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On September 25 2010 12:08 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2010 12:06 Gecko wrote:
Hey, this game interests me but i have been told that it is impossible for newer players to get into the game so late. Is this true or should i give this game a shot? That's not true. It'll take a while to unlock some of the more advanced roles but you're a valuable and indeed necessary part of a fleet from a few hours old.
What kind of things can newer players do in a fleet? Common sense tells me that my tiny starter ship would be worthless against the big bad battle cruisers all the pros have.
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On September 25 2010 12:23 Gecko wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2010 12:08 KwarK wrote:On September 25 2010 12:06 Gecko wrote:
Hey, this game interests me but i have been told that it is impossible for newer players to get into the game so late. Is this true or should i give this game a shot? That's not true. It'll take a while to unlock some of the more advanced roles but you're a valuable and indeed necessary part of a fleet from a few hours old. What kind of things can newer players do in a fleet? Common sense tells me that my tiny starter ship would be worthless against the big bad battle cruisers all the pros have.
As Kwark said, you are indeed a valuable asset to any fleet. You can hop into a fast frigate and be a dedicated tackler, i.e you keep the enemy in place while your friends take him down. This is one of the most important roles in the fleet. I think this is the most common role for newer players and it really helps out. You can be effective with almost all manners of Electronic Warfare with a frigate, and almost all of them takes next to no time to train for.
Players who have played for 5 years can act as tacklers aswell, so it's not a myth that it's actually useful.
In a couple of weeks you might sit in a decent fitted Cruiser, able to dish out a couple of hundred DPS which opens up other roles for you. I wouldn't want to mess with 20 "newbies" in Cruisers, the DPS adds up pretty fast 
There is a lot of different stuff you can do pretty fast in EVE. Non-combat related roles can be useful to corps aswell, like hauling etc.
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United States43990 Posts
On September 25 2010 12:23 Gecko wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2010 12:08 KwarK wrote:On September 25 2010 12:06 Gecko wrote:
Hey, this game interests me but i have been told that it is impossible for newer players to get into the game so late. Is this true or should i give this game a shot? That's not true. It'll take a while to unlock some of the more advanced roles but you're a valuable and indeed necessary part of a fleet from a few hours old. What kind of things can newer players do in a fleet? Common sense tells me that my tiny starter ship would be worthless against the big bad battle cruisers all the pros have.
What you've got to realise is that little tackling fighter represents an invested value of approximately 150,000 isk. And when you're the one holding the tackle on an 80,000,000 battlecruiser as the larger slower ships warp in then who gives a fuck how new you are. At that point you are the three year old players worst nightmare as his warp drive won't engage and he sees local spike. He can't just swat you out of his way, he's using big guns designed for big fights and you're fast and specialised for the job at hand. He turns all his guns on you and gets the odd glancing hit but it's not enough, I land next to you with the rest of the fleet and heavier ships put down some secondary points (warp disruption) on his ass. If he keeps shooting at you he'll probably get the kill but at that point who the hell cares, we're looting the wreck of something 500x your worth.
Skill points don't just give you a linear increase in damage and hp the way they would in an RPG. It's not at all like that. They unlock new roles and new ships and more advanced modules but these come at a price. Eve is dominated by the principle of an exponential decline. You can move up to bigger ships and use more advanced fittings (basically equipment) but the increase to your abilities will be far lower to the massive increase in price. And while you may end up pretty badass you'll still be a pirates wet dream as they hunt you in a small gang with ships worth a tiny fraction of the value of yours and tear you apart before looting your gear for sale. Similarly with skillpoints there's a level system in which each higher level takes roughly 5x the SP of the previous one. That means that hypothetically a one year old player could have all the same skills as a five year old player at a single level lower which is well within the margin of pilot skill.
In our first war it was a week old player in a budget fitted ship who tackled the enemy over and over again leaving the older players free to take big stuff and blow them up. He was just as important as them, if he hadn't been there one of them would have had to leave their battlecruiser and hop in a frigate to take his place.
Also dps has an exponential cost as you try and get more of it. Getting from 600 to 650 may take the careful use of some faction mod to free up fitting room and while it may be justifiable to spend 10m on it if the ship already costs 200m that doesn't change the fact you'd much rather just have a 150dps cruiser which costs 3m to buy and fit. The first few dps come way cheaper than the last few.
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Big turrets ment to shoot ships 150KM away can't hit/track a little frigatte orbiting it at 500m.
