EPT
[ASL13] Ro8 Day 4
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
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HOLYBATS
Turkey730 Posts
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[JXSA].Zergling
China186 Posts
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t2azor
32 Posts
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prosatan
Romania8042 Posts
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Ruff
Kazakhstan179 Posts
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prosatan
Romania8042 Posts
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sysen
27 Posts
But head say 3-1 win for rain | ||
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Mozdk
Denmark6989 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 19:00 Mozdk wrote: Why does it say Arty and Tasteless will cast, when there is no link to their stream? Will they be casting delayed? They have a weird arrangement that to this day I don't understand. They have to stream days later...it's kind of bullshit for them. Especially since Nyoken and Scan are so good. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
Edit: They asked Rain what the most important match was. He said match three. I don't see any reason for him to be honest here. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
DOUBLE OMG...TURNING AROUND AT THE NAT! | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
Just a garbage opening honestly. Had he done a nexus first into forge he would've had a massive advantage. | ||
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 19:19 BLinD-RawR wrote: uncharacteristic opening game from rain, did not expect him to attempt such a bold opening. Same....he had an opportunity to have a massive lead by taking a gamble with nexus first. 12 hatch was very likely. Rain needs to win this second game. I think it's much harder to win with zealot pressure than with an early nexus for someone at Rain's level. | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 19:12 Sirris wrote: I don't think the past records are a huge clue. It will come down to the openings. I'm assuming Rain is in shape. I would imagine he will be going nexus forge to be honest. Taking a risk. If he doesn't I think he's taking a disadvantage vs Soulkey on the first map. I imagine Soulkey will go hatch first. Of course Soulkey could know this way better than I do and counter this play. Just want to point this out...sorry. Rain really should've 13 nexus 13 forge. Or something like this. It's just expected Soulkey to hatch first. | ||
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
My bad...i missed he scouted after pylon. The second part is true though. Rain will need to get a lot of offense on 2 base. The cannon timing is not ideal. If you look at Mini's successful games he delays the first cannon. Rain didn't do it. Really slow growth for rain and the hydras are coming. Rain should be very scared about everything. It's such a hard spot. Obviously we can see everything but Rain has no idea if it's Muta/scourge or hydra bust. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
Needs to rebuild the forge and get armor...it will be a tough spot. This is a nightmare situation for Rain to be honest... but he can do it. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
This is a terrible position for Rain It's a nightmare to get the third base for Rain. Great counter with zealots on the far top right to deny a base. But it doesn't really matter if rain can't get a solid third. Rain does start a mineral only but he really needs a third gas. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
OMG AGAIN RAIN SHOWING HIS MIDGAME SKILL! Rain doing everything he needed to do. Amazing skills. | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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oxKnu
1180 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
 Him shredding the mutas so easily was a big part of it.His midgame play is so great. He just needs to lean on that. If he can set himself up for a solid midgame he will take the series. Much easier said than done. | ||
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Zariel
Australia1285 Posts
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Xeln4g4
Italy1209 Posts
Edit: Ohhh and i fotgot the wonderfull mutas sacrifice ... sent in the middle of a goon templar army. Not even a D+ player could do worse than that. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 19:48 Zariel wrote: That lone zealot deserves a medal for taking down the forth base himself Yea lol that zealot was insane. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 19:48 Xeln4g4 wrote: LOL play by Soulkey "ok lets pretend pvz is balance" lets play randomly throwing the army away after a clear lead .... sometime i really doubt the intention of the players ... It's really hard man when you're doing 10 things at once but yes...in this instance Soulkey was not microing his hydra groups well especially versus the storms. | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
If he does forge expand that's fine but with the quick scouting i think Soulkey will expand and drone too rapidly. It will be a harder game for Rain. However if Soulkey goes for a 12 hatch it will be tricky for Rain and pretty even based on how greedy Rain plays. | ||
