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On August 30 2012 02:36 Black Gun wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 02:27 Markwerf wrote:On August 30 2012 01:49 kafkaesque wrote:
I'm getting really frustrated with my WW-Barbarian...
It feels like I'm dying way too frequently, and although I've increased my mitigation, LoH and Vitality, that doesn't seem to change much. I'm fine as long as there are a bunch of mobs around, but once I've killed the minions and only the Yellow stands, I drop faster than I can leech.
Quill beasts, Spear Throwers, Molochs (those evasive flying fuckers...) and especially those fat wizards who shield themselves... they all take AGES to kill and it's hard to even keep berserker up. If berserker isn't up, however, I drop like a sack of potatoes.
When the run is finished, which takes me about 1:10 hour (fields of slaughter + cave, bridge of corsik, keep depths 1-3, core of arreat), I hardly break even gold-wise and since 1.04 hit, I haven't sold a single mid-range item, even if I undercut the current market by 50%-75%... I'm not a fan of the WW build either. I won't deny it's probably the best build by far for quick farming IF you have great gear but I don't like the style of it and don't think it works well if you don't have super gear. sorry, but what are you talking about? after the latest inferno nerf, it is easily possible to make a ww/sprint barb that can clear act3 conveniently with gear for 10M.
ye for 10M you can easily but it's much harder for 1-2M. Also I doubt that for anything lower than 10M a WW build is as fast as a build with rend, the WW build is much more expensive to get some decent DPS and you're main source of damage is the tornadoes from sprint who don't do nearly as much damage as rend. Yes you move faster in between creeps, but some stuff like goblins and kiting mobs are also much more troublesome for WW.
For just spider/azmo runs etc I doubt you can get an efficient WW build on 5M while it's not too hard with rend because you don't need a critical amount of expensive affixes to sustain the build. Attack speed, life on hit, crit chance/dmg, good quality emeralds are a neccesity for an efficient WW build I think, not so much with revenge/rend.
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We'll soon see - I actually just fully kitted out a friend's new 60 barb for whirlwind yesterday (every single piece of equipment bought brand new from AH) for 3.4m gold. I'm interested to see how he does 
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On August 30 2012 00:51 Kazeyonoma wrote:Show nested quote +On August 29 2012 12:34 Sylvr wrote:On August 29 2012 04:57 Kazeyonoma wrote:So i updated some pieces last night, http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Kazeyonoma-1662/hero/14226got my loh back up to 1400 or so, my health is up to 37k now, still gunning for 41-45k if i can. replaced my old bulkathos with a newer one that had crit chance on it, replaced my bracers with a decent strongarm bracers, replaced my other ring with one that had crit chance and focused mostly on getting my life up (hence no str, but vit AND %life) Think my helm will be the next thing to replace, i need to farm pretty hard though to get enough to buy a decent andariels, but I'm worried my AR will drop too long doing so. I can kill stuff in act 3, but I occasionally just drop dead from damage and I have to believe it's because my AR/defensive stats aren't sufficient, but I'm okay with being a bit of a glass cannon (it beats mindnumblingly boring act 1 farming) Not sure if I should replace my kymbo's gold for anything, everything seems way overpriced right now, and it is giving me some decent LOH, life%, and str. I know crit would be ideal, but those cost way more than I'd be able to afford right now. Any other ideas for gear upgrades? I saw a weapon upgrade or two, but they come in the 5mill+ range, for marginal upgrades in dps, mostly just to ditch the extraneous stats of dex/int i have, to get vit, and/or crit damage. searching for 1hand axe, str, vit, loh > 500, and sorting by dps maxes out around 970 or so for my price range, and felt it just wasn't worth the investment to see marginal gains. All that %Life you're running is wasted without a solid VIT foundation. Also, it seems to me that you're getting the wrong stats in the wrong slots. Some slots favor certain stats, which makes them cheaper than having that same stat in another piece. What jumped out at me was the low STR on your belt, and no VIT. The AR on it is awesome, but is it really worth missing out on 250+ STR and 100+ VIT? Even if you get a belt with 0 AR, you could easily make it back up on your bracers if you drop 50-100 STR from them, and still have a net gain of both VIT