EPT
Edit: Just learned he has played with the OG tag for months, as he was theier signed sub.
OG Discussion - Page 26
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Atoissen
Norway1737 Posts
Edit: Just learned he has played with the OG tag for months, as he was theier signed sub. | ||
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Dracolich70
Denmark3820 Posts
On August 27 2016 02:44 hariooo wrote: I am happy to discover you are not gonna condemn Fly forever, even if he chickened out. People make mistakes all the time it's not like I'm gonna condemn Fly forever. That being said the timeline doesn't look good. Moon implies he got kicked as soon as he got back so unless you're suggesting Fly only made up his mind while Moon was in flight the more likely explanation is just that he balked at doing it face to face. | ||
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Anamorph
236 Posts
On August 27 2016 02:03 Dracolich70 wrote: Fly is not a business employer, but a kid that plays DotA. Even people employed to kick friends from companies loathe this side of things. Some even crack completely, and quit themselves. Fly is a kind and giving person, so it is not far off, that it hurts him personally. If he was a d**k it would be easy. Furthermore I reckon Moon deserved to know as soon as the decision was made, which was most likely when face to face was not an option. I am not fond of them not sorting out issues, but that is another thing entirely. Having a personal conversation - that s how it works with friends, thats how it works as a business employer, thats how it works in regular sport (soccer, handball etc.). | ||
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Racket
3023 Posts
On August 27 2016 02:03 Dracolich70 wrote: Fly is not a business employer, but a kid that plays DotA. Even people employed to kick friends from companies loathe this side of things. Some even crack completely, and quit themselves. Fly is a kind and giving person, so it is not far off, that it hurts him personally. If he was a d**k it would be easy. Furthermore I reckon Moon deserved to know as soon as the decision was made, which was most likely when face to face was not an option. I am not fond of them not sorting out issues, but that is another thing entirely. People should stop calling kids these guys. They are around 25 years old, they are not kids anymore. Suma1l is still a kid and almost not anymore. The only thing that keeps them from appearing as grown ups is that they play video games and they usually behave like 15 years old kids. All in all, speaking face to face with someone you care about to say them something you decided yourself and that will probably hurt them is not easy and many people escape this kind of situations as much as they can. But Fly could have done it through Skype at least. | ||
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Dracolich70
Denmark3820 Posts
On August 27 2016 18:46 Racket wrote: I call him a kid because in relation to me he is(I was his age, when he was born). Furthermore youngsters of today mature later for each generation, which explains the immaturity in the scene/community. When you couple this knowledge of the slow maturity curve, and add in they are people that are behind computers ever since they were teens, they are even less evolved.People should stop calling kids these guys. They are around 25 years old, they are not kids anymore. Suma1l is still a kid and almost not anymore. The only thing that keeps them from appearing as grown ups is that they play video games and they usually behave like 15 years old kids. All in all, speaking face to face with someone you care about to say them something you decided yourself and that will probably hurt them is not easy and many people escape this kind of situations as much as they can. But Fly could have done it through Skype at least. However, that being said, I think Fly is pretty mature, but when you have emotions, and like someone, and aren't a complete d**k, it is pretty hard to have the face to face, even if that was the right thing to do. I tried to explain the natural difference in being employed to make these hard decisions, and then a pro player forced into these decisions. It was an unfair comparison, and suggests people pass judgments without the understanding of the things in question. Do you even know the situation in detail? Lastly, Fly is 23. | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
On August 28 2016 00:52 Dracolich70 wrote: I call him a kid because in relation to me he is(I was his age, when he was born). Furthermore youngsters of today mature later for each generation, which explains the immaturity in the scene/community. When you couple this knowledge of the slow maturity curve, and add in they are people that are behind computers ever since they were teens, they are even less evolved. However, that being said, I think Fly is pretty mature, but when you have emotions, and like someone, and aren't a complete d**k, it is pretty hard to have the face to face, even if that was the right thing to do. I tried to explain the natural difference in being employed to make these hard decisions, and then a pro player forced into these decisions. It was an unfair comparison, and suggests people pass judgments without the understanding of the things in question. Do you even know the situation in detail? Lastly, Fly is 23. Tal shouldve made the F2F , Moon deserved to be treated better , did Tal took the EZ way , Yap he did , he didnt want to face moon reaction , is he too young to face such a scenario ? NO , he is the team leader and if he decided something he should stand behind it and explain to a guy who felt like you are his family for over a year. Not sure why you are so eager to defend him ? he just didnt want the drama , he felt bad for kicking him of course but he didnt care about him enough because if he did he would have made the talk. you dont break up with your GF via text message unless you have 0 backbone and 0 respect for her and you dont kick a guy you spent 10hours a day for over a year traveling all over the world sleeping in the same house/hotels like he was some random dude. Good luck to OG , I really like Tal as a player and a leader , but he fumbled this time around. | ||
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Dracolich70
