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On September 19 2010 17:26 wesleyq wrote:
While on the topic of religion... just curious, is following Buddhism as a way to live life but not believe any of the afterlife things atheism?
Atheism is plain and simply the lack of belief in any deities. People have proposed the existence of gods, whether they be Allah, Yahweh, Zeus, Ra, or so on. An atheist has not been convinced that any of those proposed gods are real.
Nothing else is required or disallowed to be called an atheist. Many atheists strive to be scientifically literate and skeptical, others couldn't care less about science or reality. A person could believe in ghosts or fairies or unicorns or any other silly and irrational superstitions, and still not believe in a god.
There is nothing in Buddhism that speaks to the existence of a god. Some Buddhists believe in gods, while others do not and can be called atheists. Hope that answers your question.
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Ya about Morals. They are learned from your parents. Right and wrong. It has more to do with Empathy for other humans and is more GENUINE when it is as such.
Just not doing something because "I'm afraid I'll go to hell" is the wrong reason to be good.
You get your morals from your parents. They tell you when what you do is right or wrong. Atheist or no, good parenting or no, that's where you get it from.
Lastly, to proclaim that religion has some how prevented more deaths than it has caused- with morals- vs its justification for wars- is a pretty silly argument for it.
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On September 19 2010 17:42 blitzkrieger wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 17:37 hifriend wrote:On September 19 2010 17:34 blitzkrieger wrote:On September 19 2010 17:26 TOloseGT wrote:On September 19 2010 17:23 blitzkrieger wrote:On September 19 2010 17:10 Blix wrote:On September 19 2010 17:01 blitzkrieger wrote:
I hate getting into these arguments because I don't have any sources for anything anymore... but there is no value to human life in atheism at all. Humans are just another animal. If you can profit off the expense of another human thats fine.
Do you realize that this (and one of your previous statements) is actually quite offensive to atheists? Yes. I find offense in many things everyday all day. If you can show me how this isn't true please tell me. Atheism strips meaning and purpose and value from everything except self preservation and reproduction. Very enlightening, where's your proof of THIS? Thats what atheism is by definition. I don't know how to explain it any better. Evolution Goals: 1: Self Preserve 2: Reproduce (once reproduce 1 is null). If you want to explain "atheism by definition," how about looking up the definition of atheism rather than bringing up the natural mechanics of evolution. "Atheism is commonly defined as the position that there are no deities. It can also mean the rejection of belief in the existence of deities. A broader definition is simply the absence of belief that any deities exist." An atheist could reject the theory of evolution and still be an atheist. Ok then tell me where you get your morals and why these are to be followed.
Are you to tell me that without religion or god, you would not have empathy for fellow human beings?
That you would not like others to do to you as you to them?
Religion -> Human morality? REDONKULOUS PROPOSITION.
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On September 19 2010 17:45 blitzkrieger wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 17:29 TOloseGT wrote:On September 19 2010 17:26 blitzkrieger wrote:On September 19 2010 17:15 aimaimaim wrote:On September 19 2010 16:45 blitzkrieger wrote:
If Hitler used the Church for anything it was just that, to use them. I'm pretty sure Japanese aren't a master race according to Hitler (or Italians for that matter) yet he enlisted their aid to accomplish his own goals. If Hitler had won I am sure he would have disposed of not only the Church but also Japan when he saw fit.
I mean even if you believe the Catholic Church helped Hitler I don't think anyone believes that Christian values and Nazism have any real similarities. And its in the Christian religion that the Church (organization) can and will become corrupt, it was said be Jesus too.
If you take away religion you are just left with natural selection. And people will abuse that to say who is "fit" or not and be even more selfish. I mean WW2 already had that. Life is a FFA where every action is to gain and everyone are really enemies. There is no justification for anything except to further oneself. Things like abortion are already accepted by many and soon we will have designer babies because "its not a life". They already do selective abortion in China for women which is a huge problem, I read there will be 120million bachelors in China in a few years because they aborted so many female babies, wish I had the source...
I think atheism is the most dangerous thing out there because it removes all restraints and takes away any morals and inserts nothing. Human beings are selfish and evil and taking off the restraints will unleash the monster. You can justify anything with atheism as long as if further's your own goals. Atheists are only accountable to themselves and can easily change any moral or value. We have already seen it with Hitler, Stalin, and Mao among others. Human beings become expendable and their is no value to life (look at abortion). People are already selfish and apathetic but the rise in militant atheism is going to make it even worse.
