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I'm having a hard time placing a few of the units in the game in terms of usability and value.
Vamp counts cairn wraiths - Their melee attack and defense are horrible, and they have no armor to speak of. The ethereal doesn't seem to do much. Sure, they cause terror, but if they're not flanking with another unit tanking, they're kinda dead against anything.
Vamp count hex wraiths - sort of the same issue as with the cairn wraiths, although their steeds and mobility makes them actually usuable to get in position for flanks. However, they're higher tech but a lot poorer in performance than any other sort of cavalry the vamp counts can field.
Dwarf Slayers - they die. Horribly. 0 armor? Even if they're one of the only anti-large option for Dwarfs, fielding an armored unit of, well, pretty much anything with great weapon is a better idea against large creatures I feel. The greatest problem is not the unit dying either, it's it taking so much losses it slows you down by forcing you to rest or re-recruit.
Am I just using these poorly? Are any of you in love with said units, or do you agree with me that they're kinda hopeless?
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On June 29 2016 06:36 plated.rawr wrote:
I'm having a hard time placing a few of the units in the game in terms of usability and value.
Vamp counts cairn wraiths - Their melee attack and defense are horrible, and they have no armor to speak of. The ethereal doesn't seem to do much. Sure, they cause terror, but if they're not flanking with another unit tanking, they're kinda dead against anything.
Vamp count hex wraiths - sort of the same issue as with the cairn wraiths, although their steeds and mobility makes them actually usuable to get in position for flanks. However, they're higher tech but a lot poorer in performance than any other sort of cavalry the vamp counts can field.
Dwarf Slayers - they die. Horribly. 0 armor? Even if they're one of the only anti-large option for Dwarfs, fielding an armored unit of, well, pretty much anything with great weapon is a better idea against large creatures I feel. The greatest problem is not the unit dying either, it's it taking so much losses it slows you down by forcing you to rest or re-recruit.
Am I just using these poorly? Are any of you in love with said units, or do you agree with me that they're kinda hopeless?
The cairn wraiths/hex wraiths seem to have no collision with friendly non ghosts- you can stack them on top of other units/charge through your own units.
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On June 29 2016 06:36 plated.rawr wrote:
I'm having a hard time placing a few of the units in the game in terms of usability and value.
Vamp counts cairn wraiths - Their melee attack and defense are horrible, and they have no armor to speak of. The ethereal doesn't seem to do much. Sure, they cause terror, but if they're not flanking with another unit tanking, they're kinda dead against anything.
Vamp count hex wraiths - sort of the same issue as with the cairn wraiths, although their steeds and mobility makes them actually usuable to get in position for flanks. However, they're higher tech but a lot poorer in performance than any other sort of cavalry the vamp counts can field.
Dwarf Slayers - they die. Horribly. 0 armor? Even if they're one of the only anti-large option for Dwarfs, fielding an armored unit of, well, pretty much anything with great weapon is a better idea against large creatures I feel. The greatest problem is not the unit dying either, it's it taking so much losses it slows you down by forcing you to rest or re-recruit.
Am I just using these poorly? Are any of you in love with said units, or do you agree with me that they're kinda hopeless?
I found no use for the Cairn Wraiths and Slayers eithers.
The Hex Wraiths worked fine for me. Seemed to do as good or better then black knights. Donno what I was doing different then you.
A good tip for them is because they are a low HP unit a Invocation on them will restore most of the unit.
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On June 29 2016 07:11 dae wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2016 06:36 plated.rawr wrote:
I'm having a hard time placing a few of the units in the game in terms of usability and value.
Vamp counts cairn wraiths - Their melee attack and defense are horrible, and they have no armor to speak of. The ethereal doesn't seem to do much. Sure, they cause terror, but if they're not flanking with another unit tanking, they're kinda dead against anything.
Vamp count hex wraiths - sort of the same issue as with the cairn wraiths, although their steeds and mobility makes them actually usuable to get in position for flanks. However, they're higher tech but a lot poorer in performance than any other sort of cavalry the vamp counts can field.
Dwarf Slayers - they die. Horribly. 0 armor? Even if they're one of the only anti-large option for Dwarfs, fielding an armored unit of, well, pretty much anything with great weapon is a better idea against large creatures I feel. The greatest problem is not the unit dying either, it's it taking so much losses it slows you down by forcing you to rest or re-recruit.