and STR. I also think the body could be better if you drop some STR and make it up in a 3rd socket while also picking up some VIT and higher AR (Body with STR, VIT, AR, 3 Sockets). Your gloves are the same way. Offensive stats are cheaper on gloves because people craft the hell out of them and the market is saturated. Ideally, you want CC, IAS, CD, and STR on gloves. If you absolutely can't stand to drop the AR or VIT, then I'd say the CD is easiest to give up, as it is a pure damage stat whereas everything else contributes to survivability/sustainability. Also, 4.5% Crit is way too low on Gloves. They can get up to 10%, which means the stat doesn't start to get expensive till around 8%+. I wanna say your LOH is a bit overkill. I would drop it from the Amulet and get something with 7-8% Crit, STR and VIT and either IAS or CD if you can afford it. Oh, and your pants have much room for improvement. You could probably get all of those same stats + 2 sockets for fairly cheap. Regarding everything I've posted above: What's cheap for one person might be a fortune for someone else. Generally, I consider a piece cheap if it's under 1m since I can farm that up in A1 in a few hours even without any sellable drops (in other words, just from gold pickup and vendoring blues and bad yellows, or selling Essences if that's what you do). Some people who farm A3 with ease might consider 5m cheap, or sometimes even 10m if they're constantly finding high-end loot to sell. With 1m per slot MAX (probably much cheaper), and some knowledge of which stats to look for in which slot, I think you could improve at least a few things. Edit: Oh, and about your weapons, you should be able to get an offhand with 900+ LOH and drop it from your mainhand altogether, which should make it easy for you to get a ~1k mainhand with socket and at least some stats for a net gain in damage. Also, if you switch your offhand to dagger for lower average attack speed, your LOH will go further (which means it won't hurt as much to lose some). Thanks, I actually improved my gear last night since you wrote this (but before i read this post!) my life is now up to 51k (i swapped out some gems from str to vit, figured if i survive, i can fight, who cares if i lose 1k dps here or there if i keep dying). Here's my updated gear setup: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Kazeyonoma-1662/hero/14226I'll look to replacing the pants, gloves, and belt per your suggestion, this type of advice is EXACTLY the stuff I needed to know, i know some things are 'better' for stats than others, but everytime I searched, things just looked... the same. I'm pretty tapped out right now in gold after buying the pieces I have now, I'm back up to over 1400 loh mostly just from my offhand, and mainhand combo. I'll look to find a 1k+ mainhand axe with 100 or so loh, which'll keep me just above 1.1k LOH i think. If not, than i'll just sit at a flat 1005 LOH but with a 1k mainhand. I know I have a lot of % life, but man did it make huge jumps once i started bulking up my vit. I dropped about 100 str, but gained 350-400 or so vit, combined with my +49% life modifier, has just made me so much more survivable. I actually was able to go into act 3 last night and almost do a full clear. I had to call it quits after Cydaea(sp?) because I was getting tired and it was late, but overall it was very fun, I'm getting the hang of how to properly use the build too, which is great. Any tips for fighting bosses? Strangely enough on Ghom and Siegebreaker, I couldn't just sprint/ww them to death as I kept losing fury too quickly, something that never happens on regular monsters, even solo ones like the big armored monsters that cover their face when initially damaged. Is there something special about the bosses that make it so I can't crit them as much? Also, would you suggest doing full clears like I've been doing from basically lighting the torches all the way to Cydaea or should I just jump straight to say siege breaker because the outside field is so easy to abuse the sprint/ww with, there's a ton of elites there I can round up and kill in large droves, and then just take down siegebreaker, and either go finish act, or restart game and rinse/repeat for fast runs. I've always just been in act 1 so being able to do it like this now is just mindblowing to me. For the first time since pre-60, my barb feels like a barb again from d2, just whirlwinding the shit out of things, having life dip low but bounce back up from lifesteal(LOH in this case), and having a ton of fun. Thanks everyone who's helped out, I'm getting close to sustainable I think, and once I reach that, I hope I can begin my lifelong journey of chain farming stuff like I did in d2... i even sold some stuff for $ last night woo!