Most people believe this even though the internet, and gaming are filled with young liberals/atheists for the most part so I'll get like 50 flames for this but I don't care. You can criticize me and the Pope all you want but I should be able to criticize atheism just as well.
wtf are you talking about?? morals? you look for morals in religion? tell me 1 concrete event where atheism is bad and ill give you 10 concrete events why organized religion is bad .. fuck the pope .. tell me, why do christians all over the world needs a pope? Only Catholics follow the Pope. And there are like 2+ billion Catholics. I can give many reasons religion and the abuse of scripture can be bad as well. I can only find ONE reason for doing something good in Atheism (social contract) and thats not even doing good, that is looking for a reward for mutual benefit. Help is only given if it can return some other form of help. I can't find anything good with the Bible. You're basically out for yourself because then you wouldn't get into Heaven. See what I did there? You can't find anything good in the Bible at all? What about not murdering people? Oh wait that is ok because you are an atheist. So actually you wouldn't find anything because there are no values. Be fruitful and multiply is probably the only thing an atheist can agree with. If you are being a Christian simply for a reward you don't get it, thats how atheists think though. You are supposed to love God and man and your faith gets you there. If you were trying to go to heaven for rewards only then you basically forfeit your ticket. Protestantism is about intentions.
It's hard to find a passage about murder when your entire old testament tells of rape and death.
If you think Atheism comes with a lack of morals, you're just thinking like a typical Religious nutjob, who can't think for themselves and needs a book to tell them how to live their life.
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On September 19 2010 17:33 kammeyer wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 17:27 Pioneer wrote:
Comments like his are the reason that the average Christian is bashed so often. Granted the militant atheists don't make it easy. They forget that the loudest people tend to be the dumbest. A couple idiots are not an accurate representation of a whole people.
Also funny how he thinks it's appropriate to make these statements, considering all the problems the Catholic Church has been facing lately you'd think that he would work more towards appeasing the general populace rather than make inflammatory comments.
edit: Kammeyer where do you come up with these statistics? "93% of scientists are not atheist in the slightest" Atheism is growing, it's becoming more and more popular to state that you don't believe in a God than it is to say that you do.
If you're going to try and defend religion at least do it intelligently rather than blurt out false statistics and opinions. Hi, uh, someone blurted out that statistic before me. It works both ways, champ. 93% of scientists are atheists is nowhere near the case. It's not even remotely close.
Why would you use the statistic if you weren't sure about it. Also where did I state that 93% of scientists are atheists?
You're either a troll or a blithering idiot. Either way don't presume to talk down to me. Champ.
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Negative, University education in theology. It's not an ethnic cleansing because it goes no where near the same degree of what Hitler did. You can try to twist it how you please, it's no where near the same. It's a boring argument, Half. It really is, can you try something else to compare Hitler to the Bible? because you're far off that it's putting me to sleep at 3:46am.
So your argument for why it isn't Ethnic cleansing is that they didn't kill as many people.
I don't know what to say to that. So if I killed every single Black person in detroit, it wouldn't be an ethnic cleansing because it was just detroit?
What the fuck is wrong with you.
Lastly, to proclaim that religion has some how prevented more deaths than it has caused- with morals- vs its justification for wars- is a pretty silly argument for it.
Religion doesn't cause deaths. People cause deaths. Religion exists because people want it, and some people need it. Its just the fulfillment of a natural demand. People will prefer delusion to despair.
Atheism is a natural state. People are born Atheists. Given an atmosphere of intellectual fulfillment and security, they will remain Atheists.
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Hmm... to the above posters taking offence to my apparent arrogance, first off it wouldn't exactly be accurate to call Albert Einstein a religious person, nor Isaac Newton either for that matter, not that it matters at all really. If you have some time on your hands you should probably read some of the work of these populist genius's. And to be quite honest for the most part I've been disappointed.
In all honesty I only allowed myself to be drawn into this very very boring argument because i was extremely bored at the time. Here is the premise of the OP, Pope is a leader of a major religion. Pope claims to receive divine revelation for god. Pope says something that evidence suggest is overwhelmingly untrue in order to support his church's doctrine. Anything wrong with this picture?
What may appear as a low level assumption to you is as simple as 1+1 to me, and don't bother insulting my intelligence directly it's common, boring, and uninteresting, instead try to prove why your right.
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On September 19 2010 17:44 Half wrote:Show nested quote +
Lol, Darwin lost his faith because his daughter died - nothing more, nothing less.