Am I just using these poorly? Are any of you in love with said units, or do you agree with me that they're kinda hopeless? The cairn wraiths/hex wraiths seem to have no collision with friendly non ghosts- you can stack them on top of other units/charge through your own units.
This is interesting. I'll do some testruns with them as stacked units and see how they work.
Edit: After a couple battle tests, it seems that yes, cairn wraiths can stack on top of friendly units. However, I've so far not had much practical outcomes from it. A stack of Skeleton swordsmen + cairn wraiths gets bogged down by a stack of human swordsmen for ages, so it doesn't really seem to help for much.
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On June 29 2016 06:04 Vivax wrote:
I tried empire on legendary and every neighbour becomes a chaos horde in no time. Took the entire province from the secessionists in a few turns before they start shitting stacks off 1 city like marienburg did shortly after stomping the emperors army + garrison in the western town with 2 and a half stacks.
And yea xDaunt whack a mole is one of the core features of this game. Skaeling coming to raze one of your city then running from your army into the seas is a classic (like in the most northwestern part of the bretonnian territory), which is why it can help to have an army razing their settlements along the coastline.
For some reason, the Chaos and Norscan hordes got bitched pretty badly in my campaign. I know that a good chunk of their forces got wrecked trying to siege Reikland. I'm not entirely sure what happened to the rest. I think that they got whittled down by all of my allies in the Northeast. At least half of the settlements up there were raised, so definitely there was a lot of action in that region. All in all, Chaos was completely wiped out by turn 120 in my game. Kinda anticlimactic. I don't even feel like I really did anything.
Anyway, after Chaos disappeared, I tried to look for an opening towards attacking the Vampire Counts. They have been retardedly strong in my game and were fielding like 5 full stacks plus a couple half stacks. I probably spent 10-15 turns maneuvering around with my two armies and trying to cajole my allies into attacking them. I did finally get a good opening and wiped out two of their armies and sacked a city. But before I exploit it, Top-Knot orks showed up from the South threatening my holdings in Wissenland and Reikland. Shortly thereafter, those Estalian assholes backstabbed me. I have them all fairly well bottled up in Wissenland with one army and some fortified garrisons while my other army has been blitzing through the Southern Bretonnian kingdoms. Of course, the game decided to throw another curveball at me by having Bretonnia proper attack one of my military allies and forcing me to declare war on them. So now it's Turn 153, and I have a shitton of Estalian and Top-Knot armies coming up from the South, Bretonnia is threatening me in the Northwest, and the Vampire Counts are lurking in the East. Oh, and let's not forget the Green Skins, who are damned close to wiping out the Dwarves, at which point I'm sure that they'll be knocking on my door. I still only have two main armies. I have a third half army up in Middenland, whom I've tasked with rebuilding the North so that I can continue expanding my economic base. I'm just now raising a third main army, but it won't be fully online for another 10 turns. Needless to say, I have some work to do.
Oh, and for the record, fuck those ork assassin heroes. Goddamn, they're annoying as shit.
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On June 29 2016 07:23 plated.rawr wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2016 07:11 dae wrote:On June 29 2016 06:36 plated.rawr wrote:
I'm having a hard time placing a few of the units in the game in terms of usability and value.
Vamp counts cairn wraiths - Their melee attack and defense are horrible, and they have no armor to speak of. The ethereal doesn't seem to do much. Sure, they cause terror, but if they're not flanking with another unit tanking, they're kinda dead against anything.
Vamp count hex wraiths - sort of the same issue as with the cairn wraiths, although their steeds and mobility makes them actually usuable to get in position for flanks. However, they're higher tech but a lot poorer in performance than any other sort of cavalry the vamp counts can field.
Dwarf Slayers - they die. Horribly. 0 armor? Even if they're one of the only anti-large option for Dwarfs, fielding an armored unit of, well, pretty much anything with great weapon is a better idea against large creatures I feel. The greatest problem is not the unit dying either, it's it taking so much losses it slows you down by forcing you to rest or re-recruit.