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On September 26 2010 00:27 Snowfield wrote:
Big turrets ment to shoot ships 150KM away can't hit/track a little frigatte orbiting it at 500m.
big turrets meant to hit at 1.5k can't hit webbed battlecruisers orbiting at 500m
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On September 25 2010 23:31 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2010 12:23 Gecko wrote:On September 25 2010 12:08 KwarK wrote:On September 25 2010 12:06 Gecko wrote:
Hey, this game interests me but i have been told that it is impossible for newer players to get into the game so late. Is this true or should i give this game a shot? That's not true. It'll take a while to unlock some of the more advanced roles but you're a valuable and indeed necessary part of a fleet from a few hours old. What kind of things can newer players do in a fleet? Common sense tells me that my tiny starter ship would be worthless against the big bad battle cruisers all the pros have. What you've got to realise is that little tackling fighter represents an invested value of approximately 150,000 isk. And when you're the one holding the tackle on an 80,000,000 battlecruiser as the larger slower ships warp in then who gives a fuck how new you are. At that point you are the three year old players worst nightmare as his warp drive won't engage and he sees local spike. He can't just swat you out of his way, he's using big guns designed for big fights and you're fast and specialised for the job at hand. He turns all his guns on you and gets the odd glancing hit but it's not enough, I land next to you with the rest of the fleet and heavier ships put down some secondary points (warp disruption) on his ass. If he keeps shooting at you he'll probably get the kill but at that point who the hell cares, we're looting the wreck of something 500x your worth. Skill points don't just give you a linear increase in damage and hp the way they would in an RPG. It's not at all like that. They unlock new roles and new ships and more advanced modules but these come at a price. Eve is dominated by the principle of an exponential decline. You can move up to bigger ships and use more advanced fittings (basically equipment) but the increase to your abilities will be far lower to the massive increase in price. And while you may end up pretty badass you'll still be a pirates wet dream as they hunt you in a small gang with ships worth a tiny fraction of the value of yours and tear you apart before looting your gear for sale. Similarly with skillpoints there's a level system in which each higher level takes roughly 5x the SP of the previous one. That means that hypothetically a one year old player could have all the same skills as a five year old player at a single level lower which is well within the margin of pilot skill. In our first war it was a week old player in a budget fitted ship who tackled the enemy over and over again leaving the older players free to take big stuff and blow them up. He was just as important as them, if he hadn't been there one of them would have had to leave their battlecruiser and hop in a frigate to take his place. Also dps has an exponential cost as you try and get more of it. Getting from 600 to 650 may take the careful use of some faction mod to free up fitting room and while it may be justifiable to spend 10m on it if the ship already costs 200m that doesn't change the fact you'd much rather just have a 150dps cruiser which costs 3m to buy and fit. The first few dps come way cheaper than the last few.
This game sounds really fun im going to download the trial! I will look more into this tackling thing it sounds really cool to do
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KwarK edit: Our war with you guys is over now, don't see any point in keeping you around.
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Gecko, PM KwarK, he can probably get you a 21 day trial, instead of the 14 day one. Plus you might get free crap.
edit: I'm dumb and can't type.
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On September 26 2010 01:49 Cleomenes wrote:
Gecko, PM KwarK, he can probably get you a 21 day trial, instead of the 14 day one. Plus you might get free crap.
edit: I'm dumb and can't type.
And you can't understand either 
If you wanna try eve, get a 14 day trial on site, join channel SCBW and talk to us
and tmonet, thanks for being extremely pedantic
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On September 26 2010 02:32 Snowfield wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2010 01:49 Cleomenes wrote:
Gecko, PM KwarK, he can probably get you a 21 day trial, instead of the 14 day one. Plus you might get free crap.
edit: I'm dumb and can't type. And you can't understand either If you wanna try eve, get a 14 day trial on site, join channel SCBW and talk to us and tmonet, thanks for being extremely pedantic
well what you said was kinda misleading but you have a good point.
frigates at close range aren't going to get hit by any sort of bs gun. Conversly I always giggle at frigates thinking they are safe from me at 200 km only for them to get one shot by a round of tremor!
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On September 26 2010 00:53 tmonet wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2010 00:27 Snowfield wrote:
Big turrets ment to shoot ships 150KM away can't hit/track a little frigatte orbiting it at 500m. big turrets meant to hit at 1.5k can't hit webbed battlecruisers orbiting at 500m
Err... What?
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On September 25 2010 12:23 Gecko wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2010 12:08 KwarK wrote:On September 25 2010 12:06 Gecko wrote:
Hey, this game interests me but i have been told that it is impossible for newer players to get into the game so late. Is this true or should i give this game a shot? That's not true. It'll take a while to unlock some of the more advanced roles but you're a valuable and indeed necessary part of a fleet from a few hours old. What kind of things can newer players do in a fleet? Common sense tells me that my tiny starter ship would be worthless against the big bad motherships all the pros have.
FYP.
EDIT: Annddd I missed a titan kill thanks to work. Moral of story: quit your job, sell your wife and children, and triple box.
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or quit eve, keep your job, and play less games that are less EPIC!
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United States43990 Posts
War is over and The Hatchery is stronger than ever. The war did very little to damage the corps missioning activities and the majority of players experienced absolutely no disruption to their day to day business. Our only big losses were in engagements we chose to fight and once it became clear we would not be given good odds we failed to lose any other big ships. Or at least, we lost nothing until the last 100 seconds of the war. Then Chaka managed to lose a battlecruiser which he'd loaned money off me to buy and planned to sell to me for a profit. But that was an individual loss (of about 38.5m), not a corp loss and all involved agreed it was absolutely hilarious.
