[Veganism] Fucking humanity - Page 22

On February 09 2011 18:48 ICanFlyLow wrote:
most people seem to forget that chickens and so on has a brain the size of a fingernail

On February 09 2011 18:49 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
Meat eating is primitive and stupid.

We live in a modern world where we can (anything) so we have a large variety of food to chose from, the healthiest food avaliable is obviously the best option (vegetable, fruit, grains). We no longer hunt since we dont have to work for any of our food now, we may aswell pick the best food. It's literally unnatural for humans to eat meat, we have taken a herbivore approach to food. since we just pick off food instead of hunting it down.

On February 09 2011 18:55 Humppis wrote:
What vegans tend to forget, is that plants and us animals have common ancestor. You are eating biomass of another living being, who just hapens to not be able to fight or even yell back. In that sence, all vegans are self righteous hypocritics.

Only option is to create our food from lifeless materials, whitch pretty much means that only laboratories can make food in form of pills, powders and chemical solutions. This can very well be the future of feeding as you could eliminate all the useless and harmful materials in our food suply, resulting in healthier life.

For now, we must consume another living being to nourish our selfs, be it plant or animal.

On February 09 2011 13:25 jalstar wrote:
I drive through fields of cows all the time in SoCal so I refuse to believe that all cows are locked up inside in tiny pens.

And I don't eat meat or poultry often because it's too expensive to get stuff that isn't processed garbage, so if anything I'm closer to vegetarian than carnivore.

On February 09 2011 18:48 imapotato wrote:
Ok right of the bat i'm gonna say i'm a meat eater. All i really have to say is that the video shown here is crap, it shows the worst factory farms on the planet and ignores any points on free range / fairly treated animals.
To make matters worse the person who started this whole thread comes from NZ were we have incredibly high standards on animal cruelty, so the video doesn't really relate to him at all.

I guess the thing i have to say is that there's nothing wrong with eating meat, the only thing i would like to see happen is to see stricter rules on how animals are treated in these farms, feeding people sick animals is not alright!

Stop forcing your goddamn life style on other people!

On February 09 2011 18:08 Belial88 wrote:

While from a completely rational viewpoint this makes sense, from a logistic standpoint, as well as realistic standpoint, you are wrong. Rich countries in the west like meat, we make a lot of meat, and we like vegetables, and we make a lot of vegetables. We just make a lot of food in general. Now, you aren't complaining about veggies. You are complaining about meat, which we make a lot of. We make so much meat, that we actually export some of this meat to developing countries. By limiting demand, or to be more inclusive and direct, by hurting supply/suppliers, you lessen how much meat we export.

Now in a perfect world we wouldn't waste the food on our plates, and mail it to Africa. But there are huge logistic issues, as well as health, issues with that. All in all, we have a surplus, and we can export our meat, made cheap by popular demand, to poor people.

I'm an economist (with a degree to prove it)

If you want to have an argument about the farts of farm animals leading to the destruction of the world, then go for it. But don't derail this argument by changing subjects. I may agree with you on this one, but it's off topic to say the least.

It's not necessarily meat, or vegetarianism, that I am saying is for the poor/rich. A huge redux of what I am saying is that by limiting economy, you can hurt poor people far away - in essence, globalization, and the narrow viewpoint held by those who think that their actions have no impact on others, particularly when it comes to sectors of the economy. My point of view of extreme veganism like PETA is the same as my point of view against monopolies, and against simple, neighborhood vandals. When your goal is to hurt a sector of the economy, the damage can hurt the livelihood of others, sometimes people who are extremely sensitive to such damages.

I would say the same thing if there was a radical meat-only group who's goal was to destroy the crops of international agricultural giants. Many countries don't have the choice to pick and choose between meat and vegetables, and these two goods are often interchangeable in poor societies, so raising the price of one leads to a rise in the price of the other (complementary goods).

