EPTThe trailer, however, sucked balls. I think it would have been better had they not had any.
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread - Page 128
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Hider
Denmark9448 Posts
The trailer, however, sucked balls. I think it would have been better had they not had any. | ||
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CicadaSC
United States1986 Posts
On June 07 2024 22:52 JimmyJRaynor wrote: New Unit. cool new unit, normally i expect tier 3 to be really big units, so they have that FEELING as the player you just created something powerful. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On June 08 2024 02:18 PurE)Rabbit-SF wrote: A bit of side tangent. around 15 mins in this video , The Valorant creator talks about how anti-cheat is first thing they think. I still have the same belief about I am really sad to see StormGate's anti cheat is lackluster in it's current state. For real, CSGO was so full to the brim with cheaters that it put me off the game for good. Valorant stomping down hard on it brought so many players over I'll give FG some slack though, the tests so far have been mostly invite only and it's pretty easy for them to manually ban people when there's only a few thousand players. If cheating is an issue they'll surely crack down on it | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On June 08 2024 04:25 Waxangel wrote: I find this kind of super-complex unit especially interesting in the context of the D.Kim/Uncapped game being revealed in a few hours. By this point I think we can completely disregard all of FG's prior "lower barrier to entry" rhetoric and see that it's actually the ultimate double-down on Blizzard-style RTS, stacking every layer of complexity from War3, SC2, SC2 co-op and adding even more of their own. It's such a contrast to the D.Kim RTS which is stripping away as many layers as possible until they reach what they consider the 'real' core' of Blizz RTS. Not a value judgment on either, but such an interesting way to see where people have gone from LotV. Not sure I agree. The mechanical smoothings they've done (smart building, auto hotkeys, autocast abilities), lack of monotonous macro mechanics like inject and chrono boost, and the lessened impact of supply blocks (through charge stacking and power building) all add up. Plus units don't one shot each other like in sc2 They've gone less in the direction of macro mechanics aren't a thing like other recently revealed games, and more in the way of you can still have fun playing and smoothly build an army if you lack the mechanical dedication, you just probably don't make GM playing like that. And I think that's the best way. EDIT: a better way of wording this. FG are focusing on it still being fun to play for noobs, even if basic mechanical barriers still exist. Other competitive games like shooters, mobas, or fighting games can be played and enjoyed at any level, while RTS games are an exercise in frustration if you don't have a lot of basics down. Plus FG are developing coop and a unique 3v3 mode as well, and I would expect those to be much more casual friendly. If FG are smart they'll know those gamemodes have bigger playerbase potential | ||
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Adico
14 Posts
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MegaBuster
167 Posts
- They sent two junior devs to demo it that mention within the video that they aren't familiar with past Blizzard editors, this keeps the discussion very trivial. - There's no improvements whatsoever to the major problems in the SC2 editor. There's also no identification of them or plan to improve them. - There's a fraction of the functionality of the SC2 editor. Its a partial view but every part you see this is true for. - The hot reloading or flipping back and forth to the editor that they focus on is present in many different types of software development and is kind of a "nice-to-have it, if it works" versus something transformative. You could do it in Minecraft modding for example and it saw use for calibrating little balance points on gameplay. - The load time demos are using a map with a very small amount of data. Its an odd way to demo something that sees more value with increasing project size, as well there's also no discussion of uploading the maps to their servers which is a major slowdown with SC2. - Still no comment on ownership, IP, monetization, anything. These are all major problems in the SC2 environment and need some real vision. - The video is full of promises that things will only improve, this is a base, things are so obviously going to get better from here with no direction or specifics. The last point should be directly opposed given the nature of editor support in the past by this exact team. Where unlike all the stuff they take credit for with SC2 and did not do, they definitely are the people who did not understand the problems of the editors and its community and jerked them around for years. In short this kind of editor thing is made to impress people who don't use or will not use it as part of the marketing for the game at large. Its basically to whip up people into saying: CAN'T WAIT TO PLAY ALL THE MODS PEOPLE WILL MAKE! (But why will they make them?) | ||
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RogerChillingworth
Chad3132 Posts
On June 08 2024 04:25 Waxangel wrote: I find this kind of super-complex unit especially interesting in the context of the D.Kim/Uncapped game being revealed in a few hours. By this point I think we can completely disregard all of FG's prior "lower barrier to entry" rhetoric and see that it's actually the ultimate double-down on Blizzard-style RTS, stacking every layer of complexity from War3, SC2, SC2 co-op and adding even more of their own. It's such a contrast to the D.Kim RTS which is stripping away as many layers as possible until they reach what they consider the 'real' core' of Blizz RTS. Not a value judgment on either, but such an interesting way to see where people have gone from LotV. Would not agree Stormgate has the stacking complexity of previous Blizz RTS. That's a crazy statement. It's as complex or less complex than any one Blizz RTS. The graven is an early look at a t3 unit and it's likely to be changed. I get the impression that they're throwing out a lot of ideas to get some feedback, and will subsequently trim the unit down and hone its identity. Many of the other units are much more straightforward. But anyway, I think it's pretty easy to reinforce a bit of complexity with the notion that not every tooltip needs to be read and completely understood at face value. Just get into a game and get a feel for it. Stormgate itself can encourage this in any number of ways, including a unit tester. I've never been a fan of tooltips or trying to grasp a game purely analytically, so that's why I bring it up. Simplicity is good, and there is a good amount of it in Stormgate, but offering the option of a bit complexity for people who want to go there is pretty crucial. In DotA, you can play Ogre Magi until your eyes bleed, and have a good time, but some people couldn't live without their Meepo or Invoker and that's what makes the game. (I should add, Meepo and Invoker are extreme examples.) | ||
