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On January 29 2011 13:08 StimedPylon wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2011 12:49 waxypants wrote:
Damages my ass....without these TV stations broadcasting the game "illegally", the StarCraft name would be nothing today. No GSL either. Blizz only started getting involved after KeSPA started selling the broadcasting rights to these stations. That's when it became illegal. Also, seeing as 80% of the SC1 and BW sales were made before 2001, OGN/MBCGame have little to do with it's popularity outside Korea since e-sports is a very small and niche market. You also forgot the countless illegal servers for BW that are still up and running in and outside Korea. Blizz should have this in the bag as far as law is concerned.
Lol
MBC/OGN had hold and broadcast tournaments long before the "Kespa sells right" incident, so by your logic it's legal lol. If so there's no reason to sue OGN/MBC, Blizz must have sued Kespa instead.
There are not "countless" illegal servers, and most of them are legal in their host country.
Also, sales of the game has little to do with esport, a game can be "popular" like WoW, but being popular has nothing to do with esport. In the other hand, MBC/OGN made esport. Without them there would be no competive SC1, and consequently, no competitive SC2.
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On January 29 2011 13:37 StimedPylon wrote:
After all the retarded shit KeSPA pulled all these years, they get no second guess chances from me. Kind of sad to see the last years of BW full of soo much pointless conflict and cock waving on both sides.
So Blizz didn't pull their own "retarded shit" by your logic ? Their "stuffs" are even more retarded to me : no LAN, claims ownership of all contents made by fans, forced transition to SC2, reserves the right to ban people whenever they like (or can I say steal 60 bucks from people whenever they like)... They just treat customers like trash there's no way they're better than Kespa. It's good to have SC2 grow and replace BW (when SC2 becomes good enough), but definitely not under Blizzard's rule.
BW is now more popular than SC2 in the whole East Asia region (which consist of Korea, China, South East Asia), the region that has the most gamers in the world (and also has the biggest population in the world). Do you honestly think USA and Europe are all that matters ? (Westerners are the guys who change games the most seriously).
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no LAN
lol pirate servers
claims ownership of all contents made by fans
All EULAs do this for games that have map editors.
forced transition to SC2
Jumping to conclusions again.
reserves the right to ban people whenever they like (or can I say steal 60 bucks from people whenever they like)
You like having maphackers in your games?
They just treat customers like trash there's no way they're better than Kespa. It's good to have SC2 grow and replace BW (when SC2 becomes good enough), but definitely not under Blizzard's rule.
BW became great under Blizzard's rule and guidance, otherwise BW would have been just another generic Warcraft clone.
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On January 29 2011 14:04 StimedPylon wrote:
BW became great under Blizzard's rule and guidance, otherwise BW would have been just another generic Warcraft clone.
Lol the guy before me was right, your posts are really gold.
Blizz has no "rule" over BW, and you even mentioned "guidance" lol. Blizz just sucks in every level.
PS : I will quit this thread from now on since I will get banned sooner or later if the arguing goes on, but at least I'm happy because I have done my duty for Beesuit BW lol.
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On January 29 2011 14:15 kamikami wrote:
PS : I will quit this thread from now on since I will get banned sooner or later if the arguing goes on, but at least I'm happy because I have done my duty for Beesuit BW lol.
you would probably do your duty for BW a lot better if you went back to the LR thread dude
not sure what a bunch of people who are not connected to the situation arguing here achieves
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I think Blizzard may have gone a bit too far, but I can understand why Blizzard is doing this. From a business point of view, E-Sports is a relatively new industry/market that has the potential to grow. However, they do need to protect their products and any form of commercialization of their products so that their current and future products are not misused or used for anything without their approval.
When Blizzard gave Gretech rights to broadcast their games, they gave them rights to multiple games, including SC: BW. So I don't really know if the forced transition part will actually be applied. Also, the exact wording also sounds a bit too vague for me. It can mean many things and not what you guys are actually thinking.
Also, it didn't have to go to court if KeSPA didn't start the leagues again. I think they should of negotiated way more before announcing new seasons for the leagues. It was like a slap to the face to Blizzard. Both sides made stupid moves in my opinion, but this part about starting the leagues again sort of made me knew that Blizzard and Gretech wasn't going to just keep negotiating anymore.
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This.
Should be required reading for everyone trying to chime in on this thread.
This case doesn't just pertain to BW/SC2. It will set a precedent on how IP rights will be handled for e-sports, especially in Korea, which is important for the long-term well-being of e-sports in general. Though it is unfortunate that Starcraft is the object of this lawsuit, it was inevitable that there would be a legal battle concerning and clarifying the general concept of IP rights in regards to e-sports. The Korean BW scene has always had very fuzzy legality, so it's no surprise that Blizzard has stepped in to clarify the rights being held between the e-sports scene and the developers themselves.
