|
Bosnia-Herzegovina983 Posts
On January 30 2016 00:22 Steelavocado wrote:
I think it was FATA or Mutumba that said that "any team with Miracle would have won the Frankfurt major"
His ability to carry and make the teammates around him play to the best of their ability puts him at #1 at this point in time
He's just best mechanical player out there. I think it was g1 vs lgd where sylar with TB ultied some support and miracle insta astrals him so he's safe. I watched few of his pubs vods on youtube. He's just fastest player i ever seen.
|
Yeah, Faker is so miles ahead of his peers that not calling him the best League player would be considered a hate crime.
Dota is so much of a team game that it's hard to consider Miracle great without crediting his team for giving him space to do great things. So how great is Miracle without his team? Would we sing praises for Miracle if he played in some tier 2 NA pub-stack?
|
I mean he makes fly looks a good player
|
On January 30 2016 00:24 Racket wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2016 00:20 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:14 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:11 Kamisamanachi wrote:
A player having high impact doesn't always make him the best player, I think. He is using the space. Created by his teammates to farm and carry them in the late game.its more like teamwork ,tbh..yeah he is pretty impressive Like Suma1l was, and now he is getting bashed. Miracle is a great player, better than many, but being the best in the world in dota is an almost impossible to proof statement if not completely impossible. Why do you think so? Every other sport has the best player in the world and some sort of an award for it, hell, League of Legends has one and so does CSGO, what makes dota so special you cant name one? Whether other sports have something like that does not make it a must for dota, in addition, other sports having them has nothing to do with making an statement possible to proof. Faker being considered the best player in LoL has to do with the nature and mechanics of the game rather than with decision making and teamwork. Your turn.
You are trying to make it way more complicated then it actually is, any best in anything(mvp) is awarded by popularity vote.
Not every single person in the world thinks Messi is the best footballer in the world, and yet he is. We dont need everyone here to agree Miracle is the best, but if majority agrees, then its settled.
And yes, to me, Miracle has those moments in the game, just like Messi, just like Faker that no one else in the world does and that makes him in my opinion the best and it seems im not alone in this.
|
On January 30 2016 00:30 molecu wrote:
Yeah, Faker is so miles ahead of his peers that not calling him the best League player would be considered a hate crime.
Dota is so much of a team game that it's hard to consider Miracle great without crediting his team for giving him space to do great things. So how great is Miracle without his team? Would we sing praises for Miracle if he played in some tier 2 NA pub-stack?
I would rather put him with Dendi and company and see if he can make FeedStyle die less times.....
|
Bosnia-Herzegovina983 Posts
On January 30 2016 00:31 Faruko wrote:
I mean he makes fly looks a good player
Fly is smth like ppd. Not great mechanical player but his game knowledge is quite great and his shows that in drafting.
Fly carried coL to that good ti5 result.
|
On January 30 2016 00:31 Super_Style wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2016 00:24 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:20 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:14 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:11 Kamisamanachi wrote:
A player having high impact doesn't always make him the best player, I think. He is using the space. Created by his teammates to farm and carry them in the late game.its more like teamwork ,tbh..yeah he is pretty impressive Like Suma1l was, and now he is getting bashed. Miracle is a great player, better than many, but being the best in the world in dota is an almost impossible to proof statement if not completely impossible. Why do you think so? Every other sport has the best player in the world and some sort of an award for it, hell, League of Legends has one and so does CSGO, what makes dota so special you cant name one? Whether other sports have something like that does not make it a must for dota, in addition, other sports having them has nothing to do with making an statement possible to proof. Faker being considered the best player in LoL has to do with the nature and mechanics of the game rather than with decision making and teamwork. Your turn. You are trying to make it way more complicated then it actually is, any best in anything(mvp) is awarded by popularity vote. Not every single person in the world thinks Messi is the best footballer in the world, and yet he is. We dont need everyone here to agree Miracle is the best, but if majority agrees, then its settled. And yes, to me, Miracle has those moments in the game, just like Messi, just like Faker that no one else in the world does and that makes him in my opinion the best and it seems im not alone in this.
