TeamLiquid is looking to recruit writers to help with covering the various BW leagues in 2017 as well as individuals who would be interested in helping keep BW TLPD up to date.
Description: As a BW writer, you will be responsible for writing recaps, previews, feature articles and more as needed. The written pieces can be concise or lengthy, heavily dependent on what is being covered. They should be done in a timely manner as well. Positions are not paid and are on a strictly voluntary basis.
How to Apply: Send an application containing the following information to BigFan and/or 2Pacalypse-.
Your TeamLiquid.net ID and Skype information. For coordination purposes, we require writers to use Skype.
Short introduction and relevant background information as it pertains to this position. Please do not send resumes.
Availability and desired workload.
Applications are open indefinitely.
Two test writing assignments must also be completed.
Write a recap of a single day or an event that recently unfolded in the BW scene (GG event, ATB2 and other online tournaments are options). Try to tell a story and be as creative as you like. Be concise or go all out; there are no limitations so long as the piece is interesting to read. Examples provided above are for reference only and show several different approaches when it comes to doing recaps.
Write an article previewing a group(s) or a main storyline leading into the tournament. A main storyline includes, but is not limited to, looking at a tournament favorite or popular player going into the event and any tournament specific storylines. Considering that ASL4 is set to start towards the end of August, a preview article could focus on that tournament in particular. The possibility of Flash taking a third ASL championship is one example. Be as creative as you like and make the article an entertaining read.
Description: As a BW TLPDer, you will be responsible for keeping TLPD up to date with results being inputted in a timely manner. This position is not paid and is on a strictly voluntary basis. If your application is accepted, you will have the honor of having the great Epoxide teach you the ways of TLPD. A once in a life opportunity and only few positions remain! Apply today!
How to Apply: Send an application containing the following information to BigFan and/or 2Pacalypse-.
Your TeamLiquid.net ID and Skype information. For coordination purposes, we require staff to use Skype.
Short introduction of yourself. Please do not send resumes.
Availability and desired workload.
Applications are open indefinitely.
Seeing as TLPD is central to TeamLiquid and the BW community, this position entails a lot of trust. Please provide some examples of work that you have done either in this community or another that show your passion and dedication to the game. Basically, show us that you are a trustable individual considering the importance of TLPD. Don't forget to provide any other relevant background information that pertain to this position.
Amazing, I would love to help but I would rather be involved with TLStrat BW Style. I will ponder the thought of applying, I think I could do well....thanks for this awesome opportunity for everyone!
im really against this if you take a look at what kind of ''content'' sc2 writers put out its a complete joke every tiny event or round that is done in some tourney is posted in an article its non-content. prefer people to write something interesting instead of the obvious
On August 11 2017 19:36 onlystar wrote: im really against this if you take a look at what kind of ''content'' sc2 writers put out its a complete joke every tiny event or round that is done in some tourney is posted in an article its non-content. prefer people to write something interesting instead of the obvious
but isn't that what we do too, we do a recap and preview of each game week of a tournament and the reality is that even that we are stretched thin to do with our real life commitments.
On August 11 2017 19:35 GeckoXp wrote: what ever happened to the ABC stuff?
we are recruiting so that we can do more stuff and bring back ABC, it comes down to interest, time and commitment.
On August 11 2017 19:36 onlystar wrote: im really against this if you take a look at what kind of ''content'' sc2 writers put out its a complete joke every tiny event or round that is done in some tourney is posted in an article its non-content. prefer people to write something interesting instead of the obvious
Seriously why not put out ideas for "something interesting" instead of a complaint, which is nonsensical anyway because who the hell forces you to read the coverage that's done by TL?
I'm more interested in SC2 but I like that BW fans have this opportunity. I hope this goes well for everybody
I already do what I can find most important, however I could definitely do more. Let me know. Give me tasks for TLPD all I'll be happy to work on it and I'm also happy to learn.
What is involved in the TLPD work? From what I remember reading somewhere here it was a very lengthy and arduous process. Where do you get the results from, how are the records collated and imported etc?.
