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Fruscainte
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
4596 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-27 01:47:09
May 27 2013 01:45 GMT
#1581
http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2013/03/21/full-disclosure-microsoft-releases-and-breaks-down-government-requests-for-user-data-the-world-around/

And so the claims of being "paranoid" come full circle.

2.1%

That is the percentage of requests that Microsoft receives from governments that result in the disclosure of what Microsoft calls “customer content,” which it describes by example as for instance “the subject line and body of an email exchanged through Outlook.com; or a picture stored on SkyDrive.” That in mind, the vast majority - 97.9% – of met requests end in the release non-consumer content, which could be a location of residence, or gender of the account holder.

That information still matters, but it is far less rubber-glove than the Feds being able to read through your email and tease out what sort of pornography is your main preference. I almost kid.

For the 2012 calendar year, Microsoft served 1,558 requests that resulted in the disclosure of consumer content, and 56,388 that included the release of non-consumer content.


In 2012, Microsoft did not answer 16.8% of government requests, as they did not have the data in question. Or, as its spreadsheet dictates, 16.8% of requests resulted in “Disclosure of No Customer Data.” If they didn’t have it, they didn’t make it up.

The 1.2% figure is far more interesting, as it represents the percentage of requests that resulted in no information being provided, as the request was, and again I quote, “Rejected for Not Meeting Legal Requirements.” Or in common speak, “No, we aren’t telling you shit about that.”


I dont think this is a company I feel comfortable with putting a camera and microphone permanently recording me in my house. Only 1.2% of the time they denied the government rights to information on users when requested? Keep in mind Microsoft is on the forefront of internet censorship, so it doesn't surprise me they cooperate with the government but Jesus -- they don't even TRY 98.8% of the time to say no.

Man I've been sipping on that haterade today
Zooper31
Profile Joined May 2009
United States5713 Posts
May 27 2013 01:50 GMT
#1582
On May 27 2013 10:45 Fruscainte wrote:
http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2013/03/21/full-disclosure-microsoft-releases-and-breaks-down-government-requests-for-user-data-the-world-around/

And so the claims of being "paranoid" come full circle.

Show nested quote +
2.1%

That is the percentage of requests that Microsoft receives from governments that result in the disclosure of what Microsoft calls “customer content,” which it describes by example as for instance “the subject line and body of an email exchanged through Outlook.com; or a picture stored on SkyDrive.” That in mind, the vast majority - 97.9% – of met requests end in the release non-consumer content, which could be a location of residence, or gender of the account holder.

That information still matters, but it is far less rubber-glove than the Feds being able to read through your email and tease out what sort of pornography is your main preference. I almost kid.

For the 2012 calendar year, Microsoft served 1,558 requests that resulted in the disclosure of consumer content, and 56,388 that included the release of non-consumer content.


Show nested quote +
In 2012, Microsoft did not answer 16.8% of government requests, as they did not have the data in question. Or, as its spreadsheet dictates, 16.8% of requests resulted in “Disclosure of No Customer Data.” If they didn’t have it, they didn’t make it up.

The 1.2% figure is far more interesting, as it represents the percentage of requests that resulted in no information being provided, as the request was, and again I quote, “Rejected for Not Meeting Legal Requirements.” Or in common speak, “No, we aren’t telling you shit about that.”


I dont think this is a company I feel comfortable with putting a camera and microphone permanently recording me in my house. Only 1.2% of the time they denied the government rights to information on users when requested? Keep in mind Microsoft is on the forefront of internet censorship, so it doesn't surprise me they cooperate with the government but Jesus -- they don't even TRY 98.8% of the time to say no.

Man I've been sipping on that haterade today


To be fair theres a difference between what the results are and what happened before then. They could've said no to 100% of requests but then warrants/public safety and any other reason you can think of pursuaded them otherwise and therefore only 1.2% of the time actually resulted in them giving no information at all. You could think of it being 1.2% of the time the government wanted to break the law and Microsoft stopped them lol.
Asato ma sad gamaya, tamaso ma jyotir gamaya, mrtyor mamrtam gamaya
TheRabidDeer
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
United States3806 Posts
May 27 2013 03:15 GMT
#1583
http://www.vg247.com/2013/05/27/we-arent-using-kinect-to-snoop-says-harrison/
Kinect wont snoop unless you opt in. What defines "opting in" is up in the air until we see what kind of agreements we have to sign to use it and some features.

