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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On July 23 2015 06:32 kwizach wrote:
GreenHorizons, I'm left-wing myself but if you could tone down a bit your campaigning for Sanders it would make reading your posts more enjoyable. At this rate I can't even imagine what it's going to be like during the primary itself.
There are hundreds of people who read this thread and never post (a lot of the info is for them). Sorry if I think this election is critically important and that Sanders is the only candidate who isn't going to be/already paid off by big money interests.
I feel like my country and my future is on the line and I actually have a candidate that represents my views, I'm going to make sure others who feel similarly are also in the loop.
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http://georgetownlawjournal.org/articles/criminal-law-2-0-preface-to-the-44th-annual-review-of-criminal-procedure/
They say that any prosecutor worth his salt can get a grand jury to indict a ham sandwich. It may be that a decent prosecutor could get a petit jury to convict a eunuch of rape.
Long Read, but a TLDR is these 12 myths :
1. Eyewitnesses are highly reliable
2. Fingerprint evidence is foolproof
3. Other types of forensic evidence are scientifically proven and therefore infallible
4. DNA evidence is infallible
5. Human memories are reliable
6. Confessions are infallible because innocent people never confess
7. Juries follow instructions
8. Prosecutors play fair
9. The prosecution is at a substantial disadvantage because it must prove its case beyond a reasonable doubt
10. Police are objective in their investigations
11. Guilty pleas are conclusive proof of guilt
12. Long sentences deter crime
These problems, IMO are not limited to criminal justice (that's simply where the consequences are most dire). If you can't be bothered with 42 pages, at least read the last page under the headline "Repeal 3 Felonies a Day"
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On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question.
Not quite a national issue, but there's a group in my state trying to get another cartel codified into the state constitution.
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On July 23 2015 05:34 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 05:27 deth2munkies wrote:On July 23 2015 05:19 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 04:19 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Texas authorities are denying accusations that the shocking Sandra Bland dashcam video has been edited.
Jumps, loops and other inconsistencies in the 52-minute dashcam video of Bland's July 10 arrest are due to "technical issue during posting," rather than editing, Tom Vinger, a spokesman for the Texas Department of Public Safety, told NBC News.
The 28-year-old woman was found dead in her jail cell three days after authorities in Prairie View, Texas, pulled Bland over for failing to signal a lane change. Her encounter with Texas state trooper Brian Encinia quickly escalated when she refused to put out her cigarette and exit her vehicle.
Footage of the incident shows Encinia drawing his Taser and telling Bland, "I will light you up."
Since the video's release, several news outlets have noted inconsistencies in the video, such as choppy segments and a lack of continuity.
"At several points in the video of Bland's arrest, posted Tuesday to the department's YouTube channel, video of a person walking or a car driving by are cut or repeat themselves as the audio continues uninterrupted," NBC News reported. Source The cop is blatantly lying in the video too. This department is particularly bad. The feds should of been on this from the jump. I watched the video, what is he lying about? For the record: The stop and arrest were perfectly legal. The use of force, professionalism, and possible murder are still up in the air even after watching the video (although we can probably agree, the cop was not the most professional person out there.) Lies by omission to start. He doesn't describe the interaction before she is removed from the car accurately at all. He neglects to mention the U-turn and pursuit, he doesn't mention the cigarette, "I will light you up" isn't mentioned, that he told her she was under arrest, that he instigated by asking her why she was upset, etc... People watching this video and thinking the cop was remotely honest are simply blind/deaf.
He doesn't have to describe the interaction. He asked her to put out a cigarette and she said no, and it's perfectly legal for him to ask and her to refuse. It's also perfectly legal for him to order her out of the car during a traffic stop and it's a crime in Texas to refuse to do so, one for which she could legally be arrested. He's allowed to use reasonable force to remove her from the car if she refuses to leave following a lawful order to do so, whether or not the force is reasonable is up for debate. What happens off camera is also up for debate and could be interpreted multiple ways.
