EPT[GOM] Classic Season 2 Finals (8/2) - Page 68
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ThePhan2m
Norway2751 Posts
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cz
United States3249 Posts
On February 09 2009 01:50 TheYango wrote: If this were true, then why wouldn't the peak all-time ELO be higher? Every bonjwa has dropped a few games here and there, even during their time of dominance. he's not bonjwa. He's the best player currently, but that's not enough. | ||
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Dazed.
Canada3301 Posts
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miseiler
United States1389 Posts
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arb
Noobville17922 Posts
On February 09 2009 01:54 Dazed_Spy wrote: anyone who says Jangbi is the new stork should be banned on sight. someone has to take the silver curse | ||
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Avidkeystamper
United States8556 Posts
He has not dominated long enough. There are too many players as good as he is. He is affected by maps. | ||
]343[
United States10328 Posts
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Darth Peter
Romania438 Posts
On February 09 2009 02:05 Avidkeystamper wrote: Bisu is not bonjwa in my opinion for these couple reasons: He has not dominated long enough. There are too many players as good as he is. He is affected by maps. How much do you have to dominate? Bisu won 2 MSL's in a row,was in a Final of another and made it to the semifinals of an OSL. After that,he dominates the scene since October. That's at least one year of domination. What more do you need? And of course there are players just as good right now. But they didn't dominate for so long,they didn't win 4 titles,they are not considered Revolutionists. And with all due respect, his wins aren't that much influenced by the maps. Why can't anybody else besides him and Jangbi win on these maps now if they are so imbalanced? Because they are the best. And Bisu also won on maps which do not favour Protoss over terran or zerg. I am not saying that Bisu should be Bonjwa right now,but if he continues his domination,reaches his new Elo peak and wins the OSL,even in these circumstances,he should be one. But of course,there are haters,who,no matter what he does will say that he doesn't deserve to be Bonjwa. | ||
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abakben
United States308 Posts
On February 09 2009 02:15 Darth Peter wrote: How much do you have to dominate? Bisu won 2 MSL's in a row,was in a Final of another and made it to the semifinals of an OSL. After that,he dominates the scene since October. That's at least one year of domination. What more do you need? And of course there are players just as good right now. But they didn't dominate for so long,they didn't win 4 titles,they are not considered Revolutionists. And with all due respect, his wins aren't that much influenced by the maps. Why can't anybody else besides him and Jangbi win on these maps now if they are so imbalanced? Because they are the best. And Bisu also won on maps which do not favour Protoss over terran or zerg. I am not saying that Bisu should be Bonjwa right now,but if he continues his domination,reaches his new Elo peak and wins the OSL,even in these circumstances,he should be one. But of course,there are haters,who,no matter what he does will say that he doesn't deserve to be Bonjwa. You do not need to explain anything to those haters. They cannot understand it. | ||
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fanatacist
10319 Posts
On February 03 2009 00:02 fanatacist wrote: I love PvP. I love Bisu. JangBi is pretty sick. This should be a good finals. I predict Bisu 3-1. Bisu didn't play that well in the last MSL finals and still took JangBi to school. I think he will play better now, and even though JangBi's nerves in a tournament setting should have gotten better, after Bisu spills first blood, JangBi will start to crumble and have flashbacks of previous anal stretching by Bruce Lee Toss. He will get a silver, Stork will console him but JangBi will look into Stork's eyes and see that Stork is himself but a few silvers into the future, will cry at night and slump for a bit then try hard and come back to a semi-decent state only to get silver again (provided he doesn't go whoring out of depression). Bisu will face Jaedong in an epic Bo5 which will melt our collective faces and the GOM website will crash from utter sex. However I predict Bisu 3-2 Jaedong. GL HF GG~ Owned. | ||
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Avidkeystamper
United States8556 Posts
On February 09 2009 02:15 Darth Peter wrote: How much do you have to dominate? Bisu won 2 MSL's in a row,was in a Final of another and made it to the semifinals of an OSL. After that,he dominates the scene since October. That's at least one year of domination. What more do you need? And of course there are players just as good right now. But they didn't dominate for so long,they didn't win 4 titles,they are not considered Revolutionists. And with all due respect, his wins aren't that much influenced by the maps. Why can't anybody else besides him and Jangbi win on these maps now if they are so imbalanced? Because they are the best. And Bisu also won on maps which do not favour Protoss over terran or zerg. I am not saying that Bisu should be Bonjwa right now,but if he continues his domination,reaches his new Elo peak and wins the OSL,even in these circumstances,he should be one. But of course,there are haters,who,no