I'm glad I could help. Hopefully Hairy can double-check some of my advice and make sure I'm not talking out of my ass. He's the real authority on the WW build in this thread, from what I can tell.
As for running out of fury vs bosses, it depends on your gear. The more IAS and CC you have, the fewer tornados you can sustain with. As it stands, I can usually sustain with 2 tornados unless I just get unlucky with RNG. 3 is basically guaranteed to keep my fury maxed. Are you just bouncing back and forth through them, or are you spinning around them? Try just sprinting around them and WWing occasionally instead of continuously and get a feel for how long you can hold the trigger before your run dry.
Something odd that I found was that, as your gear gets better, you actually use WW LESS. The reason being is that mobs will often die before Into the Fray can fill your fury back up. WW just becomes a utility skill for getting out of corners and for laying down tornados inside mobs rather than around them (when necessary), These days, I typically just use small bursts of WW rather than holding it like I did when I was a 10k DPS tornado barb. Though I do still tend to use it continuously on large stationary bosses like Azmodan and Ghom and Siegebreaker... I don't know why you aren't able to sustain on them. You probably have too low of CC and IAS. Try to make those Gloves and Amulet changes I mentioned, and for your offhand, look for a Dagger.
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On August 30 2012 08:20 Hairy wrote:We'll soon see - I actually just fully kitted out a friend's new 60 barb for whirlwind yesterday (every single piece of equipment bought brand new from AH) for 3.4m gold. I'm interested to see how he does
I built my friends new WW Barb for 6M the other day too. Some of the gear we found was better than mine, lol. I told him he's lucky I liked him or I would have bought the shit for upgrades for myself and gave him hand-me-downs, lol. I still have a bit higher damage than he does, but his defensive stats are all slightly better.
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Okay so I havn't exactly played much in months...I quit a few days after 1.03 released. Anywho, I plan to be switching to this WW/sprint build everyone seems to be using. I have done quite a bit of research and have farmed up some money over the past few days to begin building a good set that can efficiently clear A3. I have about 25M to spend.
Here is my current gear: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Bairemuth-1169/hero/788725
*note: i will change my skills once I buy new pieces
So as of now here is what I'm thinking of upgrading with first priorities on top...
Item: What I want
MH mace: 950+ dps, 700+ LoH, with socket
OH axe: 700+ dps, 700+ LoH with crit damage + socket
Boots: Move Speed 10%+, 60+ AR, STR or VIT
Ammy: Crit 7%+, STR/VIT, and then either crit damage or attack speed (ignoring AR)
Helm: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR or VIT with socket
Ring 2: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR or VIT
Bracers: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR and VIT
*note: I have a pair of gloves with: roughly 65 STR/VIT, 6.5% crit, 29% crit dmg, 53 AR (is this good enough, or should I drop a stat to find greater gains in the rest of the stats?)
Anywho, I'm just wondering if I'm working towards the right type of gear setup. Which stats are most valuable? For example, what kind of AR / HP numbers should i be working towards to be able to comfortably survive A3. Any tips on what stats have the most bang for their buck would be greatly appreciated. I'm kind of scared to begin making purchases until I have a full understanding on the direction I should be going.