The fact that they are aware of it and make it an "opt in" feature just seems odd. Somebody can tinfoil hat like crazy.
Ryder.
Profile Joined January 2011
1117 Posts
May 27 2013 03:52 GMT
#1584
On May 26 2013 10:38 Blisse wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2013 06:29 TheRabidDeer wrote:
Basically, everybody that is familiar with technology (us) hates it and anybody that is a bit more "mainstream" thinks it looks amazing.


No, this is what people say to think that they think they're better than others.

The voice recognition and tracking is really cool and interesting, and it's cool that Microsoft is the one stepping up to push this kind of technology forward because they already have a really good platform to try out these "innovations", rather than having a random company show up in the next couple years to do this exact thing that Microsoft is trying out now.

I don't mind the Kinect if I can just turn it around and have it face the floor - not sure if that's been mentioned yet.


Show nested quote +
On May 26 2013 10:28 Ryder. wrote:
Jeez what happened to the days you could just buy a game, plug it in and play and it ended there...


What happened to the days where your phone only called people? What happened to the day where your computer was only used for computing numbers? This is attempting to move forward technology. And attempting is better than not, I would guess.

No, if the system forces itself down your throat and disallows you to turn it off so it can invade upon your privacy then this isn't a beneficial 'forward' move. Progression in itself isn't necessarily beneficial...
mahnini
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
United States6862 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-27 05:31:59
May 27 2013 05:29 GMT
#1585
nevermind
the world's a playground. you know that when you're a kid, but somewhere along the way everyone forgets it.
nam nam
Profile Joined June 2010
Sweden4672 Posts
May 27 2013 08:29 GMT
#1586
Since when is voice and motion control "innovative?"
Arevall
Profile Joined February 2010
Sweden1133 Posts
May 27 2013 08:59 GMT
#1587
On May 27 2013 17:29 nam nam wrote:
Since when is voice and motion control "innovative?"


Since a few years ago.

But employing voice and motion control on a larger scale actually is innovative.
nimdil
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Poland3772 Posts
May 27 2013 10:53 GMT
#1588
I just wonder why would anyone except exlusive titles fanboys bother to buy Xbox One. PS4 appears to be be much more efficient system but unlike in the previous generation it will have very similar architecture. Overall the games available on both should be superior on PS4. Kinect also shouldn't be that relevant factors as there are indications that PS4 will have similar capabilities.

Weird ideas from MS for Xbox One sounds alarming, Sony always seemed to be more relaxed company.
freelander
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Hungary4707 Posts
May 27 2013 11:14 GMT
#1589
On May 27 2013 19:53 nimdil wrote:
Sony always seemed to be more relaxed company.


yea especially when it's about storing customer's data
And all is illuminated.
Blisse
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada3710 Posts
May 27 2013 11:56 GMT
#1590
On May 27 2013 08:39 mahnini wrote:
imagine yourself (if you will) group chatting with your teammates on your over skype while discussing and organizing tonight's upcoming match. now, imagine you are doing this during lunch on your mobile phone and regardless of where your teammates are they get the message and are able to respond. at the same time, you are able to contact the opposing team's leader and confirm a time. once that's done you setup a calendar appointment and setup reminders for each of your teammates (there's nothing worse than teammates late for a match!)

the day's over, you hop in your car which happens to have bluetooth hands free integration. traffic is moving a little slower than usual today. you skype call your go-to-guy and inform him that you may be a little late and he should try to round up everyone because you won't be home in time to do it yourself like you normally do.

half an hour later, you hit your front door, yell "XBOX ON" as you step inside and shed your backpack, bag, or what have you. you play out your match and win. it was pretty fun.

you think there could've been improvement though, not that anyone in particular played badly (except gary; gary always plays badly), so you organize a skype video chat with everyone while sharing the replay. long after the replay is over and constructive criticism has been dispensed while shooting the shit, you receive a notification that the season finale of your favorite show is on in 30 mins.

you say your goodbyes and do some chores (like eating and junk like that) before streaming favorite show on your computer over the network via your xbox whilst checking your emails. it was a good episode. your post on facebook got 8 likes.

you're a little tired but not quite ready for bed so you grab your tablet and watch some local news (again streaming from your xbox) in bed before finally turning in.

from a gaming perspective the xbox one is kind of a let down (if you can even say that -- since really its gaming capabilities are yet unproven). but from a business and user perspective, the convergence of all your electronic devices and the ability to create a persistent and seamless user experience is unimaginably awesome. not only does it give microsoft a ubiquitous presence in your home, but it effectively usurps google's search dominance by introducing an additional layer (for lack of a better word) before you hit the browser, and has the potential to build a far more cohesive ecosystem than android.

desktop, phone, xbox, tablet all running windows? no problem, we'll make sharing apps, storage, contacts, EVERYTHING extremely convenient. it all depends on microsoft's execution, but it would be pretty amazing if they pull this off correctly.


