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Anime Discussion Thread - Page 419

Forum Index > Media & Entertainment
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If you come in here looking for "anime recommendations" then please refer to this chart before posting: Anime Recommendations (as of may 2014). We also have an IRC channel called #tladt where we all hang out. The channel is on Rizon, not QuakeNet! Feel free to check it out. TLADT discord is Discord.gg

For currently airing anime, please see Anichart.net
Lucumo
Profile Joined January 2010
6850 Posts
October 07 2010 03:17 GMT
#8361
+ Show Spoiler +
In the translated version he says:

"Ku-------fool. Does it not know Servants cannot become the core...?!"

That "it" seems to refer to the Holy Grail and "fool" to either the Holy Grail or Shirou who just got caught with the chain(+they were fighting some seconds ago, so why not call him that).

Hm, maybe the translators had the same problem and just made it easier for themselves(and for us).
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-07 03:29:48
October 07 2010 03:21 GMT
#8362
dekisokonai almost literally means "that which was not properly made/completed"
and the big sticking point is "onaji" which is "the same" hence my "another servant"
@drone:
By means of using "dekisokonai" the absolute of pointing toward
+ Show Spoiler +
the grail

is minimized. I'm not sure. Maybe it was just a poor sentence by Nasu. You can't ever factor out bad writing ;/

Anyways yeah it seems like the translator there took out some nuances. Go figure.

Edit:
No matter what, the fundamental question behind that sentence is
+ Show Spoiler +
how much Gilgamesh actually knows about the Grail. Now, as opposed to most other heroes I think he's "in the know" given that he was there when the Grail leaked at the end of Fate/Zero and he's constantly reminded of its effects and, to an extent, its corruption. To that end he knows about how it's "not right," so you could say "that incomplete thing" could and probably does still point toward the Grail.

The question then moves towards why he used "another servant" which implies that that which he spoke to is also a servant. When the Grail corrupted him, did he feel Avenger's presence? I don't think there's a lot of evidence backing that up, however when you consider that corruption by the Grail messed with his psyche (he became a lot more psychotic afterward) and combine that with the actions of Avenger during ataraxia, you might end up with the lump sum of Gilgamesh being like 90% Gilgamesh 10% Avenger, or at least knowing/feeling the presence of Avenger. To that end this sentence might be the single line in all of the Fate/ series to hint at it. I'm not really sure.

Curious, eh?


Edit2:
LEMME GO BACK TO WRITING MY ESSAY IN PEACE
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
dronebabo
Profile Blog Joined December 2003
10866 Posts
October 07 2010 03:36 GMT
#8363
--- Nuked ---
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-07 03:39:40
October 07 2010 03:38 GMT
#8364
+ Show Spoiler +
He attempted to construct a Grail by infusing using Shinji as a vessel. Thus, the failed combination of Shinji + Grail could be referred to as a dekisokonai. That said I went back in my edit and pointed out that it could also be the Grail based on his understanding of the current status of the Grail itself. Tough to say, I was just saying it wasn't necessarily 100% the Grail due to the word choice.


Alternatively
+ Show Spoiler +
Given his narcissistic ass he could also just be randomly trash-talking something as a dekisokonai the same way he calls everyone 雑種 (mongrel). Oh the ambiguity.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
dronebabo
Profile Blog Joined December 2003
10866 Posts
October 07 2010 03:41 GMT
#8365
--- Nuked ---
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-07 03:50:50
October 07 2010 03:48 GMT
#8366
Heehee

+ Show Spoiler +
I don't know if you'll ever get a straight-out answer. At the end of Fate/Zero Kiritsugu forces Saber to destroy the Grail, but IIRC unfortunately by destroying the Vessel the corrupted Grail leaks and roasts a huge chunk of the city (aka what happened to Shirou). Kiritsugu and Kirei were fighting in the leaked mud, and Kiritsugu was supposed to have slain Kirei, but "Avenger" ends up raging about the "messed up" Grail and does several things.
1) He revives Kirei
2) He curses Kiritsugu
3) He corrupts Gilgamesh
With regards to 2, he corrupts Kiritsugu to die a painful, agonizing death, and this occurs in a number of ways, including the busting of his magic circuits that prevents him from breaching the Einzbern territory to rescue his daughter (Ilya), and eventually the failure of various parts of his body (limbs, eyes, then death).
3, he corrupts Gilgamesh such that instead of being retrieved by the Grail his being is twisted into a physical manifestation, and at this juncture he starts becoming a lot more psychotic (he was filled with jealous in War 4/zero but he wasn't batshit crazy like in 5/stay night).

More mind-fuck to chew on :D


*casts summon Ecael*
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
NB
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Netherlands12045 Posts
October 07 2010 05:19 GMT
#8367
the page b4 the last page of bleach makes me think of Kaichou wa maid-sama T__T... why the characters are so similar :<

i am having trouble in finding a good website that update anime Fall season on mediafire T_T
i can torrent but i cant do that forever so mediafire is a must for me... help pls :<
Im daed. Follow me @TL_NB
Ecael
Profile Joined February 2008
United States6703 Posts
October 07 2010 05:33 GMT
#8368
Isn't 2 not exactly anyone's doing as it is simply the result of Kiritsugu being exposed to the mud? The way that we saw Emiya react to it in Fate more or less suggests that its very own existence is a curse onto its own, and that there wouldn't been a need of something else acting on it to make it a full blown curse.