Thank you to anyone willing to offer advice
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On August 30 2012 10:26 Bairemuth wrote:Okay so I havn't exactly played much in months...I quit a few days after 1.03 released. Anywho, I plan to be switching to this WW/sprint build everyone seems to be using. I have done quite a bit of research and have farmed up some money over the past few days to begin building a good set that can efficiently clear A3. I have about 25M to spend. Here is my current gear: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Bairemuth-1169/hero/788725*note: i will change my skills once I buy new pieces So as of now here is what I'm thinking of upgrading with first priorities on top... Item: What I want MH mace: 950+ dps, 700+ LoH, with socket OH axe: 700+ dps, 700+ LoH with crit damage + socket Boots: Move Speed 10%+, 60+ AR, STR or VIT Ammy: Crit 7%+, STR/VIT, and then either crit damage or attack speed (ignoring AR) Helm: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR or VIT with socket Ring 2: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR or VIT Bracers: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR and VIT *note: I have a pair of gloves with: roughly 65 STR/VIT, 6.5% crit, 29% crit dmg, 53 AR (is this good enough, or should I drop a stat to find greater gains in the rest of the stats?) Anywho, I'm just wondering if I'm working towards the right type of gear setup. Which stats are most valuable? For example, what kind of AR / HP numbers should i be working towards to be able to comfortably survive A3. Any tips on what stats have the most bang for their buck would be greatly appreciated. I'm kind of scared to begin making purchases until I have a full understanding on the direction I should be going. Thank you to anyone willing to offer advice
First off, your offhand doesn't need that much damage, as it only factors 15-20% of your damage. My own offhand has 200 DPS, and you'll see that a lot on well-geared WW Barbs. You benefit more from just getting pure stats like uber high LOH (900+), Socket, STR (200+), Increased Attack Speed, and VIT if possible (Prioritized in that order, IMO). Since you get that much LOH from your offhand, you can drop it altogether from your mainhand and just get as high of damage as you can afford (socket is nice, but it isn't always worth giving up the raw DPS. Someone else can give you the details).
Next, you're going to be sorely lacking in attack speed. Attack Speed is absolutely crucial for both your LOH and your Fury sustain. With this build, you aren't so much worried about big numbers as you are a LOT of numbers. That being said, you ideally want an Axe mainhand and a Dagger offhand, though you can get away with Mace/Dagger or Axe/Sword. Mace/Sword is doable, but I wouldn't recommend it. Mace/Axe or worse is suicide if you ask me. The correct weapon combo is the reason you can get away with only 900-1000 LOH instead of the 1400+ that used to be the norm before people solved it.
But don't stop there with the Attack Speed. Get some in your gloves for sure, and I would even reserve 1 ring for that over Crit% (both stats if you can afford it). You can try to get some in Amulet and Offhand too if you want, but don't give up TOO much damage for it.
Also, don't go too overboard with the Crit%. You have 5 natural, 5 from Bloodlust, 10 from Weapons Master, and 3 from Battle Rage for a total of 23% off the bat. If you just add another 20% from gear, you can then prioritize stuff like AR, VIT, and armor to make sure you don't get one-shotted by anything, and then STR and Crit Damage to add DPS.
Also note that your character sheet DPS will show that you lose a shit load of damage from using a low DPS offhand, but this is WRONG. As Hairy mentioned some posts up, the character sheet assumes that you use your weapons 50/50, but with this build it's actually either 85/15, or 80/20 (I've heard both. I'm not sure which is correct), which means that stats are infinitely more important for your offhand than raw DPS since they boost the damage that your mainhand does, which is where a vast majority of your damage actually comes from!