And while I haven't been to India, I have been to Hindu societies, and poor Hindus eat meat too. I think you are referring to beef, but the poster wasn't saying don't eat beef he was saying don't eat meat. However, I don't expect you to know this and poor people in Hindu countries eat meat, eat vegeatbles, eat whatever they can afford, just like poor people everywhere.

To make it clearer, in many countries McDonalds is a luxury. In poor areas in America, it is a major source of sustanence (contributes greatly to health problems but at least they eat, and they do pick it for a reason). I know this because I've traveled (more than once I was told the best restaurant in town was McDonalds).

As I mentioned above, it's a logistic issue. Rich countries make a surplus of meat, poor countries benefit from the surplus through international trade. If rich countries stopped eating so much meat, poor countries do not have an import for cheap food. Ideally, the most efficient thing would be for everyone to eat rice/maize (depending on geographical location) but that would not provide enough nutrients, even for vegans. The fact of the matter is life is inefficient, yet running an inefficient system of meats like kobe beef somehow leads to a rise in the standard of living. People need rich, excessive foods, even if to give them more reason to make more money, to be more productive, even if the reason is so stupid to take a girl out for a fancy dinner in a materialistic society. And while materialism may be the cause of a loss of spirituality in our world today, that man driving a lamborghini in my city who just made national news by beating up his famous pop-star singer girlfriend is driving many in my country to spend more money, to work longer hours, and to make better things, sometimes unnecessary, and sometimes very necessary.

Take a drive through the ghetto, actually, but many people rely on mcdonalds. Maybe a bit dramatic what I said - to be clear, in poor countries it is a luxurious place to eat where luxury does not exist, and for rich countries it may be a way for the kids to be fed when they cant do so otherwise, as easily, so they have more time, and a better standard of living if there were no mcdonalds.

I don't mind vegetarians, or vegans, and I actually believe they live a much healthier lifestyle than I do (nevermind I'm a smoker). But I don't eat to be healthy (I'm quite healthy as it is, and I don't eat unhealthiy, ie no fast food, snacks, or junk food, but I do drink a lot of milk and eat a lot of meat), and I do realize the importance of overconsumption in western societies. I'm an economist (with a degree to prove it) and I've traveled much of the world, and have seen what the excess in our country has done for other countries - great things. Our unending thirst for oil props up entire continents, our love of junk food gives luxury where none exists, and our fast cars are a means for transnational transportation where horseback dominated. Being vegan is fine, but groups like PETA turn a lifestyle choice into an aggressive campaign that's blind to whom it hurts.

On February 09 2011 14:04 FuDDx wrote:
I don't care about you're eating habits. Ive been a vegi for over 16 years both my kids are vegi and my wife a Masters (almost Phd,quitter) In nutritonal sciences also been vegi for 16 years. We enjoy our lifestyle and are educated about it.

eat what you want ...

I also work in a Vegan Kitchen (I hate the food love the pay) And most of our clients are people trying to loss weight by getting french fries, deep fried fake chicken nuggets and fake tuna melt. silly fools.

On February 09 2011 18:19 SerpentFlame wrote:


Your cat isn't special among animals, and by owning one you've certainly seen how they have feelings albeit different from human ones. I'm sure you'll think about animal feelings and empathy in life when s/he dies. I know I did when my cat died.

Additionally, I really hope that people who eat meat (myself included) stop trying to act so high and mighty about it. There's really no need to be on the moral high ground when we're not. Eating meat is something that's done out of habit, and out of convenience, and certainly not born of morals. That humans aren't alone in having feelings among animals is well-documented by the scientific community.

Also the claim that most meat (at least in the US) isn't factory farmed is really just false, if you look up the statistics.

Here's one for you now: http://www.pressherald.com/life/foodanddining/the-real-cost-of-the-food-we-eat_2010-09-01.html.

On February 09 2011 18:23 Sotamursu wrote:

There is no objective morality. Of course I would think that they're doing something wrong, because mankind is suffering. Mankind is what keeps me alive and provides for me. But from the alien pow, they aren't doing anything wrong. I don't really understand what you mean by taking the easy way out. I feel like you're trying to go into arguing semantics.