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Flash used for ZvZ? - Page 2

Forum Index > Brood War Strategy
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AttackZerg
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States7454 Posts
May 01 2009 05:40 GMT
#21
strayline post the replay.

I know who that was!
ZaplinG
Profile Blog Joined February 2005
United States3818 Posts
May 01 2009 06:12 GMT
#22
What do you think about throwing queens in the mix for some ensnare? They are fairly cheap and would certainly would help even out the mobility deficit.
Don't believe the florist when he tells you that the roses are free
skronch
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States2717 Posts
May 01 2009 06:35 GMT
#23
if anyone can pull this off well in a game, can you please post a rep? i find that i'm pretty confined to the ling/muta/scourge style of ZvZ simply because it's the only build i've ever seen on tv.
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12796 Posts
May 01 2009 06:37 GMT
#24
Eh.. hydra has power in large numbers, mutaling diminish power in large numbers. Depend if you can get enough
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
Dromar
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States2145 Posts
May 01 2009 06:46 GMT
#25
I've thought about hydras ZvZ a few times.

The first time, I realized mutas are considered small, so hydras only hit them for 5, and said fuck it.

After that, every time I consider hydras ZvZ, I can't help but think that 99.9% of progames go mutas. Never see hydras except in the extremely rare cases of 30 minute games or something. There must be a reason no progamer goes hydra instead of muta ZvZ ever.

That said you're not playing against progamers, so I'm sure if you refined a good build, you could do reasonably well with it.
Elite00fm
Profile Joined January 2008
United States548 Posts
May 01 2009 07:15 GMT
#26
if someone goes hydras in zvz off of 2 base I just take a 3rd gas and go muta/ling/lurker gg unbreakable contain while i mass expo
davidgurt
Profile Joined September 2006
United States1355 Posts
May 01 2009 07:15 GMT
#27
HI CRIM
There's crashing?
samachking
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
Bahrain4949 Posts
May 01 2009 07:46 GMT
#28
Hydras in critical mass destroy evreything Z has unless Z has swarm. As soon as you have 3.5+ groups of Hydra there is not much you can do against it, especially with upgrades its too powerful. However you can easily counter hydra by scouting Hydra tech which only works off 2 base, then removing some drones of gas, then go for mass ling with a few 3-5 muta attack and the zerg will pretty much die most of the time.
"And then Earthlings discovered tools. Suddenly agreeing with friends could be a form of suicide or worse. But agreements went on, not for the sake of common sense, or decency, or self preservation, but for friendliness."
Patriot.dlk
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Sweden5462 Posts
May 01 2009 08:02 GMT
#29
Liquid.Drone is quite good at making hydras in zvz (or was).

It's very winnable but lurkers are required. Most zergs counter hydras with a shitload of lings and their mutas and that's beatable because lurkers take out any number of lings .

when you beat a hydra zerg often you either:
- out harass him and win early on.
- abuse greater mobility and win later on.

The second option requires few zerglings, just have a bunch to stab / kill ninja exps. All minerals you get left over from mutas should be invested into sunkens guarding your (extra) expand. For example you can hatch the ramp and sunk up there making it very hard to penetrate with hydra. When you have 10 sunks at your exps he basically can't attack you and the game goes into expand-all-over mode.

You can have islands whiteout defense there so getting drop to get islands is gosu. You should be able to exand more overall if you save up money for mass sunk and dont waste into useless zerglings.

This is about what l.drone said about this once and It's very true to me

Marine50
Profile Joined September 2007
Australia1764 Posts
May 01 2009 08:02 GMT
#30
On May 01 2009 15:35 skronch wrote:
if anyone can pull this off well in a game, can you please post a rep? i find that i'm pretty confined to the ling/muta/scourge style of ZvZ simply because it's the only build i've ever seen on tv.


Reps of this would be great to watch. I remember in a TL.net Attack episode someone went Hydra against muta on Tau Cross
IRIS FIGHTING!!!
Patriot.dlk
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Sweden5462 Posts
May 01 2009 08:07 GMT
#31
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=59065

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=23108&currentpage=All

Posts made in these threads by L.Drone is very good if you intend to play hydra/lurk
Swarmy
Profile Joined July 2008
Canada70 Posts
May 01 2009 08:08 GMT
#32
Going hydra can work, if your opponent has inferior economy.
Boonbag
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
France3318 Posts
May 01 2009 08:54 GMT
#33
timing +1 push with 2 - 3 lurkers works wonders against stupid opponents
Crimson)S(hadow
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
Philippines578 Posts
May 01 2009 11:08 GMT
#34
On May 01 2009 16:15 davidgurt wrote:
HI CRIM


lol hello dt
"It's the end of the BW era which i devoted everything to for 10 years. I tried playing sc2, but my BW memories run too deep; I felt like I was playing an entirely different game" -ToSsGirL
KlaCkoN
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1661 Posts
May 01 2009 11:18 GMT
#35
It works okish versus 1 hat muta since his ling count will be limited. Defend the first mutas with one spore and ~5 hydra. Attack at ~12 lings 12 hydras is a pretty good timing.
"Voice or no voice the people can always be brought to the bidding of their leaders ... All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger."
StarBrift
Profile Joined January 2008
Sweden1761 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-05-01 11:47:00
May 01 2009 11:44 GMT
#36
On May 01 2009 15:37 evanthebouncy! wrote:
Eh.. hydra has power in large numbers, mutaling diminish power in large numbers. Depend if you can get enough


Are you kidding? It's the other way around. 6 groups of mutas will kill an infinite ammount of hydras if the terrain is tight. They will die soooo much faster than the mutas. Add dark swarm and plague and you have another deal. But then cracklings should rip everything apart.
sprawlers
Profile Joined June 2007
Norway439 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-05-01 11:46:27
May 01 2009 11:45 GMT
#37
I can only see this working regularly against 1 hatch muta or when you 12 hatch, cause you need to have the economic lead to be sporing up.

[image loading]

On Tau cross, from gosucup 8 finals. Ptak vs chosen. I think the key was that the build wasn't scouted until he was almost at his nat.
I feel like mass lings and attacking main muta, nat zerglings would work just as well with such a drone advantage, but once he has set himself up with hive and hydra with 2 gas against 2 gas, he has the game won, as his army is way more cost effective, and he also has defilers with plague coming pretty soon.
malathion
Profile Joined March 2009
United States361 Posts
May 01 2009 13:20 GMT
#38
Lots of theorycraft ITT.

Why not try it for 20 games and report the results?
kroko
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
Finland2136 Posts
May 01 2009 13:20 GMT
#39
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=68268
+
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=70721
I have Sick Timing and UnReal Macro
AlwaysGG
Profile Joined March 2009
Taiwan952 Posts
May 01 2009 13:27 GMT
#40
it works sometimes. i remember i seem few of those game in the foreign scenes and on WCG also.

this unorthodox build best to surprise someone because it work best on player that don't know how to counter it :0
Trust 神教教主 FlaSh | Believe 火心 EffOrt
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