EPTI've seen successful high elo Tarics with Chalice, but I think the item is garbage. As Southlight has explained many times before, the reason why high elo builds are the way they are is frequently because the decisive fights of the game frequently occur on just 1 2-3K item after boots. And in that light, you have to weight SS-only Taric vs. GA-only Taric, which frankly, isn't even close because at that point in the game GA-only Taric is essentially impossible to kill, while SS-only Taric is providing a bunch of auras that may or may not actually have a serious impact on the fight.
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
I've seen successful high elo Tarics with Chalice, but I think the item is garbage. As Southlight has explained many times before, the reason why high elo builds are the way they are is frequently because the decisive fights of the game frequently occur on just 1 2-3K item after boots. And in that light, you have to weight SS-only Taric vs. GA-only Taric, which frankly, isn't even close because at that point in the game GA-only Taric is essentially impossible to kill, while SS-only Taric is providing a bunch of auras that may or may not actually have a serious impact on the fight. | ||
r33k
Italy3402 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:12 STS17 wrote: Just looked at a guide for Kayle because I was bored. It suggested this for harassing during the laning phase: Here is a quick guide of what to do in common laning scenarios: -An enemy champion is going in for a last hit => Reckoning -An enemy champion is about to attack you or an ally => Reckoning -An enemy champion just popped out of the bushes => Reckoning -An enemy champion is about to attack your turret => Reckoning -An enemy champion is running away in fear of Reckoning => Reckoning -An enemy champion hasn't been hit by Reckoning recently, and has forgotten what it looks like => remind him with a Reckoning -An enemy champion is low on health, and is therefore asking you to kill him => Reckoning - Reckoning is on cooldown => Reck...crap Confirm/Deny oh great, a guide suggesting that you ignore farming with Kayle and instead spend every last point of mana on an OK nuke. I dunno, this might be what you should do in like, a two man lane with someone else who needs to farm more than you (...there really isn't anyone I can think of for this, lol). common laning scenarios: - opponent does anything that doesn't hurt your feelings => turn on E and last hit every creep - opponent does something that hurts your feelings => cast W on yourself, turn on E, last hit every creep I mean, really, I just rice with kayle up until Rageblade and Zerker Greaves, at which point, laning is over and I'll now either grab red buff and teamfight or just solo push side lanes. EDIT: they have to be either really squishy or really stupid to make me honestly wanna spend mana on Rockoning during laning. | ||
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SBelmont
United States122 Posts
![[image loading]](http://a.imageshack.us/img22/807/udyr.jpg) | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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deth2munkies
United States4051 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:27 Southlight wrote: Taric re-gains mana basically infinitely and at one of the fastest paces by simply autoattacking. Thus the only way Taric loses a lane is if he's forced off of creep - once it happens it's hard for Taric to re-gain lane control. On the flip side if you stack armor runes you end up with something like 140 armor at level 1, which makes you go LOLOLOL at all the autoattack shit anyone can do, and spell damage isn't high enough early to push you off. And it doesn't matter because some little shit bans him every game anyway  | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:29 Mogwai wrote: ^ I'll believe that when I see it -_-. Until then meh, I'm not gonna spend money on Armor Runes :p. You don't even play tanks. Go away. Edit: According to korea angel it's also fantastic on Amumu. | ||
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oberon
United States1320 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:20 Mogwai wrote: oh great, a guide suggesting that you ignore farming with Kayle and instead spend every last point of mana on an OK nuke. I dunno, this might be what you should do in like, a two man lane with someone else who needs to farm more than you (...there really isn't anyone I can think of for this, lol). common laning scenarios: - opponent does anything that doesn't hurt your feelings => turn on E and last hit every creep - opponent does something that hurts your feelings => cast W on yourself, turn on E, last hit every creep I mean, really, I just rice with kayle up until Rageblade and Zerker Greaves, at which point, laning is over and I'll now either grab red buff and teamfight or just solo push side lanes. EDIT: they have to be either really squishy or really stupid to make me honestly wanna spend mana on Rockoning during laning. This is basically my strategy when the lane is even or hard. When I have an easy lane, I'll go Q->E->Q and try to set up kills with my partner. Knowing when to do each of those is, I think, pretty important in being a good Kayle (I'm currently pretty bad at it, honestly). The penalty for choosing "heal/rice" when you should choose "slow/smash" is much less than the other way, however -- you end up missing some free kills, instead of coming out of the lane underfarmed. | ||
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SCC-Faust
United States3736 Posts
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:30 Southlight wrote: You don't even play tanks. Go away. Edit: According to korea angel it's also fantastic on Amumu. and that's not entirely true, I do play tanks, I just don't play them particularly well :p. I can still play a passable Taric or Amumu at my elo, I just don't specialize in it at all. is it Armor/level, flat Armors, or a mix btw? | ||
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oberon
United States1320 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:38 Southlight wrote: At least one point in Reckoning is great for the amplify damage effect, IMO. Agreed. When aiming to farm, I go EWWQWR. The thing about reckoning is that, while it's pretty good, it's not mana efficient for harass. You really need to be landing it, then whacking them with E, a few times, and either killing or zoning them. Otherwise, you're just taking off 20%-40% of someone's health -- and costing yourself valuable mana. | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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Orpheos
United States1663 Posts
edit* and i usually dont have mana problems with kayle. either im in a hard lane and im sitting back using E for lasthitting. or im being aggressive with a strong lane and just using autoattacks to last hit. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:38 Southlight wrote: At least one point in Reckoning is great for the amplify damage effect, IMO. oh, and to address this, even though I hardly use it during laning, I've start leveling reckoning the fastest now, usually with EWQQQRQWQ or something for first nine levels, only deviating vs. strong harass to level my W faster. I mean, it's still your best killing tool, I just happen to be of the opinion that having a consistently high cs throughout laning is way more important than actually going for kills with Kayle. Like if you ever find yourself past 20 minutes without a rageblade, you're doin' it wrong. EDIT: Kayle is stupid and OP, you can really level her abilities however you want after you get the first point in all of them. they all start strong and have mediocre scaling. | ||
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oberon
United States1320 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:42 Orpheos wrote: i always get E first for lasthitting and harassing. but Q harass is really good if you have a strong lane partner. otherwise just keep farming with E. and healing with W. i still like to max Q really early cause its a nice nuke to have in the midgame. Well, given that every point in E but the first is useless, you're going to be maxing Q and W pretty early no matter what... | ||
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Orpheos
United States1663 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:44 oberon wrote: Well, given that every point in E but the first is useless, you're going to be maxing Q and W pretty early no matter what... youd be surprised the amount of people who dont know this. and mogwais build is pretty much the same as the one i do. | ||
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Niton
United States2395 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:42 Southlight wrote: Flat armor, AFAIK, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was a mix on anything other than Taric. For Taric you tend to see flat because of that level 1 crazy armor stupid cheese crap -_- lolol Tower does nothing to me! stupid thing... Can you elaborate on that? It sounds interesting, but I have no clue what you're referring to o.O | ||
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Orpheos
United States1663 Posts
On August 04 2010 23:46 Niton wrote: Can you elaborate on that? It sounds interesting, but I have no clue what you're referring to o.O i think the point is to get a full page of flat armor runes so at level one you have a stupid amount of armor that lets you shrug off all lane harassing especially with heals and being able to freely hit the minions for mana and CD on imbue. | ||
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