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On August 30 2012 11:02 Sylvr wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 10:26 Bairemuth wrote:Okay so I havn't exactly played much in months...I quit a few days after 1.03 released. Anywho, I plan to be switching to this WW/sprint build everyone seems to be using. I have done quite a bit of research and have farmed up some money over the past few days to begin building a good set that can efficiently clear A3. I have about 25M to spend. Here is my current gear: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Bairemuth-1169/hero/788725*note: i will change my skills once I buy new pieces So as of now here is what I'm thinking of upgrading with first priorities on top... Item: What I want MH mace: 950+ dps, 700+ LoH, with socket OH axe: 700+ dps, 700+ LoH with crit damage + socket Boots: Move Speed 10%+, 60+ AR, STR or VIT Ammy: Crit 7%+, STR/VIT, and then either crit damage or attack speed (ignoring AR) Helm: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR or VIT with socket Ring 2: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR or VIT Bracers: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR and VIT *note: I have a pair of gloves with: roughly 65 STR/VIT, 6.5% crit, 29% crit dmg, 53 AR (is this good enough, or should I drop a stat to find greater gains in the rest of the stats?) Anywho, I'm just wondering if I'm working towards the right type of gear setup. Which stats are most valuable? For example, what kind of AR / HP numbers should i be working towards to be able to comfortably survive A3. Any tips on what stats have the most bang for their buck would be greatly appreciated. I'm kind of scared to begin making purchases until I have a full understanding on the direction I should be going. Thank you to anyone willing to offer advice First off, your offhand doesn't need that much damage, as it only factors 15-20% of your damage. My own offhand has 200 DPS, and you'll see that a lot on well-geared WW Barbs. You benefit more from just getting pure stats like uber high LOH (900+), Socket, STR (200+), Increased Attack Speed, and VIT if possible (Prioritized in that order, IMO). Since you get that much LOH from your offhand, you can drop it altogether from your mainhand and just get as high of damage as you can afford (socket is nice, but it isn't always worth giving up the raw DPS. Someone else can give you the details). Next, you're going to be sorely lacking in attack speed. Attack Speed is absolutely crucial for both your LOH and your Fury sustain. With this build, you aren't so much worried about big numbers as you are a LOT of numbers. That being said, you ideally want an Axe mainhand and a Dagger offhand, though you can get away with Mace/Dagger or Axe/Sword. Mace/Sword is doable, but I wouldn't recommend it. Mace/Axe or worse is suicide if you ask me. The correct weapon combo is the reason you can get away with only 900-1000 LOH instead of the 1400+ that used to be the norm before people solved it. But don't stop there with the Attack Speed. Get some in your gloves for sure, and I would even reserve 1 ring for that over Crit% (both stats if you can afford it). You can try to get some in Amulet and Offhand too if you want, but don't give up TOO much damage for it. Also, don't go too overboard with the Crit%. You have 5 natural, 5 from Bloodlust, 10 from Weapons Master, and 3 from Battle Rage for a total of 23% off the bat. If you just add another 20% from gear, you can then prioritize stuff like AR, VIT, and armor to make sure you don't get one-shotted by anything, and then STR and Crit Damage to add DPS. Also note that your character sheet DPS will show that you lose a shit load of damage from using a low DPS offhand, but this is WRONG. As Hairy mentioned some posts up, the character sheet assumes that you use your weapons 50/50, but with this build it's actually either 85/15, or 80/20 (I've heard both. I'm not sure which is correct), which means that stats are infinitely more important for your offhand than raw DPS since they boost the damage that your mainhand does, which is where a vast majority of your damage actually comes from!
Wow, thank you so much for this information!! I did not realize the uselessness of the OH weapon dps. But I was under the assumption that WW relies greatly on OH damage and much more significant than 80/20. And it is good that you brought up attack speed because I pretty much ignored it after the 1.03 nerf, but i guess it's definitely not useless! And yeah I plan to shoot for an axe / dagger combo then. For some reason I assumed with the weapon spec I was going for 2 axe / mace combo type thing, but obviously the OH doesn't matter (good to know). I was hoping to hit 50% crit or so total, but if this is overkill then maybe I will prioritize other stats such as attack speed, ar, vit, etc. Thanks again
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Hello, i need some help of experienced barbarians.
So this is my character
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Kronos-1233/hero/4713789
But i die in act 2 i mean i finished but with help from my friends (its easier) but when i farm alone, most of the elites kill me, i have in total 1041 of LoH and with war cry i have 774-850 all resist.
My build is like... some point in the midle of WW doble tornado and some random stuff. Also i noticed that in the build it appears cleave, but in reality i use frenzy or bash for the fury, i jsut changed it to cleave to see something, but i think i'll use frenzy because of the LoH.