Denmark3820 Posts
We don't know how long Fly have known this decision. We have a statement from an understandably disappointed Moon, claiming friendships are intact, but thinks people were not focused enough and probably played too much Overwatch, which is understandable considering he spammed Overwatch stuff for months on Twitter. I am very doubtful that any of these things are done face to face, nor from PPY when Fly was kicked. I do think we should hold Fly to a higher standard, but telling a friend you took with you into the team, and housed in Israel is not as easy as people seemingly like to project. Despite being in the eSport scene for many years, Fly have not done these things often, if at all, because Fnatic were the by far longest standing team. I think the reason why people do not understand this, is that youngsters of today, toss away friendships on end as part of the buy and toss away generations, and it doesn't seem like a big deal, which it probably isn't on most occations for these reasons. | ||
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Racket
3023 Posts
On August 28 2016 00:52 Dracolich70 wrote: I call him a kid because in relation to me he is(I was his age, when he was born). Furthermore youngsters of today mature later for each generation, which explains the immaturity in the scene/community. When you couple this knowledge of the slow maturity curve, and add in they are people that are behind computers ever since they were teens, they are even less evolved. However, that being said, I think Fly is pretty mature, but when you have emotions, and like someone, and aren't a complete d**k, it is pretty hard to have the face to face, even if that was the right thing to do. I tried to explain the natural difference in being employed to make these hard decisions, and then a pro player forced into these decisions. It was an unfair comparison, and suggests people pass judgments without the understanding of the things in question. Do you even know the situation in detail? Lastly, Fly is 23. "They are around 25 years old" those were my words. But anyway I am not saying anything bad about him, I expected something different from him. He had his reasons, kid, adolescent or grown up doesn't matter in the end. There is a lot of people a lot older than him who can't do it so if he doesn't the only one who can care enough is Moon. | ||
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SpeaKEaSY
United States1070 Posts
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nanaoei
3358 Posts
the person it's done to will feel an empty gap of obligation of sense of mutual respect because that is what you would have done for them. this is at least how i've felt before. however, there's nothing you can do except work up the courage and timings to talk it out in earnest with no judgment. some people just fold or don't consider these things, and they just so happen to be people you trust and share in everything about life the most. i don't think it matters what he should have done, the outcome and the decisions leading to it would be just about the same. the moment someone decides not to work it out (or that it's not worth it to) is what should be in contention, that's when that level of respect goes away, and maybe for these two it had gone that deep before. maybe not, who knows. | ||
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common_cider
342 Posts
2. ana 3. s4 4. jerax 5. fly http://imgur.com/a/AzEIM the usual is jerax | ||
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caiovigg
Brazil1802 Posts
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common_cider
342 Posts
On August 30 2016 07:40 caiovigg wrote: so, who is ana? http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Ana | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
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nothingmuch
448 Posts
(neither do I) | ||
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Anamorph
236 Posts
On August 31 2016 18:49 nothingmuch wrote: Gentle reminder that everyone criticising Flys bedside manner does not know the reason for Moons kick in the first place. (neither do I) There is no reason to not do it face2face, thats the point. Even if moon was toxic in a person, you still have to do it in a personal conversation. They lived together, won 2 majors together, they called each other friends, they were in a business relationship too, so thats just what a person deserves. | ||
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nothingmuch
448 Posts
You don't know anything about what happened. Might want to go a little easy on the judgement. There are plenty of reasons why Fly may not have done it face to face and while people certainly could be right and Fly just didn't man up, this is as clear a case as there has ever been of "you don't know what you're talking about". Literally. | ||
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Racket
3023 Posts
On August 31 2016 19:38 nothingmuch wrote: Moon accidentally shot Flys Grandma. They were on a shoting range for fun, and Moon fucked up and accidentally hit Flys Grandma. She was sent to the hospital and it seemed like she'd be ok, but then she died during Moons flight home. You don't know anything about what happened. Might want to go a little easy on the judgement. There are plenty of reasons why Fly may not have done it face to face and while people certainly could be right and Fly just didn't man up, this is as clear a case as there has ever been of "you don't know what you're talking about". Literally. Well, no one is killing him nor making him cry. These are just opinions and I don't believe anyone here desire the worst for him either. Of course no one knows what happened, but if everyone is forbid to even make an assumption and share their thoughts on that assumption then all threads would be empty. Of course there is more to talk about (and even more certain) in DC's thread where Misery pulled a Ppy after criticizing him, but not everyone wants to talk about it. Free the people now. | ||
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Faruko
Chile34171 Posts
s4, ana, jerax, notail and fly | ||
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spudde123
4814 Posts
s4 going offlane is also pretty cool. | ||
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