Am I just using these poorly? Are any of you in love with said units, or do you agree with me that they're kinda hopeless? The cairn wraiths/hex wraiths seem to have no collision with friendly non ghosts- you can stack them on top of other units/charge through your own units. This is interesting. I'll do some testruns with them as stacked units and see how they work. Edit: After a couple battle tests, it seems that yes, cairn wraiths can stack on top of friendly units. However, I've so far not had much practical outcomes from it. A stack of Skeleton swordsmen + cairn wraiths gets bogged down by a stack of human swordsmen for ages, so it doesn't really seem to help for much.
they are pretty good coz they heal too fast
multiplayer leaderboards use them a decent amount with invocation overcast
they're getting buffed in update1
also slayers are just bad but they are getting this buff Slayers: lower chance of getting knocked down by splash attacks
On June 29 2016 09:11 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2016 06:04 Vivax wrote:
I tried empire on legendary and every neighbour becomes a chaos horde in no time. Took the entire province from the secessionists in a few turns before they start shitting stacks off 1 city like marienburg did shortly after stomping the emperors army + garrison in the western town with 2 and a half stacks.
And yea xDaunt whack a mole is one of the core features of this game. Skaeling coming to raze one of your city then running from your army into the seas is a classic (like in the most northwestern part of the bretonnian territory), which is why it can help to have an army razing their settlements along the coastline. For some reason, the Chaos and Norscan hordes got bitched pretty badly in my campaign. I know that a good chunk of their forces got wrecked trying to siege Reikland. I'm not entirely sure what happened to the rest. I think that they got whittled down by all of my allies in the Northeast. At least half of the settlements up there were raised, so definitely there was a lot of action in that region. All in all, Chaos was completely wiped out by turn 120 in my game. Kinda anticlimactic. I don't even feel like I really did anything. Anyway, after Chaos disappeared, I tried to look for an opening towards attacking the Vampire Counts. They have been retardedly strong in my game and were fielding like 5 full stacks plus a couple half stacks. I probably spent 10-15 turns maneuvering around with my two armies and trying to cajole my allies into attacking them. I did finally get a good opening and wiped out two of their armies and sacked a city. But before I exploit it, Top-Knot orks showed up from the South threatening my holdings in Wissenland and Reikland. Shortly thereafter, those Estalian assholes backstabbed me. I have them all fairly well bottled up in Wissenland with one army and some fortified garrisons while my other army has been blitzing through the Southern Bretonnian kingdoms. Of course, the game decided to throw another curveball at me by having Bretonnia proper attack one of my military allies and forcing me to declare war on them. So now it's Turn 153, and I have a shitton of Estalian and Top-Knot armies coming up from the South, Bretonnia is threatening me in the Northwest, and the Vampire Counts are lurking in the East. Oh, and let's not forget the Green Skins, who are damned close to wiping out the Dwarves, at which point I'm sure that they'll be knocking on my door. I still only have two main armies. I have a third half army up in Middenland, whom I've tasked with rebuilding the North so that I can continue expanding my economic base. I'm just now raising a third main army, but it won't be fully online for another 10 turns. Needless to say, I have some work to do. Oh, and for the record, fuck those ork assassin heroes. Goddamn, they're annoying as shit.
honestly just get a steam tank doom stack
i had 8 steam tanks 8 demis 2 great swords warrior priest karl franz in my strongest army
legendary empire finished in 150 turns
put all ur income agents (wizards/witchhunters) next to ur richest city hopefully marienburg
and ideally u become military allies and vassalize everyone u can as soon as chaos arrives
dont bother with confederation its bad on vh/legendary
i finished my legendary campaign with only 2 provinces (reikland/marienburg) and 2 cities in the nuln place
also hopefully blood knights wont be better than grail knights
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I wonder what new units they'll add for Dwarfs. I feel like Dwarfs just are not a very dynamic race. On the other hand, I like the design of almost all of their units. The only unit that really becomes obsolete is Dwarfen Warriors (although I know nothing about multiplayer considerations).
Vampires on the other hand feel very dynamic, but several of their units are just clear upgrades. GG replace Skeles/Spears, Vargheists replace fell bats, Horrors replace ghouls.
