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Prophet is an awful teamfighter in general anway (far better at ganks which don't need a mek). Mek on prophet is great for pushes but prophet is a split-pusher not a team-pusher.
The midas allows you to keep up on experience while using global tp to gank (very important). It also allows you to accelerate your level 11 and 16 timings AND it allows you to save your ultimate for fights while still having an obscene income.
Prophet is an opportunistic hero all the way until sheep stick. Before that item, he isn't really forcing the issue anywhere so a midas isn't preventing him from making stuff happen. Prophet wants to either see no enemy heroes or jump on an enemy hero to make it 2 or 3 vs 1. None of that requires any items per se so you might as well midas it up. Again, prophet plays PvE plus a few ganks with his TP and ult. No need for fighting items until hex allows him to start making stuff happen. Midas just makes sense. Plus holla holla get dolla etc.
E: once again I'm slower and less insightful than Yango. Ah well.
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ah ok those are some good answers. To continue the item discussion what is the place of necrobook on furion in you guys opinion. I like to get it after shadow blade, unless hex is really important(against a carry with low charges bkb, a single core line up, et)
Gives some good stats and sick split pushing. Any thoughts?
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would only get it when involved in an all in push strat, base race or split pushing only games. doesnt provide good enough combat stats/skills and is good to drop towers with, but doesnt actually help you clear creeps as fast as some other items. if you intend on teamfighting at all then there are better items to get (orchid,hex,mek or proper damage items)
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Necrobook on prophet is essentially saying "I *NEVER* want to fight. Rat Doto 4lyfe!"
Not that necrobook creeps are useless during a fight, just that so many other items that cost the same amount allow prophet to fight much much better while still offering some solid split-push potential (hex + right-click items basically).
E: I mean, rat doto is a pretty legit strat on prophet, but seriously a right-click built prophet split pushes just as fast, if a bit later into the game.
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United States47024 Posts
That's actually not quite right. Necrobook is a fantastic teamfight item when your team is the aggressor face-rushing the enemy back-line. The necrobook units do this very well and the Endurance Aura supplements your teammates doing this as well.
The thing is, this tends to be quite a rare scenario because Furion is an escape-less back-line hero that typically needs a lot of coverage against facerush heroes himself, so outside of occasional pubs, you don't run into this scenario very often.
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On August 20 2013 01:42 Sn0_Man wrote:
Necrobook on prophet is essentially saying "I *NEVER* want to fight. Rat Doto 4lyfe!"
Not that necrobook creeps are useless during a fight, just that so many other items that cost the same amount allow prophet to fight much much better while still offering some solid split-push potential (hex + right-click items basically).
E: I mean, rat doto is a pretty legit strat on prophet, but seriously a right-click built prophet split pushes just as fast, if a bit later into the game.
If you go into the game thinking of a pushing build midas, necro3, deso, ac is the way. (better throw in a lothar somewhere). Nothing compares to necro in pushing and it is also decent in teamfights, although it's very annoying to have your necro's stolen by chen, ench, hotd users. The good thing is that you don't even have to be on the lane to get the tower because you can just leave the necros if you think the situation is too risky.
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On August 20 2013 01:42 Sn0_Man wrote:
Necrobook on prophet is essentially saying "I *NEVER* want to fight. Rat Doto 4lyfe!"
Not that necrobook creeps are useless during a fight, just that so many other items that cost the same amount allow prophet to fight much much better while still offering some solid split-push potential (hex + right-click items basically).
E: I mean, rat doto is a pretty legit strat on prophet, but seriously a right-click built prophet split pushes just as fast, if a bit later into the game.
Pretty sure Hex+Necro 3 is comparable damage to Hex+One Dmg item. Especially if you mana burn the hero that is hexed too.
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I saw bone7 go midas into phase necrobook in a progame. Really cool build. You shouldnt forget is mad dps for the cost also you could argue that its more reliable split push then a shadow blade because you can just walk away from your summoned units and still have a good push going. Something to experiment with imo
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I feel that Desolator is underutilized by most prophets. That -6 armor really helps when you are pushing down towers and makes his splitpush that much faster. It's also pretty cheap compared to a lot of other items.
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Now I finally understand... ty for sharing.
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Just wondering what's the best way to counter SB with NP.
When you cast trees around him before his charge hits will that stop it?
Or alternatively if you put your trees around yourself will that stop it from hitting?
I assume the best counter for this, as with any hero without a proper disable is to get scythe and have that shit ready for when he's coming.