This sounds really cool, if they can pull it off.

Right now I'm really happy with how integrating my Live account on Windows 8 lets me skip logging in for a lot of places - automatic authentication. So stuff like Visual Studio automatically detects I have a .edu account and doesn't need to pester me for authentication. Other stuff like automatic Hotmail sign-in that I don't really even pay attention to. Of course there's drawbacks and you really have to be wary of your own privacy, but having this stuff that just pulls everything together into one is pretty neat, and Microsoft is probably the only one with the ability to do that because of the Windows and Xbox ecosystems. Google has to pull in so many services, bring Android to TVs, Google TV, and Apple has to create its own hardware to also do the same, except without games. When and if they work out the kinks, I hate to sound like an ad, but it's really something that will try to change how you interact with all your technology.
There is no one like you in the universe.
Skilledblob
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany3392 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-27 12:47:20
May 27 2013 12:46 GMT
#1591
well I guess if you have Windows 8 allready you probably wont mind the Xbone either. I always like to play "who's a sales rep in this thread" when I read the comments. So far it's fairly entertaining
Zocat
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany2229 Posts
May 27 2013 13:13 GMT
#1592
On May 27 2013 10:45 Fruscainte wrote:
http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2013/03/21/full-disclosure-microsoft-releases-and-breaks-down-government-requests-for-user-data-the-world-around/

And so the claims of being "paranoid" come full circle.

Show nested quote +
2.1%

That is the percentage of requests that Microsoft receives from governments that result in the disclosure of what Microsoft calls “customer content,” which it describes by example as for instance “the subject line and body of an email exchanged through Outlook.com; or a picture stored on SkyDrive.” That in mind, the vast majority - 97.9% – of met requests end in the release non-consumer content, which could be a location of residence, or gender of the account holder.

That information still matters, but it is far less rubber-glove than the Feds being able to read through your email and tease out what sort of pornography is your main preference. I almost kid.

For the 2012 calendar year, Microsoft served 1,558 requests that resulted in the disclosure of consumer content, and 56,388 that included the release of non-consumer content.


Show nested quote +
In 2012, Microsoft did not answer 16.8% of government requests, as they did not have the data in question. Or, as its spreadsheet dictates, 16.8% of requests resulted in “Disclosure of No Customer Data.” If they didn’t have it, they didn’t make it up.

The 1.2% figure is far more interesting, as it represents the percentage of requests that resulted in no information being provided, as the request was, and again I quote, “Rejected for Not Meeting Legal Requirements.” Or in common speak, “No, we aren’t telling you shit about that.”


I dont think this is a company I feel comfortable with putting a camera and microphone permanently recording me in my house. Only 1.2% of the time they denied the government rights to information on users when requested? Keep in mind Microsoft is on the forefront of internet censorship, so it doesn't surprise me they cooperate with the government but Jesus -- they don't even TRY 98.8% of the time to say no.

Man I've been sipping on that haterade today


Yeah, and I hope that everyone stops using Skype as a result.
They even click on your links (with your login data).

Oh and a bit offtopic, did you read your report? Those evil Chinese had 6 requests and those evil Russians 2! While our freedom loving USA has over 1100, Germany over 600 and UK also over 1000
Arevall
Profile Joined February 2010
Sweden1133 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-27 13:50:06
May 27 2013 13:48 GMT
#1593
According to Digital Trends the Xbox One will be region locked as well.

Original source: Microsoft answers the question of Xbox One region locks
Vardant
Profile Joined November 2010
Czech Republic620 Posts
May 27 2013 13:53 GMT
#1594
X360 was region locked too, so that's not surprising.

However, what is funny is his reasoning -
“Similar to the movie and music industry, games must meet country-specific regulatory guidelines before they are cleared for sale”

considering, that PS3 is not region locked and one would think, they have to meet the same guidelines for their games.
dcemuser
Profile Joined August 2010
United States3248 Posts
May 27 2013 14:16 GMT
#1595
On May 26 2013 02:48 AnomalySC2 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2013 02:18 s3rp wrote:
On May 26 2013 02:08 AnomalySC2 wrote:
On May 26 2013 01:58 Rollin wrote:
On May 26 2013 01:20 Saumure wrote:
As an engineer, I am pretty happy they made a new kinect, hoping it will be at least as or more awesome than the first one

I've had some university colleagues working on some very cool kinect projects. If it's truly "so much better" as they say it will be really cool to see what happens!