Did god tell you this? lol. Show nested quote +
Comments like his are the reason that the average Christian is bashed so often. Granted the militant atheists don't make it easy. They forget that the loudest people tend to be the dumbest. A couple idiots are not an accurate representation of a whole people.
Theists like you are why I haven't joined the "Down with religion bandwagon" :/. Religion, on an individual and communal level, can be a powerful force of self improvement, self realization, and other positive effects. The issue is, due to its power, it lends itself to being easily manipulated, or distorted for private gain, unless used in conjunction with "Secular rationale". Show nested quote +
I know it doesn't have goals or think. Thank you for that. I should have said Operation.
Your analogy sucks.
I'm actually aware that you didn't mean goals, but the funny part is you still think as if it had goals. How can you apply a statistical trend and then say "THIS IS HOW YOU LIVE YOUR LIFE"? What kind of reasoning is that.
Uh, no. Lol. It's actually recorded in multiple documentaries about Darwin especially due to the hardships him and his wife had due to the disagreements. He lost his daughter and reconsidered his faith. Nothing more, nothing less. It's in multiple books and documentaries.
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On September 19 2010 17:41 Sad[Panda] wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 17:39 Evil_Monkey_ wrote:On September 19 2010 17:15 aimaimaim wrote:On September 19 2010 16:45 blitzkrieger wrote:
If Hitler used the Church for anything it was just that, to use them. I'm pretty sure Japanese aren't a master race according to Hitler (or Italians for that matter) yet he enlisted their aid to accomplish his own goals. If Hitler had won I am sure he would have disposed of not only the Church but also Japan when he saw fit.
I mean even if you believe the Catholic Church helped Hitler I don't think anyone believes that Christian values and Nazism have any real similarities. And its in the Christian religion that the Church (organization) can and will become corrupt, it was said be Jesus too.
If you take away religion you are just left with natural selection. And people will abuse that to say who is "fit" or not and be even more selfish. I mean WW2 already had that. Life is a FFA where every action is to gain and everyone are really enemies. There is no justification for anything except to further oneself. Things like abortion are already accepted by many and soon we will have designer babies because "its not a life". They already do selective abortion in China for women which is a huge problem, I read there will be 120million bachelors in China in a few years because they aborted so many female babies, wish I had the source...
I think atheism is the most dangerous thing out there because it removes all restraints and takes away any morals and inserts nothing. Human beings are selfish and evil and taking off the restraints will unleash the monster. You can justify anything with atheism as long as if further's your own goals. Atheists are only accountable to themselves and can easily change any moral or value. We have already seen it with Hitler, Stalin, and Mao among others. Human beings become expendable and their is no value to life (look at abortion). People are already selfish and apathetic but the rise in militant atheism is going to make it even worse.
Most people believe this even though the internet, and gaming are filled with young liberals/atheists for the most part so I'll get like 50 flames for this but I don't care. You can criticize me and the Pope all you want but I should be able to criticize atheism just as well.
wtf are you talking about?? morals? you look for morals in religion? tell me 1 concrete event where atheism is bad and ill give you 10 concrete events why organized religion is bad .. fuck the pope .. tell me, why do christians all over the world needs a pope? *cough* *cough* The Pope is the leader of the catholic faith, thank you very much. He has nothing to do with Christianity. Catholicism is a type of Christianity so he does but its not to the whole Christian faith
Catholicism predates christianity, so you should go back to school.
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On September 19 2010 17:48 Half wrote:Show nested quote +
Negative, University education in theology. It's not an ethnic cleansing because it goes no where near the same degree of what Hitler did. You can try to twist it how you please, it's no where near the same. It's a boring argument, Half. It really is, can you try something else to compare Hitler to the Bible? because you're far off that it's putting me to sleep at 3:46am.
So your argument for why it isn't Ethnic cleansing is that they didn't kill as many people. I don't know what to say to that. So if I killed every single Black person in detroit, it wouldn't be an ethnic cleansing because it was just detroit? What the fuck is wrong with you.
You're clearly unaware of what ethnic cleansing is. You're comparing killing every black person in Detroit to killing off nearly an entire ethnicity in Israel? Are you retarded?
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On September 19 2010 17:49 kammeyer wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 17:44 Half wrote:
Lol, Darwin lost his faith because his daughter died - nothing more, nothing less.
Did god tell you this? lol.
Comments like his are the reason that the average Christian is bashed so often. Granted the militant atheists don't make it easy. They forget that the loudest people tend to be the dumbest. A couple idiots are not an accurate representation of a whole people.