On August 11 2017 19:36 onlystar wrote: im really against this if you take a look at what kind of ''content'' sc2 writers put out its a complete joke every tiny event or round that is done in some tourney is posted in an article its non-content. prefer people to write something interesting instead of the obvious
but isn't that what we do too, we do a recap and preview of each game week of a tournament and the reality is that even that we are stretched thin to do with our real life commitments.
On August 11 2017 19:36 onlystar wrote: im really against this if you take a look at what kind of ''content'' sc2 writers put out its a complete joke every tiny event or round that is done in some tourney is posted in an article its non-content. prefer people to write something interesting instead of the obvious
The four feature articles I've written since the turn of the year covered a variety of subjects, none of which was directly related to tournaments. If you proved to be a worthy applicant and were capable of producing interesting original content, I'm fairly certain the editors will be thrilled to enable you and make those projects a reality. I've only worked with the SC2 staff, but I'm sure those over in the BW division are equally wonderful people.
Wolf, do you know any korean strategy site/forum that d be up to date? Do you think they would object to us translating some of their content for tlpd?
It could be a good start to modernise tlpd in a relatively short time.
On August 11 2017 20:09 DSK wrote: What is involved in the TLPD work? From what I remember reading somewhere here it was a very lengthy and arduous process. Where do you get the results from, how are the records collated and imported etc?.
Would you share how successful these calls are? I am curious in particular about the TLPD one, it seems to me a little weird to formulate it as "open position" with a bnuch of requirements instead of a call for help. Do people actually "apply" to do annoying work for free? Don't they need to be actively talked into it?
edit - jokes aside. The tlpd role is special case in TL. It's not like writing where you if you make a typo, you can hit the edit button and fix it easily. Since updating tlpd is a tedious task, we can't just have a random guy walking in and ruining all the records.
So how will the VOD archives work now especially for the Korean scene?
I'm surprised the TLPD still references BW VODs I uploaded 10 years ago as a little fanboy. Those days when we had to split the VODs after grabbing torrents to upload on YT were quite tedious.
On August 12 2017 14:55 FlaShFTW wrote: Just asked bigfan to add me to that TLPD list. Imo should just give all the writers in the BW staff TLPD access but I digress.
TBH I think it would make sense. There is a lot of overlap in duties since writers have to stay informed about games. I imagine if there are regular re-broadcasters like John they should have it too, IMO.
On August 12 2017 08:51 c3rberUs wrote: edit 2 - re-read post. Nvm
edit - jokes aside. The tlpd role is special case in TL. It's not like writing where you if you make a typo, you can hit the edit button and fix it easily. Since updating tlpd is a tedious task, we can't just have a random guy walking in and ruining all the records.
Good point. I have gotten quite used to having that luxury from posting VODs.
On August 12 2017 08:51 c3rberUs wrote: edit 2 - re-read post. Nvm
edit - jokes aside. The tlpd role is special case in TL. It's not like writing where you if you make a typo, you can hit the edit button and fix it easily. Since updating tlpd is a tedious task, we can't just have a random guy walking in and ruining all the records.
Good point. I have gotten quite used to having that luxury from posting VODs.
We all do ^_^. But you aren't a 'random guy' though.
5,6 or 7 years ago I would have happily done this for free. But TL is trying so hard nowadays to be a big eSports-Hub, I cannot agree with all these "applications" for unpaid positions.
On August 12 2017 23:34 Malinor wrote: 5,6 or 7 years ago I would have happily done this for free. But TL is trying so hard nowadays to be a big eSports-Hub, I cannot agree with all these "applications" for unpaid positions.
I would agree with you if these positions somehow furthered the "eSports" side of their profits, but I imagine the only money TeamLiquid makes off of BW is through ad revenue. I could understand a royalties-type payout system, such as a certain fixed % of ad revenue from your written piece (calculated by views * % of non-adblock users, I guess), but thinking that there would be a commission-based or hourly-based payment system for these positions is a far-fetched dream. Besides, there are people who are passionate enough to keep this scene afloat for free - they have been for years. That's what makes the foreign BW scene so beautiful.
