Crazy Zerg - Page 3

On July 30 2021 11:48 404AlphaSquad wrote:


I wonder why he is so hated by the BW community on TL, given that he is the biggest foreign BW streamer. Maybe it is because he also casts sc2 and people here are ready to oust/shame people for it.

On July 30 2021 06:24 404AlphaSquad wrote:
I dont understand how there exist people who look at the defiler and do not see it as the most insane unit ever conceived in an RTS game.

But that is the nature of BW. Everything is broken in so many ways and everyone just has to deal with it. But by modern game design standards, something like a defiler in its current form would never exist in a game imo, due to how unfair/unfun it feels to play against.

On July 30 2021 13:39 Dante08 wrote:
Btw I don't think many people here have an idea of the "new" crazy Zerg style OP is talking about.

- You go 2 hatch or 2.5 hatch mute and get +1 attack, keep Terran in base and abuse them with muta micro (you need good muta micro to pull this off).
- Get quick carapace upgrade, tech to ultras asap
- Take random locations all over the map where travel distance is far.
- The "craziest" thing about this variation is no zerglings, just pure upgraded ultras

The reason this is so strong is the mutas can keep Terran in base forever, and the upgraded ultras can tank forever vs marines. You don't even need zerglings with this build, all your larva goes to ultras.

Watch this game between Action and Rush to see what I'm talking about (from the 1:19 mark). Action also countered with the ultras whenever Rush moved which is essentially buying time for another expo, once you get your 4th gas the game is pretty much over. The next game on eclipse showcases an even stronger version of this build since Action took the double gas. Going tank is risky, if Zerg picks off 1-2 tanks with mutas its gg. Valk builds can work but Zerg just needs to sunken up and buy time for ultras.

On July 30 2021 19:48 Nikon wrote:


Yeah, I'm not impressed with the T's ability to deal with 2 hatch muta that doesn't even attempt to hold you into your base by attacking it and rather plays as a 3hatch opener. Without zerglings. This game is entirely on the T, I'm afraid. He simply did nothing. No pressure, no drops, no split attacks, even though the zerg didn't kill an apprciable amount of marines...

On July 30 2021 20:18 Dante08 wrote:


What are you talking about, it's 2 rax academy vs 2 hatch, he pressured early to force sunkens. He then teched to starport on 2 rax, you can't move out anymore if Zerg goes 2 hatch heavy muta. And you suggest drops vs 2 hatch muta? It's gg if the mutas catch a dropship. Did you even watch the game?

This is Rush who is one of the top 5 Terrans and you're saying stuff like no pressure, drops or spilt attacks lmao.

On July 30 2021 21:45 LaStScan wrote:
First battle is always 8 muta vs 12mm

On July 30 2021 23:29 ggsimida wrote:


as a pro should you make an assumption like this though? considering the build variant where zerg just make only ~5 mutas (one shot healthy marine) and rushes tech. i think terrans making assumptions these little details can be the difference between 2 similarly skilled players and like this is what makes zerg mind/metagaming effective. maybe you can enlighten further on this.

On July 30 2021 21:45 LaStScan wrote:
When you play at high level, Terran cannot move out with 12mm(12 marines + # medics).
11 Muta > 12mm always.
First battle is always 8 muta vs 12mm, but zerg is always going to have the advantage with picking up a single marine and force terran to waste medic's energy. the longer the battle goes, terran falls behind because of medic's energy and marine ball becomes weak.

On July 30 2021 23:40 krooked wrote:


You can't know, i.e., if you assume one way or another, you lose.

Example 1:

Terran moves out, Z has made 8 mutas, Terran loses his army, basically game lost right there

Example 2:

Terran moves out, Z hasn't made 8 mutas, Terran keeps his army and game goes on.

Here is the key thing: Terran can't know which scenario is going to occur. Thus, it is entirely coinflip to move out. As such, the only right move is to NOT move out, or else you are gambling.

On July 30 2021 23:42 Nikon wrote:


What's your opinion of the particular game people linked me then? Terran didn't fidnt the third, but he was absolutely in a position to kill it in time, but didn't find it and it ended up costing him the game. Am I wrong?



What about the scenario in which the T player kills off mutas and forces them back to defend? Surely, top terran players are at least as good at microing their marines vs mutas as Z players are microing the mutas?

On July 30 2021 23:40 krooked wrote:


You can't know, i.e., if you assume one way or another, you lose.

Example 1:

Terran moves out, Z has made 8 mutas, Terran loses his army, basically game lost right there

Example 2:

Terran moves out, Z hasn't made 8 mutas, Terran keeps his army and game goes on.

Here is the key thing: Terran can't know which scenario is going to occur. Thus, it is entirely coinflip to move out. As such, the only right move is to NOT move out, or else you are gambling.

On July 30 2021 23:48 krooked wrote:


Nobody is forcing the mutas to engage into a bad fight if they don't make 8 mutas. They can simply avoid fighting and put up sunks, conceding map control. The point is that in 2H muta, Zerg can have enough to simply kill the moveout force, and T just cannot risk that.

On July 30 2021 23:55 ggsimida wrote:


cool but i like to hear scan's opinion on it tho

On July 31 2021 00:01 krooked wrote:


Then go ask him in a private chat. This is a public forum, and anyone can participate.

On July 31 2021 00:00 Nikon wrote:


So basically, you've given up on every TvZ you play from the get go, because you believe the Z is that much better than you that you can't do anything. This is exactly what you're saying.