Theists like you are why I haven't joined the "Down with religion bandwagon" :/. Religion, on an individual and communal level, can be a powerful force of self improvement, self realization, and other positive effects. The issue is, due to its power, it lends itself to being easily manipulated, or distorted for private gain, unless used in conjunction with "Secular rationale".
I know it doesn't have goals or think. Thank you for that. I should have said Operation.
Your analogy sucks.
I'm actually aware that you didn't mean goals, but the funny part is you still think as if it had goals. How can you apply a statistical trend and then say "THIS IS HOW YOU LIVE YOUR LIFE"? What kind of reasoning is that. Uh, no. Lol. It's actually recorded in multiple documentaries about Darwin especially due to the hardships him and his wife had due to the disagreements. He lost his daughter and reconsidered his faith. Nothing more, nothing less. It's in multiple books and documentaries.
LMFAO, there is no documented report that even implies that Darwin started questioning his faith because of the death of his daughter. Do a little research and come back with your tail between your legs please.
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United States43189 Posts
I find this hilarious, both because of the Nazi Youth connection and the fact that it was the support of the German Catholic party that brought Hitler to power. They made a pact with the Pope that gave Hitler the support of the Catholic Church in exchange for protection for German Catholics. While you can make an argument that all Germans consented to the atrocities that followed out of self interest most didn't put it in writing. The Catholic Church were the first to assure Hitler he could do whatever he liked to anyone else as long as they were protected.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichskonkordat
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Uh, no. Lol. It's actually recorded in multiple documentaries about Darwin especially due to the hardships him and his wife had due to the disagreements. He lost his daughter and reconsidered his faith. Nothing more, nothing less. It's in multiple books and documentaries.
I was kind of being facetious. My point is its entirely silly to marginalize a persons religious beliefs like that. You don't know what he was thinking, I'm assuming.
If someone decided to believe in god because their daughter didn't die, you would think that would be more significant right? Yet if they converted to Atheism because there daughter died, there thought process is marginalized.
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On September 19 2010 17:45 TOloseGT wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 17:42 blitzkrieger wrote:On September 19 2010 17:37 hifriend wrote:On September 19 2010 17:34 blitzkrieger wrote:On September 19 2010 17:26 TOloseGT wrote:On September 19 2010 17:23 blitzkrieger wrote:On September 19 2010 17:10 Blix wrote:On September 19 2010 17:01 blitzkrieger wrote:
I hate getting into these arguments because I don't have any sources for anything anymore... but there is no value to human life in atheism at all. Humans are just another animal. If you can profit off the expense of another human thats fine.
Do you realize that this (and one of your previous statements) is actually quite offensive to atheists? Yes. I find offense in many things everyday all day. If you can show me how this isn't true please tell me. Atheism strips meaning and purpose and value from everything except self preservation and reproduction. Very enlightening, where's your proof of THIS? Thats what atheism is by definition. I don't know how to explain it any better. Evolution Goals: 1: Self Preserve 2: Reproduce (once reproduce 1 is null). If you want to explain "atheism by definition," how about looking up the definition of atheism rather than bringing up the natural mechanics of evolution. "Atheism is commonly defined as the position that there are no deities. It can also mean the rejection of belief in the existence of deities. A broader definition is simply the absence of belief that any deities exist." An atheist could reject the theory of evolution and still be an atheist. Ok then tell me where you get your morals and why these are to be followed. I get my morals from my atheist parents, who were taught to them from my atheist grandparents, who were taught to them from my atheist great-grandparents and so on back to the ages of Confucius. We cherish our loved ones and our neighbors because we have compassion and understanding. We don't murder because we have empathy Need I go on?
You take care of your community and family because they benefit you. Think of the world around you, the food you eat, the clothes you wear. How much of it did you make? Are you capable of fully taking care of all your needs? No. You need other humans to help you each do a part in order to receive a greater benefit. You need farmers for food. Other to make clothes. Some to make computers so you can go on the internet. If this benefit did not exist or was less than the reward you would not do it.
When you were a baby you would have died if your parents left you. In fact it takes almost 20 years for most children to be ready to live on their own. From birth you were extremely dependent on others. In turn you will take care of your children because you are paying the debt. The entirety of human society exists because it is beneficial to humans. Even acts such as self sacrifice are really to benefit the species. Google the social contract or watch any episode of House MD.
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On September 19 2010 17:52 TOloseGT wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2010 17:49 kammeyer wrote:On September 19 2010 17:44 Half wrote:
Lol, Darwin lost his faith because his daughter died - nothing more, nothing less.