On August 12 2017 23:34 Malinor wrote: 5,6 or 7 years ago I would have happily done this for free. But TL is trying so hard nowadays to be a big eSports-Hub, I cannot agree with all these "applications" for unpaid positions.
I would agree with you if these positions somehow furthered the "eSports" side of their profits, but I imagine the only money TeamLiquid makes off of BW is through ad revenue. I could understand a royalties-type payout system, such as a certain fixed % of ad revenue from your written piece (calculated by views * % of non-adblock users, I guess), but thinking that there would be a commission-based or hourly-based payment system for these positions is a far-fetched dream. Besides, there are people who are passionate enough to keep this scene afloat for free - they have been for years. That's what makes the foreign BW scene so beautiful.
TL wants passionate people, but only now hires unpaid BW writers?
On August 12 2017 23:34 Malinor wrote: 5,6 or 7 years ago I would have happily done this for free. But TL is trying so hard nowadays to be a big eSports-Hub, I cannot agree with all these "applications" for unpaid positions.
I would agree with you if these positions somehow furthered the "eSports" side of their profits, but I imagine the only money TeamLiquid makes off of BW is through ad revenue. I could understand a royalties-type payout system, such as a certain fixed % of ad revenue from your written piece (calculated by views * % of non-adblock users, I guess), but thinking that there would be a commission-based or hourly-based payment system for these positions is a far-fetched dream. Besides, there are people who are passionate enough to keep this scene afloat for free - they have been for years. That's what makes the foreign BW scene so beautiful.
TL wants passionate people, but only now hires unpaid BW writers?
I really don't exactly love Teamliquid as a whole as there is plenty of room for criticism, but you have to hand it to most of the Brood War staff: If they're asked to help, they usually listen, give you advice, resources, time and then go the extra mile if you're not a total moron.
The point I personally hestitate to "apply" as writer would be the strange timing of it all. There were good writers promoting good events, but for some reason it doesn't seem as if they were asked to do this officially. Things like DRTL, Nina's articles, the AI guys and some of the SBWI content comes to mind. Please take that to heart - it seems like semi leeching off people, as it seems to be the hope that original content is produced cause of passion.
Not only leeching. They do it right when remastered is about to be released. Where is the passion of TL for BW? Why didn't they hired writers 1-2 years ago?
On August 12 2017 23:34 Malinor wrote: 5,6 or 7 years ago I would have happily done this for free. But TL is trying so hard nowadays to be a big eSports-Hub, I cannot agree with all these "applications" for unpaid positions.
I would agree with you if these positions somehow furthered the "eSports" side of their profits, but I imagine the only money TeamLiquid makes off of BW is through ad revenue. I could understand a royalties-type payout system, such as a certain fixed % of ad revenue from your written piece (calculated by views * % of non-adblock users, I guess), but thinking that there would be a commission-based or hourly-based payment system for these positions is a far-fetched dream. Besides, there are people who are passionate enough to keep this scene afloat for free - they have been for years. That's what makes the foreign BW scene so beautiful.
TL wants passionate people, but only now hires unpaid BW writers?
Passionate people have always been here. The BW section gained writers throughout the years of relative drought in the scene and as far as I know, they are all unpaid. This to me seems like they are saying "Hey, plenty of people have worked on our BW section and news for years, but in order to keep up with what will likely be a much busier period than BW has seen in years, we are wondering if there are people put there who want to volunteer/replace the staff members who are aging/quitting or add on to our task force of volunteers."
As I said, I do agree that perhaps some form of ad revenue sharing system would make sense, but even then I imagine that it would result in pennies. Not a livable wage by any means.
Ultimately though, if volunteers exist, then why hire anyone? Simply makes no sense fiscally. As a trade off, some of the articles I read have numerous mistakes in them. That's just the nature of the system. I imagine if TL was making a ton of money off of BW and the associated hype, they would want to further their lot and investment in the market and pay people. Unfortunately, BW is not in such a gravytrain.
