EPTBehavioural Modification Camps in the USA - Page 14
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let_FLY
80 Posts
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Qaz
84 Posts
On May 30 2011 05:11 Olinim wrote: I acknowledged that in my post. I said most Christians deviate away from this due to shifting of the times. Yes, I just thought it could use some restating, as you've been under quite a bit of critisism for something else you said. I also wanted to add a historical perspective to it. While somewhat of topic....As for the idea that seems to have gotten you under fire, whether or not homosexuality is determined at birth or a choice, perhaps there can be more reasons than simply genetics. However, I and,( judging from a quick search of google scholarly article) most of us do not have enough information to blame it on any one thing. Admittedly, I'm having a hard time seeing sexual orientation as a choice. | ||
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Xiron
Germany1233 Posts
On May 30 2011 05:31 let_FLY wrote: every fucking thread turns into a direct representation of what the internet feels is a proper representation of that country. grow up, if you really think the majority of americans feel this is necessary i can't even begin to form an insult that would likely result in a ban anyway. Germans protest against nuclear power, government considers all pro's and con's, nuclear power plants are going to be turned off soon. The will of people made a choice. Ive never been to USA, but if you say "the majority of americans" doesnt want those camps, why are they still there? That doesnt really make sense to me. Do americans not care? In germany something like that would not be possible at all. Do you mind to explain me your thoughts? | ||
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Zealotdriver
United States1557 Posts
On May 30 2011 05:37 Xiron wrote: Germans protest against nuclear power, government considers all pro's and con's, nuclear power plants are going to be turned off soon. The will of people made a choice. Ive never been to USA, but if you say "the majority of americans" doesnt want those camps, why are they still there? That doesnt really make sense to me. Do americans not care? In germany something like that would not be possible at all. Do you mind to explain me your thoughts? I don't want to speak for let_fly, but here in the US we have a saying, C.R.E.A.M. cash rules everything around me The groups supporting these abusive camps have enough money to buy legal protection and political influence. Many americans would like to see these places shut down, but enough americans with money support these brutal camps so nothing will be done. | ||
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Qaz
84 Posts
On May 30 2011 05:37 Xiron wrote: Germans protest against nuclear power, government considers all pro's and con's, nuclear power plants are going to be turned off soon. The will of people made a choice. Ive never been to USA, but if you say "the majority of americans" doesnt want those camps, why are they still there? That doesnt really make sense to me. Do americans not care? In germany something like that would not be possible at all. Do you mind to explain me your thoughts? The difference is these camps have nothing to do with the government, while nuclear power does. They're private schools--companies for profit. It only takes a tiny percentage of the population to be willing to send their children there for it to be profitable. Who has the majority is irrelevant. From the text, it also seems that the treatment in these schools has been kept relatively secret. For example, they weren't allowed to say to their parents that the schools had anything to do with religion. This isn't something that can be blamed on the general population of the US. | ||
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The KY
United Kingdom6252 Posts
On May 30 2011 05:37 Xiron wrote: Germans protest against nuclear power, government considers all pro's and con's, nuclear power plants are going to be turned off soon. The will of people made a choice. Ive never been to USA, but if you say "the majority of americans" doesnt want those camps, why are they still there? That doesnt really make sense to me. Do americans not care? In germany something like that would not be possible at all. Do you mind to explain me your thoughts? I have to say, usually I deplore that childish 'fuck America' bollocks, but the fact that this is allowed to happen in any country baffles me, and indicates that at best there is something wrong with the American system and at worst something wrong with the American mindset. If something like this happens here then it happens secretly and illegally, and when it is discovered it is all over the news. Of course America is a very large country, which no doubt has a significant effect. Everything is bigger in the US, including the insane fringe groups. Blaming the country and it's people for this kind of thing is obviously an overly simplistic knee jerk response. | ||