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TMNT
2723 Posts
To think he could have 3-0 Soulkey if he didn't throw away the first game on THE Protoss map with that cheese. | ||
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Soulforged
Latvia918 Posts
Harass of dts/ht did enough, even if not enough drone kills it forced a lot of pulls were made and those are expensive. Mutas did not pay off, in comparison. They forced couple extra cannons and killed one templar. They did not prevent zealots from denying top right and didn't kill them either, the poke of goons to the nat has kept mutas busy. Those 2 things brought the game to even, with Rain having some 20 supply lead instead of equal supply in the early midgame. Even game state = bad attack by soulkey was a throw. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 19:56 TMNT wrote: Rain should learn his lesson now: no need to copy Mini, you are also an ASL champion. To think he could have 3-0 Soulkey if he didn't throw away the first game on THE Protoss map with that cheese. True that...I really wanted him to nexus into forge | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
Don't risk this too hard. Just light harassment please...FFS he did overpool.... WHY DIDNT YOU GATEWAY FIRST! Just a terrible opener for Rain...like I said before Rain needs to win the opener and he failed massively. He's behind for sure. He might come back not saying the game is done, but it's a bad game for him so far. | ||
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TMNT
2723 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:02 TMNT wrote: Never mind he tried to cheese again LOL maybe his wrist is not in good condition I don't think his wrist is bad..was a bad gamble...but i really wish he would've just played towards a strong mid game. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
I can't see Rain winning this game against someone like Soulkey. Mini in his championship run immediately saw the muta switch and got a second stargate instantly to counter. That being said that hidden templar was great! | ||
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Soulforged
Latvia918 Posts
You lose 1-2 sairs and you have no tempo for good 3 minutes... | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
This is a dire position for Rain. He has some options though. With the mutas and lurkers in play I can't see Rain winning this game. | ||
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
It's done....the tempo from soulkey is winning. Rain can only stumple to a third at best. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
Like I said...Rain needs to get a lead in the beggining. | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
This is Rain's champion test. He needs to come up with something special here. He can't play a basic game, the map is very hard for him. He needs to be something GREAT. Do it Rain | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
i'd take the risk for Rain and 12 nexus 12 forge. You're not hurting me Scan. I hate the way he played those games | ||
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Soulforged
Latvia918 Posts
He made 4 cannons to defend because of that(+2 in main and nat each), while Soulkey made no more muta and droned for a while. That's it, after then he was very behind and had no timing. He'd have a shot to make it to lategame defensively, but losing templars to mutas sealed it. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:19 Soulforged wrote: Early game didn't matter period, what went wrong was he lost 2 sairs in the first attack and he made 4 cannons to defend because of that, while Soulkey made no more muta and droned for a while. That's it, after then he was very behind and had no timing. He'd have a shot to make it to lategame defensively, but losing templars to mutas sealed it. If you don't think the early game mattered "at all" then you don't understand broodwar Sorry to say man. The early game always matters...a lot. The situation wouldn't have been like that if the early game went Rain's way. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
Yes. 12 nexus into 12 gateway...full mini mode. | ||
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Soulforged
Latvia918 Posts
That 2nd probe wasn't so bad because it forced 4 lings and the 2nd hatch was delayed for the zerg as well, you're reading too much into the opener. Like, he wasn't ahead after it obviously, but he wasn't significantly behind until after he lost sairs and made 4 unnecessary cannons. | ||
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TMNT
2723 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:11 Sirris wrote: It's done now.... Like I said...Rain needs to get a lead in the beggining. Well isn't it the case for Protoss in all PvZ anyway? If you don't get a lead somehow in the early, you'll get run over by Zerg. I saw a lot of Bisu vs Soulkey practice games before this. And Bisu is probably the best with early Zealot aggression, but Soulkey dealt with it like it was nothing. Maybe that's the reason Rain opts for those weird builds. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:22 Soulforged wrote: Early game could result in there being 1-2 less zealots in that attack. It could be a contributing factor to the 5th sair not being ordered. That 2nd probe wasn't so bad because it forced 4 lings and the 2nd hatch was delayed for the zerg as well, you're reading too much into the opener. Alright man...it's too much to debate  If you say so. I'm talking about gateway first into fast nexus against the build soulkey played. The build I called for Rain. After that it's so complicated. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