I would like to farm act 2 (i farm ac 1 so easily that i can change my pants and gloves for lvl 23 items that give me +exp and i still dont die.. but in act 2 i mean i can very well kill the normal mobs but i have problems with most of the elites) so.. what do you think that i should change?
i would appreciate you help a lot
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On August 30 2012 13:49 Straxis wrote:Hello, i need some help of experienced barbarians. So this is my character http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Kronos-1233/hero/4713789But i die in act 2 i mean i finished but with help from my friends (its easier) but when i farm alone, most of the elites kill me, i have in total 1041 of LoH and with war cry i have 774-850 all resist. My build is like... some point in the midle of WW doble tornado and some random stuff. Also i noticed that in the build it appears cleave, but in reality i use frenzy or bash for the fury, i jsut changed it to cleave to see something, but i think i'll use frenzy because of the LoH. I would like to farm act 2 (i farm ac 1 so easily that i can change my pants and gloves for lvl 23 items that give me +exp and i still dont die.. but in act 2 i mean i can very well kill the normal mobs but i have problems with most of the elites) so.. what do you think that i should change? i would appreciate you help a lot
If you are going for a WW build, you need to go completely for it. The build is based on the synergy between crits, battle rage (with into the fray) and sprint (with run like the wind). Sprint tornadoes attack fast generating lots of crits which give you fury through into the fray and you then use that fury to keep sprinting and spinning. If you don't have those three things (lots of crit on your gear, battle rage + into the fray and sprint + run like the wind), you aren't really doing the WW build.
It is a little hard to see what your goal is, but I would recommend carefully reading through the last 10 pages of this thread, there is a lot of very good and well explained information in here.
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On August 30 2012 13:49 Straxis wrote:Hello, i need some help of experienced barbarians. So this is my character http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Kronos-1233/hero/4713789But i die in act 2 i mean i finished but with help from my friends (its easier) but when i farm alone, most of the elites kill me, i have in total 1041 of LoH and with war cry i have 774-850 all resist. My build is like... some point in the midle of WW doble tornado and some random stuff. Also i noticed that in the build it appears cleave, but in reality i use frenzy or bash for the fury, i jsut changed it to cleave to see something, but i think i'll use frenzy because of the LoH. I would like to farm act 2 (i farm ac 1 so easily that i can change my pants and gloves for lvl 23 items that give me +exp and i still dont die.. but in act 2 i mean i can very well kill the normal mobs but i have problems with most of the elites) so.. what do you think that i should change? i would appreciate you help a lot
Well my first advice is simple. What are you trying to build. When you have a plan, then you can build around it and adjust items accordingly. So choose a build.
My 2nd advice is also simple, your gear has low amounts of str & vit. Just going straight for items that has above 150str on every slot with some vit & decent(60+) resist should do you fine. However, this goes back to the first point. What do you want to build.
There's Tranq Tanky DPS barb, there's the Tornado and there's the 2handed rend/seismic slam builds. In other words when you've chosen a path then we can suggest to you what you need etc.
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On August 30 2012 09:40 Sylvr wrote:
I'm glad I could help. Hopefully Hairy can double-check some of my advice and make sure I'm not talking out of my ass. He's the real authority on the WW build in this thread, from what I can tell.
Everything seemed spot on, so I didn't feel a need to comment 
Something odd that I found was that, as your gear gets better, you actually use WW LESS. The reason being is that mobs will often die before Into the Fray can fill your fury back up. WW just becomes a utility skill for getting out of corners and for laying down tornados inside mobs rather than around them (when necessary), These days, I typically just use small bursts of WW rather than holding it like I did when I was a 10k DPS tornado barb. Though I do still tend to use it continuously on large stationary bosses like Azmodan and Ghom and Siegebreaker... I don't know why you aren't able to sustain on them. You probably have too low of CC and IAS. Try to make those Gloves and Amulet changes I mentioned, and for your offhand, look for a Dagger.
I've noticed this more and more. In my full DPS gear my tornadoes are now critting for 25k+, and I am actually starting to find it noticeably harder to keep WOTB running continuously because things just die before they give me the fury required. Whirlwind definitely just gets applied in little dashes here and there, now.