On August 13 2017 07:54 duke91 wrote: Not only leeching. They do it right when remastered is about to be released. Where is the passion of TL for BW? Why didn't they hired writers 1-2 years ago?
Because there were not enough BW events for the staff to not be able to handle them? Why seek more volunteers if all existing tournaments are getting adequate coverage?
There was always a shortage of BW staff since the death of OSL. There have been posts like this since then as well. The posts usually happen when it's critically low (as you can see with TLPD not having been updated). There's no grand scheme going on here.
On August 12 2017 23:34 Malinor wrote: 5,6 or 7 years ago I would have happily done this for free. But TL is trying so hard nowadays to be a big eSports-Hub, I cannot agree with all these "applications" for unpaid positions.
When I write for tl I do it for the love of the game. It's because I have something I feel is worth writing and I want people to read it. So for me there's a mutual exchange taking place. But I only write when I feel like it, if they wanted someone to write on demand for pay then I'd not be a good candidate.
First off, thanks to all the applicants so far. Figured that I might as well answer some questions.
On August 11 2017 19:35 GeckoXp wrote: what ever happened to the ABC stuff?
good question, it just stopped one day. I say blame 2pac for that!
On August 11 2017 19:36 onlystar wrote: im really against this if you take a look at what kind of ''content'' sc2 writers put out its a complete joke every tiny event or round that is done in some tourney is posted in an article its non-content. prefer people to write something interesting instead of the obvious
So, what method do you think we should take to try and recruit some more staff? Also, I disagree with the rest of your post. Our BW coverage is on par with SCII writers. The only two differences are aesthetics (we have our only gfx expert) and the way we basically group up several groups all together (2 group recaps/2 group preview for example) while they typically split them.
On August 11 2017 22:20 KungKras wrote: Does this mean BW news will return to the TL frontpage?
BW news has always been on the frontpage. It also largely varies depending on what is going on in the scene. At one point, we even took over 3/4 slots on the FP lol.
On August 12 2017 08:36 opisska wrote: Would you share how successful these calls are? I am curious in particular about the TLPD one, it seems to me a little weird to formulate it as "open position" with a bnuch of requirements instead of a call for help. Do people actually "apply" to do annoying work for free? Don't they need to be actively talked into it?
the numbers are gonna remain a secret I don't really see the point in disclosing them, much like they have never been disclosed in the past afaik.
On August 12 2017 12:01 Disregard wrote: So how will the VOD archives work now especially for the Korean scene?
I'm surprised the TLPD still references BW VODs I uploaded 10 years ago as a little fanboy. Those days when we had to split the VODs after grabbing torrents to upload on YT were quite tedious.
Nothing is set in stone atm, still deciding how to approach TLPD with remastered around the corner
On August 13 2017 07:54 duke91 wrote: Not only leeching. They do it right when remastered is about to be released. Where is the passion of TL for BW? Why didn't they hired writers 1-2 years ago?
What are you talking about? We had more active staff during the Sonic era than we do now from what I recall and TL covered all the SSLs and pretty much most major offline tournaments/events since then. There was no need to hire more writers at the time because much like jealous stated below, there were enough staff to cover the big tournaments. With remastered being released soon, we are looking at the possibility of three offline tournaments (ASL/OSL/SSL). That also doesn't consider that article that got posted a while ago that SKT/KT are looking at potentially creating teams again which could mean something similar to PL. The current BW staff are great guys and have done a fantastic job with coverage but you can't possibly expect them to cover all those tournaments and leagues on top of real life obligations and I wouldn't expect them to either.
On August 13 2017 07:54 duke91 wrote: Not only leeching. They do it right when remastered is about to be released. Where is the passion of TL for BW? Why didn't they hired writers 1-2 years ago?
Because there were not enough BW events for the staff to not be able to handle them? Why seek more volunteers if all existing tournaments are getting adequate coverage?
On August 12 2017 23:34 Malinor wrote: 5,6 or 7 years ago I would have happily done this for free. But TL is trying so hard nowadays to be a big eSports-Hub, I cannot agree with all these "applications" for unpaid positions.
