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StarCraft: Remastered coming in May? - Page 32

Forum Index > BW General
1190 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 30 31 32 33 34 60 Next
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
March 21 2017 15:42 GMT
#621
On March 22 2017 00:31 Jae Zedong wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2017 00:27 ZenithM wrote:
I mean it would probably be quite obvious on camera if it feels like the same old BW or if it's different. SC2 was obviously a different game.

It could still look very, very similar and yet be completely different. Especially since graphical updates could mask new unit behavior to an observer.

Hmmm, I guess. Still I don't think the SC2 comparison is very fair :D. The gameplay vids will probably be dissected to no end by a lot of viewers, I think the only differences they could miss are the ones only the players would feel, like response time. But point taken, it can make or break a game.
Dazed.
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3301 Posts
March 21 2017 16:30 GMT
#622
Why would a graphical update impact the way the engine understands unit behaviour etc?
Never say Die! ||| Fight you? No, I want to kill you.
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-03-21 16:47:34
March 21 2017 16:44 GMT
#623
It's possible that an old 2D game like BW presents some coupling of rendering with the game engine. I don't know how BW was implemented, but path finding, collisions, mouse clicks can all possibly be directly tied to pixels. Afaik BW is grid-based, for path finding/collision (so BWHD would keep the same grid but just raise the number of pixels per cell), but still:

Because the project was always two months from launch it was inconceivable that there was enough time to re-engineer the terrain engine to make path-finding easier, so the path-finding code just had to be made to work. To handle all the tricky edge-cases, the pathing code exploded into a gigantic state-machine which encoded all sorts of specialized “get me out of here” hacks.

found in http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/429573-broodwar-and-starcraft-2-pathing

Who knows what those "hacks" entail. Maybe they do look directly at the visuals.
Jae Zedong
Profile Joined September 2016
407 Posts
March 21 2017 16:45 GMT
#624
On March 22 2017 01:30 Dazed_Spy wrote:
Why would a graphical update impact the way the engine understands unit behaviour etc?

I didn't say that. What I meant was that if the engine has been altered to remove minor glitches/features, it might be harder to spot as an observer if the units' visuals also have been altered (which they will have been in one way or another). We will probably need to get our hands on it ourselves to check if everything plays 1:1.
Tyrant.
hitthat
Profile Joined January 2010
Poland2349 Posts
March 21 2017 17:17 GMT
#625
On March 21 2017 20:56 Zera wrote:
Or is it just me who can't live without daily doses of cancer/salt??


Hell yeah, let the drama keep going!
[image loading]
Shameless BroodWar separatistic, elitist, fanaticaly devoted puritan fanboy.
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
March 21 2017 17:26 GMT
#626
On March 22 2017 01:44 ZenithM wrote:
It's possible that an old 2D game like BW presents some coupling of rendering with the game engine. I don't know how BW was implemented, but path finding, collisions, mouse clicks can all possibly be directly tied to pixels. Afaik BW is grid-based, for path finding/collision (so BWHD would keep the same grid but just raise the number of pixels per cell), but still:

Show nested quote +
Because the project was always two months from launch it was inconceivable that there was enough time to re-engineer the terrain engine to make path-finding easier, so the path-finding code just had to be made to work. To handle all the tricky edge-cases, the pathing code exploded into a gigantic state-machine which encoded all sorts of specialized “get me out of here” hacks.

found in http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/429573-broodwar-and-starcraft-2-pathing

Who knows what those "hacks" entail. Maybe they do look directly at the visuals.

That OP has lots of mistakes, read the following post to understand how pathing etc... work.
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/429573-broodwar-and-starcraft-2-pathing?page=9#176
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
Sero
Profile Joined October 2010
United States692 Posts
March 21 2017 17:37 GMT
#627
If they include MBS and automine I'm going to throw up all over my computer, then drive to Irvine and vomit all over Blizzard HQ. The past 100 posts are making me feel queasy.
<3 FlaSh HiyA Stats HoeJJa
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
March 21 2017 17:37 GMT
#628
On March 22 2017 02:26 BigFan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2017 01:44 ZenithM wrote:
It's possible that an old 2D game like BW presents some coupling of rendering with the game engine. I don't know how BW was implemented, but path finding, collisions, mouse clicks can all possibly be directly tied to pixels. Afaik BW is grid-based, for path finding/collision (so BWHD would keep the same grid but just raise the number of pixels per cell), but still:

Because the project was always two months from launch it was inconceivable that there was enough time to re-engineer the terrain engine to make path-finding easier, so the path-finding code just had to be made to work. To handle all the tricky edge-cases, the pathing code exploded into a gigantic state-machine which encoded all sorts of specialized “get me out of here” hacks.

found in http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/429573-broodwar-and-starcraft-2-pathing

Who knows what those "hacks" entail. Maybe they do look directly at the visuals.

That OP has lots of mistakes, read the following post to understand how pathing etc... work.
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/429573-broodwar-and-starcraft-2-pathing?page=9#176

Thanks, but it doesn't alter my point in any way :D. Still grid-based, still contains a good amount of hacks, per the lead programmer's words.
ROOTFayth
Profile Joined January 2004
Canada3351 Posts
March 21 2017 18:08 GMT
#629
On March 21 2017 19:00 -Archangel- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 21 2017 18:49 Jealous wrote:
Fuck. This thread is being taken over by "I wouldn't mind if MBS and automine were implemented in BW" people. Abort mission. No further constructive discussion can happen here it will only be of potential detriment. If you play SC2, love automine and MBS and smartcasting, I am very happy for you. Foreigners have begun to win games against Koreans again, Blizzard is balancing your game, there is much content to see.

