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On January 27 2013 19:24 SocialStigma wrote:Thanks guys all those answers help clarify things, especially from Sentenal and ragz_gt. @Sentenal + Show Spoiler + I completely forgot about how the servant's power is based on how good of a magus the master is. And I guess Shirou barely even counts as a magus lol. @ragz_gt + Show Spoiler + Wow! I had no idea his tracing ability also gave him the fighting ability of the user. I was thinking how ridiculous it was that he traced the swords and instantly became an expert at using them haha. Oh and don't worry, I already knew Archer was future Emiya. I read it from wiki and I've seen the unlimited blade works movie. I realise the FSN anime is not very good, but I really liked the characters and the whole idea/story. So I still managed to enjoy it, especially the first time i saw it (it was probably one of the first anime series I watched). I've also read some of the VN about 2 years ago - only the fate route and part of unlimited blade works. I can tell how the VN is much better and much more detailed than the anime but the problem is I enjoy watching things much more than reading (for example lord of the rings, I'd never have the motivation to read the book but I loved the movies). And I read pretty slowly so it took me about a month to get through the first route of FSN the VN. But I'm thinking it might be worth it since I really like FSN and type moon stuff. Does anyone know if it's possible to get a censored version or non R rated version of the VN? I would like to avoid those scenes otherwise I wouldn't be able to read it anywhere other than at home.
FSN, and the Nasuverse in general, is much better after reading through side material and learning that everything actually has "rules". There's so much detail that could never be properly explained in an anime, or even a VN.
Even the explanations for Noble Phantasms alone is perspective altering.
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On January 27 2013 15:32 SocialStigma wrote:The other day I rewatched Fate Stay Night in preparation for watching Fate Zero and there were some parts that seemed really stupid to me. I don't know why but the first time watching FSN, years ago, I didn't really think too much about it, but now I'm finding it hard to ignore. + Show Spoiler + It was about the fight between Kuzuki (caster's master) and Saber. How is it possible that Kuzuki beat Saber so easily in a one on one fight? Not only that, he did it with his bare fists. I realise that caster used a spell to enhance his fists but I don't think that makes much of a difference. The way he dodges every attack from Saber and just completely destroys her seems a bit absurd. It seems crazy that a normal person can beat a servant, especially one so skilled in close combat. I was thinking doesn't that mean he could also beat lancer and archer is a straight up fight (with no noble phantasm attacks), since it seemed like Saber could.
The next part made even less sense to me. When Shirou fights Kuzuki with Archer's twin swords he seems to do much better than Saber. It looks like he even stands a chance at beating Kuzuki. I'm pretty sure during sword training Shirou can't even touch Saber. I'd be really grateful if someone could give me a detailed explanation to those questions.
Honestly I dropped both F/N and F/Z due to bad writing, cliches, and inconsistencies.
I believe I gave the former a 2/10, and the latter a 4/10. I'm really not sure why those shows are regarded so highly; I know the VN is excellent, but anime adaptations aren't always good.
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On January 28 2013 08:09 DemigodcelpH wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2013 15:32 SocialStigma wrote:The other day I rewatched Fate Stay Night in preparation for watching Fate Zero and there were some parts that seemed really stupid to me. I don't know why but the first time watching FSN, years ago, I didn't really think too much about it, but now I'm finding it hard to ignore. + Show Spoiler + It was about the fight between Kuzuki (caster's master) and Saber. How is it possible that Kuzuki beat Saber so easily in a one on one fight? Not only that, he did it with his bare fists. I realise that caster used a spell to enhance his fists but I don't think that makes much of a difference. The way he dodges every attack from Saber and just completely destroys her seems a bit absurd. It seems crazy that a normal person can beat a servant, especially one so skilled in close combat. I was thinking doesn't that mean he could also beat lancer and archer is a straight up fight (with no noble phantasm attacks), since it seemed like Saber could.
The next part made even less sense to me. When Shirou fights Kuzuki with Archer's twin swords he seems to do much better than Saber. It looks like he even stands a chance at beating Kuzuki. I'm pretty sure during sword training Shirou can't even touch Saber. I'd be really grateful if someone could give me a detailed explanation to those questions. Honestly I dropped both F/N and F/Z due to bad writing, cliches, and inconsistencies. I believe I gave the former a 2/10, and the latter a 4/10. I'm really not sure why those shows are regarded so highly; I know the VN is excellent, but anime adaptations aren't always good.