Waxangel
United States33699 Posts
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iamperfection
United States9648 Posts
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Adico
14 Posts
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_Spartak_
Turkey459 Posts
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Topin
Peru10128 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](https://static1.cbrimages.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/shaman-king-archangel.jpg?q=50&fit=contain&w=1140&h=&dpr=1.5) | ||
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SoleSteeler
Canada5472 Posts
Are we allowed to talk about stuff now, thoughts and feelings and such? | ||
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_Spartak_
Turkey459 Posts
On June 10 2024 05:50 SoleSteeler wrote: Only about things that have been publicly shown (which should be a lot since there will be many streams by content creators soon).July 30th if you have the founder pack and early access for all on August 13th. Nice to have a date! Are we allowed to talk about stuff now, thoughts and feelings and such? | ||
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Topin
Peru10128 Posts
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On June 10 2024 05:19 iamperfection wrote: so there you go protoss light basically Protoss heavy more like. Their town halls are Motherships, they can warp in buildings without a worker, their pylons charge up nearby units. Gameplay wise they're SC2 protoss on steroids. Lore/visuals is pretty much the same but I think everyone expected that part. The one part I'm not feeling is the name. Celestial Armada feels like the description of a faction, not the factions actual name. | ||
NonY
8751 Posts
Anyway, imo the weirdest feature of celestial is how they expand and gather resources. And no one really has any idea of that until they play them. So all initial reactions (with respect to assumptions about gameplay) are pointless. Their weird expansions and workers are so fundamental to the experience of playing them that you can’t understand what it’s like to play them until you try them. I totally get how, visually, people see Terran, Zerg and Protoss. But the way infernals, vanguard and celestials play is a good mix of t/z/p as well as some original mechanics. I really prefer to only play one race. I always hated off racing in sc1 and sc2. But I think I have to force myself to play random in early access to try all three and decide what I want to main. With respect to gameplay, these are three truly new factions separate from StarCraft that people need to discover themselves edit: pcgamer article mentions changes to celestial economy (removal of morph core). i still imagine its differences will be jarring and really key to the experience. and my point about the factions all being new still stands. it's hard to nail down their identity in terms of the starcraft races | ||
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SoleSteeler
Canada5472 Posts
Vanguard is like War3 human - lancers are similar to a footman (not exactly, but tier 1 melee guy in armour) Exo feels more like a rifleman than a marine. I'm pretty sure their attack cooldown is very similar too. Medics feel more like war3 priests than BW medics. Atlas feels more like a mortar team than a tank, due to the way it fires. (Visually, sure, more like a tank). Bobs definitely have an SCV/peasant feel Hedgehog definitely feels more Starcraft inspired. Hornets and dropships too. Infernal feels more like UD + Orc from War3. I don't really get a zerg feeling from them. Brutes feel more like orc grunts (or UD abominations) fiends are like UD ghouls Even their "mutalisk" - the spirggan, is closer to an UD gargoyle than it is to a muta. Flaming imps feel more like goblin sappers than banelings. Shadowflyers are similar to scourge, yes, but also to Orc batriders. I think the shadowflyer and batrider both speed up when they get closer to their target. Celestials... I only got to play about 10 games with them. I (along with many others) had a hard time figuring out how to make buildings. You need to use the global build button. No actual worker needed. They felt very unique to me, and that surprised me. Their mining was weird as hell but after a couple games you get used to it. I quite enjoyed them. Celestials have similarities to both night elf and protoss. A townhall that moves and attacks (tree of life). Constructing buildings outside your main base (also NE with ancient of war creeping). Watching Parting's celestial building pushes outside their opponent's bases felt War3-like to me. (ancient protector pushes). Their crystals mining from trees is the same as NE wisps. Visually, protoss for sure. Warping in, high technology, etc. The obvious stuff. Ancient warrior types. I don't remember all their units too well - they had huntress sentinel like ability (detector on a tree). I think it was a flying unit that could choose to land or land on a tree? The kri are super cool - basically a ninja zealot dude who rolls around like a baneling. When they die, they blow up after a couple seconds and deal AoE damage. Overall, War3 was super popular and a great game, but having huge armies and multiple bases was not something you saw in it. I'm glad SG fulfills that fantasy. I'm hopeful for the 3v3 mode, but I can't see how it won't lag like hell! Even SC2, a 14 year old game, can barely run even 3v3/4v4 big armies past a certain point. I guess CPUs from the past 2-3 years have a better shot. Sorry for my unorganized ramblings. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
Based on a scout of youtube and reddit comments, the general reaction is "they've just copied protoss". Which you only get when you look at the visuals alone. Building wise seems more C&C than Blizzard RTS. Infernals as well. They're closer to Orc, Undead, even sc2 protoss in terms of production. But because they look dark and swarmy and have a zergling unit, people just think it's a zerg copy. As for Vanguard, well they look identical to terran so I get it, we were always gonna get a terran/human faction. But they play much closer to BW terran than SC2 from what I've seen/played. If Frost Giant made the exact same races but with different aesthetics there wouldn't be this complaint. It doesn't help that half the commenters have probably only played SC2 so will look at any sci-fi RTS and get the feeling it's just SC2 again. | ||
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SoleSteeler
Canada5472 Posts
good read, notes at bottom indicates a stationary townhall (but arcship remains?) and no more morph cores, which were built at the arcship and were used to either build the harvesting thing over the luminite mine, or you can drop a lumbering type station (which also produces prisms, the collector thing) | ||
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