So, to sum up, good job at dealing with the situation. It wasn't ideal but was just a miscalculation on their part and there wasn't much either party could do about that. They were pretty decent about it and we'll probably do this again sometime. We've ended the war with more members than we started, about 1.3b more in corp assets than before, a weeks more skill points and a lot of experience. All in all we're stronger than ever.
The move to our new HQ in Emol is going ahead now and I know a lot of you have already started moving stuff and grinding standing. That'll set us up nicely and hopefully we'll have the whole corp in a single region at last. With our numbers and skills we should be able to make the nearby lowsec our bitch. So I'm looking forward to that. Good going.
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So it turns out I couldn't bear to wait until summer, so I will be getting started up again. Will apply for the hatchery soon.
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On September 25 2010 12:06 Gecko wrote:
Hey, this game interests me but i have been told that it is impossible for newer players to get into the game so late. Is this true or should i give this game a shot?
Electronics warfare modules takes very little isk and skill, while have massive effects.
Tackle: You can make the enemy unable to make strategic moves (warp) as well as moving at 50% speed with one web. This means it is pretty much stuck until he kills you (which can take a while if you do it right) as has been said.
Electronics Counter Measures: spend two month of focused training and you can disable just about any unprepared opponent ship for >70% of the time. In one month you'd be disabling for 50% of the time. In they time they can not shoot, support allies or do much other then defend. The ship to do this also costs only under 10m with all fittings. (which a vet making 40m per hour can probably donate if with good cause)
Tracking Disruptors: Spend a week training. You opponent's guns now lose 40~60% of their range. This is very bad for your opponent if your team is now too far away to hit.
Note that those effects, while powerful, is not significantly improved by having a ton of skill points, unlike damage output (which takes the most training time). Any newbie can fly a Ewar boat and annoy the HELL out of most opponents.
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With exception of some supercapital flying fleets that involves ships costing some 400 times of a battlecruiser, most engagements in eve is won by cohesive fleets that puts the most guys into battle. Battles have been won by throwing 400 newbies into the grinder after all....
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On September 25 2010 12:23 Gecko wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2010 12:08 KwarK wrote:On September 25 2010 12:06 Gecko wrote:
Hey, this game interests me but i have been told that it is impossible for newer players to get into the game so late. Is this true or should i give this game a shot? That's not true. It'll take a while to unlock some of the more advanced roles but you're a valuable and indeed necessary part of a fleet from a few hours old. What kind of things can newer players do in a fleet? Common sense tells me that my tiny starter ship would be worthless against the big bad battle cruisers all the pros have.
http://www.eve-search.com/thread/1025677/page/1
Video is pwnage. Dl it. Nuff said.
Get in a rifter nao!
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Then Chaka managed to lose a battlecruiser which he'd loaned money off me to buy and planned to sell to me for a profit. But that was an individual loss (of about 38.5m), not a corp loss and all involved agreed it was absolutely hilarious.
hahahaha, oh chaka....
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On other, a bit old eve news: apparently when atlas lost the hub systems in deklein and insmother, their new leadership(bobby was afk for a long time, basicly from late spring on his appereance diminished heavily) made a deal with RA and the drone russians to let them evacuate their assests or something.
The terms are quite interesting:
Atlas alliance disbands,
all of their super caps that are currently being built, half are given to ra, half they keep
they give up omist
not sure about whether or not they could evacuate structures or not
Since the information is scarce I've given you the toned down version because I haven't been able to find if they had to give existing supercaps as well, which would make the deal even more retarded : >
Atlas was basicly bobby atlas and a bunch of mindless drones, I think the end started when khanid? and quesa left and bobby supposedly got a girlfriend or something and didn't play eve anymore. A lesson to be learned in leadership structure is it not? <wink, wink>
In other more ME related news, I've been doing missions... IN A MAELSTROM. Almost got a 6,9 rep with republic fleet wooo*
+ Show Spoiler +*Surprisingly missioning isn't that bad if you can listen in on a The hatchery roam where serg is playing bait, sitting in a belt with a can out but not mining because he doesn't have mining lasers, and also no point >.>
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So we're roaming lowsec with mid-sized fleet, i'm in a poorly fit t1 drake flying in lowsec for the first time. We arrive at a nullsec gate and wait for serg to give commands. A tengu shows up and locks nou who then suicides by shooting it. Then the Tengu locks me but doesnt shoot, waiting for me to suicide as well. Instead i drop a cargo container and name it "BRING IT" because im the guy with the friends in there and all. We idle a bit longer and finally all except me warp out. A cane jumps in immediately and the tengu starts shooting me. I panic hard because he does like 600dmg per shot and jump the gate to nullsec. Instead of warping away on the other side i try reach the gate back and get shot by some other people and barely can jump back with 50% structure just for the tengu to finish me on the other side. FML
![[image loading]](http://starcraft2.ingame.de/forum/images/smilies/deliver.gif)
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EPT