Curious to know what you consider the "cliches" and "inconsistencies". Especially since both series are well known for having characters that complete subvert or twist the well known archetypes.
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Obviously there is no VN of F/Z, and the anime is a pretty literal adaptation of the novel. So not sure it's where it's going.
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On January 28 2013 08:31 ragz_gt wrote:
Obviously there is no VN of F/Z, and the anime is a pretty literal adaptation of the novel. So not sure it's where it's going.
The Umineko no Naku Koro Ni anime is a literal adaptation of the first four arcs of the VN, and it's widely regarded as one of the worst shows ever made while the VN is widely regarded as one of the best VNs ever written.
Just because a show is a "literal" (in quotes because while some studios try to strictly adhere to the source material it's never exactly the same for reasons below) adaptation doesn't mean it can't be poorly made in that there are lots of areas to mess up for example with pacing, or scenes chosen to be omitted or not omitted in that anime adaptions can never fully cover the source material of long VNs without at least being 50-100 episodes as opposed to the standard 12-24.
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Canada4481 Posts
On January 28 2013 08:53 DemigodcelpH wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2013 08:31 ragz_gt wrote:
Obviously there is no VN of F/Z, and the anime is a pretty literal adaptation of the novel. So not sure it's where it's going. The Umineko no Naku Koro Ni anime is a literal adaptation of the first four arcs of the VN, and it's widely regarded as one of the worst shows ever made while the VN is widely regarded as one of the best VNs ever written. Just because a show is a literal adaptation doesn't mean it can't be poorly made in that there are lots of areas to mess up for example with pacing, or scenes chosen to omit or not omit in that anime adaptions can never fully cover the source material of long VNs without at least being 50-100 episodes as opposed to the standard 12-24.
You clearly missed the fact that F/Z was NOT a VN.
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On January 28 2013 08:55 Nagisama wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2013 08:53 DemigodcelpH wrote:On January 28 2013 08:31 ragz_gt wrote:
Obviously there is no VN of F/Z, and the anime is a pretty literal adaptation of the novel. So not sure it's where it's going. The Umineko no Naku Koro Ni anime is a literal adaptation of the first four arcs of the VN, and it's widely regarded as one of the worst shows ever made while the VN is widely regarded as one of the best VNs ever written. Just because a show is a literal adaptation doesn't mean it can't be poorly made in that there are lots of areas to mess up for example with pacing, or scenes chosen to omit or not omit in that anime adaptions can never fully cover the source material of long VNs without at least being 50-100 episodes as opposed to the standard 12-24. You clearly missed the fact that F/Z was NOT a VN.
I never said it was. I'm referring to the entire series with emphasis on how it started.
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On January 28 2013 08:56 DemigodcelpH wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2013 08:55 Nagisama wrote:On January 28 2013 08:53 DemigodcelpH wrote:On January 28 2013 08:31 ragz_gt wrote:
Obviously there is no VN of F/Z, and the anime is a pretty literal adaptation of the novel. So not sure it's where it's going. The Umineko no Naku Koro Ni anime is a literal adaptation of the first four arcs of the VN, and it's widely regarded as one of the worst shows ever made while the VN is widely regarded as one of the best VNs ever written. Just because a show is a literal adaptation doesn't mean it can't be poorly made in that there are lots of areas to mess up for example with pacing, or scenes chosen to omit or not omit in that anime adaptions can never fully cover the source material of long VNs without at least being 50-100 episodes as opposed to the standard 12-24. You clearly missed the fact that F/Z was NOT a VN. I never said it was. I'm referring to the entire series with emphasis on how it started.
I'm still curious about where you think F/Z was overly cliched or inconsistent.
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Canada4481 Posts
On January 28 2013 08:56 DemigodcelpH wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2013 08:55 Nagisama wrote:On January 28 2013 08:53 DemigodcelpH wrote:On January 28 2013 08:31 ragz_gt wrote:
Obviously there is no VN of F/Z, and the anime is a pretty literal adaptation of the novel. So not sure it's where it's going. The Umineko no Naku Koro Ni anime is a literal adaptation of the first four arcs of the VN, and it's widely regarded as one of the worst shows ever made while the VN is widely regarded as one of the best VNs ever written. Just because a show is a literal adaptation doesn't mean it can't be poorly made in that there are lots of areas to mess up for example with pacing, or scenes chosen to omit or not omit in that anime adaptions can never fully cover the source material of long VNs without at least being 50-100 episodes as opposed to the standard 12-24. You clearly missed the fact that F/Z was NOT a VN. I never said it was. I'm referring to the entire series with emphasis on how it started.
