes.
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On July 23 2011 19:45 Tachion wrote:
So what was the reason behind the cops taking so long to show up? He was shooting on that island for an hour and a half? 2 hours? It sounds like people with cell phones were texting and calling like crazy once it started. I don't understand.
A bomb in the city? other, what, 5 false alarms of other places what might had been bomb targets?
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Well, the chief of police actually said they were ready for another attack, as they didn't send all their resources downtown. Still, there's nothing to suggest that the cops didn't act as quickly as they could.
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On July 23 2011 19:45 Tachion wrote:
So what was the reason behind the cops taking so long to show up? He was shooting on that island for an hour and a half? 2 hours? It sounds like people with cell phones were texting and calling like crazy once it started. I don't understand.
The reason is the bomb attack that started this whole mess - surely all the cops and medics in a wide region were called to that. His attack on the future leaders of that party was pretty much "optimal" - so sickening...
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On July 23 2011 19:45 Tachion wrote:
So what was the reason behind the cops taking so long to show up? He was shooting on that island for an hour and a half? 2 hours? It sounds like people with cell phones were texting and calling like crazy once it started. I don't understand.
Well it seems quite obvious that all cops were heading for Oslo where the bomb exploded. According to google maps, it takes about half an hour to get from Oslo to the island. It seems there are no other cities nearby, and then they also needed a boat/helicopter to cross the water. And german media spielgel claims he half an hour until police arrived.
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I think the main problem was that it was a f'ing island.
I can imagine it has to be a waiting/betting game on where the shooter was on the island for it to be safe for the police to travel over there. Imagine being 5 police officers in a VERY visible boat when there's a gunman with a assault rifle on land, in daylight.
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On July 23 2011 19:45 Tachion wrote:
So what was the reason behind the cops taking so long to show up? He was shooting on that island for an hour and a half? 2 hours? It sounds like people with cell phones were texting and calling like crazy once it started. I don't understand.
Most reasonable explanation for that is that most of the cops were busy with the bombing of that building I guess.
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In the hours after the bombing there were also reports of muslims, and in general people from the east being harassed, these also stopped when he was revealed to be norwegian.
this is making me sick :/
i actually didnt really hear about that before i read this thread. i heard a very short news in the radio about an incident in norway, but that was all.
this shit is so f'd up. i cant really believe it..
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On July 23 2011 19:46 sCfO20 wrote:
Okay, sure the guy with the camera didn't have a gun.
But my point is, why didn't this happen at all? There was no effort for anything like this. It sounds like your law enforcement got bested by a maniac. Which should never happen. It's what you guys pay your taxes for.
It sounds like? Have you already carried out a full investigation of this horrific incident? This is way to early for people like you to judge on how it has actually happened.
It's what you guys pay your taxes for
What? Please listen to what your are saying.
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i am against capital punishment
this is an exception though
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On July 23 2011 19:14 Tachion wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 19:02 crappen wrote:
By destroying this man, executing your own vengeance and thirst for it, is a terrible solution. This man, Anders Behring, must be in extreme pain to do such things, he is already in hell.
Do not destroy yourself by having thoughts of vengeance. I hope we in Norway can find a good solution to this, and why not try to rehabilitate him if we think its a slight chance of posibility?
I hope we can find peace in all this, and not fall into the trap of fear. You...feel sorry for him? Hope he can be rehabilitated and re-enter society? I honestly don't even understand how someone could possibly want that for a guy who just mass murdered a bunch of children. If it was your daughter on her hands and knees begging him for her life before he killed her...he deserves better than what she got? I just keep deleting comments that make me rage at the naivety of this. I dunno what to say. sorry.
That is precisely the wrong reason to execute someone: because why should he deserve better than his victims?
Any act of justice must be exactly that: an act of justice. It's not about what someone "deserves"; it's about what society believes is the proper mechanism for repayment of the wrong that has been perpetrated upon it. It should not be about the anger one would feel at one's family being personally wronged.
That's not to say that I necessarily think execution should be off the table as a punishment, nor do I feel that it is necessarily an act of revenge. But if it is to be used, it must be decided via a cold, rational process, as befits justice. Not the hot rage of someone who wants vengeance for their personal tragedy. That's why justice is often carried out by people who are neutral observers: judges, jurors, etc.
