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On November 03 2012 04:44 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 04:22 PizzaParty wrote:
Why is Vanguard generally a bad item on Sven ? Vanguard's a pretty weak item in general right now compared to other options. On Sven in particular it doesn't give you anything you want. There are other more appropriate ways to get Regen, and pure defensive/no offensive stats aren't really what Sven wants midgame.
I'm going to be going on an Axe spree for a few games. Was just too busy/annoyed to start up DotA again, and I think that'll be a fun way to get back into it. I've been hearing constantly that Vanguard just isn't a great item as it used to be anymore, and I should get alternatives. I was personally thinking like Vit Booster + Hood or something, not even necessarily to build into a pipe. Would that be sufficient, or do I even need the regen from Hood since I'm getting tranquils?
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Now that Silencer's a crazy laner I want to play him more. Unfortunately my previous core item, Force Staff, was rather drastically changed for Silencer's purposes.
Do you guys think it's still worth it or should you go something like drums+eul instead?
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On October 30 2012 23:55 Brainling wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2012 07:46 Absurd Bunny wrote:
I know people hate how LoL players compare LoL to Dota 2, and I'm not going to do that, but I want to try to get differences and the feeling for learning things in Dota 2 instead of LoL. No idea if this is considered simple answers and questions, maybe it is, but it might be a lot.
1. So a basic team for LoL would be an AP carry, AD carry, jungler, support, and tank. The support and tank are going to be the same, but will there be more than 1 carry? If so, would they all be agility? What roles need to be in 1 team?
2. When I'm starting out, should I go off the recommended section, or should I look up builds on the internet and copy them from there? What sites are good to start out with?
3. What are easy heroes to play?
I think that's all for now that can come off the top of my mind, if there's more I'll be sure to ask. As a former LoL player who switched to Dota 2, I might have some insight on these: 1) Forget everything you know about position sets, like in LoL. Dota is a much more fluid experience, and there are multiple ways to "lane" the game. There are viable 2-1-2, 3-1-1 and 2-1-1-1 strategies in Dota, and you'll see all three used at a competitive level. In addition, in competitive Dota, we tend to number the positions based on farm priorities. So a 1 would be your hard carry who needs maximum farm. A 5 would be your support who needs the least amount of farm. In most pub games, this is irrelevant, but it's something to keep in mind if you plan to watch any competitive Dota. As far as carries, in a pub game, you'll generally end up with multiple carries, because it's what people want to play, but at the competitive level, you tend to only have one true 'hard carry' on a team, but you'll generally have a durable or ganking semi-carry in your 2 or 3 slot. There are carries of every attribute type in Dota. As a very very loose rule of thumb, agility carries tend to be attack speed based, strength carries tend to be durable and int carries tend to be nuke heavy. This is by no means a RULE, it's just a loose pattern. There are clear exceptions to it in all three stat rosters. All the stat of a hero really implies is what stat scales their right click damage. There are some more systemic things to think about, but for now that's all you need to worry about. A heroes primary attribute scales their right click. 2) The recommended items are fine, but once you identify some heroes you like to play, I would go online and research more specialized builds for them, and learn when to use them. You'll find that the recommended items in game tend to be super generalist, and not meant to handle any one situation well, just meant to handle all situations passably (which is mostly what you want in low level pubs). 3) If you tell me what you're favored LoL role was, I can tell you some heroes to try out. I wouldn't worry about "easiest". Play what you find fun and interesting, regardless of difficulty, and you'll stay interested in the game and want to learn it.
I like to play AD carries the most. Im guessing the most standard for pubs and whatnot are the 2-1-2 or 1-1-2 (jungle), which role hero would go where?
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On November 04 2012 00:45 Absurd Bunny wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2012 23:55 Brainling wrote:On October 30 2012 07:46 Absurd Bunny wrote:
I know people hate how LoL players compare LoL to Dota 2, and I'm not going to do that, but I want to try to get differences and the feeling for learning things in Dota 2 instead of LoL. No idea if this is considered simple answers and questions, maybe it is, but it might be a lot.
1. So a basic team for LoL would be an AP carry, AD carry, jungler, support, and tank. The support and tank are going to be the same, but will there be more than 1 carry? If so, would they all be agility? What roles need to be in 1 team?
2. When I'm starting out, should I go off the recommended section, or should I look up builds on the internet and copy them from there? What sites are good to start out with?