Your point is that he Manta'ed right when he had to to make you say WOW!!! I have seen RTZ do that, so what is your point again?
|
On January 30 2016 00:21 molecu wrote:
I don't know. This showed me that Miracle is one of the best core farming playmakers in the game, he is also one of the best afk ricers in the game. I don't think famed ricers like EE or RTZ could pull that networth off given how behind OG were most of the game.
He's a morph in a game with no hex (until Lina bought one) or silence. Chrono's the only way to catch him out and the void needs most of his team behind him to have a hope of chainstunning and killing Miracle through morph. His team gave him all the safe farm until he had linkens and they stayed off the map a lot of the time which makes it super hard for LGD to know whether it's even safe to go on the morph.
I'm still impressed with how effortlessly he constantly does little extra things (like all the illusion baits), but he was set up for success this game. And if LGD had had the balls to push when he was dead with no BB, we'd be talking about miracle throwing right now.
|
But yeah, I think Miracle is the best player at the moment. Swap Miracle with any of the tier 1 mids we have now and watch OG fall to pieces and see the team Miracle goes to rise above the rest. I can't say if they'll win the next Major, but if they do then Miracle would be one of the best candidates for Dota 2 GOAT.
|
On January 30 2016 00:33 Racket wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2016 00:31 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:24 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:20 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:14 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:11 Kamisamanachi wrote:
A player having high impact doesn't always make him the best player, I think. He is using the space. Created by his teammates to farm and carry them in the late game.its more like teamwork ,tbh..yeah he is pretty impressive Like Suma1l was, and now he is getting bashed. Miracle is a great player, better than many, but being the best in the world in dota is an almost impossible to proof statement if not completely impossible. Why do you think so? Every other sport has the best player in the world and some sort of an award for it, hell, League of Legends has one and so does CSGO, what makes dota so special you cant name one? Whether other sports have something like that does not make it a must for dota, in addition, other sports having them has nothing to do with making an statement possible to proof. Faker being considered the best player in LoL has to do with the nature and mechanics of the game rather than with decision making and teamwork. Your turn. You are trying to make it way more complicated then it actually is, any best in anything(mvp) is awarded by popularity vote. Not every single person in the world thinks Messi is the best footballer in the world, and yet he is. We dont need everyone here to agree Miracle is the best, but if majority agrees, then its settled. And yes, to me, Miracle has those moments in the game, just like Messi, just like Faker that no one else in the world does and that makes him in my opinion the best and it seems im not alone in this. Your point is that he Manta'ed right when he had to to make you say WOW!!! I have seen RTZ do that, so what is your point again?
Whats your point, because you are just arguing here without saying anything of value to either your statement or mine.
edit: and why just quote this morph game, like its the only game he played in his career, he did fine but nothing otherworldly. he had far more impressive games this tournament, invoker vs eg game 1 for instance.
|
On January 30 2016 00:37 Super_Style wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2016 00:33 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:31 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:24 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:20 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:14 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:11 Kamisamanachi wrote:
A player having high impact doesn't always make him the best player, I think. He is using the space. Created by his teammates to farm and carry them in the late game.its more like teamwork ,tbh..yeah he is pretty impressive Like Suma1l was, and now he is getting bashed. Miracle is a great player, better than many, but being the best in the world in dota is an almost impossible to proof statement if not completely impossible. Why do you think so? Every other sport has the best player in the world and some sort of an award for it, hell, League of Legends has one and so does CSGO, what makes dota so special you cant name one? Whether other sports have something like that does not make it a must for dota, in addition, other sports having them has nothing to do with making an statement possible to proof. Faker being considered the best player in LoL has to do with the nature and mechanics of the game rather than with decision making and teamwork. Your turn. You are trying to make it way more complicated then it actually is, any best in anything(mvp) is awarded by popularity vote. Not every single person in the world thinks Messi is the best footballer in the world, and yet he is. We dont need everyone here to agree Miracle is the best, but if majority agrees, then its settled. And yes, to me, Miracle has those moments in the game, just like Messi, just like Faker that no one else in the world does and that makes him in my opinion the best and it seems im not alone in this. Your point is that he Manta'ed right when he had to to make you say WOW!!! I have seen RTZ do that, so what is your point again? Whats your point, because you are just arguing here without saying anything of value to either your statement or mine.