Now, in the shadow of the event (and possibly not even the shadow, as there are reports of a second shooter), is not the time to go looking for punishments. That way lies revenge.
As for the hope for rehabilitation, meh. Sure, it may be possible to turn him into a productive member of society, but that seems to ignore the damage done to that society. Even if they were to "fix" him, is it reasonable to ever trust such a person with actual social responsibility again? We're not talking about some thug mugging people on the streets; we're talking about a guy so utterly removed from reasonable human behavior that he executed people begging for mercy.
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On July 23 2011 14:05 Krikan wrote:
The apprehended person was now revealed to be norwegian. This stopped the theories about this being a terror attack, which had been the running theory both around the world, and on the norwegian news channels.In the hours after the bombing there were also reports of muslims, and in general people from the east being harassed, these also stopped when he was revealed to be norwegian.
So, basically, because he wasn't a muslim or looked like a guy from Iraq, it wasn't a terror attack? What's stopping Norwegians from committing terror attacks? IRA are not muslims yet they're still deemed a terror organization.
I'm sorry, it's a terrible thing that's been done in Norway but these inconsistencies bug the crap out of me.
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On July 23 2011 19:46 sCfO20 wrote:
Okay, sure the guy with the camera didn't have a gun.
But my point is, why didn't this happen at all? There was no effort for anything like this. It sounds like your law enforcement got bested by a maniac. Which should never happen. It's what you guys pay your taxes for.
Its the backside of having an open democratic society. If some maniac decides to go on a killing spree it can be really hard to prevent.
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On July 23 2011 19:43 nam nam wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 19:40 Traeon wrote:
They did shoot him apparently. It just took 30 minutes for the police to get there. Are you sure? I saw one article saying it took two hours.
Rough *unconfirmed* timeline:
1520 - Bomb goes off in Oslo Centre. Hitting multiple government ministries and the PM's office. Causing all emergency services to go on high alert.
~1700 - The gunman (after presumably driving from Oslo after planting the bomb) starts opening fire on Utøya.
~2030 - Gunman is apprehended by the police.
You have to take into account that the gunman created the near-perfect diversion with the bomb. The frantic emergency calls from the youths at Utøya took some time to register with the emergency services, as they were all pre-occupied with dealing with the bomb blasts. Once the situation at Utøya started to register with the Police, it still tokk our 'SWAT' teams about 30 mins of 'fast driving' to get from Oslo (where they had been deployed in response to the bomb blast) to Utøya.
To put it into context. The bomb blast alone was one of the most significant events to happen to Oslo since Norwegian Saboteurs blew up German stuff in Oslo during WW2.
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Fundamentalism, be it religious or not, is the most dangerous thing in the world.
This is atrocious.
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On July 23 2011 19:43 nam nam wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 19:40 Traeon wrote:
They did shoot him apparently. It just took 30 minutes for the police to get there. Are you sure? I saw one article saying it took two hours.
I'm not sure, but I've seen 30 minutes menioned on various news sites. I guess there's a lot of confusion still.
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On July 23 2011 19:38 Thorakh wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 19:33 Ryndika wrote:
Why didn't this guy make suicide? What was his motives?
More than likely he wants to announce his views to the whole world and wants to see how Norway crumbles. Which, if people don't go screaming for revenge, won't happen.
this reminds me of the The Dark Knight (Batman). The Joker wants to see the people blow each other up on the boats which doesn't happen because the people have morals and don't fall for his insanity.
Norway is making the right move. Don't go insane over this and throw everything away the country has worked for so long. This makes me proud
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On July 23 2011 19:46 Zarahtra wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 19:43 nam nam wrote:On July 23 2011 19:40 Traeon wrote:
They did shoot him apparently. It just took 30 minutes for the police to get there. Are you sure? I saw one article saying it took two hours. It took atleast 1 hour, I believe it was closer to 1.5 though You have to understand though the communications were fucked after the bombing and apparently the fucker went straight from Oslo to the island, so he had a lot of headstart on the police. It seemed like they could've been faster, especially considering there were boats out helping the kids in the water long time before police got to the island, but I suppose the boats were probably around the shore and it were civilians that heard the gun shots(and probably the screams) and went out on their boats to help(this i don't know note, apart that the boats were out there relatively fast).
I got both german and danish newssites saying the special-agents of the norwegian police reached the island 30minutes after the shooting began.
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EPT