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On August 30 2012 10:26 Bairemuth wrote:Okay so I havn't exactly played much in months...I quit a few days after 1.03 released. Anywho, I plan to be switching to this WW/sprint build everyone seems to be using. I have done quite a bit of research and have farmed up some money over the past few days to begin building a good set that can efficiently clear A3. I have about 25M to spend. Here is my current gear: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Bairemuth-1169/hero/788725*note: i will change my skills once I buy new pieces So as of now here is what I'm thinking of upgrading with first priorities on top... Item: What I want MH mace: 950+ dps, 700+ LoH, with socket OH axe: 700+ dps, 700+ LoH with crit damage + socket Boots: Move Speed 10%+, 60+ AR, STR or VIT Ammy: Crit 7%+, STR/VIT, and then either crit damage or attack speed (ignoring AR) Helm: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR or VIT with socket Ring 2: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR or VIT Bracers: Crit 4%+, 50+ AR, STR and VIT *note: I have a pair of gloves with: roughly 65 STR/VIT, 6.5% crit, 29% crit dmg, 53 AR (is this good enough, or should I drop a stat to find greater gains in the rest of the stats?) Anywho, I'm just wondering if I'm working towards the right type of gear setup. Which stats are most valuable? For example, what kind of AR / HP numbers should i be working towards to be able to comfortably survive A3. Any tips on what stats have the most bang for their buck would be greatly appreciated. I'm kind of scared to begin making purchases until I have a full understanding on the direction I should be going. Thank you to anyone willing to offer advice
I would say not to stress too much about gear - just go buy some crit pieces on your neck, gloves, bracers, and perhaps a ring or two. Once you're at ~45%+ crit just go try the build out and see how it feels, and you'll be in a better situation to evaluate gear choices. Don't neglect attack speed; faster attacks = more crits = more fury. Ideal weapons are an offhand dagger with great stats (eg ~900 LOH, crit damage etc etc), and then a mainhand axe (or mace) with huge DPS.
On August 30 2012 11:02 Sylvr wrote:
Also note that your character sheet DPS will show that you lose a shit load of damage from using a low DPS offhand, but this is WRONG. As Hairy mentioned some posts up, the character sheet assumes that you use your weapons 50/50, but with this build it's actually either 85/15, or 80/20 (I've heard both. I'm not sure which is correct), which means that stats are infinitely more important for your offhand than raw DPS since they boost the damage that your mainhand does, which is where a vast majority of your damage actually comes from!
The reason for the 85/15, and the 80/20, is the ratio of whirlwind to sprint damage. You've heard two different numbers because they improved whirlwind's damage!
Your sprints do 4x 60% weapon damage, for a total of 240% with all tornadoes hitting
Whirlwind is 145% weapon damage (formerly 110%)
This means total DPS output max is 240% + 145% = 385% (formerly 350%)
Your offhand is only used for half of whirlwind's attacks, i.e. 72.5% damage (formerly 55%)
72.5 / 385 = 18.8% damage (formerly 15.7%)
You don't have the fury income to be able to whirlwind unless you have virtually all of your tornadoes hitting, so it's safe to say that - at MOST - your offhand's DPS contributes 18.8% of your overall. We can even take this further; it's rare to be in a situation where you are using whirlwind continuously. In fact, most of the time you are sprinting around and only using whirlwind occasionally - which makes that 18.8% DPS contribution even less.
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On August 30 2012 07:38 LingsAreBunnies wrote:
[oh thats interesting, didnt know offhand weapons were that irrelevant in damage. is there a way to more accurately calculate how much dps crit damage is "worth"? Im kinda curious where you got that 30%, Im very surprised that 676 dps with 170+ crit damage is beaten by a 930 dps no crit damage weapon. Also, how much loh can I afford to give up if I were to get a stronger mainhand, if at all or should I get some loh on my other pieces? Thanks for your help!
