EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 8510
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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
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Sermokala
United States13906 Posts
I mean look at buzzfeed. That showed you don't need to be "good at your job" anymore to make a living. | ||
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Introvert
United States4742 Posts
On August 21 2017 12:36 Plansix wrote: Anyone has to be better than that publication. Their defense of confederate war statues was mostly a rant about liberals and totally bypasses the part that Lee didn't want confederate monuments. It as some alternative reality stuff. At one point it argued that Jim Crow was bad, but blacks have suffered worse under liberals that destroyed their families. NR has a lot of writers of various quality with sometimes opposite opinions. honestly reading this thread I'm kind of doubt your take on it. I mean being against their removal is a legitimate opinion. edit: I don't mean a particular article, I mean your take on the whole. For that latter part you mention it's probably referred to in context of marriage rates or whatever. edited for clarity. edit again: I think I found the one in particular that you were talking about. it's not like from the Editors or something, it's one dude from a well known think tank given a space for his opinion. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15672 Posts
I refuse to believe our country is such trash that our military is vulnerable in this way to whoever is president. I can not sleep at night thinking Trump's incompetence could somehow leak into ships crashing. But the timing sure is fucked. Can someone who actually knows about military shit help me sleep better? This is just 2 freak accidents that couldn't be related to Trump somehow dicking shit up by not being properly organized with appointments and whatnot, right? On August 21 2017 14:22 Introvert wrote: NR has a lot of writers of various quality with sometimes opposite opinions. honestly reading this thread I'm kind of doubt your take on it. I mean being against their removal is a legitimate opinion. edit: I don't mean a particular article, I mean your take on the whole. For that latter part you mention it's probably referred to in context of marriage rates or whatever. edited for clarity. edit again: I think I found the one in particular that you were talking about. it's not like from the Editors or something, it's one dude from a well known think tank given a space for his opinion. National Review? Is that what you mean by NR? I consider NR on par with Salon. Sure, if you sift through it, you can find tiny little bits of truth in the shit they vomit onto their website, but as a whole, it is just dog shit. There are totally legitimate right wing publications and I think any point you would hope to be making would not rely on National Review. | ||
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15672 Posts
On August 21 2017 14:39 LegalLord wrote: You can be sure that Trump doesn't manage the day-to-day logistics of how our ships travel. The only way you could pin it on him is if the cause ultimately ended up being stupidity in staffing, but the DoD seems to be well-provisioned in that regard. Yeah, I guess that's what I mean. I would hope that our military is managed in such a insulated way that it really doesn't matter who is president. At least in terms of shit like this. Obviously makes a huge difference in terms of intervention and blah blah blah. I just mean a shitty president should NOT lead to ships crashing lol @_@ | ||
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Introvert
United States4742 Posts
On August 21 2017 14:33 Mohdoo wrote: Ok so this whole ship crashing thing: I refuse to believe our country is such trash that our military is vulnerable in this way to whoever is president. I can not sleep at night thinking Trump's incompetence could somehow leak into ships crashing. But the timing sure is fucked. Can someone who actually knows about military shit help me sleep better? This is just 2 freak accidents that couldn't be related to Trump somehow dicking shit up by not being properly organized with appointments and whatnot, right? National Review? Is that what you mean by NR? I consider NR on par with Salon. Sure, if you sift through it, you can find tiny little bits of truth in the shit they vomit onto their website, but as a whole, it is just dog shit. There are totally legitimate right wing publications and I think any point you would hope to be making would not rely on National Review. This is a ridiculous opinion, but then again you did just ask for reassurance that these ship crashes aren't related to Trump being president. I suppose you could separate out their opinion and reporting, but for example at least two or three of their reporters were snatched by politico just this year. I'm not even sure why I asked p6 in the first place, knowing this thread. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15672 Posts
On August 21 2017 14:58 Introvert wrote: This is a ridiculous opinion, but then again you did just ask for reassurance that these ship crashes aren't related to Trump being president. I suppose you could separate out their opinion and reporting, but for example at least two or three of their reporters were snatched by politico just this year. I'm not even sure why I asked p6 in the first place, knowing this thread. I know, right? Isn't it just such a shame you even asked? I can't help but just feel so sorry for you after going through all that trouble. I would just feel so bummed and so discouraged if I were you. The world is such a sad place :'( Edit: btw, remember how in my post I said I refuse to believe it's related to Trump? It's ok *pat pat* | ||
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Introvert
United States4742 Posts