matter what he does will say that he doesn't deserve to be Bonjwa. "How much do you have to dominate? Bisu won 2 MSL's in a row,was in a Final of another and made it to the semifinals of an OSL. After that,he dominates the scene since October." The nail in his coffin is his extended absence after his domination, he was no where to be found for a very long time. An extended period of time doesn't have any gaps, he played so helplessly for a good half year. "And of course there are players just as good right now. But they didn't dominate for so long,they didn't win 4 titles,they are not considered Revolutionists." Yes, but people like Savior would consistently beat his "rivals" whenever they met, Bisu still has a under 50% against Flash + JD, that was the point I was making. If I remember correctly, Savior denied many of his rivals titles many, many times (except Chojja), Bisu got knocked out by his rivals many, many times. (Bacchus, GOMS4, Arena). "And with all due respect, his wins aren't that much influenced by the maps. Why can't anybody else besides him and Jangbi win on these maps now if they are so imbalanced? Because they are the best. " He himself said that maps influenced the outcomes of his games. (Interview after losing to by.hero) Savior did not have the same weakness (Shinhan OSL). "But of course,there are haters,who,no matter what he does will say that he doesn't deserve to be Bonjwa." I hope you're not referring to me, my post wasn't laden with hate or anything, since the standard for bonjwa is very high. | ||
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Ethelis
United States2397 Posts
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MrHoon
10183 Posts
We aren't hating on Bisu like OMGGG U DONT DESERVE IT BLAH BLAH BLAH and he clearly showed in wildcard and recent interviews he doesn't want to fuck up and finally stopped being retarded (thank god) But you guys still aren't understanding, the Bonjwa standard is so fucking high. Yes I do believe if Bisu does well in the OSL he will be able to be closer to the Bonjwa title but even that isn't enough. Right now, the competition is too high. There are still 3 other players that are considered to be on the same level with Bisu, and any one of these guys have the chance to become bonjwa. But even these guys, are far from the bonjwa title. | ||
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Calyx
United States49 Posts
On February 08 2009 21:09 MrHoon wrote: Whenever I think of a strategy, I think how well would it work and how enjoyable it is. Woah, Bisu looks at the entertainment value of his strategies before using them? Thats awesome. | ||
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Darth Peter
Romania438 Posts
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iloahz
United States964 Posts
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JWD
United States12607 Posts
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-orb-
United States5770 Posts
On February 09 2009 02:41 Calyx wrote: Woah, Bisu looks at the entertainment value of his strategies before using them? Thats awesome. What a baller seriously. Also man jangbi threw game 3 away so hard | ||
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Proposal
United States1310 Posts
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
from what i understand of the bonjwa concept in korea, it seems to involve both current dominance and also historical legacy. this is why the traditional standard of measuring a bonjwa has stayed the same, although the competition has gotten tougher. to qualify for a traditional bonjwa, you have to have 4(?) major titles, with at least one each of msl and osl, and stay kespa #1 for half a year continuously. in addition, you need a 70% winrate over any one year period. quite obviously one can dominate the scene even without reaching one or two of these qualifications, and i suspect that the concept was invented after we had already seen players like boxer nada and oov, and people found common features of their careers and tailored a standard for their historical position. we'd have to look at when the word bonjwa came into use in its current form. whether it was after nada, oov or savior. in any case, although it is understandable that people would try to measure current players to historical ones, what is being compared are not really the players, but a position, a throne of dominance whose standards may change by the competitive balance of the scene. this throne may also just disappear, and be replaced by a tier system, like the 6 dragons. in the bisu case, although he has done very well, the scene has players that are also doing well, and bisu does not stand out as much. so calling him the chief of the dragons is fine, he does not qualify for bonjwa, not through any fault of his own, but because the term does not describe the scene currently. in any case, the title of bonjwa is derived from underlying performance. calling someone bonjwa does not add anything new to our information about her performance. we all know what games bisu won and lost, and under what conditions, so glossing over that with a single impression seems like an exercise taken for the purpose of entertainment only. although bisu does not deserve to be mentioned in the same breathe with ipx et al, he still has a lot of games left to play. though flash is still the blue chipper of choice, bisu has done well to wrest away the scene from everyone in the past few months. | ||
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