EPT[Spoiler] Next Bonjwa? - Page 7
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BanZu
United States3329 Posts
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strongwind
United States862 Posts
On February 09 2009 01:35 cosiant wrote: Even Bisu himself is saying no way This is from the interview: - You still aren't hearing the name "Bonjwa", how do you feel? ▲ I was asked this before. Honestly, I don't really want to hear it. When I saw bonjwas in my eyes, they all rised to the top, and toppled down to the abyss. I don't want to be a bonjwa, rather I want to be that guy who was good and didn't fall into the abyss. If the guy himself doesn't want the title, than you should not give it to him. this quote says it all. He's making his own path, so while we're all debating whether he's some immeasurable term, he'll keep raking in the championships. Keep it up KTY! | ||
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Proposal
United States1310 Posts
On February 09 2009 07:16 BanZu wrote: At this point, yes, Bisu is more-or-less bonjwa. With the standards set by the previous ones, there is no way we are going to see another one... and that the competition is rising | ||
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TheTyranid
Russian Federation4333 Posts
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Lukeeze[zR]
Switzerland6838 Posts
On February 09 2009 04:09 Baddieko wrote: I dont think so. The GSL can't be counted as a major tourney. Some teams had pulled out. Best and Stork and many players drop the tourney to avoid schedule.congestion.[...] exactly who cares about 35k$ (+ 8k$ bonus vs jaedong) ? ~_~ | ||
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abakben
United States308 Posts
On February 09 2009 07:38 TheTyranid wrote: The biggest problem with this Bisu is Bonjwa debate is establishing a clear definition of what a Bonjwa is. There are several definitions of Bonjwa right now so TL needs to properly define the term. Otherwise, Bisu will always qualify as a Bonjwa from some points but won't qualify from others thus resulting in numerous threads of a never ending debate. I definitely agree with you. There should be a formal minimum requirements list. Otherwise it is pointless to argue his status. | ||
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darkemperor
Turkey725 Posts
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Letmelose
Korea (South)3227 Posts
On February 09 2009 07:38 TheTyranid wrote: The biggest problem with this Bisu is Bonjwa debate is establishing a clear definition of what a Bonjwa is. There are several definitions of Bonjwa right now so TL needs to properly define the term. Otherwise, Bisu will always qualify as a Bonjwa from some points but won't qualify from others thus resulting in numerous threads of a never ending debate. Since the word was used without a clear definition to start off with, there is no way any discussion involving the words "bonjwa" will lead to a concrete answer. Each person has slightly different views on the subject, and that's why Korean communities argue over a crappy made up word to this date, and why TL.net has been doing the same since it caught the "bonjwa" fever. Savior was often refered to as "Mae-bonjwa" during his glory days without all the various connotations the word carries today. It was just an expression of how awesome Savior was at the time. "LimLeeChoi" (the surnames of Boxer, Nada, and Oov) was also a popular phrase, a phrase that grouped three of the most dominating terrans, or players for that matter, of the progaming scene so far. After Savior started to dominate like mad, It didn't take long for someone to create the phrase "LimLeeChoiMae". It just got accepted and the phrase spread like wildfire. And these four players were bonjwas by default since then. People just felt right about it I guess. People started to define the word after they used it. But how can one person successfully define the word so that it captures the brilliance of all these four players? We kind of feel it in our hearts, but there is no one criteria that makes all of us content. | ||
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[DUF]MethodMan
Germany1716 Posts
On topic: I don't think there will be any Bonjwa again. The reasons have been pointed out countless times in this and other threads. There are just too many top players and the training must have become such intensive, there wouldn't be any way to dominate using one or two builds (like Savior did). As much as I'm a Bisu fanboy and voting instantly "yes" (:D), after reading through this thread makes me doubt giving him Bonjwa status. I don't see any player coming close to be Bonjwa, it is, disregarding the players skill, just impossible nowadays. But moreover you have to agree on one thing, Bisu climbed out of his slump pretty quickly and he didn't just climb out of it, he was and still is the player to beat. I think this will be the new definition of "Bonjwa", the ability of climbing out of some sort of slump after losing important series. And with the incredible skill density AND the heavy amount of televised matches to be played nowadays it will be kinda normal to lose important series which undoubtfully can have such a psychological impact on the player so they tend to slump after it. | ||