He already countered u with miracle is not the best player .his team is providing him a big support and space to make him farmed late game.and the thing u were praising miracle was also done by many players in the past such as flashy plays.and u are just using awards as a means of discussions which are pretty pointless.
This tournament suddenly got more interesting as 2 of western teams are still in competition of battlefury
|
http://mdl.huomaotv.cn/#f
Okay, the site would take a while to load, but I did find their copy of the Brackets.
They have Newbee vs LGD & VG vs EG. So I'd take that as "official". Granted, I'd have really hoped it was the other way. Would have made for a better games in the next round.
|
On January 30 2016 00:41 Taf the Ghost wrote:http://mdl.huomaotv.cn/#fOkay, the site would take a while to load, but I did find their copy of the Brackets. They have Newbee vs LGD & VG vs EG. So I'd take that as "official". Granted, I'd have really hoped it was the other way. Would have made for a better games in the next round.
Idk why they changed this or they fcked up but vg va EG in next round could have been better match if hy beat bewbee .
|
On January 30 2016 00:41 Taf the Ghost wrote:http://mdl.huomaotv.cn/#fOkay, the site would take a while to load, but I did find their copy of the Brackets. They have Newbee vs LGD & VG vs EG. So I'd take that as "official". Granted, I'd have really hoped it was the other way. Would have made for a better games in the next round.
Wouldn't it be LGD vs VG in the next round either way?
|
On January 30 2016 00:32 Valhalla44 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2016 00:31 Faruko wrote:
I mean he makes fly looks a good player Fly is smth like ppd. Not great mechanical player but his game knowledge is quite great and his shows that in drafting. Fly carried coL to that good ti5 result.
Fly carried Col to the second-worst possible placing at TI5...
He's literally had zero real success with a non-Miracle team.
|
On January 30 2016 00:40 Kamisamanachi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2016 00:37 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:33 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:31 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:24 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:20 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:14 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:11 Kamisamanachi wrote:
A player having high impact doesn't always make him the best player, I think. He is using the space. Created by his teammates to farm and carry them in the late game.its more like teamwork ,tbh..yeah he is pretty impressive Like Suma1l was, and now he is getting bashed. Miracle is a great player, better than many, but being the best in the world in dota is an almost impossible to proof statement if not completely impossible. Why do you think so? Every other sport has the best player in the world and some sort of an award for it, hell, League of Legends has one and so does CSGO, what makes dota so special you cant name one? Whether other sports have something like that does not make it a must for dota, in addition, other sports having them has nothing to do with making an statement possible to proof. Faker being considered the best player in LoL has to do with the nature and mechanics of the game rather than with decision making and teamwork. Your turn. You are trying to make it way more complicated then it actually is, any best in anything(mvp) is awarded by popularity vote. Not every single person in the world thinks Messi is the best footballer in the world, and yet he is. We dont need everyone here to agree Miracle is the best, but if majority agrees, then its settled. And yes, to me, Miracle has those moments in the game, just like Messi, just like Faker that no one else in the world does and that makes him in my opinion the best and it seems im not alone in this. Your point is that he Manta'ed right when he had to to make you say WOW!!! I have seen RTZ do that, so what is your point again? Whats your point, because you are just arguing here without saying anything of value to either your statement or mine. He already countered u with miracle is not the best player .his team is providing him a big support and space to make him farmed late game.and the thing u were praising miracle was also done by many players in the past such as flashy plays.and u are just using awards as a means of discussions which are pretty pointless. This tournament suddenly got more interesting as 2 of western teams are still in competition of battlefury
So everything Messi does is just because his team provided space and support, he is just as good as every other "flashy" player in the world? Ever stopped to wonder that maybe just maybe, Miracle is the one that makes OG shine and not the other way around.