Did god tell you this? lol.
Comments like his are the reason that the average Christian is bashed so often. Granted the militant atheists don't make it easy. They forget that the loudest people tend to be the dumbest. A couple idiots are not an accurate representation of a whole people.
Theists like you are why I haven't joined the "Down with religion bandwagon" :/. Religion, on an individual and communal level, can be a powerful force of self improvement, self realization, and other positive effects. The issue is, due to its power, it lends itself to being easily manipulated, or distorted for private gain, unless used in conjunction with "Secular rationale".
I know it doesn't have goals or think. Thank you for that. I should have said Operation.
Your analogy sucks.
I'm actually aware that you didn't mean goals, but the funny part is you still think as if it had goals. How can you apply a statistical trend and then say "THIS IS HOW YOU LIVE YOUR LIFE"? What kind of reasoning is that. Uh, no. Lol. It's actually recorded in multiple documentaries about Darwin especially due to the hardships him and his wife had due to the disagreements. He lost his daughter and reconsidered his faith. Nothing more, nothing less. It's in multiple books and documentaries. LMFAO, there is no documented report that even implies that Darwin started questioning his faith because of the death of his daughter. Do a little research and come back with your tail between your legs please.
Already have, I appreciate it though.
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Of course Darwin lost his faith. He was a brilliant man =].
Religion is sneaky and indoctrinates you at a stage in your life when you can't object.
It's merely a waiting game of when one comes the realise it's all BALLS.
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On September 19 2010 16:45 blitzkrieger wrote:
If Hitler used the Church for anything it was just that, to use them. I'm pretty sure Japanese aren't a master race according to Hitler (or Italians for that matter) yet he enlisted their aid to accomplish his own goals. If Hitler had won I am sure he would have disposed of not only the Church but also Japan when he saw fit.
I mean even if you believe the Catholic Church helped Hitler I don't think anyone believes that Christian values and Nazism have any real similarities. And its in the Christian religion that the Church (organization) can and will become corrupt, it was said be Jesus too.
If you take away religion you are just left with natural selection. And people will abuse that to say who is "fit" or not and be even more selfish. I mean WW2 already had that. Life is a FFA where every action is to gain and everyone are really enemies. There is no justification for anything except to further oneself. Things like abortion are already accepted by many and soon we will have designer babies because "its not a life". They already do selective abortion in China for women which is a huge problem, I read there will be 120million bachelors in China in a few years because they aborted so many female babies, wish I had the source...
I think atheism is the most dangerous thing out there because it removes all restraints and takes away any morals and inserts nothing. Human beings are selfish and evil and taking off the restraints will unleash the monster. You can justify anything with atheism as long as if further's your own goals. Atheists are only accountable to themselves and can easily change any moral or value. We have already seen it with Hitler, Stalin, and Mao among others. Human beings become expendable and their is no value to life (look at abortion). People are already selfish and apathetic but the rise in militant atheism is going to make it even worse.
Most people believe this even though the internet, and gaming are filled with young liberals/atheists for the most part so I'll get like 50 flames for this but I don't care. You can criticize me and the Pope all you want but I should be able to criticize atheism just as well.
You base your reasoning on the assumption that there is no other way to moral behavior than religion. This is the point where you are wrong. Moral behavior is possible without religion. Here is a few reasons why:
1. Philosophy. A lot of philosophers concerned with moral ethics tried to determine what is good and what is bad without ever relating to religion. Immanuel Kant is the best example. He basically said what Jesus said but totally detached it from the existance (and believe in) a higher force.
2. Moral Imprinting. Science tells us that we acquire moral standards by imprinting of our societal sourroundings. If a society is based on chritian ethics, the society will most likely feel bound by these ethics even if people do not actively believe in a god/higher power - ethical behavior is detached from religious believes
3. You basically assume that people will not do good things if they are not forced into it by the fear of eternal punishmeht (i.e. hell). I do not want to speculate about where you get this idea but its truly saddening. I would like to disagree with that and take it one step further: Atheists do moral ethics because they intrinsically believe them to be good/right. They do not need to be coerced into ethics with fear/threats - hence an atheist behaving ethically is morally superior to a bliever the way you understand them.
Imagine a person who does good things not because there is a reward in for them (heaven/paradise) and who refrains from doing bad stuff not because of fear of punishmeht (hell) but merely because is the moral way to behave. Who do you think is morally more evolved?