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TheTyranid
Russian Federation4333 Posts
On February 09 2009 08:19 Letmelose wrote: People started to define the word after they used it. But how can one person successfully define the word so that it captures the brilliance of all these four players? We kind of feel it in our hearts, but there is no one criteria that makes all of us content. There is one criteria. During the reign of those 4 players, no other player came close to their skill level. They were favourites in any boX matchup and this were the "undisputed bests" of that time which is one of the proposed definitions of Bonjwa. The word Bonjwa roughly translates as "best" from Korean, right? Therefore undisputed best is the most accurate definition of Bonjwa. Bisu's individual title count is Bonjwa worthy. However he is NOT the undisputed best. If Bisu was the undisputed best, there would be no question if he could beat Jaedong in a bo5. Do you think there is any doubt in Bisu winning in a bo5 vs Jaedong? If you do, you acknowledge that Bisu is not a Bonjwa. There is a reason why this era is called the Post Bonjwa era. Ever since 3/3/07, there has been no undisputed best. In a time period where there are several players playing at an equal level, you can't have a Bonjwa, now matter how good the players play. You need a significant gap in skill and performance between #1 and #2 to have the #1 be a Bonjwa. There is no such gap between Bisu and JD/Flash. Even if Bisu won 10 starleagues and there were people stepping on his toes, he would not Be a Bonjwa. | ||
disciple
9070 Posts
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eshlow
United States5210 Posts
1. Keep up his dominance (aka 75%+ winrate that he has going since Oct last year) 2. Beat Jaedong Bo5 (Feb 22nd... preferably 3-1 or 3-0) 3. Win this OSL with the unfavorable toss maps (going through a couple of Leta/Flash/Jaedong/Stork/etc.). I'd say that would be a good case for him with the MSL, OSL, and GOM titles plus dominance of peers. | ||
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fanatacist
10319 Posts
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Boblion
France8043 Posts
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Djabanete
United States2786 Posts
On February 09 2009 08:39 TheTyranid wrote: To be fair, Jaedong and July (?) are the ONLY people against whom Bisu would not be the clear favorite in a Bo5. (Not that this negates your point, but just to give credit where it's due.) edit: quotes > me | ||
Atrioc
United States1865 Posts
there was a point in KESPA history when sAviOr was four-hundred points higher than the #2 (NaDa) and one-fucking-thousand points higher than the #3. That is so far above his closest competitors that there isnt a shadow of a doubt in his ability to beat anyone on earth. You cannot say the same about Bisu at this point. | ||
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Cambium
United States16368 Posts
On February 09 2009 10:02 Atrioc wrote: You guys... there was a point in KESPA history when sAviOr was four-hundred points higher than the #2 (NaDa) and one-fucking-thousand points higher than the #3. That is so far above his closest competitors that there isnt a shadow of a doubt in his ability to beat anyone on earth. You cannot say the same about Bisu at this point.  I like this argument. | ||
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mIsUZu
New Zealand528 Posts
Winning streak, consistency, karisma, stats, career.. I believe Savior will be the last bonjwa because it is just impossible to have someone dominiating the pro scene thesedays, what with such mechanical practice sessions each team has and the amount of competition that the new youngsters bring in.. | ||
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Deleted User 30223
3104 Posts
On February 09 2009 10:02 Atrioc wrote: You guys... there was a point in KESPA history when sAviOr was four-hundred points higher than the #2 (NaDa) and one-fucking-thousand points higher than the #3. That is so far above his closest competitors that there isnt a shadow of a doubt in his ability to beat anyone on earth. You cannot say the same about Bisu at this point. This is the definition of dominance | ||
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Night[Mare
Mexico4793 Posts
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