I was going to calculate what the benefit actually was, and what DPS weapon would be required for your mainhand weapon to be equivalent to your current one just through raw DPS, but your profile is showing a 2H build now instead of your whirlwind gear
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nowadays i realised my mace offhand is a bad idea. my Tornados hit way harder, but way slower. I find myself using Bash a lot. I do love the cold damage on my offhand though. Makes life easy fighting goblins/quillbeasts.
So i cheat. I carry my dagger offhand & my mace offhand in my inventory and switch it out as needed.
Suggestion :- if your using bash, i cant recommend Onslaught(2x reverberation) enough. It does great damage, and because it hits 3 times it can crit 3 times and activate battle rage's fury regen. Love it. And it removes knockback.
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Would using a 630dps 1H Mighty weapon, with ~280 strength and 1600LoH (no socket) be a decent OH weapon of choice for a WW barb? Was gonna junk it, but the stats seem quite nice
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http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Porouscloud-1152/hero/5485528
So this guy has been a pet project for me tbh. Currently been using this spec, but not sure if it's optimal for a 2h build. I have no intentions of ever buying enough CC/CD to make it matter. I've been doing well so far in act 1/2, everything dies in one rend, and I get massive amounts of health back through ~3% lifesteal off rend.
My goal with him is just to finish the game with a 2h build, with the ultimate goal of terrible terrible damage through monstrous amounts of strength and weapon damage(CC/CD is overrated ;D)
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On August 30 2012 17:44 Mithhaike wrote:
nowadays i realised my mace offhand is a bad idea. my Tornados hit way harder, but way slower. I find myself using Bash a lot.
This doesn't quite make sense... Tornadoes always do the damage based upon your mainhand weapon. Their attack speed will either be your mainhand's attack speed, or your offhand's attack speed (it alternates when you use whirlwind). If you have a mace offhand, that just means that sometimes your tornadoes will hit slowly (1.2 speed); it doesn't mean they hit harder. You could have a 1300 DPS mace in your offhand, but it's never going to be used for sprint's damage.
I do love the cold damage on my offhand though. Makes life easy fighting goblins/quillbeasts.
So i cheat. I carry my dagger offhand & my mace offhand in my inventory and switch it out as needed.
Very much agreed on the cold weapons. I also have a cold weapon I swap to for ranged enemies. I'd suggest having a cold weapon that is an eligible mainhand replacement though; this means that tornadoes snare enemies with every hit (instead of 50% of your whirlwind attacks, if it's in your offhand).
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On August 30 2012 18:13 Truez wrote:
Would using a 630dps 1H Mighty weapon, with ~280 strength and 1600LoH (no socket) be a decent OH weapon of choice for a WW barb? Was gonna junk it, but the stats seem quite nice
1600 LOH on a 1H weapon? GIMME! 
Offhand DPS is pretty much irrelevant for a ww/sprint barb; stats are all-important. Sounds like it could be a reasonable offhand.
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On August 30 2012 18:20 Amui wrote:http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Porouscloud-1152/hero/5485528So this guy has been a pet project for me tbh. Currently been using this spec, but not sure if it's optimal for a 2h build. I have no intentions of ever buying enough CC/CD to make it matter. I've been doing well so far in act 1/2, everything dies in one rend, and I get massive amounts of health back through ~3% lifesteal off rend. My goal with him is just to finish the game with a 2h build, with the ultimate goal of terrible terrible damage through monstrous amounts of strength and weapon damage(CC/CD is overrated ;D)
You really hate crit and crit damage, don't you? :O
I don't want to sway you too much, but even just a few items with crit & crit damage will increase your DPS output by a substantial amount, not to mention fury generation.
Looking at your build, I don't see the purpose of Sprint. Because the 'Into the Fray' rune of battle rage is not a viable option for you with only 8% crit, I imagine your fury generation would be very, very slow without it. Given that you'll be wanting to be spend fury on Rend, Seismic Slam and Battle Rage as a priority, I can't see you having any fury to spare on Sprint? I'd suggest you try out 'Furious Charge' or 'Wrath of the Berserker' in that slot instead.
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EPT