USE THE PROBES Rain is winning this game slightly. | ||
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Soulforged
Latvia918 Posts
Weird game, can't tell who's ahead. Letting lings in was obv bad, but after that - nice ling force, didn't lose many probes, but a lot of drills and interrupted gas mining. Pure chaos for both from there :D | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
He needs to keep his sair count high. Take the third Rain! No need to pressure too hard....Move out then move back. That's what you do! FFS...he needed to take the third while pressuring | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Soulforged
Latvia918 Posts
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Soulforged
Latvia918 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
Don't attack into sunkens...pressure and take a fourth you got this. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
JUST TAKE IT! GG | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
great game by both players | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
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Xeln4g4
Italy1209 Posts
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
Poll: Recommend Rain vs Soulkey Set 3? Yes (7) If you have time (4) No (1) 12 total votes Your vote: Recommend Rain vs Soulkey Set 3? | ||
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Soulforged
Latvia918 Posts
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TMNT
2723 Posts
Whats next now, he'd probaly bring Sair Reaver on Metaverse I guess/hope. Edit: ah shit it's on Butter instead. | ||
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:39 Xeln4g4 wrote: Rain is damn good, if he wins this last match, he will win ASL13. no he will only advance to the Ro4. he needs to win 2 more Bo7s after this to win ASL13, please keep up with the tournament on liquipedia. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:38 emperorchampion wrote: 12 nexus, 12 gate, cyber from rain great game by both players That's what I'm saying man! You either prepare to counter over 9 pool straight up or you go full macro mode. Soulkey is a player that wants to play over pool at the most and most likely 12 hatch. I suggested 4 pool for him because I don't think anyone would've seen it coming. With the pressure on in this game. I'm going 12 nexus 12 forge. I'll barely deny the over pool with probe pull. | ||
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prosatan
Romania8042 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:38 emperorchampion wrote: 12 nexus, 12 gate, cyber from rain great game by both players Yesss!! On vertical spawns... how can he pull something like this idk... | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:40 BLinD-RawR wrote: no he will only advance to the Ro4. he needs to win 2 more Bo7s after this to win ASL13, please keep up with the tournament on liquipedia. Haha I love your counter point but I think what Xel was saying is that Rain is the clear favorite. I agree with you however...I think players like Light and Soma for example will be a hard challenge. To be honest all of these players are fairly even. It's just slight edges to certain players. | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Zariel
Australia1285 Posts
This is a clinic of what happens when zerg stays on lair tech for too long. Protoss superior units takes advantage once they can get their critical mass. | ||
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:42 Sirris wrote: Haha I love your counter point but I think what Xel was saying is that Rain is the clear favorite. I agree with you however...I think players like Light and Soma for example will be a hard challenge. I know what he was saying, I was being facetious, Rain may have gotten past light in the Ro16, but I can't see him winning a Bo7 against him, soma also isn't easy. unless he's facing bisu he's got it tough. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
I hope Rain reads the early hatch early pool and keeps his zealots back and gets the nexus up fast. FAKE CANNON RUSH LOL | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
See.... | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
OMG HE DOES IT! | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
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Zariel
Australia1285 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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prosatan
Romania8042 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Soulforged
Latvia918 Posts
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