I'm not gung-ho "Yay, cops!" or even saying that there couldn't be criminal charges or a successful 1983 case brought out of this stop, but the stop was lawful, the order to exit was lawful, and the arrest was lawful. I think that fact is bound to get swept up by the media in the furor, but it's worth stating.
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On July 23 2015 07:28 deth2munkies wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 05:34 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 05:27 deth2munkies wrote:On July 23 2015 05:19 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 04:19 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Texas authorities are denying accusations that the shocking Sandra Bland dashcam video has been edited.
Jumps, loops and other inconsistencies in the 52-minute dashcam video of Bland's July 10 arrest are due to "technical issue during posting," rather than editing, Tom Vinger, a spokesman for the Texas Department of Public Safety, told NBC News.
The 28-year-old woman was found dead in her jail cell three days after authorities in Prairie View, Texas, pulled Bland over for failing to signal a lane change. Her encounter with Texas state trooper Brian Encinia quickly escalated when she refused to put out her cigarette and exit her vehicle.
Footage of the incident shows Encinia drawing his Taser and telling Bland, "I will light you up."
Since the video's release, several news outlets have noted inconsistencies in the video, such as choppy segments and a lack of continuity.
"At several points in the video of Bland's arrest, posted Tuesday to the department's YouTube channel, video of a person walking or a car driving by are cut or repeat themselves as the audio continues uninterrupted," NBC News reported. Source The cop is blatantly lying in the video too. This department is particularly bad. The feds should of been on this from the jump. I watched the video, what is he lying about? For the record: The stop and arrest were perfectly legal. The use of force, professionalism, and possible murder are still up in the air even after watching the video (although we can probably agree, the cop was not the most professional person out there.) Lies by omission to start. He doesn't describe the interaction before she is removed from the car accurately at all. He neglects to mention the U-turn and pursuit, he doesn't mention the cigarette, "I will light you up" isn't mentioned, that he told her she was under arrest, that he instigated by asking her why she was upset, etc... People watching this video and thinking the cop was remotely honest are simply blind/deaf. He doesn't have to describe the interaction. He asked her to put out a cigarette and she said no, and it's perfectly legal for him to ask and her to refuse. It's also perfectly legal for him to order her out of the car during a traffic stop and it's a crime in Texas to refuse to do so, one for which she could legally be arrested. He's allowed to use reasonable force to remove her from the car if she refuses to leave following a lawful order to do so, whether or not the force is reasonable is up for debate. What happens off camera is also up for debate and could be interpreted multiple ways. I'm not gung-ho "Yay, cops!" or even saying that there couldn't be criminal charges or a successful 1983 case brought out of this stop, but the stop was lawful, the order to exit was lawful, and the arrest was lawful. I think that fact is bound to get swept up by the media in the furor, but it's worth stating.
The legality of what transpired during the stop is a tertiary issue. Although I would disagree that the officer wasn't obligated to completely and accurately describe the event.
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On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question.
Lots of things. Iran for one. But Trump is a far better story. The media does indeed show what sells, snd that is reflected here- despite all the whining about our media (which is terrible).
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On July 23 2015 07:34 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question. Lots of things. Iran for one. But Trump is a far better story. The media does indeed show what sells, snd that is reflected here- despite all the whining about our media (which is terrible).
Enlighten us as to what about the Iran deal is important that we haven't covered?
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On July 23 2015 07:42 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 07:34 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question. Lots of things. Iran for one. But Trump is a far better story. The media does indeed show what sells, snd that is reflected here- despite all the whining about our media (which is terrible). Enlighten us as to what about the Iran deal is important that we haven't covered?
I'm out and about, but there was like 2 pages worth pf posts on it and then not a peep since then. More details were released, people could discuss how it's going down with the UN. But all there is is silence. Which is fine, we don't have to talk about anything. But there is certainly more going on than Trump statements and Sanders campaign stops.
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On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question.
Not quite sure why you think the preseason to the primaries to the elections is "important". It is cucumber time everywhere, not just in Europe.
At least Europe has the tour de france and Greece to keep the news cycle occupied.
