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zealot pressure early on is great.
rally 2 gateways to his expo and just keep harassing.
make him spend money on sunkens which cost a lot of min 50 for drone 75 for creep and 50 for sunken each. thats 175 EACH.
usually i try to keep my scouting probe alive as long as possible. and find out his tech. you can even do some cheese and take his gas if you want lol. usually i look at how many sunkens lings and hatcheries he has. after playing for a bit you will know what he is getting.
also with the first 2 templar that come out i get an archon thats it. then just get templar goon as someone posted here.
ultralisks are freaken awesome units but remember that they are not the source of damage.
use storms on his lings or maelstrom his ultras and he cant deal that much damage.
the only real time i use dark archons i versus long game zergs. the feedback really hurts defilers and the maelstrom is great on ultras. if your da tech is really early you can even try mcing his overlords and kill with dts or even mc his ultras lol.
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Sweden33723 Posts
You shouldn't gas rush, ever, if he is fast expanding because it serves ZERO purpose then  !
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I gasrushed in a recent PvZ on Nostalgia, because the expand doesn't have gas and I was going fast expo and just wanted to delay his lings for a bit longer... think it served a purpose there ^^ As I've just started playing on PGTour I've also just started playing a bit more on different maps (tho WGT CL prepared me a bit), so I'm not that experienced with the different maps. My PvT fexpo on Gaema failed me twice, tho I still think it should be doable ^^ The biggest problem I have with PvZ is if the Z makes it to late-game in about the same healthy state as I do I'm usually doomed, as Ultra-crack (defiler) almost always does it for me.
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Sweden33723 Posts
Yeah defilers are lame ;o
And I guess gas rush is doable on nost =]
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On October 26 2004 04:09 FrozenArbiter wrote:
There some 1+ build that is pretty popular on nostalgia.
Zealot/reaver a la kingdom works well too ;o
What Kingdom game(s) is that?
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Sweden33723 Posts
Kingdom vs JulyZerg
Dahlia of jungle.
WCG Kor prelim.
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You only want to gas rush vs zerg when he two hatchs in main, on LT, or when he is going 1 hatch pool and you want to delay lings/speed/lair. But really, I only suggest it when 2 hatch main with hatch first.
Ideal times to delay are 6v9 or 9v6 on LT when OL scouts you early and you show 2 gates. Z will sometimes 2 hatch in main (on that ledge) so as to get a later pool and more drones. He will do this IF you show 2 gates. If you only show 1 gate and go tech then he definitely will expo with first hatch. Don't get any lots with those 2 gates (wait for the pool) and take your gas around 14 or so. His second OL will be showing up in about 5 seconds and when he sees your gas taken he will take his and plop down a nother hatch. You need to take his gas before he takes it. This will force him to use those 3 larva for lings, even though you still have zero lots. As lings start building you should have a cyb starting and a pylon about to finish. Build 2 lots as soon as its done and then 1 more lot and a later goon (cyb takes longer than lot build time)
Now you have a cyb and 3 lots and a goon to tech safely (lower corners) for whatever tech you want. I HIGHLY suggest 2 probe scouts right now. He is eihter powering of 6-10 lings, or he expoed again. Or he is massing lings (18+) with speed. If it is the last you need to get forge ASAP and 1-2 cannons at ur cliff. You can go either sair or reaver with this. Or play it completely safe and go for temp tech. Scouting is vital to see his response. He COULD be going mutt, so see if he has a gas up at his expo. If he does, assume mutt. then its either cannon/sair expo into archon or striaght to archon.
Thats the basics, but you should be able to figure out the proper responses. THe key is just misleading the Z until you choose what to go.
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Hmm interesting build but my problem with this is often (probably also my problem that when I blind(ish)ly follow BO's like this) that my opponent doesn't quite have the insight he/she should have, thus powers lings stupidly or not so at all and comes running in with an army he shouldn't have ^^ (thats why I just stick to my own strats, tho I take advice from others ^^ the "just build 1 archon, storm the rest" against mutas was kind of an eye opener and when I checked some reps I indeed saw I made to much archons). Anyway I'm ranting.
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Sweden33723 Posts
Yeah that's garimto's advice ^_^ (1 archon then goon storm)
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well youll notice that I said its CRUCIAL to scout to see his reaction.
As for the initial reaction im basing this all on; you need to be able to keep a probe alive in their base for 2+ minutes. I mean christ, he doesnt even have lings til the end of that time and hes busy killing an assimilator...so really if your doing things blindly the problem is not the BO. Its you. You scout so u KNOW what BO to do.
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On October 29 2004 14:44 Promises wrote:
Hmm interesting build but my problem with this is often (probably also my problem that when I blind(ish)ly follow BO's like this) that my opponent doesn't quite have the insight he/she should have, thus powers lings stupidly or not so at all and comes running in with an army he shouldn't have ^^ (thats why I just stick to my own strats, tho I take advice from others ^^ the "just build 1 archon, storm the rest" against mutas was kind of an eye opener and when I checked some reps I indeed saw I made to much archons). Anyway I'm ranting.
Umm... does he mean "blindly" as in without altering his BO, or as in little recon? I thought he meant without changing his BO...
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well its obvious that if the BO doesnt fit dont use it...I assumed that you wouldnt intentionally use an inappropriate BO while KNOWING that it was inappropriate. If he wants to argue that he knew and still did it then I really dont know what to say....
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On August 29 2004 13:14 Yuljan wrote:
As Zerg i find it hard to handle early mass zealot pressure.
Right I have that problem too !
maybe harass Z in beginning ? dunno
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as a zerg player i am a big fan of containing protoss w/ speedling -> lurker, with scourge to snipe obs. i faced a protoss player once who broke my contain very effectively by sniping lurkers before my support could engage. if you have problems with lurk contain i suggest using multiple obs to look at the positioning of the zerg's lurkers. if he or she is n00b like i was in that game and leaves his lurks out front, snipe those puppies with your goons. once he is down to 1/2 lurks send in your speedlots and own him all the way home and then some. gl hf
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i think protoss is difficult to win zerg
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On October 29 2004 14:50 FrozenArbiter wrote:
Yeah that's garimto's advice ^_^ (1 archon then goon storm)
Yes, it's the most annoying thing ever. 1 archon > MANY mutas.
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MaTRiX[SiN]
Sweden1282 Posts
On October 30 2004 21:09 oPtioNaLk wrote: Show nested quote +On October 29 2004 14:50 FrozenArbiter wrote:
Yeah that's garimto's advice ^_^ (1 archon then goon storm) Yes, it's the most annoying thing ever. 1 archon > MANY mutas.
u can take out 1 archon with 6~~ muta's if u know how to micro...(if the archon is unsupported that is)
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Sweden33723 Posts
Actually you can do it with 4 or less ;<
If it is completely unsupported you can do it with 1 (if ideal micro) ;o
But you always should have cannons :O
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Indeed that early in the game I can and will scout, and there's no problem, as my post wasn't directly set to the strategy you pointed out. However, a bit later in the game when PvZ truly becomes a guessy feely thing, when I take the bo's or whatever of gosus, often my opponents power on at strange moments (probably leaving them depleted or disadvantaged later on), but as I didn't expect it it's often rather dangerous. So my point was that when I follow BO's like that a bit later in the game I have the tendency to get wrecked. So I'll just do my own crap and lose/win with that.
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EPT