F/SN sucked as an anime adaptation of the VN and that may explain why that was bad, but you didn't explain why F/Z was bad. That's what they wanted to know. You instead reply with how "literal" VN adaptations suck, which F/Z was not, because it's not a VN.
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On January 27 2013 13:55 Sentenal wrote:
How far are you in VOTOMs? Anyway, VOTOM's thing is its "realism", in that it tries to be as hard scifi as Mecha can be, for the most part. The second arc of the show is the best.
I'm at episode 36 now and yeah it is getting more interesting with the desert planet arc. Votoms definitely is the most realistic mecha series I've seen. All the weapons are understandable, no mech is overpowered even when special mechs are introduced. Mechs get destroyed a lot even when piloted by the heroes although it is strange how they almost always definitively destroy another mech while only taking limb damage most of the time. Heck Chirico had his mech throw an empty bazooka and it exploded the mech. In episode 36 Chirico shoots out the eye of another mech with a handgun and I think "alright he took out its vision I've seen him do that before" nope it blows up due to a handgun 0_o. Also Gotho is a wizard apparently.
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On January 28 2013 11:27 BlackMagister wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2013 13:55 Sentenal wrote:
How far are you in VOTOMs? Anyway, VOTOM's thing is its "realism", in that it tries to be as hard scifi as Mecha can be, for the most part. The second arc of the show is the best. I'm at episode 36 now and yeah it is getting more interesting with the desert planet arc. Votoms definitely is the most realistic mecha series I've seen. All the weapons are understandable, no mech is overpowered even when special mechs are introduced. Mechs get destroyed a lot even when piloted by the heroes although it is strange how they almost always definitively destroy another mech while only taking limb damage most of the time. Heck Chirico had his mech throw an empty bazooka and it exploded the mech. In episode 36 Chirico shoots out the eye of another mech with a handgun and I think "alright he took out its vision I've seen him do that before" nope it blows up due to a handgun 0_o. Also Gotho is a wizard apparently.
Chirico's Pistol is an Anti-AT Pistol, so that partly explains why its so effective. I'll refrain from saying anything else, since its spoilers if I do lol
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Canada8031 Posts
On January 28 2013 11:27 BlackMagister wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2013 13:55 Sentenal wrote:
How far are you in VOTOMs? Anyway, VOTOM's thing is its "realism", in that it tries to be as hard scifi as Mecha can be, for the most part. The second arc of the show is the best. I'm at episode 36 now and yeah it is getting more interesting with the desert planet arc. Votoms definitely is the most realistic mecha series I've seen. All the weapons are understandable, no mech is overpowered even when special mechs are introduced. Mechs get destroyed a lot even when piloted by the heroes although it is strange how they almost always definitively destroy another mech while only taking limb damage most of the time. Heck Chirico had his mech throw an empty bazooka and it exploded the mech. In episode 36 Chirico shoots out the eye of another mech with a handgun and I think "alright he took out its vision I've seen him do that before" nope it blows up due to a handgun 0_o. Also Gotho is a wizard apparently.
Did you notice the size of the handgun? The thing's freakin' massive. It fires 20-gauge armor piercing rounds.
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My issue is that shooting the eye even with an anti AT gun should just disable the AT, but it makes the AT explode and kills the pilot. I assume the head would just have sensor equipment and the bullets themselves were not explosive. Too many of the mechs explode when I think in a realistic mech series more of the mechs would just be disabled or at least not explode instantly.
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Wait... that's your issue while watching Votoms?
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Regarding combat realism yes.
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The pilot's head is right behind the AT's camera, so at the very least it would kill the pilot.
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Many AT models use the backpack as the primary power source, bullets going through the head could easily hit the backpack and cause the system to ignite.
Also, all ammunition in VOTOMs is either HE or DU rounds.
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Because of the upcomming Fate/Illya anime, I picked the manga. Kind of weird...
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/UPt7PlM.jpg)