Poll: Recommend Rain vs Soulkey Set 5? Yes (21) No (0) If you have time (0) 21 total votes Your vote: Recommend Rain vs Soulkey Set 5? | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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LG)Sabbath
Argentina3022 Posts
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prosatan
Romania8042 Posts
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Xeln4g4
Italy1209 Posts
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weiliem
2071 Posts
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BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
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prosatan
Romania8042 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:53 BLinD-RawR wrote: what do you know, not only did I get the score right, sk floundered in set 5 while rain outperformed 100% correct !  | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:53 LG)Sabbath wrote: shield battery healing probes, just insane micro by rain One of the best moves ever. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:53 BLinD-RawR wrote: what do you know, not only did I get the score right, sk floundered in set 5 while rain outperformed I did too I promise I didn't copy you haha. | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:45 BLinD-RawR wrote: I know what he was saying, I was being facetious, Rain may have gotten past light in the Ro16, but I can't see him winning a Bo7 against him, soma also isn't easy. unless he's facing bisu he's got it tough. That's the real test. Light or Soma.... or even Bisu. Bisu surely will study Rain soooo hard. I think it will be very hard for every single player. Anyone can win this. I know my picks though | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Xeln4g4
Italy1209 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:42 Sirris wrote: Haha I love your counter point but I think what Xel was saying is that Rain is the clear favorite. I agree with you however...I think players like Light and Soma for example will be a hard challenge. To be honest all of these players are fairly even. It's just slight edges to certain players. Weakest mu for Rain is pvz ... he will just eat other races, can be bo07 or bo11 doesnt matter. He has another pvz so i might be wrong ... but he will destroy bisu and light. So he will be third (in case he lose semi) or win the whole thing. Not because soma is better but because pvz is broken ... Rain played great, but hey ... Soul give a good help ... also in the last game he just had to keep those lings alive inside Rain main, but he confront zeals??? Wtf which z does that???!! | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 21:01 Xeln4g4 wrote: Weakest mu for Rain is pvz ... he will just eat other races, can be bo07 or bo11 doesnt matter. He has another pvz so i might be wrong ... but he will destroy bisu and light. So he will be third (in case he lose semi) or win the whole thing. Not because soma is better but because pvz is broken ... Rain played great, but hey ... Soul give a good help ... also in the last game he just had to keep those lings alive but he confront zeals??? Wtf which z does that???!! I think Rain's weakest match up is TvP actually. Light will be his weakness. Maybe I'm wrong but that's what I think. Like I've said before it will still be extremely close. But I believe Light vs Rain will be essentially the finals. Maybe Soma is the best...we will see. Those are my picks though Basically Light or Rain. | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 21:04 emperorchampion wrote: bisu bo7 coming up tomorrow I don't think it's tomorrow? Unless it's another tournament | ||
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LG)Sabbath
Argentina3022 Posts
Nyoken just said it's tomorrow, it's not on the calendar though so idk | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 21:06 LG)Sabbath wrote: Nyoken just said it's tomorrow, it's not on the calendar though so idk If it was ASL tomorrow that would be odd. They usually space them out in the late rounds. I could be completely wrong though. | ||
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nyoken
United States100 Posts
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TMNT
2723 Posts
On March 29 2022 20:50 Zariel wrote: How does one.....kill 6 lings....with 2 zealots (without losing one)?! Great micro by Rain but I think Soulkey got too excited after he got the run by that he just wanted to take down Rain asap. The correct move would be to run those lings around, poking probes, keeping Protoss busy, instead of a head-on fight with zealots. | ||
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oxKnu
1180 Posts
On March 29 2022 21:02 Sirris wrote: I think Rain's ZvP is actually stronger than Bisu. Bisu needs strong momentum early on in tech. I think Bisu is weaker to hydra busts etc. What do I know though...we will see Don't be ridiculous now. Bisu is on a level of his own. Remember that Zerg is at an all time high of being the strongest in this meta and he STILL crushes, although his level has diminished compared to his heyday overall. Even Mini is not as fundamentally strong as Bisu in PvZ even though he's won a title beating top zergs along the way. Rain, however, again showing that he is a mastermind of tournament play. Constantly playing and thinking outside of the box and just confusing zergs into a middling game state where he can flourish. Also, worth nothing how sharp his control has been this whole series. There are players out there that haven't left the game for 2 years and are nowhere near this level of control. Rain truly is a talent. Tournaments are far more exciting when he is around. | ||