Please leave BW alone. Don't let them hear your wanton cries for debasement of this game. It is as it should be. Dumb AI, bad pathing, 12 units per hotkey, who would ever want to play this mess? Right guys? Please T_T;

You can always play BW non HD version.
Also by now Blizzard has already decided/implemented these changes if this BWHD exists so no matter what any of us say here it will change nothing. This topic is for exchange of expectations and opinions, not for telling Blizzard how to design anything.

as much as I think Jealous would need a therapy for his obsession over broodwar, I think the mechanics should be left untouched
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
March 21 2017 18:10 GMT
#630
Mechanics should not be touched. The idea of a remaster is to fix any glaring bugs, provide OS support and increase the graphics quality. Gameplay and anything associated with it should not be touched.
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
SetGuitarsToKill
Profile Blog Joined December 2013
Canada28396 Posts
March 21 2017 18:14 GMT
#631
I can't wait for the salt when we learn they added the baneling and medivac to BW HD multiplayer
Community News"As long as you have a warp prism you can't be bad at harassment" - Maru | @SetGuitars2Kill
Rainalcar
Profile Joined April 2010
Croatia565 Posts
March 21 2017 18:15 GMT
#632
There is much to do in BW that auto-mining wouldn't diminish the game, but actually give players more time to execute brilliant micro. Same for custom keys, there is no real downside to it.

However, unit group limit may NOT be touched. Grouping of buildings would be interesting, although I am more against it than not.
j.r.r.
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
March 21 2017 18:20 GMT
#633
On March 22 2017 03:14 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:
I can't wait for the salt when we learn they added the baneling and medivac to BW HD multiplayer

Ah cmon that would actually be horrible, we both know that
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
ROOTFayth
Profile Joined January 2004
Canada3351 Posts
March 21 2017 18:32 GMT
#634
On March 22 2017 03:15 Rainalcar wrote:
There is much to do in BW that auto-mining wouldn't diminish the game, but actually give players more time to execute brilliant micro. Same for custom keys, there is no real downside to it.

However, unit group limit may NOT be touched. Grouping of buildings would be interesting, although I am more against it than not.

nah, having to send workers to mine is a pretty big part of having good broodwar mechanics, this needs to be left untouched
-Archangel-
Profile Joined May 2010
Croatia7457 Posts
March 21 2017 18:36 GMT
#635
Well I hope the game than has a classic mode for all your grogs
SetGuitarsToKill
Profile Blog Joined December 2013
Canada28396 Posts
March 21 2017 18:38 GMT
#636
On March 22 2017 03:20 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2017 03:14 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:
I can't wait for the salt when we learn they added the baneling and medivac to BW HD multiplayer

Ah cmon that would actually be horrible, we both know that

What if they just added Liberators? Would that be okay?
Community News"As long as you have a warp prism you can't be bad at harassment" - Maru | @SetGuitars2Kill
ortseam
Profile Joined April 2015
996 Posts
March 21 2017 18:39 GMT
#637
I love how Jealous makes big post about the bigger screen issue , then people with not other argument than modernization come here saying he needs therapy. Guess that's what you get for explaining things, getting repeatedly insulted from people who ignore how the game works
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-03-21 18:42:29
March 21 2017 18:40 GMT
#638
On March 22 2017 03:14 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:
I can't wait for the salt when we learn they added the baneling and medivac to BW HD multiplayer

I very highly doubt that they'll add new units to the multiplayer so you'll be waiting a long time for that salt

On March 22 2017 03:39 ortseam wrote:
I love how Jealous makes big post about the bigger screen issue , then people with not other argument than modernization come here saying he needs therapy. Guess that's what you get for explaining things, getting repeatedly insulted from people who ignore how the game works

Anyone who actually played the game for a long while will realize that most of his points are on par with most of their thoughts so I wouldn't worry much about it
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
hitthat
Profile Joined January 2010
Poland2349 Posts
March 21 2017 18:44 GMT
#639
On March 22 2017 03:14 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:
I can't wait for the salt when we learn they added the baneling and medivac to BW HD multiplayer


Looks like I really need bigger, better fortified trench.
Shameless BroodWar separatistic, elitist, fanaticaly devoted puritan fanboy.
Rainalcar
Profile Joined April 2010
Croatia565 Posts
March 21 2017 18:47 GMT
#640
On March 22 2017 03:32 ROOTFayth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2017 03:15 Rainalcar wrote:
There is much to do in BW that auto-mining wouldn't diminish the game, but actually give players more time to execute brilliant micro. Same for custom keys, there is no real downside to it.

However, unit group limit may NOT be touched. Grouping of buildings would be interesting, although I am more against it than not.

nah, having to send workers to mine is a pretty big part of having good broodwar mechanics, this needs to be left untouched


It is. And it can be replaced by something far more meaningful. I don't want people losing after brilliant psi storms because they weren't fast enough to deploy their workers. The spectators don't even care about this aspect, except when they see drones roaming around in the middle of the map out of the blue. Brood War is difficult enought not to lose a single thing if auto-mining is introduced. We are not talking about smart casting here.
j.r.r.
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