EPTTL Chess Match 4 - Page 117
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docvoc
United States5491 Posts
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Ng5
702 Posts
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jdseemoreglass
United States3773 Posts
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Ng5
702 Posts
c6 wasn't good aside from holding a draw where I have no chance of winning ever, unless you don't realize you have no real plan and mess up hugely. And I don't know what else. c5 is tempting but pretty bad right here and every other move would not do anything. Well yes, not to mention Reb8 loses instantly. | ||
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Archers_bane
United States1338 Posts
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Raysalis
Malaysia1034 Posts
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qrs
United States3637 Posts
On November 15 2011 16:21 Ng5 wrote: Yes, those were the three (not Reb8)."OK, no big surprise: this was one of the three moves we were expecting." c6 wasn't good aside from holding a draw where I have no chance of winning ever, unless you don't realize you have no real plan and mess up hugely. And I don't know what else. c5 is tempting but pretty bad right here and every other move would not do anything. Well yes, not to mention Reb8 loses instantly. I think we're coming at this game from slightly different points of view: i.e. you're treating a draw as something you want to avoid, while I've been considering it something you should be happy to come away with. | ||
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Ng5
702 Posts
I've been taking notes on what to tell you during the post game analysis for a very long time now. I think when it's over I'll take out a Saturday and do at least a six-hour analysis on my stream. If I ever actually get back to streaming. After all the fuss it seems impossible sometimes. | ||
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drevil69
64 Posts
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Ng5
702 Posts
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chesshaha
United States1117 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + I'm voting the same move as last time, this time looks like this move will win... | ||
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qrs
United States3637 Posts
On November 15 2011 21:27 Ng5 wrote: If you do the post-game analysis on your stream, please record it!I've been taking notes on what to tell you during the post game analysis for a very long time now. I think when it's over I'll take out a Saturday and do at least a six-hour analysis on my stream. If I ever actually get back to streaming. On November 15 2011 22:31 chesshaha wrote: It's a better move this time (imho).I'm voting the same move as last time, this time looks like this move will win... | ||
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SheaR619
United States2399 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + Black will end up giving up that position. He cant do Bd3 because we can follow it up by doing Ne1 which basically win us a free bishop. This mean his only logical response is to retreat. This will basically force black to retreat and play defensively again or go for the a5 pawn instead which I think he is going to do next. | ||
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qrs
United States3637 Posts
On November 16 2011 00:12 SheaR619 wrote: I disagree: I think Black will play one of three moves, none of which are the one that you mention.22. Re3 + Show Spoiler + Black will end up giving up that position. He cant do Bd3 because we can follow it up by doing Ne1 which basically win us a free bishop. This mean his only logical response is to retreat. This will basically force black to retreat and play defensively again or go for the a5 pawn instead which I think he is going to do next. + Show Spoiler + His most likely move, imo, is 22...Rxd3, but he could also play 22...Rcb8 or 22...Rd3. If Black gives up the position, as you suggest, Re1 is a strong move for us (prefaced by 23. a4 if Black plays 22...Rb5). For that reason, I think that Black will play one of the three above moves. See 22. Re3 on the tree for more analysis. edit: actually, maybe your move works out for Black too... looking at it some more... PS: I miss everyone posting analysis.  . I'm doing what I can myself, but my analysis abilities pale in comparison to those of the team as a whole. Come back, guys!edit 2: OK, I added SheaR's suggestion to the tree, here. It looks like it has potential to be an interesting line. I kind of hope Black will go down it, as the other suggested continuations tend to lead to simplification. I think we have strong chances if he does, so I'm afraid he probably won't, but who knows the mind of Ng5? | ||
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ffreakk
Singapore2155 Posts
22. Re3 as well | ||
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qrs
United States3637 Posts
Assuming that we play 22. Re3, which seems likely (not to mention that I can't come up with a move I like better), the Black response that I'm most concerned about is this one. We only have a couple of reasonable-looking responses to that--and unless I've mis-assessed it, the first of these actually allows Black to take control of the game. You can help by a) confirming that this first option is bad and/or b) seeing if the other option(s) is(/are) any better. Much thanks to anyone who takes this up! | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25560 Posts
22. Abstain EDIT: PS: Ok so I'll bite. I don't particularly dislike 22. Re3 Rxe3 23. fxe3 + Show Spoiler + the reason I don't dislike it is our chief threat is the C pawn-- we have only one islanded pawn to fight it with. by bringing the f pawn over the the e file, we un-island our pawns, and I remain confident that our g and h pawns can handle the situations on f and h. By bringing a pawn guard up on our d pawn things we give our knight mobility, which is important since he has a white bishop. It's currently very worrisome that he can at some point play Bd3, but this problem basically won't go away since our pawns are past that point. Our ability to contest him on white squares is weak because of the bishop situation, unless we use our knight, who is a baller. What I really really really don't like is how it gets our bishop trapped on the right side. And that in the short term he can still do some sort of bishop move to get onto d3. I'm unclear on what to do here. | ||
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hp.Shell
United States2527 Posts
22. Re3 Edit: Blazinghand:+ Show Spoiler + I don't see why Bd3 is a problem for us. Care to explain? | ||
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qrs
United States3637 Posts
On November 16 2011 04:41 hp.Shell wrote: Careful with the assumptions.... ...Rc8 has proven that black does not wish to trade material in the present position. 21. Bf4 created a situation where, if Black moved his e7 Bishop, RxR KxR would leave White free to capture an important pawn (much more important than the a3 pawn) with Bxc7. Understandably, Black would not want to allow that particular trade in that particular position. I don't think we can extrapolate anything more. @Blazinghand: imho, we should put future moves that we're considering into spoilers in this thread. | ||
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hp.Shell
United States2527 Posts
On November 16 2011 05:18 qrs wrote: Careful with the assumptions.... 21. Bf4 created a situation where, if Black moved his e7 Bishop, RxR KxR would leave White free to capture an important pawn (much more important than the a3 pawn) with Bxc7. Understandably, Black would not want to allow that particular trade in that particular position. I don't think we can extrapolate anything more. @Blazinghand: imho, we should put future moves that we're considering into spoilers in this thread. True. Still good to keep black making awkward moves. If he does decide to trade material it's to our advantage. | ||
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