I'd need the source to check, and unfortunately I simply don't have the leisure to do that nor the ability to grab them atm ><
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-07 06:12:07
October 07 2010 05:34 GMT
#8369
On October 07 2010 14:33 Ecael wrote:
Isn't 2 not exactly anyone's doing as it is simply the result of Kiritsugu being exposed to the mud? The way that we saw Emiya react to it in Fate more or less suggests that its very own existence is a curse onto its own, and that there wouldn't been a need of something else acting on it to make it a full blown curse.

I'd need the source to check, and unfortunately I simply don't have the leisure to do that nor the ability to grab them atm ><


Nay.
+ Show Spoiler +
IIRC it was specifically stated that "the Grail" cursed Kiritsugu to an agonizing end.


Edit:
Hmm

+ Show Spoiler +
だが『この世すべての悪』と接触したことでキリツグを触んだ呪いは


Okay, on one hand it's depicted as per touching the mud, but it still wouldn't explain why him and Kirei were treated differently >_>
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
doktorLucifer
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States855 Posts
October 07 2010 06:24 GMT
#8370
What anime are you (Southlight) and Eccael talking about? it seems interesting :O
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
October 07 2010 06:28 GMT
#8371
Theoretically Unlimited Blade Works but it appears we're talking more about the whole Fate/X timeline at this point, ahahah.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
doktorLucifer
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States855 Posts
October 07 2010 06:34 GMT
#8372
So I'll be looking into these. :D

So I'm in the process of watching all of this season's debut episodes... even the stuff that is/should be considered bad seems quite good so far.

I'm still halfway through Toaru Majutsu no Index `-`
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
October 07 2010 09:53 GMT
#8373
The Fate/Stay Night anime is decentish, and the Unlimited Blade Works movie has really good fights, but the Visual Novel for Fate/Stay Night is far superior, so I suggest looking into the VN/english translation rather than starting with the anime.
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
Midj
Profile Joined March 2010
Canada253 Posts
October 07 2010 17:44 GMT
#8374
I just finished berserk.

How should I feel?
I enjoy watching more than playing.
Ecael
Profile Joined February 2008
United States6703 Posts
October 07 2010 17:50 GMT
#8375
Ok, I am back. About the difference in the treatment of Kiritsugu and Kirei, I recall the portion right after when they were engulfed in the mud has something. I'll try to check when I am actually capable of reading and remotely understanding what I am reading, way too tired and mentally fatigued now -.-

Anyone got a save for F/SN that I can use for that part of UBW? I don't think I'd be up to try to read through F/SN again just to confirm parts...at that I am not even sure I kept a copy since I just through F/SN was so inferior to Tsukihime so I might've just deleted it hahahaha~
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
October 07 2010 17:52 GMT
#8376

Or somewhere around that video.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
NB
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Netherlands12045 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-07 20:20:01
October 07 2010 20:18 GMT
#8377
emiyaaaaaaaaaaaaa
+ Show Spoiler +
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fX9O-WXye8c





my personal opinion: Fate stay night is the series that has sickness OST :<

looking for the song that the robots sang in Ghost in the shell season 2. ^^
Im daed. Follow me @TL_NB
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
October 07 2010 20:41 GMT
#8378
On October 08 2010 02:44 Midj wrote:
I just finished berserk.

How should I feel?

You mean the anime? The ending of the anime made want to gouge my eyes out, or kill a small animal, or something similar to that but not really.
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
Tyrio
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
United States3248 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-07 21:00:14
October 07 2010 20:59 GMT
#8379
On October 08 2010 05:18 NB wrote:
emiyaaaaaaaaaaaaa
+ Show Spoiler +
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fX9O-WXye8c

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSm6nnwesV4&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZF29ATE3PTE&feature=related


my personal opinion: Fate stay night is the series that has sickness OST :<

looking for the song that the robots sang in Ghost in the shell season 2. ^^


Fate/Unlimited Codes had by far the best rendition of Emiya imo.


[NA] Tyrio.486 / Ahsh
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
October 07 2010 21:32 GMT
#8380
On October 08 2010 05:41 Sentenal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2010 02:44 Midj wrote:
I just finished berserk.

How should I feel?

You mean the anime? The ending of the anime made want to gouge my eyes out, or kill a small animal, or something similar to that but not really.


What you should feel is uncontrollable rage thanks to the misleading title that implied it was the first of more than 1 fucking season.

Then you should go read the manga because it actually is much better than the anime.

Personally, I found the ending to be very well done, it could have totally backfired and turned to absolute shit but Kentaro manages to maintain everything that made Berserk great despite a major shift in the storyline. It's one of the few mangas I go back and read over once in a while.

Claymore is trying or going to do something similar but unfortunately, I don't know if it's going to work out like Berserk too.
Get it by your hands...
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