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On September 19 2010 17:39 cursor wrote:
I, for one, can't believe that people still actually seriously cling to these arcane religions. It really amazes me. You REALLY gotta have the blinders on to think that the world written about in the Bible is the world we actually live in.
These "Christian" type people seriously overestimate their importance and don't realize they are just a tiny whisper in time. Like the hundreds of silly religions that preceded them. In 5000 years Christians will be seen as we see Egyptian religion now. Or Roman gods, or ancient Greek gods. Just a bunch of mystical rigmarole slapped together to justify power systems. I'm not religious at all but I hate it when people think they are on some higher plane of intelligence because they have gotten past the "god belief" or whatever. You are not better than "these "Christian" type people."
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On September 19 2010 17:53 Half wrote:Show nested quote +
Uh, no. Lol. It's actually recorded in multiple documentaries about Darwin especially due to the hardships him and his wife had due to the disagreements. He lost his daughter and reconsidered his faith. Nothing more, nothing less. It's in multiple books and documentaries.
I was kind of being facetious. My point is its entirely silly to marginalize a persons religious beliefs like that. You don't know what he was thinking, I'm assuming. If someone decided to belief in god because their daughter didn't die, you would think that would be more significant right? Yet if they converted to Atheism because there daughter died, there thought process is marginalized.
If someone decided to belief in god because their daughter didn't die
You're going to have to type sentences more clearly at 4am, I'm too tired to decipher what you're trying to say.
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On September 19 2010 16:45 blitzkrieger wrote:
If Hitler used the Church for anything it was just that, to use them. I'm pretty sure Japanese aren't a master race according to Hitler (or Italians for that matter) yet he enlisted their aid to accomplish his own goals. If Hitler had won I am sure he would have disposed of not only the Church but also Japan when he saw fit.
I mean even if you believe the Catholic Church helped Hitler I don't think anyone believes that Christian values and Nazism have any real similarities. And its in the Christian religion that the Church (organization) can and will become corrupt, it was said be Jesus too.
If you take away religion you are just left with natural selection. And people will abuse that to say who is "fit" or not and be even more selfish. I mean WW2 already had that. Life is a FFA where every action is to gain and everyone are really enemies. There is no justification for anything except to further oneself. Things like abortion are already accepted by many and soon we will have designer babies because "its not a life". They already do selective abortion in China for women which is a huge problem, I read there will be 120million bachelors in China in a few years because they aborted so many female babies, wish I had the source...
I think atheism is the most dangerous thing out there because it removes all restraints and takes away any morals and inserts nothing. Human beings are selfish and evil and taking off the restraints will unleash the monster. You can justify anything with atheism as long as if further's your own goals. Atheists are only accountable to themselves and can easily change any moral or value. We have already seen it with Hitler, Stalin, and Mao among others. Human beings become expendable and their is no value to life (look at abortion). People are already selfish and apathetic but the rise in militant atheism is going to make it even worse.
Most people believe this even though the internet, and gaming are filled with young liberals/atheists for the most part so I'll get like 50 flames for this but I don't care. You can criticize me and the Pope all you want but I should be able to criticize atheism just as well.
Your whole premise is wrong. You're looking at atheists and say that because we do not believe in a higher power than ourselves, we would turn on all morale and become an anarchistic society where everyone just does as they wish. If there is no God to account to, you have to account for all the actions you are doing yourself. You're not left with "nothing", you're left with the realization that you're the only one accountable for what you're doing, no one else. I am fairly certain that you know at least a bit of philosophy? I do concur with you that humans do things mostly for their own gain, which is a philosophical theory called utilitarianism (Even though there are probably many atheists that would argue different) but that would not necessarily lead to a world that is worse than now. Most humans do want to live in Peace, and having no God above you doesn't change that. It is not that because I do not believe in God, suddenly I want to rape women or kill people or have a bad morale. Of course the church and even the religions themselves are instilling thoughts like that the world would fall into anarchy into their followers, given that it is necessary to keep them.
For the church to prevail it has to have some kind of use for the humans (you see, even religious people use this) Now if you take away the life after death and salvation (things we cannot prove or disprove) then what is there left that the church can bring you? It's only the promise that everything would go worse if people were atheists, where it probably would either stay the same, or become only better.
Most of the major conflicts in this world have had and still have religion as their basis. In this way, religion probably leads to more man-made death than anything else. People die and kill for "their God" for as long as we can think of religion, and you're saying Atheism would be worse?
I am in no way saying that the world suddenly would turn peaceful when everyone would be an atheist, but I do believe that it would not be worse than it is now, I think it could be even better.
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