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Galacsia
Chile161 Posts
but I can't take away anything from Rain, he played fantastically. Deserved win and there's a higher chance that he keeps on playing now that he's seeded on ASL14 | ||
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TornadoSteve
1030 Posts
On March 29 2022 22:07 oxKnu wrote: Rain truly is a talent. Tournaments are far more exciting when he is around. 100% agreed. Cant say the same for the rest of your post, though | ||
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M3t4PhYzX
Poland4195 Posts
WP & GGs  | ||
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Kaolla
China2999 Posts
Regarding his control, it might be ok, but he did still lose some corsairs in one of these games (forgot think 2 or 3) because he was too busy multitasking it seemed... Anyway awesome games. This RO8 was really fun. | ||
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outscar
2832 Posts
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HOLYBATS
Turkey730 Posts
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whylessness
United States376 Posts
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Marl
United States692 Posts
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LpTraxamillion
265 Posts
On March 29 2022 21:16 TMNT wrote: Great micro by Rain but I think Soulkey got too excited after he got the run by that he just wanted to take down Rain asap. The correct move would be to run those lings around, poking probes, keeping Protoss busy, instead of a head-on fight with zealots. This, he wins easily if he keeps those lings alive in the main, gets speed, and forces cannon etc. While droning He saw red and went for it but got hard outmicrod. I feel like Soulkey played relatively poorly compared to what he is capable of this series. | ||
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t2azor
32 Posts
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Lazyer
United States342 Posts
Rain's multitasking throughout the series was also great, always sending out scouting zealots under pressure. Rooting for him in Ro4. | ||
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Lazyer
United States342 Posts
On March 29 2022 21:10 nyoken wrote: It's tomorrow. Light/bisu both played last week so they've had time to prepare I don't see the LB yet My guess is Light 4-2 Bisu | ||
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arbiter_md
Moldova1219 Posts
But the next game will be completely different for Rain. Soma is the only seed remaining, he has practice of playing in the semifinal and he is unbeatable in this ASL so far. The guy didn't lose a single game, and he has a chance to keep the record intact while reaching the finals. In fact if Bisu wins the other semi, Soma has a chance to take the title without losing a single game. Don't think this has ever happened in a Starleague. Anyway, I expect Soma vs Light finals and it will probably give some good games. | ||
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RowdierBob
Australia13006 Posts
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 22:07 oxKnu wrote: Don't be ridiculous now. Bisu is on a level of his own. Remember that Zerg is at an all time high of being the strongest in this meta and he STILL crushes, although his level has diminished compared to his heyday overall. Even Mini is not as fundamentally strong as Bisu in PvZ even though he's won a title beating top zergs along the way. Rain, however, again showing that he is a mastermind of tournament play. Constantly playing and thinking outside of the box and just confusing zergs into a middling game state where he can flourish. Also, worth nothing how sharp his control has been this whole series. There are players out there that haven't left the game for 2 years and are nowhere near this level of control. Rain truly is a talent. Tournaments are far more exciting when he is around. I only meant I thought Rain was better at PvZ recently not overall to be clear | ||
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Sirris
681 Posts
On March 29 2022 21:10 nyoken wrote: It's tomorrow. Light/bisu both played last week so they've had time to prepare Thank you sir. | ||
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ShowTheLights
Korea (South)1688 Posts
So glad he secured a seed and I cannot wait to see him vs Soma Sure hes the underdog vs Soma but Rain can make anything happen | ||
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sM.Zik
Canada2547 Posts
On March 30 2022 14:31 RowdierBob wrote: Any of Rain v Light, Soma v Light or Soma v Bisu would be a good final. PvP would be grim and might finally be the push artosis needs to quit BW. Idk, I would be pumped for a Rain vs Bisu finals regardless. The two greatest PvP battling it out in a grand final sounds good to me. | ||
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