Game 1 vs eg he won pretty much alone, that does happen, even in dota.
|
Not necessarily related to this game but from what I have seen from following pro-dota during the last 8 years and having played it on a decent level as well for the last 4 my assessment is that miracle is the most gifted player mechanically I have ever seen. Is he the best player period? Hard to say, too much going on at that level for me to judge his game sense, movements and teamwork compared to other top players but if Fata and Matumba says he is the best, I would not be hard to convince.
|
On January 30 2016 00:49 hariooo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2016 00:32 Valhalla44 wrote:On January 30 2016 00:31 Faruko wrote:
I mean he makes fly looks a good player Fly is smth like ppd. Not great mechanical player but his game knowledge is quite great and his shows that in drafting. Fly carried coL to that good ti5 result. Fly carried Col to the second-worst possible placing at TI5... He's literally had zero real success with a non-Miracle team.
Col, a team with four players that had never even attended a Dota LAN before getting 9-12th at TI.
Anyway, haters gonna downplay.
|
On January 30 2016 00:37 Super_Style wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2016 00:33 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:31 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:24 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:20 Super_Style wrote:On January 30 2016 00:14 Racket wrote:On January 30 2016 00:11 Kamisamanachi wrote:
A player having high impact doesn't always make him the best player, I think. He is using the space. Created by his teammates to farm and carry them in the late game.its more like teamwork ,tbh..yeah he is pretty impressive Like Suma1l was, and now he is getting bashed. Miracle is a great player, better than many, but being the best in the world in dota is an almost impossible to proof statement if not completely impossible. Why do you think so? Every other sport has the best player in the world and some sort of an award for it, hell, League of Legends has one and so does CSGO, what makes dota so special you cant name one? Whether other sports have something like that does not make it a must for dota, in addition, other sports having them has nothing to do with making an statement possible to proof. Faker being considered the best player in LoL has to do with the nature and mechanics of the game rather than with decision making and teamwork. Your turn. You are trying to make it way more complicated then it actually is, any best in anything(mvp) is awarded by popularity vote. Not every single person in the world thinks Messi is the best footballer in the world, and yet he is. We dont need everyone here to agree Miracle is the best, but if majority agrees, then its settled. And yes, to me, Miracle has those moments in the game, just like Messi, just like Faker that no one else in the world does and that makes him in my opinion the best and it seems im not alone in this. Your point is that he Manta'ed right when he had to to make you say WOW!!! I have seen RTZ do that, so what is your point again? Whats your point, because you are just arguing here without saying anything of value to either your statement or mine. edit: and why just quote this morph game, like its the only game he played in his career, he did fine but nothing otherworldly. he had far more impressive games this tournament, invoker vs eg game 1 for instance.
Its ok, I understand you, you are just saying that Miracle is the best player in the world, like chocolate icecream is the best taste in the world. It is not a matter of who/what is the best but rather that you like him/it better than any other.
I, personally, try to express in forums more neutral because, like in this case, it is easily misunderstandable. With friends I speak like you do, because they know me and know what I mean with less words or even wrong ones.
|
On January 30 2016 00:36 molecu wrote:
But yeah, I think Miracle is the best player at the moment. Swap Miracle with any of the tier 1 mids we have now and watch OG fall to pieces and see the team Miracle goes to rise above the rest. I can't say if they'll win the next Major, but if they do then Miracle would be one of the best candidates for Dota 2 GOAT.
You're taking something reasonable (Miracle's probably THE standout player since TI) and going unreasonable places with it. OG wouldn't fall to pieces without Miracle, though they would definitely be weakened (how much none of us can say, let's stop pretending). Miracle couldn't carry any 4 players to relevancy. And GOAT candidates in Dota 2 are people like Puppey or Xiao8, who's won a TI and gotten top 3 3 times playing 3 different positions. Not a guy whose career accomplishments are winning 2 tournaments that aren't TI.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