3. What are easy heroes to play?
I think that's all for now that can come off the top of my mind, if there's more I'll be sure to ask. As a former LoL player who switched to Dota 2, I might have some insight on these: 1) Forget everything you know about position sets, like in LoL. Dota is a much more fluid experience, and there are multiple ways to "lane" the game. There are viable 2-1-2, 3-1-1 and 2-1-1-1 strategies in Dota, and you'll see all three used at a competitive level. In addition, in competitive Dota, we tend to number the positions based on farm priorities. So a 1 would be your hard carry who needs maximum farm. A 5 would be your support who needs the least amount of farm. In most pub games, this is irrelevant, but it's something to keep in mind if you plan to watch any competitive Dota. As far as carries, in a pub game, you'll generally end up with multiple carries, because it's what people want to play, but at the competitive level, you tend to only have one true 'hard carry' on a team, but you'll generally have a durable or ganking semi-carry in your 2 or 3 slot. There are carries of every attribute type in Dota. As a very very loose rule of thumb, agility carries tend to be attack speed based, strength carries tend to be durable and int carries tend to be nuke heavy. This is by no means a RULE, it's just a loose pattern. There are clear exceptions to it in all three stat rosters. All the stat of a hero really implies is what stat scales their right click damage. There are some more systemic things to think about, but for now that's all you need to worry about. A heroes primary attribute scales their right click. 2) The recommended items are fine, but once you identify some heroes you like to play, I would go online and research more specialized builds for them, and learn when to use them. You'll find that the recommended items in game tend to be super generalist, and not meant to handle any one situation well, just meant to handle all situations passably (which is mostly what you want in low level pubs). 3) If you tell me what you're favored LoL role was, I can tell you some heroes to try out. I wouldn't worry about "easiest". Play what you find fun and interesting, regardless of difficulty, and you'll stay interested in the game and want to learn it. I like to play AD carries the most. Im guessing the most standard for pubs and whatnot are the 2-1-2 or 1-1-2 (jungle), which role hero would go where?
As a former LoL player myself who LOVED AD (this was like a year and a half ago though, mind you) some of the heroes I particularly liked that are also relatively newbie friendly are, in order of easiest to hardest imo:
Juggernaut
Lycanthrope
Chaos Knight and Nightstalker if you liked Bruiser
Lifestealer
Beastmaster
Sand King and Slardar also get some special mentions.
I hold the philosophy that playing Hard Support is just as damaging to a new player as playing Hard Carry, they are both difficult to play properly and can absolutely throw a game if you mess up. Semi-Carries, Gankers, Pushers and Initiators are perfect newbie heroes and are, in my opinion, the most fun as well.
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Not strategy or build related, but
Was playing dota and whenever a teamfight started and Spectre used her ult, I would experience a massive amount of lag. It was not related to my connection as my friend sitting next to me would be perfectly fine.
It may have been because my computer was overheating or 'tired' after having played dota for the last 5 or so hours, but for the most part I would experience normal gameplay, except in these instances.
Uh, what do
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On November 04 2012 09:07 Bswhunter wrote:
Not strategy or build related, but
Was playing dota and whenever a teamfight started and Spectre used her ult, I would experience a massive amount of lag. It was not related to my connection as my friend sitting next to me would be perfectly fine.
It may have been because my computer was overheating or 'tired' after having played dota for the last 5 or so hours, but for the most part I would experience normal gameplay, except in these instances.
Uh, what do
It means your processor is struggling.
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I was personally thinking like Vit Booster + Hood or something, not even necessarily to build into a pipe. Would that be sufficient, or do I even need the regen from Hood since I'm getting tranquils?
It should be easy enough to farm for both vanguard and the hood due to his third skill but yeah if you struggled then I guess Vit Booster + Hood would be better worth it because you already get the massive bonus armor (+physical damage reduction) from his first skill. You are going to need hood because although you already have a skill which provides physical resistance, you lack magic resistance. So buying hood can compensate that weakness.
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On November 04 2012 00:45 beef42 wrote:
Now that Silencer's a crazy laner I want to play him more. Unfortunately my previous core item, Force Staff, was rather drastically changed for Silencer's purposes.
Do you guys think it's still worth it or should you go something like drums+eul instead?
I think he might be one of the few heroes where the regen is actually more useful than the dmg/attackspeed of the old version, at least until the lategame. Since you're more likely to follow it up with a eul/sheepstick/drums/shit that gives int than a meck/pipe (depending on your lineup), you're actually really lacking in regen. Going tranq boots > force staff/treads is a solid way to build your core in the current version (IMO). You really don't do much right click damage early so you can hold off on phase/treads til later.
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Is there any way to change it so that Dire healthbars are always red and Radiant are always green, despite what side you're playing on? Because that's always been something that annoyed me. :|
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id personally not get force staff on silencer anymore, unless in desperate circumstances
(drums), euls and rod of atos seems much better now
you have some escape potential, insane ms and a 60% slow on top of that. Not to mention decent dmg and hp
if you manage to get an orchid as well you could 1v1 almost any hero without bkb using perma silence
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On November 04 2012 10:54 Jehct wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2012 00:45 beef42 wrote:
Now that Silencer's a crazy laner I want to play him more. Unfortunately my previous core item, Force Staff, was rather drastically changed for Silencer's purposes.
Do you guys think it's still worth it or should you go something like drums+eul instead? I think he might be one of the few heroes where the regen is actually more useful than the dmg/attackspeed of the old version, at least until the lategame. Since you're more likely to follow it up with a eul/sheepstick/drums/shit that gives int than a meck/pipe (depending on your lineup), you're actually really lacking in regen. Going tranq boots > force staff/treads is a solid way to build your core in the current version (IMO). You really don't do much right click damage early so you can hold off on phase/treads til later.