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Hedgehog
Macedonia73 Posts
Interesting, I didn't know that "Romans were mostly bisexuals." Could you point to some of the historical sources? Ancient Rome pretty much copy-pasted their whole culture and mythology from the Ancient Greeks. Homosexuality in Ancient Greek polises namely Sparta was a social norm. When a boy becomes 7 years of age he's taken from the family and is given a 'combat trainer' who was in the same time his lover... So yeah, in Ancient Rome homosexuality was widespread but also by the time of Aurelius Augustinus(the 1st true christian philosopher in the context of developing the christian political theory) who witnessed the fall of Rome, the hunt for the homosexuals can be traced to. In his works he mentions all the bad things Rome and Roman people have done that lead to their downfall and homosexuality(or deviating the god's will/plan) was one of them. And with the establishment of the church as the only source of legitimacy of the rulers in the middle ages(in Europe) the hunt for heretics and abominations goes into overdrive. We all know how that affected the cultural and scientific progress... Sadly, remnants of that mindset still exist even after a millennium. As for some works you can read on about Roman culture, try Cicero and Seneka. And pretty much every ancient Greek philosopher. | ||
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PlaGuE_R
France1151 Posts
On May 30 2011 05:54 Hedgehog wrote: Ancient Rome pretty much copy-pasted their whole culture and mythology from the Ancient Greeks. Homosexuality in Ancient Greek polises namely Sparta was a social norm. When a boy becomes 7 years of age he's taken from the family and is given a 'combat trainer' who was in the same time his lover... So yeah, in Ancient Rome homosexuality was widespread but also by the time of Aurelius Augustinus(the 1st true christian philosopher in the context of developing the christian political theory) who witnessed the fall of Rome, the hunt for the homosexuals can be traced to. In his works he mentions all the bad things Rome and Roman people have done that lead to their downfall and homosexuality(or deviating the god's will/plan) was one of them. And with the establishment of the church as the only source of legitimacy of the rulers in the middle ages(in Europe) the hunt for heretics and abominations goes into overdrive. We all know how that affected the cultural and scientific progress... Sadly, remnants of that mindset still exist even after a millennium. As for some works you can read on about Roman culture, try Cicero and Seneka. And pretty much every ancient Greek philosopher. w00t i love you! that was very well said, i was a bit tired so i couldnt be bothered to provide the sources but thank you for helping my point :D also, i HIGHLY HIGHLY recommend Caesar's campaign diaries and Suetonius' Twelve Caesars as well as Polybius' histories of Rome. They are great great reads. | ||
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Shebuha
Canada1335 Posts
It makes me think about what would happen to me if I were there. I don't want to say that it's the fault of religion, because it's not. It's one F'ed up Mormon that deserves some harsh shit. | ||
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DoubleReed
United States4130 Posts
On May 30 2011 05:37 Xiron wrote: Germans protest against nuclear power, government considers all pro's and con's, nuclear power plants are going to be turned off soon. The will of people made a choice. Ive never been to USA, but if you say "the majority of americans" doesnt want those camps, why are they still there? That doesnt really make sense to me. Do americans not care? In germany something like that would not be possible at all. Do you mind to explain me your thoughts? They aren't still there. Nearly all of them have been sued out of existence, and the ones still functioning like Cross Creek are currently under investigation with their own lawsuits. This is not acceptable in America. If you're asking "Why did this shit start to begin with?" I'll admit that it's totally fucked up. But if you're asking "Why is this allowed to continue?" then I'm telling you it's not. For instance, Jailtime! http://wwasp.blogspot.com/2007/11/randall-hinton-sentenced-to-jail-for.html | ||
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happyness
United States2400 Posts
On May 30 2011 04:17 nennx wrote: Religion is definitely to blame here. The sooner we all abandon religion the better off mankind will be. They abandoned religion in China. Things are great over there. On May 30 2011 04:09 nathangonmad wrote: I never cease to be surprised by the united states. I'm surprised as much as you are, though what makes you so certain that something like this doesn't exist in european countries? I don't know, I have to take the account with a grain of salt because I really believe that if it is as bad as this girl says, it would be all over the news. Teachers are sued over here for breaking up fights and hugging. It's hard for me to believe this story and the POV isn't exactly objective. | ||