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Obama: didn't think I could do it, bring it on plebes
Republicans: omg bad deal Iran terrorism hurdurr
There;s not much going on with Iran, ball is in Congress's court (pardon potential confusion with the Judicial branch). Iran's not voting until 80 days have passed, aka until we pass the resolution.
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On July 23 2015 06:36 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 06:32 kwizach wrote:
GreenHorizons, I'm left-wing myself but if you could tone down a bit your campaigning for Sanders it would make reading your posts more enjoyable. At this rate I can't even imagine what it's going to be like during the primary itself. There are hundreds of people who read this thread and never post (a lot of the info is for them). Sorry if I think this election is critically important and that Sanders is the only candidate who isn't going to be/already paid off by big money interests. I feel like my country and my future is on the line and I actually have a candidate that represents my views, I'm going to make sure others who feel similarly are also in the loop.
Great. Can you go do that in your own thread titled Bernie Sanders hype thread or so?
EDIT for clarification: I echo kwizach's opinion. I am really happy that you have found a great candidate, and hell, if I was a US citizen I would probably even vote for the guy. I just don't want to read about how awesome his campaign is, and how much better he is than all the other candidates 17 times a day. If there is actually Bernie Sanders NEWS, please feel free to post it and discuss it here. But most of your Bernie Sanders posts aren't news.
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On July 23 2015 07:47 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 07:42 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 07:34 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question. Lots of things. Iran for one. But Trump is a far better story. The media does indeed show what sells, snd that is reflected here- despite all the whining about our media (which is terrible). Enlighten us as to what about the Iran deal is important that we haven't covered? I'm out and about, but there was like 2 pages worth pf posts on it and then not a peep since then. More details were released, people could discuss how it's going down with the UN. But all there is is silence. Which is fine, we don't have to talk about anything. But there is certainly more going on than Trump statements and Sanders campaign stops.
No one is stopping you from talking about what you want. You think there is something significant feel free to share, but just complaining about people not talking about what you want them to isn't accomplishing anything.
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On July 23 2015 07:47 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 07:42 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 07:34 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question. Lots of things. Iran for one. But Trump is a far better story. The media does indeed show what sells, snd that is reflected here- despite all the whining about our media (which is terrible). Enlighten us as to what about the Iran deal is important that we haven't covered? I'm out and about, but there was like 2 pages worth pf posts on it and then not a peep since then. More details were released, people could discuss how it's going down with the UN. But all there is is silence. Which is fine, we don't have to talk about anything. But there is certainly more going on than Trump statements and Sanders campaign stops.
There isn't anything to talk about. Deal is pretty much finalized. Everyone likes it. Republicans are making a show of how they could have forced Iran to be the 51st state and Obama is bad because he couldn't.
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On July 23 2015 07:54 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 07:47 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 07:42 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 07:34 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question. Lots of things. Iran for one. But Trump is a far better story. The media does indeed show what sells, snd that is reflected here- despite all the whining about our media (which is terrible). Enlighten us as to what about the Iran deal is important that we haven't covered? I'm out and about, but there was like 2 pages worth pf posts on it and then not a peep since then. More details were released, people could discuss how it's going down with the UN. But all there is is silence. Which is fine, we don't have to talk about anything. But there is certainly more going on than Trump statements and Sanders campaign stops. No one is stopping you from talking about what you want. You think there is something significant feel free to share, but just complaining about people not talking about what you want them to isn't accomplishing anything.
Problem is that you've become like a more spammy xDaunt circa 2012.
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On July 23 2015 08:01 Jormundr wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 07:54 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 07:47 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 07:42 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 07:34 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question. Lots of things. Iran for one. But Trump is a far better story. The media does indeed show what sells, snd that is reflected here- despite all the whining about our media (which is terrible). Enlighten us as to what about the Iran deal is important that we haven't covered? I'm out and about, but there was like 2 pages worth pf posts on it and then not a peep since then. More details were released, people could discuss how it's going down with the UN. But all there is is silence. Which is fine, we don't have to talk about anything. But there is certainly more going on than Trump statements and Sanders campaign stops. No one is stopping you from talking about what you want. You think there is something significant feel free to share, but just complaining about people not talking about what you want them to isn't accomplishing anything. Problem is that you've become like a more spammy xDaunt circa 2012.
