EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 2187
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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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KwarK
United States44442 Posts
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States46692 Posts
On August 11 2015 00:58 KwarK wrote: Wegandi suggested that people in favour of gender equality would wish to disallow a woman fighting a man. I countered that not only would I be fine with it but also that banning someone from doing something on the basis of their gender is basically as far from gender equality as you can get. The discussion seems to have merged into "Would you watch that fight?" which couldn't be less relevant. I agree with you, and I'm totally fine with having women fight (or play against, sports-wise) men if they want, but very rarely do you find a woman who can keep up with the top tier professional men in terms of sports or wrestling or fighting. And that's not a sexist remark; it's a statement of fact. If a woman is good enough to play in the men's league, I'm all for allowing her, paying her accordingly, and it would be interesting and really cool to see. But if it's just going to water down the competition and make it less entertaining (and from a business/ network perspective, disappoint viewers), I can totally see why some leagues don't want to bother with the integration of all women with all men. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
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Deathstar
9150 Posts
Also, who in their right mind would allow a man and woman to fight, consent or not. No organization will sponsor it because they will be accused of mysoginy, and rightly so. Watching a woman get her bone crushed to prove a point on equality is anti-women. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States46692 Posts
On August 11 2015 01:06 Deathstar wrote: Women can't compete with men. That's why they have their own leagues and not integration. Also, who in their right mind would allow a man and woman to fight, consent or not. No organization will sponsor it because they will be accused of mysoginy, and rightly so. Watching a woman get her bone crushed to prove a point on equality is anti-women. Two points I'd like to respond to: 1. 99% of the time, women can't compete with men in particular sports, fighting, etc. Sure. That being said, if- hypothetically- a woman came along who *could* hang with the guys, play as well as them, keep up with them, etc., would you still not allow her to play with the men simply because she was a girl/ it may force a slippery slope of sub-par women wanting to join men, etc.? Or would you let her try out her luck in the men's league? Because I would do the latter, and see what happens. 2. I think it'd be ideal if we eventually moved past the idea that consenting adults competing/ fighting against each other is inherently bad if one is a man and one is a woman. It's not anti-woman to allow them to have a chance to compete with men, because the choice is still up to them. It would be anti-woman if we forced them to fight against men/ people who they couldn't compete with. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
But that is where it ends. Size and weight. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States46692 Posts
On August 11 2015 01:15 Plansix wrote: If it was the same weight and size class, I don't think it would be a huge deal. It is the reason those size classes exist. But no feather weight is going to fight a heavy weight fighter. In MMA there is the simple fact that the man is going to weight about 1/3 more than the woman and have a longer reach. That's just physics that the woman is going to have to work harder to win on the ground if it goes there. But that is where it ends. Size and weight. I agree. It should come down to comparable size and weight of the fighters, rather than sex. | ||
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KwarK
United States44442 Posts
On August 11 2015 01:06 Deathstar wrote: Women can't compete with men. That's why they have their own leagues and not integration. Also, who in their right mind would allow a man and woman to fight, consent or not. No organization will sponsor it because they will be accused of mysoginy, and rightly so. Watching a woman get her bone crushed to prove a point on equality is anti-women. If your concern is safety then ban all fights. There is nothing misogynistic about a professional female fighter pursuing her chosen career. Forcing her to get beaten up to put women in their place would be pretty misogynistic. Watching it because it turns you on to watch a woman get beaten up would be pretty twisted. But neither of those are what we're talking about here. We're talking about banning women from participation and that'd be very misogynistic. Again, I'm not advocating forcing people to sponsor it or host it. I'm saying that banning women from doing things they're capable of doing (and any woman is capable of being in a fight), even if they consent to it, is wrong. I'm allowed to challenge a male MMA fighter to a match. I'm certainly not capable of winning that match and I would be very surprised if anyone would want to sponsor or host it but I'm allowed to have the match if we both consent to it. Why would it be any different for a woman? Edit: If I wanted to fight a MMA fighter they'd give me plenty of excellent reasons why they wouldn't host it like it being dumb as hell, suicidal, a waste of everyone's time and so forth. They'd point out my lack of training, experience and that only a minority of teamliquid posters would have any interest in watching someone beat the shit out of me. They wouldn't say "you can't because you're a man". I'm saying women should get the same treatment. | ||
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whatisthisasheep
624 Posts
http://www.nbcnews.com/meet-the-press/new-nbc-news-survey-monkey-poll-donald-trump-still-lead-n406766 Jeb Bush and Scott Walker disappeared | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
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Sermokala
United States14220 Posts
Lucha underground (a wrestling federation) has a women wrestler who goes against males all the time and its never a problem. I know its not the same but if its okay for the much more conservative Hispanic population then it'll be okay for the broader american one. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10989 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On August 11 2015 02:05 Velr wrote: I'm pretty sure the WWF hat plenty of woman wrestlers going against guys? All that stuff is staged and acted out. It's physical for sure, no one will say otherwise. But its not competing in any sense. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States46692 Posts
On August 11 2015 02:09 Plansix wrote: All that stuff is staged and acted out. It's physical for sure, no one will say otherwise. But its not competing in any sense. Agreed. It's physically taxing entertainment, but it's not an actual competition. | ||
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whatisthisasheep
624 Posts
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JinDesu
United States3990 Posts
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22703 Posts
On August 11 2015 02:40 JinDesu wrote: I'm a little confused as to why GH was told to stop being a Bernie fanboy in this thread, and yet no one tells you to stop doing the same with Trump. Because GH came over as very pushy imo. Biased posting is always going to happen here. Its the manner and tone that often makes the difference. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On August 11 2015 02:48 Gorsameth wrote: Because GH came over as very pushy imo. Biased posting is always going to happen here. Its the manner and tone that often makes the difference. At least GH was positive about his posting, rather than posting youtube "take down videos' by internet celebrities. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10989 Posts
On August 11 2015 02:09 Plansix wrote: All that stuff is staged and acted out. It's physical for sure, no one will say otherwise. But its not competing in any sense. Yes? And your point is? | ||
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