On August 21 2017 15:21 Mohdoo wrote: I know, right? Isn't it just such a shame you even asked? I can't help but just feel so sorry for you after going through all that trouble. I would just feel so bummed and so discouraged if I were you. The world is such a sad place :'( Edit: btw, remember how in my post I said I refuse to believe it's related to Trump? It's ok *pat pat* dude spare me, you asked for someone to help you sleep better. that post deserves the same sarcasm. good work tho, thanks for the substance. | ||
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30548 Posts
On August 21 2017 10:52 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Wtf... Twice in 2 months. Very sad for the missing sailors  horrible way to goI really do wonder how these ships that to are supposed to find and target other combat ships from 100 miles away and intercept missiles flying at several mach's manage to miss a huge slow fat containership on a collision course. I've always found it interesting that we've built several generations of marine military tech without it ever being used because nobody does sea wars anymore, maybe radar and tracking capabilities are overestimated? Or it's just humans being humans and making dumb mistakes I guess. We had one of our Apache helicopters (which also is supposed to have state of the art visual/tracking stuff) fly into a high powerline and cut off quite some towns for several days. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3943 Posts
E.g. the indian navy had 7 such incidents between 2005 and 2013, which also included the loss of one of their former fleet flagships. For the US, there is this very incomplete list here: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/19/us/navy-ship-collisions-history.html?mcubz=0 or let's simply quote a more thorough analysis, even though not 100% up to date: - Collisions: The most prevalent type of major accidents has been collisions, of which there have been 456 documented cases [between 1945 and 1988], 190 between military ships, 184 between naval vessels and civilian ships. There have been 51 collisions involving aircraft carriers. There have also been 36 confirmed snaggings of submerged submarines by fishing trawlers or nets, and 82 collisions by ships with docks during mooring or unmooring, or with unidentified objects. https://fas.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/NavalAccidents1945-1988.pdf | ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28650 Posts
It's certainly no the atlantic, but unless you can point to specific articles, I feel this is more attacking their opinions than the quality of what they publish. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
This was the opinion piece. Though it is not labeled as one. | ||
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Sadist
United States7219 Posts
On August 21 2017 19:49 Plansix wrote: I'm sure there are reasonable articles in there somewhere, but they did not present themselves to me from the front page. I'm sure the same is true for huffingtonpost or Salon. They are no Wall Street Journal. This was the opinion piece. Though it is not labeled as one. What a shit show of an article. *black people worse off now than jim crow due to liberalism *calling left groups communist *mentioning of blm *the left hates america Its like a list of cliche talking points from fox news. | ||
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On_Slaught
United States12190 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On August 21 2017 21:10 Sadist wrote: What a shit show of an article. *black people worse off now than jim crow due to liberalism *calling left groups communist *mentioning of blm *the left hates america Its like a list of cliche talking points from fox news. I read plenty of republicans, some who write in the NYT and WSJ. I disagree and sometimes I mock them a bit, but I think it is important for to see what they think. But articles like this one do nothing. It asks nothing of their audience and simply affirms their already held belief. | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
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thePunGun
598 Posts
On August 21 2017 21:22 On_Slaught wrote: Sheesh. 2 crashes in 2 months is unacceptable. I imagine at this point we may see admiral demotions in the Pacific theatre. Ships aren't cars, they're several hundred thousand tons of steel, navigating through rough waters, the tiniest human error can lead to disaster. (container ships average 200! thousand tons) You can have decades of experience as a sailor, but that still won't help you when you're facing an impossible situation. Because there are no brakes on water, especially when you're navigating a steel behemoth through busy waters like the South China Sea. (edit number 167: I hate posting from my phone, can't type on those tiny ass screens, my big sausage fingers won't allow it...) | ||
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
Getting into a situation where the ships are going to have a risk of crashing is generally a "someone done fucked up and entered a dangerous zone" problem. Or a lack of coordination between them. But before pointing fingers let's see if they launch an investigation into it. | ||
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On_Slaught
United States12190 Posts
On August 21 2017 22:54 thePunGun wrote: Ships aren't cars, they're several hundred thousand tons of steel, navigating through rough waters, the tiniest human error can lead to disaster. (container ships average 200! thousand tons) You can have decades of experience as a sailor, but that still won't help you when you're facing an impossible situation. Because there are no brakes on water, especially when you're navigating a steel behemoth through busy waters like the South China Sea. (edit number 167: I hate posting from my phone, can't type on those tiny ass screens, my big sausage fingers won't allow it...) These warships are state of the art. If these massive merchant ships were actively trying to ram our ships it would be trivial to avoid them. Over 20 deaths in 2 months and you can bet more than a few careers are over (even at the admiral level). A lot of vets are saying thay they don't teach basic seamenship skills like they used to so expect Annapolis to get a nice update in curriculum. | ||
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