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GiftPflanZe
Germany623 Posts
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DoubleReed
United States4130 Posts
WWASP officials claim that the organization itself is out of business, probably because of their infamous history of abuse, but clearly all of the WWASP programs are still affiliated and WWASP has not completely faded out. | ||
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rickybobby
United States405 Posts
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
On May 30 2011 05:47 Zealotdriver wrote: You try to defend against the american stereotyping by saying that even on this serious issue, all americans can think of is food? You're doing it wrong.I don't want to speak for let_fly, but here in the US we have a saying, C.R.E.A.M. | ||
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dOofuS
United States342 Posts
On May 30 2011 04:13 JohnQPublic wrote: The facility I went to was in provo, utah. If you know anything about provo, utah you know that 90% of its population is mormon. The entire time I was there I only met one staff member that was not a mormon and he was part of the security. This was a government funded facility and it had A MORMON CHURCH on the grounds. Every sunday you had 2 options 1) go to church and have a good time because everyone who went was awarded with privileges 2) sit in silence for 3 hours and do absolutely nothing. Suffice to say most people went to the church just so that they wouldn't be "punished". I'm with jdseemoreglass. If this story had credibility, where are all the news stories? I've yet to see any news coverage of any of this, and assuming that the program has LDS affiliation because it prohibits caffeine is a red flag for me (LDS doctrine does not prohibit caffeine). The place is located in Utah, where there is a large population of Mormons, but that doesn't prove anything. That's like assuming that because someone starts a correctional facility in Brazil that gets accused of abusing young males, that it's likely tied to the Catholic church, since the majority of Brazilians are Catholic, right? I feel like everyone's being trolled. If I'm wrong, then we'll see this on the news, and things will be forced to change, but discussing this on the TL.net forums just opens up the floodgates to religious, political, and national bigotry. I get more sick of the ignorant replies to this story than I do the actual story. | ||
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Reddit TroubledTeens
United States4 Posts
I started the area of reddit you found this story in. I'm pixel8, I'm the person who originally posted that girl's horrifying tale. I'm glad you are mad, you should be outraged by this story. We are talking about ways to fight these abusive facilities if you would like to join us. Also, I've heard that many of the staff at these places are gamers that play overnight while the kids are sleeping. We are looking for employees that are disgusted and willing to covertly document the abuse. If you know of anyone, please contact me at reddittroubledteens@gmail.com. This girl's story was, sadly enough, typical. These places exist in every state, hundreds of thousands of kids have been abused. There are huge survivor networks because the abuse is so rampant and traumatic. Yes, it's legal. There are no laws to protect these kids. YET. | ||
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WhuazGoodJaggah
Lesotho777 Posts
On May 30 2011 05:07 The KY wrote: ^In regards to the 'choosing who you're attracted to' thing, the main argument against it is it makes no fucking sense. Either you are attracted to someone or you are not; when was the last time you looked at someone you didn't find attractive and said 'yeah I'm gonna be attracted to them now'. If there are any straight people who think you can choose to be gay, by all means go ahead, start being attracted to men now. What's that? You don't want to? How bizarre. I suppose there can be people that choose to have sex with their own gender even though they aren't attracted to them...but if they do exist they aren't exactly relevant. You can choose to be attracted to someone by giving it a chance. You may not be attracted to that person at first but by spending time with this person you may become attracted to her/him. | ||
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NeonFox
2373 Posts
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Olinim
4044 Posts
On May 30 2011 07:52 WhuazGoodJaggah wrote: You can choose to be attracted to someone by giving it a chance. You may not be attracted to that person at first but by spending time with this person you may become attracted to her/him. Even if you could actually become attracted to the same sex just by getting to know them(lol) that's still not CHOOSING your attraction to them. If it did happen, it would happen naturally, not by a conscious decision. | ||
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