I'd say silencer is one of the heroes where new new forcestaff is clearly worse, the extra bite you used to get from force was noticable even early on. The rework has also made him more mana intensive, which means getting sustainability items like bottle or perseverance for a later linkens seems quite attractive, making the hp regen from force unnecesary. I suppose your point might have some merit if you're playing as support though.
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On November 05 2012 08:55 Alur wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2012 10:54 Jehct wrote:On November 04 2012 00:45 beef42 wrote:
Now that Silencer's a crazy laner I want to play him more. Unfortunately my previous core item, Force Staff, was rather drastically changed for Silencer's purposes.
Do you guys think it's still worth it or should you go something like drums+eul instead? I think he might be one of the few heroes where the regen is actually more useful than the dmg/attackspeed of the old version, at least until the lategame. Since you're more likely to follow it up with a eul/sheepstick/drums/shit that gives int than a meck/pipe (depending on your lineup), you're actually really lacking in regen. Going tranq boots > force staff/treads is a solid way to build your core in the current version (IMO). You really don't do much right click damage early so you can hold off on phase/treads til later. I'd say silencer is one of the heroes where new new forcestaff is clearly worse, the extra bite you used to get from force was noticable even early on. The rework has also made him more mana intensive, which means getting sustainability items like bottle or perseverance for a later linkens seems quite attractive, making the hp regen from force unnecesary. I suppose your point might have some merit if you're playing as support though.
pers isnt a good choice because its way too expensive for what it gives, and if youre not going to make a linkens straight away itll just be a waste of 1850 gold
that said, you cant go linkens fast either because his core items are just so much better
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On November 04 2012 00:45 beef42 wrote:
Now that Silencer's a crazy laner I want to play him more. Unfortunately my previous core item, Force Staff, was rather drastically changed for Silencer's purposes.
Do you guys think it's still worth it or should you go something like drums+eul instead?
It's still worth it imo, the +asp was just the ice on the cake. On Silencer I go forcestaff<yasha<rod/vyse. If i'm raping i'll get a rod. Yasha is very good on int carry that relies on auto attacks like Silencer and OD. They're also really slow.
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People could just buy phase boots (second pair of boots) instead of a yasha, if they're not making manta, if people really want movement speed.
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I've been wondering since heroes like silencer can orb-walk and cast spells while in ethereal form, could ghost scepter be a viable item from him as well? I mean, although in ethereal form you take the extra magic damage, you are already going to be silencing most heroes anyhow. You could practically be invulnerable while attacking for a short period of time.
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On November 04 2012 00:45 beef42 wrote:
Now that Silencer's a crazy laner I want to play him more. Unfortunately my previous core item, Force Staff, was rather drastically changed for Silencer's purposes.
Do you guys think it's still worth it or should you go something like drums+eul instead?
Depends, is there a fed ursa or lifestealer something alone they lines? Then get forcestaff  .
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Rod of atos seems like a weak item to me, because if you slap an ultimate orb and void stone on your mystic staff, you get a scythe, which is much better for pretty much everyone. It's not really the fact that rod is a bad item, just that scythe is so much better.
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On November 05 2012 15:08 hkimmy wrote:
I've been wondering since heroes like silencer can orb-walk and cast spells while in ethereal form, could ghost scepter be a viable item from him as well? I mean, although in ethereal form you take the extra magic damage, you are already going to be silencing most heroes anyhow. You could practically be invulnerable while attacking for a short period of time.
yeah only problem is when you get items like orchid, treads and other attack speed buffing items, your orbwalking is slower than your auto attack. sometimes even up to half the speed
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United States47024 Posts
On November 05 2012 23:28 Incze wrote:
Rod of atos seems like a weak item to me, because if you slap an ultimate orb and void stone on your mystic staff, you get a scythe, which is much better for pretty much everyone. It's not really the fact that rod is a bad item, just that scythe is so much better.
The comparison is poor because a 3100 gold item represents a totally different timing and buildup than Scythe. Atos is finished only 400 gold later than when you would have gotten the Mystic Staff, and at every point before that is still more cost-effective (seeing as in terms of the relevant stats, Vit+Staff of Wizardry is more powerful than having an Ultimate Orb). Scythe fits later-game timings but trying to buy Scythe too early puts a gap in your itemization that is exploitable.
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On November 05 2012 23:39 evilfatsh1t wrote:Show nested quote +On November 05 2012 15:08 hkimmy wrote:
I've been wondering since heroes like silencer can orb-walk and cast spells while in ethereal form, could ghost scepter be a viable item from him as well? I mean, although in ethereal form you take the extra magic damage, you are already going to be silencing most heroes anyhow. You could practically be invulnerable while attacking for a short period of time. yeah only problem is when you get items like orchid, treads and other attack speed buffing items, your orbwalking is slower than your auto attack. sometimes even up to half the speed
not if u hit w click fast enough yo
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EPT