When I write for tl I do it for the love of the game. It's because I have something I feel is worth writing and I want people to read it. So for me there's a mutual exchange taking place. But I only write when I feel like it, if they wanted someone to write on demand for pay then I'd not be a good candidate.
pretty much. Also, seeing as this compensation issue seems to always come up, there have been changes in TL somewhat recently regarding this very topic. Let's just say that the writer positions aren't as 'unpaid' for as they seem. It's just that there is a trial period before someone gets staffed. Anyways, I can't really disclose the details on compensation.
I'll disclose some compensation info. They give us cookies. Yes, we get cookies. And sometimes a glass of milk.
If being staff is some subtle leeching operation, then I would have quit a long time ago. I simply won't volunteer for such an unfair activity. But I've enjoyed hanging out here, reading all sorts of craziness and drama unfold and of course I love the game (and to write about it.) To give something back (even if it isn't pretty) is my way of thanking everyone for years of priceless fun and enjoyment.
On August 13 2017 08:08 Jealous wrote: As a trade off, some of the articles I read have numerous mistakes in them.
Makes me wonder why the writers don't cross check each other's articles for factual errors and typos. It's pretty much standard procedure in any writing field to have at least one person go over your text before it's published.
If the reason is time/effort constraints, I understand. But pride should never be part of the equation. The best writers in the world always have people proofreading/checking their stuff.
On August 13 2017 08:08 Jealous wrote: As a trade off, some of the articles I read have numerous mistakes in them.
Makes me wonder why the writers don't cross check each other's articles for factual errors and typos. It's pretty much standard procedure in any writing field to have at least one person go over your text before it's published.
If the reason is time/effort constraints, I understand. But pride should never be part of the equation. The best writers in the world always have people proofreading/checking their stuff.
Agreed. That's why I work as an editor lol. It's a whole field. I think the overarching problem is that there aren't many professional writers on the TL staff, and many of the users have international origins and perhaps not the greatest command of the English written language. As a result, even if people proofread each other's articles, it's possible to simply miss mistakes you don't know are mistakes.
On August 13 2017 08:08 Jealous wrote: As a trade off, some of the articles I read have numerous mistakes in them.
Makes me wonder why the writers don't cross check each other's articles for factual errors and typos. It's pretty much standard procedure in any writing field to have at least one person go over your text before it's published.
If the reason is time/effort constraints, I understand. But pride should never be part of the equation. The best writers in the world always have people proofreading/checking their stuff.
Agreed. That's why I work as an editor lol. It's a whole field. I think the overarching problem is that there aren't many professional writers on the TL staff, and many of the users have international origins and perhaps not the greatest command of the English written language. As a result, even if people proofread each other's articles, it's possible to simply miss mistakes you don't know are mistakes.
For sure. Writing in a second language is friggin hard if you take it seriously. I would never trust my own English skills enough to either write or proofread in any official capacity.
Just out of curiosity, are you an editor of the Russian or English language? Both? I noticed on your stream that you speak English very well.
On August 13 2017 08:08 Jealous wrote: As a trade off, some of the articles I read have numerous mistakes in them.
Makes me wonder why the writers don't cross check each other's articles for factual errors and typos. It's pretty much standard procedure in any writing field to have at least one person go over your text before it's published.
If the reason is time/effort constraints, I understand. But pride should never be part of the equation. The best writers in the world always have people proofreading/checking their stuff.
Agreed. That's why I work as an editor lol. It's a whole field. I think the overarching problem is that there aren't many professional writers on the TL staff, and many of the users have international origins and perhaps not the greatest command of the English written language. As a result, even if people proofread each other's articles, it's possible to simply miss mistakes you don't know are mistakes.
For sure. Writing in a second language is friggin hard if you take it seriously. I would never trust my own English skills enough to either write or proofread in any official capacity.
Just out of curiosity, are you an editor of the Russian or English language? Both? I noticed on your stream that you speak English very well.