2007 wasn't just the year that SC2 was announced. It wasn't just the year the KeSPA began selling broadcasting rights. 2007 was also the year that the US and South Korea signed the US-South Korean Free Trade Agreement that allowed for US companies to start enforcing IP rights in South Korea [1][2]. Blizzard probably didn't start negotiating before 2007 due to the lack of such a law clarifying the enforcement of IP rights from foreign companies. The agreement finally provided a legal basis for them to start negotiating with the broadcasting companies, though it is also reasonable that the negotiations may have also been heavily influenced by SC2's coinciding announcement.
[1] http://www.newyorker.com/talk/financial/2007/05/14/070514ta_talk_surowiecki
[2] http://www.sbecouncil.org/news/display.cfm?ID=4133
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In most threads about this IP rights issue involving Blizzard/Gretech and KeSPA/MBC/OGN about BW, I've seen my fair share of fanboys of either side.
I don't care if you like either game and think the other is crap. I don't care if you think one side or the other is right about handling E-Sports. That is all opinion and you're entitled to it. What I want to know is, did KeSPA and the broadcasting stations possibly have violated the law or infringed on Blizzard's IP rights? Not saying that they did, but can you actually say that without a doubt KeSPA absolutely did not violate any law or IP rights.
I'm sure that most of us want constructive criticism and interpreted opinions on the arguments on both sides, not just blind fanboy opinion.
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I'm Wondering this and I read this in the first few pages of this post, is that. What will happen if Blizzard Wins and What will happen if OGN/MBCGame Wins?
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This is sad and funny at the same time.
Blizzard became so greedy....WHY!!!!!
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how come when i read about this lawsuit, all i hear is day9 talking about penises being compared.
and people who are complaining about the length of the lawsuit should get used to it T.T lawsuits usually take this long. you dont want to rush something as delicate as this.
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This thread makes me want to shoot myself lol.
I don't understand all this talk of Blizzard being greedy and wanting to take over the BW scene; have you guys even seen what Blizzard's demands were? Looking at the amount Blizzard asked for broadcasting rights, ot's obvious Blizzard isn't trying to make a profit from the BW scene, rather, they just want their IP rights to be recognized. I don't see that as being greedy at all -__-;;
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Russian Federation4405 Posts
I'm a bit ill and with high temperature and can't understand it to its fullest X______x could anyone say if that means that Starcraft (the First one) will continue to be shown or not?...
Please please let it be that it will be casted yet another and another seasons. This OSL/MSL/SPL are already extremely cool.
On January 29 2011 20:18 Brewed Tea wrote:how come when i read about this lawsuit, all i hear is day9 talking about penises being compared. and people who are complaining about the length of the lawsuit should get used to it T.T lawsuits usually take this long. you dont want to rush something as delicate as this.
This made me LOL.
Lawsuit rush! KEKEKEKEKEKE
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On January 29 2011 22:05 Vista wrote:
This thread makes me want to shoot myself lol.
I don't understand all this talk of Blizzard being greedy and wanting to take over the BW scene; have you guys even seen what Blizzard's demands were? Looking at the amount Blizzard asked for broadcasting rights, ot's obvious Blizzard isn't trying to make a profit from the BW scene, rather, they just want their IP rights to be recognized. I don't see that as being greedy at all -__-;;
Why are you talking about money for? Nobody believes that the broadcast fees are why Blizzard wants to take over.
What is this continued drivel about IP rights?
As the Judge said "- The judge also ordered the prosecution to prove the fact that defendants had violated IP rights."
What fkn rights were violated lol?
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On January 29 2011 23:48 ShadeR wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2011 22:05 Vista wrote:
This thread makes me want to shoot myself lol.
I don't understand all this talk of Blizzard being greedy and wanting to take over the BW scene; have you guys even seen what Blizzard's demands were? Looking at the amount Blizzard asked for broadcasting rights, ot's obvious Blizzard isn't trying to make a profit from the BW scene, rather, they just want their IP rights to be recognized. I don't see that as being greedy at all -__-;; Why are you talking about money for? Nobody believes that the broadcast fees are why Blizzard wants to take over. What is this continued drivel about IP rights? As the Judge said "- The judge also ordered the prosecution to prove the fact that defendants had violated IP rights." What fkn rights were violated lol?
Obviously advertising their brand 24/7 damaged their company beyond imagination.
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I am still adamantly opposed to Blizzard winning any sort of IP battle over the broadcast of BW. Not when they knew about it for so long and did absolutely nothing to stop them when it was in their interest to allow others to keep their game alive and relevant for years and years. Only now it becomes important for them to wrest control of the rights to broadcast the game because it competes with their new one.