You can't possibly be serious. How could anyone be positive about the kinect-voyeur-cam.


I do think Kinect can be used for cool things ( was even shown) . If and thats a big if it wasn't directly connected to a machine that needs to check-in to a company server every 24hours and sends collected Data to it that the company can directly sell or flat out give to just about anyone they wish.






Yeah that's kind of how I look at it. It's impressive tech but the privacy issues are beyond absurd. Can't believe MS are even trying to go down that path.


Said the opponents of the radio, the telephone, photographs, film, television, computers, the internet, cell phones, and basically anything done past the invention of the wheel.

In this case, as usual, the privacy issues are concerns of people who have no clue how technology works.

A) Everyone and their mother and their mother's server admin is going to notice if Xbox One transmits absolute fucktons of data back to Microsoft for normal Kinect usage.
B) Seriously, people propose that Microsoft is going to analyze hundreds of thousands of gamers each with hours upon hours of video/microphone/real-life telemetry per week. The processing power, data storage, and internet requirements do not EXIST to handle that much data in one place. Twitch is a professional service that serves less than a million simultaneous users on probably less than 2000-3000 streams at once and can't hold its servers stable and people are suggesting that this is possible? If Microsoft could pull anything even close to what is being suggested, we should just hand them the keys to planet Earth and say "go crazy".

If we were living in 2150, you'd have a point. I'd be agreeing and nodding my head. In 2013, the people making these 'privacy concern' arguments look crazy. Seriously. You might as well make the argument that your cell phone is recording all of your calls because it's a vastly more valid argument than the Kinect 2.0 one.
FromShouri
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
United States862 Posts
May 27 2013 14:28 GMT
#1596
Ya the post above me is literally so full of shit i seriously cant comprehend how retarded the poster would have to be to spew such non sense. Its a slippery slope and if you knew how actual technology surveillance worked instead of basically equating all of us to "people who dont understand how technology works". I mean seriously thats as bad as that other idiot earlier saying anyone who didnt agree was an iphone bro.

Skype already records all your messages and visits the links you send, outlook has a built in back door they can use to spy on you with, and now your game console can be used to gather evidence against you. You say youve nothing to hide? Good why not let someone record all your conversations and actions, im sure theyll find something.
Limited Edition, lets do some simple addition, $50 for a T-Shirt is just some ignorant bitch shit.
gosublade
Profile Joined May 2011
632 Posts
May 27 2013 14:37 GMT
#1597
I hope the sales plummit. tv, tv, tv.. tv, tv,.. sports, sports, sports... sports, sports.. i wanna play games if i buy one and not watch tv and sports.
Not even death can save you from me.
Fruscainte
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
4596 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-27 14:49:58
May 27 2013 14:46 GMT
#1598
On May 27 2013 23:16 dcemuser wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2013 02:48 AnomalySC2 wrote:
On May 26 2013 02:18 s3rp wrote:
On May 26 2013 02:08 AnomalySC2 wrote:
On May 26 2013 01:58 Rollin wrote:
On May 26 2013 01:20 Saumure wrote:
As an engineer, I am pretty happy they made a new kinect, hoping it will be at least as or more awesome than the first one

I've had some university colleagues working on some very cool kinect projects. If it's truly "so much better" as they say it will be really cool to see what happens!


You can't possibly be serious. How could anyone be positive about the kinect-voyeur-cam.


I do think Kinect can be used for cool things ( was even shown) . If and thats a big if it wasn't directly connected to a machine that needs to check-in to a company server every 24hours and sends collected Data to it that the company can directly sell or flat out give to just about anyone they wish.






Yeah that's kind of how I look at it. It's impressive tech but the privacy issues are beyond absurd. Can't believe MS are even trying to go down that path.


Said the opponents of the radio, the telephone, photographs, film, television, computers, the internet, cell phones, and basically anything done past the invention of the wheel.

In this case, as usual, the privacy issues are concerns of people who have no clue how technology works.

A) Everyone and their mother and their mother's server admin is going to notice if Xbox One transmits absolute fucktons of data back to Microsoft for normal Kinect usage.
B) Seriously, people propose that Microsoft is going to analyze hundreds of thousands of gamers each with hours upon hours of video/microphone/real-life telemetry per week. The processing power, data storage, and internet requirements do not EXIST to handle that much data in one place. Twitch is a professional service that serves less than a million simultaneous users on probably less than 2000-3000 streams at once and can't hold its servers stable and people are suggesting that this is possible? If Microsoft could pull anything even close to what is being suggested, we should just hand them the keys to planet Earth and say "go crazy".