Well judging by the general responses people really don't appreciate the significance or the magnitude of Bernie's campaign, I'd like them to at least know what's happening before they just parrot the mainstream media's take on Sanders.
What's happening is unprecedented in American politics and will catch many here off guard when they finally notice it without jaded lenses.
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On July 23 2015 08:12 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 08:01 Jormundr wrote:On July 23 2015 07:54 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 07:47 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 07:42 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 07:34 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question. Lots of things. Iran for one. But Trump is a far better story. The media does indeed show what sells, snd that is reflected here- despite all the whining about our media (which is terrible). Enlighten us as to what about the Iran deal is important that we haven't covered? I'm out and about, but there was like 2 pages worth pf posts on it and then not a peep since then. More details were released, people could discuss how it's going down with the UN. But all there is is silence. Which is fine, we don't have to talk about anything. But there is certainly more going on than Trump statements and Sanders campaign stops. No one is stopping you from talking about what you want. You think there is something significant feel free to share, but just complaining about people not talking about what you want them to isn't accomplishing anything. Problem is that you've become like a more spammy xDaunt circa 2012. Well judging by the general responses people really don't appreciate the significance or the magnitude of Bernie's campaign, I'd like them to at least know what's happening before they just parrot the mainstream media's take on Sanders. What's happening is unprecedented in American politics and will catch many here off guard when they finally notice it without jaded lenses.
Spoken like a true believer 
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On July 23 2015 07:51 ticklishmusic wrote:
Obama: didn't think I could do it, bring it on plebes
Republicans: omg bad deal Iran terrorism hurdurr
There;s not much going on with Iran, ball is in Congress's court (pardon potential confusion with the Judicial branch). Iran's not voting until 80 days have passed, aka until we pass the resolution.
More to it then that- though I would point out that if the Repubs really thought it was a bad deal, they should continue to hammer it. Especially since, as you say, it's on them.
@GH
But I personally find most FP issues important but boring to talk about, and I don't need to make posts on my time about such things. I am aware I can bring it up. That wasn't my point.
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Uhh no, I think the Republicans got a pretty heavy dose of their own medicine as it was made abundantly clear to them that the public thinks Article 2 of the United States Constitution prohibits the sort of behavior the Senate undertook a couple months ago. "47 traitors" isn't something a lot of Republicans are used to hearing
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Yeah, that "traitor" assertion was dumb even by liberal media standards. They didn't back off, it's just that negotiations continued and they basically signed away their power with that dumb bill they passed.
But again- boring. Point is, there are lots of things that could ne discussed.
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On July 23 2015 08:12 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2015 08:01 Jormundr wrote:On July 23 2015 07:54 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 07:47 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 07:42 GreenHorizons wrote:On July 23 2015 07:34 Introvert wrote:On July 23 2015 06:02 zatic wrote:
So I have been following this thread more or less passively, is there anything important happening these days in the US other than Republican presidential candidates, and cops shooting blacks? Serious question. Lots of things. Iran for one. But Trump is a far better story. The media does indeed show what sells, snd that is reflected here- despite all the whining about our media (which is terrible). Enlighten us as to what about the Iran deal is important that we haven't covered? I'm out and about, but there was like 2 pages worth pf posts on it and then not a peep since then. More details were released, people could discuss how it's going down with the UN. But all there is is silence. Which is fine, we don't have to talk about anything. But there is certainly more going on than Trump statements and Sanders campaign stops. No one is stopping you from talking about what you want. You think there is something significant feel free to share, but just complaining about people not talking about what you want them to isn't accomplishing anything. Problem is that you've become like a more spammy xDaunt circa 2012. Well judging by the general responses people really don't appreciate the significance or the magnitude of Bernie's campaign, I'd like them to at least know what's happening before they just parrot the mainstream media's take on Sanders. What's happening is unprecedented in American politics and will catch many here off guard when they finally notice it without jaded lenses.
That's fine, but take it down a notch. Not everyone here is as invested as you.
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EPT