I hope there is some resolution that allows the makers of a game to be fairly compensated if they pursue it but not be capable of stopping outright the broadcast of their games for the sake of stifling an industry (or for any reason to be honest)
I don't know how it's going to turn out but I feel like it's just bad news all around if Blizzard wins
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On January 29 2011 02:51 Nokarot wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2011 15:42 Waxangel wrote:ohhh they're actually suing them for damages, I just thought they were filing an injunction to prevent them from broadcasting I may be mistaken, but I think by giving Blizzard as much money as they are suing for in a winning lawsuit, it would only open the doors for Blizzard to sue again if the league progresses. Similar to how courts in America can win cases by referring to previous similar judgments, would they not be entitled to sue again and again and again and again so long as SC1 tournaments are held (effectively shutting them down, injunction or not.) As I said, could be mistaken. Throwing this question out there for someone smarter to answer.
I'm not a lawyer but I believe Double Jeopardy declares that to be illegal; you cannot try someone (or something) for the same crime more than once. It has to be altered in some fashion.
Maybe if they attacked with a different approach from IP violation / damages, they might be able to, but I doubt they can sue them again. Legally speaking, of course.
P.S. Korean court laws might be different, take this with a grain of salt.
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On January 29 2011 22:05 Vista wrote:
This thread makes me want to shoot myself lol.
I don't understand all this talk of Blizzard being greedy and wanting to take over the BW scene; have you guys even seen what Blizzard's demands were? Looking at the amount Blizzard asked for broadcasting rights, ot's obvious Blizzard isn't trying to make a profit from the BW scene, rather, they just want their IP rights to be recognized. I don't see that as being greedy at all -__-;;
I think you should shoot yourself and save everyone your childish notions of what this case is about.
I barely know the basics of this trial, and if anything if Blizzard wins, say bye bye to the SC:BW scene. Per what demands I have seen, they want more fees than OGN/MBC/Kespa can/will afford, they want control of the players, which means the scene, and the transition of the game from SC:BW to SC2, so Blizzard won't be holding any SC:BW tournaments of matter.
No case this important is only about money.
If I were MBC/OGN/Kespa, I would want this case to go to completion and have it decided one way or another. I don't want to be treading the line of what you can do and what you can't and who has what right. I think that's why they want to have this case rather than negotiate in private any further
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On January 30 2011 04:38 henzi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2011 22:05 Vista wrote:
This thread makes me want to shoot myself lol.
I don't understand all this talk of Blizzard being greedy and wanting to take over the BW scene; have you guys even seen what Blizzard's demands were? Looking at the amount Blizzard asked for broadcasting rights, ot's obvious Blizzard isn't trying to make a profit from the BW scene, rather, they just want their IP rights to be recognized. I don't see that as being greedy at all -__-;; I think you should shoot yourself and save everyone your childish notions of what this case is about. I barely know the basics of this trial, and if anything if Blizzard wins, say bye bye to the SC:BW scene. Per what demands I have seen, they want more fees than OGN/MBC/Kespa can/will afford, they want control of the players, which means the scene, and the transition of the game from SC:BW to SC2, so Blizzard won't be holding any SC:BW tournaments of matter. No case this important is only about money. If I were MBC/OGN/Kespa, I would want this case to go to completion and have it decided one way or another. I don't want to be treading the line of what you can do and what you can't and who has what right. I think that's why they want to have this case rather than negotiate in private any further
Wow, calm down boyo. From everything all parties have said on this matter, it isn't Blizzard trying to shut down BW, they just want everyone broadcasting it to be paying them at least something to be showing it. They are making sure their product is theirs, and someone else doesn't profit form their hard work without giving them something. People may say it is greedy, but that is what a company is for, making money off of the products they make.
If someone started showing House on a station that was not paying for the rights to show it, they would immediately be told to stop and if they didn't, would be sued. The NFL also controls who shows their games. NBC cannot just decide to show the games and sell the rights to other stations.
For those asking why Blizz did not go after this sooner, it was simply because they really couldn't, they are not a Korean company, and before the US-Korean trade agreements they really had no legal ground to stand on.
I am not saying Blizzard do not have some fault in this, or that they should get everything they are asking for. They have not handled this the best but too many people see them talking about BW and just foam at the mouth.
As a note: in my opinion, SC2 will help E-sports much more than BW at this point. People who are just getting into E-sports will not want to watch the outdated graphics of BW. The nicer looking SC2 will appeal to them much more, and will be easier to get into. I don't want BW to go away, but if you think BW is the future of E-sports you are sadly mistaken.
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EPT