If we were living in 2150, you'd have a point. I'd be agreeing and nodding my head. In 2013, the people making these 'privacy concern' arguments look crazy. Seriously. You might as well make the argument that your cell phone is recording all of your calls because it's a vastly more valid argument than the Kinect 2.0 one.


Yeah it's not like the government is doing ANYTHING in 2013 that would be concerning to the privacy of citizens or that may be infringing on the rights of certain citizens who disagree with government policy.

Oh wait.

P.S. - It's not the fact the government might get the info. It's not the fact that Microsoft might never look at the information it takes of me directly. It's the fact that people seem to think it's okay for a private company to record their day to day lives 24/7 365 days a year and to be able to sell that data to other companies without your consent for ad data. What's different about 2150 to 2013? People are still greedy in both times and people in both years will want more power. It's that simple, I just don't feel comfortable letting a corporation that already sells personal information of its users for ad data put a camera and microphone in my house. And stop assuming this requires someone to sit in front of a computer screen watching your life 24/7. This is the 21st century, computers can analyze and compress this data gathered automatically.
Whitewing
Profile Joined October 2010
United States7483 Posts
May 27 2013 16:37 GMT
#1599
I'm starting to think that out of all the sci-fi futures we might be heading towards, Shadowrun might be the most accurate.

Scary thought.

I won't be purchasing an X-Box One unless the online requirement is lifted, and the kinect recording nonsense is gone. I don't mind the used games restriction all that much tbh, it makes sense from a business perspective and it isn't exactly denying me rights.
Strategy"You know I fucking hate the way you play, right?" ~SC2John
ELESSAR
Profile Joined July 2009
Bulgaria173 Posts
May 27 2013 16:46 GMT
#1600
On May 27 2013 23:16 dcemuser wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2013 02:48 AnomalySC2 wrote:
On May 26 2013 02:18 s3rp wrote:
On May 26 2013 02:08 AnomalySC2 wrote:
On May 26 2013 01:58 Rollin wrote:
On May 26 2013 01:20 Saumure wrote:
As an engineer, I am pretty happy they made a new kinect, hoping it will be at least as or more awesome than the first one

I've had some university colleagues working on some very cool kinect projects. If it's truly "so much better" as they say it will be really cool to see what happens!


You can't possibly be serious. How could anyone be positive about the kinect-voyeur-cam.


I do think Kinect can be used for cool things ( was even shown) . If and thats a big if it wasn't directly connected to a machine that needs to check-in to a company server every 24hours and sends collected Data to it that the company can directly sell or flat out give to just about anyone they wish.






Yeah that's kind of how I look at it. It's impressive tech but the privacy issues are beyond absurd. Can't believe MS are even trying to go down that path.


Said the opponents of the radio, the telephone, photographs, film, television, computers, the internet, cell phones, and basically anything done past the invention of the wheel.

In this case, as usual, the privacy issues are concerns of people who have no clue how technology works.

A) Everyone and their mother and their mother's server admin is going to notice if Xbox One transmits absolute fucktons of data back to Microsoft for normal Kinect usage.
B) Seriously, people propose that Microsoft is going to analyze hundreds of thousands of gamers each with hours upon hours of video/microphone/real-life telemetry per week. The processing power, data storage, and internet requirements do not EXIST to handle that much data in one place. Twitch is a professional service that serves less than a million simultaneous users on probably less than 2000-3000 streams at once and can't hold its servers stable and people are suggesting that this is possible? If Microsoft could pull anything even close to what is being suggested, we should just hand them the keys to planet Earth and say "go crazy".

If we were living in 2150, you'd have a point. I'd be agreeing and nodding my head. In 2013, the people making these 'privacy concern' arguments look crazy. Seriously. You might as well make the argument that your cell phone is recording all of your calls because it's a vastly more valid argument than the Kinect 2.0 one.


It doesn't need to analyse the data or even store it. The hypothetical problem is not that they will track everyone but that if they want to track you specifically for some reason they can.
I am peaty sure that for an admin you streaming and kinect streaming on its own will look absolutely the same not to mention that admins don't watch all the traffic coming from all computers on the network. As far as I understand the idea behind the new XBox there is going to be enough traffic coming from it even if it doesn't do anything wrong and if it is using a VPN the admins of your internet providers won't be able to see what exactly is being send which is exactly what VPNs are used for.
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