(Unless SB bkb charges)
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let him charge you, then sprout yourself + tp away, that's what I would do at least. (if anyone has a better suggestion please let me know)
What I really want to know is how to play furion when there's a nyx assassin on the enemy team because he can basically instagib you and by the time you see him, it's already too late.
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Against Spirit Breaker you need to play off the map dota. Only appear if you have team mates close by, or you have vision of SB. Any time you don't see him for a while, assume he's charging for you. It's annoying to play against, but SB is pretty much a snowball hero. If you can minimize his game impact and waste his time by baiting him into unproductive charges then eventually you'll outfarm him/create a lot of space for your team. At lower levels, I think ult spamming would be ok too, since your team probably doesn't know how to farm properly anyways. If you keep the lanes pushed out, it becomes really obvious when SB is charging ( since if nobody goes to defend a tower, it means their smoked/charging/planning to kill you).
Playing against a Nyx is pretty much the same thing as Spirit Breaker, except sort of easier until Nyx grabs a blink dagger because of Nyx's early game reliance on Vendetta. Once again, try to gather information on when/where Nyx was last spotted then rotate yourself to somewhere else on the map. Alternatively, if you feel confident that you won't lose it, gem is a good pickup to put Nyx on the back foot or grab a Necro 3. Whenever you decide to push, you should also carry a sentry.
The duration of Vendetta is quite prohibitive at lvl 1 (only 15 seconds), so if you can stunt Nyx's level development or put him on the backfoot, then he won't hit lvl 11 and 16 so quickly, which will make it easier for you to track his movements.
Note: Sprouting yourself won't do anything against charge. Once you have scythe you can just sheep him too.
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^ thanks for the advice! To clarify, I meant sprouting yourself after you get hit by the charge. Once SB starts to charges you, I believe the charge hits no matter what until he cancels it.
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Well if you are caught out like that getting a sprout off is pretty hard, since better players will stutter step their hits so that they'll be "hugging you", also quelling blades (sprout also has a pretty long cast animation/turn rate factor). Not to mention with the movespeed aura, SB will generally move faster than you. It's definitely viable though, but not really something you want to rely on and not nearly as safe as not getting charged in the first place.
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On September 05 2012 23:43 Aixler wrote:My favorite Nature's Prophet build: The idea behind this build is to be strong in the first 10 minutes, which leads to better ganking/farming and pushing. You get int and mana regen, instead of barely getting out a midas. With that strong early start and an Orchid you can be more dominant on the map, leading to better performance and farm than the midas. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/frwcv.jpg) You go jungle, get lots of mana regen from the components from int treads and orchid. Using that mana you farm forest real fast and have mana to tp, kill and push. Afterwards you'll have mana to continue jungling. You should have Orchid+Treads at around minute 14 if you jungle efficiently and help push/kill. Now when you are in a fight, you bring a 5 second silence, much better than a hand of midas or an urn. The orchid helps with your damage output. Next up I usually go for Scythe of Vyse, which is doable around 20-27 min. Suddenly in a teamfight you have a ton of control instead of just auto attack damage. I transition into Manta Style for easy pushing, some defense and kill potential. If the game isn't over yet add in a MKB and Deadalus for highest damage, cancelling tps with some luck and true strike. As soon as you get your orchid, but especially as you get more items, you are able to solo kill. Teleport in close, right behind a tree, open with silence+sprout (depending on enemy hero/items) and start hitting. Optional item would be a Desolator if your team has plenty of control and needs a damage dealer. This would be your first item after orchid, replacing MKB in your build. In some extreme cases, once you have a full inventory, you can replace your treads with Satanic as damage/survivability will be more important than move speed.
What people need to understand about playing NP, Midas is not always best option. This build I like actually when looking it over since it can deal with many hard carry heros and make them squishy. For example a PA who has dodge loses her passive while sheepstick making her an easy kill etc. (Right click damage). Playing a hero is one thing but getting the right items versus the right heros will bring you and your team to easy wins!
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On August 26 2013 09:03 krez wrote:
Just wondering what's the best way to counter SB with NP.
When you cast trees around him before his charge hits will that stop it?
Or alternatively if you put your trees around yourself will that stop it from hitting?
I assume the best counter for this, as with any hero without a proper disable is to get scythe and have that shit ready for when he's coming.
(Unless SB bkb charges)
let him bash u, then ult you. then pray he doesnt RNG greater bash you again with auto attack and hit your ghost scepter then TP out.
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ghost scepter doesnt work with tp.
oh you meant the skill lol
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Spirit Breaker destroys him so hard that it's not even funny.
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EPT