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On June 30 2016 13:53 Jerubaal wrote:
I wonder what new units they'll add for Dwarfs. I feel like Dwarfs just are not a very dynamic race. On the other hand, I like the design of almost all of their units. The only unit that really becomes obsolete is Dwarfen Warriors (although I know nothing about multiplayer considerations).
Vampires on the other hand feel very dynamic, but several of their units are just clear upgrades. GG replace Skeles/Spears, Vargheists replace fell bats, Horrors replace ghouls.
Most dwarf units are already in the game.
MIssing are Rangers (vanguard troops with crossbows and greatweapons) and Bolt Throwers.
They simply are by nature a very static race.
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Awww, I thought you meant beastmen, as with their ungors and bestigors etc. units. Shame it wasn't that.
I can do without gore, so I'll pass.
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also hopefully blood knights wont be better than grail knights
they should be better they are pretty much grail knights that have become vampires?
They're insanely strong in the tabletop
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Goddamn it, my Empire VH campaign has turned into a total quagmire. Due to the new patch, all of my allies have abandoned me, so I'm fighting a war on 4 fronts basically alone. And what really has done me in was expanding north of Reikland into Middenland after Chaos was wiped out. I figured it would be safe, but noooooooo......
I think I'm just going to start a new campaign. And this time, I swear to Christ that I'm not going to go north of Reikland until after I've conquered all of the Bretonnian kingdoms and the Vampire Counts, such that my borders are secure everywhere but in the South.
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On July 01 2016 06:28 xDaunt wrote:
Goddamn it, my Empire VH campaign has turned into a total quagmire. Due to the new patch, all of my allies have abandoned me, so I'm fighting a war on 4 fronts basically alone. And what really has done me in was expanding north of Reikland into Middenland after Chaos was wiped out. I figured it would be safe, but noooooooo......
I think I'm just going to start a new campaign. And this time, I swear to Christ that I'm not going to go north of Reikland until after I've conquered all of the Bretonnian kingdoms and the Vampire Counts, such that my borders are secure everywhere but in the South.
only conquer marienburg/reikland u do not need any other provinces just make allies with everyone that way its so much easier coz ur allies deal with varg/skaeling and anything else
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On July 01 2016 10:00 ChunderBoy wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2016 06:28 xDaunt wrote:
Goddamn it, my Empire VH campaign has turned into a total quagmire. Due to the new patch, all of my allies have abandoned me, so I'm fighting a war on 4 fronts basically alone. And what really has done me in was expanding north of Reikland into Middenland after Chaos was wiped out. I figured it would be safe, but noooooooo......
I think I'm just going to start a new campaign. And this time, I swear to Christ that I'm not going to go north of Reikland until after I've conquered all of the Bretonnian kingdoms and the Vampire Counts, such that my borders are secure everywhere but in the South. only conquer marienburg/reikland u do not need any other provinces just make allies with everyone that way its so much easier coz ur allies deal with varg/skaeling and anything else
How do you keep the allies after Chaos dies? Everyone started backstabbing me -- most annoyingly those Bretonnian twats.
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How do you kill chaos? Just raze all their shit?
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On July 01 2016 15:23 B.I.G. wrote:
How do you kill chaos? Just raze all their shit?
All you need to do is kill all their armies. Or, in alot of campaigns, sit back and watch the AI do the work for you ^.^.
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You can raze Norscan tribes if you want, but that's not part of the campaign objective.
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On July 01 2016 15:23 B.I.G. wrote:
How do you kill chaos? Just raze all their shit?
The Varg and Skaelig are normal factions with cities in the top north (Norsca) that you need to raze.
The Chaos Warrior faction comes in several waves (how many waves depends on your difficulty).
This also means that you may well need to kill their Legendary lords multiple times (including Archeaon). Once all waves are used up and dead you will get the Age of Peach announcement and they won't bother you anymore.
Tho the Varg and Skaelig will keep on existing until you destroy them like any other faction.
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Finland963 Posts
On June 30 2016 23:47 plated.rawr wrote:Awww, I thought you meant beastmen, as with their ungors and bestigors etc. units. Shame it wasn't that. I can do without gore, so I'll pass.
Beastmen will be added at some point almost certainly. There's been teasers about them.
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Sorry, traveling right now. Are all the new units and balance changes in the game already or are they coming in another patch/DLC?
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EPT