A bit off-topic but I am Russian living in America; I used to do translations but now I mostly work in English in a domestic business, freelance, and internationally.
Back on topic, even with that being said, I still make plenty of mistakes in my own writing when I don't proofread. I generally catch most of them after I read through again, but even then I would say my command is far from perfect because I have some poor lingering habits due to English not being my first language. I feel that it is essential for there to be at least one or two people to proofread newsposts. This is a rough visualization - it will definitely vary case-by-case and depending on the origins of all the various components but I wanted to keep it simple:
On August 13 2017 23:21 c3rberUs wrote: I'll disclose some compensation info. They give us cookies. Yes, we get cookies. And sometimes a glass of milk.
Cookies, you say. You don't happen to have any writing positions available?
On August 14 2017 05:47 GeckoXp wrote: I tried writing a PM to BigFan but ended up writing what I would like to see happening to Artanis. Such is life.
I thought you were joking but bigfan confirmed it.
On August 14 2017 05:47 GeckoXp wrote: I tried writing a PM to BigFan but ended up writing what I would like to see happening to Artanis. Such is life.
I thought you were joking but bigfan confirmed it.
Jokes aside, I mentioned in the PM that I would maybe try TLPD again, although I get the creeps just thinking about the last time I tried. I'd try to add some of the foreign events, but for that I would need to know what's acceptable to add and what isn't. I know I've talked to someone (I guess 2pac?) about Defiler and it kind of ran dry after I realized what editing TLPD means. The core question was wether or not to add all rounds or just the top. Where do questions like that go?
On August 12 2017 23:34 Malinor wrote: 5,6 or 7 years ago I would have happily done this for free. But TL is trying so hard nowadays to be a big eSports-Hub, I cannot agree with all these "applications" for unpaid positions.
In my opinion, the amount of work required to submit an application for the BW staff is a bit overkill, so I agree with you there. However, it doesn't have anything to do with TL trying to leech off the masses and create a massive news org by exploiting free volunteers.
Every section of TL.net is self-run by a handful of passionate individuals who want to enjoy the scene and create content. There are no higher ups from TL saying, "This quota must be met" or "We expect you to be productive". For the most part, higher ups have absolutely no involvement in day to day activity. I know this because I am the managing editor of the Heroes of the Storm section and have also been involved with the TL Strategy writing staff as well as the BW staff.
Best of luck everyone, looking forward to checking out more features and coverage!
Writing for TL is how I got my career started and those early days in college where I was writing stuff for fun will always hold a special place in my heart. I didn't intend for it to be the start of anything, I wanted to share my love of the game with other people and it was a way that let me do that and I'm thankful for the opportunity.
On August 11 2017 20:09 DSK wrote: What is involved in the TLPD work? From what I remember reading somewhere here it was a very lengthy and arduous process. Where do you get the results from, how are the records collated and imported etc?.
Thanks for answering my question, Epoxide. I don't think I can spare any time doing this sadly, though it has a lot of similarities to my day job which doesn't help .
Silly question: Is there a process for updating older TLPD records with VODs etc? Like for events that took place on 2013 or 2015?
On August 11 2017 20:09 DSK wrote: What is involved in the TLPD work? From what I remember reading somewhere here it was a very lengthy and arduous process. Where do you get the results from, how are the records collated and imported etc?.
Thanks for answering my question, Epoxide. I don't think I can spare any time doing this sadly, though it has a lot of similarities to my day job which doesn't help .
Silly question: Is there a process for updating older TLPD records with VODs etc? Like for events that took place on 2013 or 2015?
Each games has to be edited manually to add the vod link. There is a mass add feature but it is inconsistent.
On September 02 2017 09:09 oDieN[Siege] wrote: What are the benefits for joining the TL team? or is this just all voluntary work?
You could definitely spin it in a positive way on a resume, and it would be legit. "Database management for teamliquid.net" or however you'd want to put it.
EPT
<3
![[image loading]](/staff/Epoxide/Various/form.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/TuSdSGJ.png)
