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On April 28 2012 11:49 TBone- wrote:
If there was something that the foreign brood war community could of done, I'm sure it would of happened already. This is one of the most passionate communities I've ever seen.
I would agree with you except for one thing: prior to now, there has been absolutely no demand for this. We've had Pro BW. Why would we care?  Now that pro BW is likely on its last legs I think people are starting to look for other options. In addition, the technology that enables this kind of thing has only sprung up in the last couple years as well.
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If Korean clans have leagues, I'll try to watch live. If they have live events or finals, I'll try to attend.
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ALLEYCAT BLUES51267 Posts
why don't we raise money to run something like this again..
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I'm going to keep bumping this thread for eternity.
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On April 28 2012 10:31 maltey wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2012 09:57 Starburst wrote:
I'd be down to help. Ozzie, we could go to SK and track down the heads of the clans xd (this is morely btw). I like the idea of streams but i dont know how we could coordinate with the koreans. Yeah I'm thinking the language barrier is the primary problem right now. We do have a couple of people who can act as go-betweens--Optical Shot and SNM immediately come to mind and I'm sure there's many more. So if we want to establish a Korean Amateur/International Community to support amateur StarLeagues/ProLeagues we need: + Show Spoiler +
1. Somewhere on the web to congregate/organize.
a. Hopefully TL cause I love this site but maybe we need something special as I wouldn't want koreans to be forced to use English. Is this an actual problem or all in my head?
2. Translators.
a. A bunch if possible.
3. An established way of funding the Leagues.
a. Paypal, kickstarter, crowdfunding, afreeca, twitch/google advertising etc
4. An established way of streaming.
a. Maybe twitch/own3d won't work very well for Koreans?
5. An Organization
a. Probably one with by-laws to establish responsibilities; deal with problems; etc.
b. Right now I'm picturing something entirely community operated. And totally not-for-profit so that all funds go to the League and community. Hopefully entirely volunteers.
I'm actually going into my third semester of Korean, so I can speak a decent amount if that helps.
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On April 28 2012 12:42 Starburst wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2012 10:31 maltey wrote:On April 28 2012 09:57 Starburst wrote:
I'd be down to help. Ozzie, we could go to SK and track down the heads of the clans xd (this is morely btw). I like the idea of streams but i dont know how we could coordinate with the koreans. Yeah I'm thinking the language barrier is the primary problem right now. We do have a couple of people who can act as go-betweens--Optical Shot and SNM immediately come to mind and I'm sure there's many more. So if we want to establish a Korean Amateur/International Community to support amateur StarLeagues/ProLeagues we need: + Show Spoiler +
1. Somewhere on the web to congregate/organize.
a. Hopefully TL cause I love this site but maybe we need something special as I wouldn't want koreans to be forced to use English. Is this an actual problem or all in my head?
2. Translators.
a. A bunch if possible.
3. An established way of funding the Leagues.
a. Paypal, kickstarter, crowdfunding, afreeca, twitch/google advertising etc
4. An established way of streaming.
a. Maybe twitch/own3d won't work very well for Koreans?
5. An Organization
a. Probably one with by-laws to establish responsibilities; deal with problems; etc.
b. Right now I'm picturing something entirely community operated. And totally not-for-profit so that all funds go to the League and community. Hopefully entirely volunteers.
I'm actually going into my third semester of Korean, so I can speak a decent amount if that helps.
We need someone to bridge the connection between the two community. So as long as you possess the ability to read and write in Korean, then everything is more or less settled. The Koreans can offer the inner working of their training regime. Foreigners will be able to elevate their plays even further than ICCUP. And from all these events we have seen so far, many of them have already spend fairly good amount of time in preparing for clan wars. This ‘service’ can give the team members just that bit more of advantages. I think there is definitely something that could be done to re-ignite the fizzling spark of the non-korean countries.
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I'd be happy to see something like TSL 1 or 2 again but I suppose that'd require a sponsor.
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BW is alive and well. Take a look under the tournament subforum and check out everything that is happening there. Even today hacklebeast had over 500 viewers in the GC finals...I think this is the best thing people can be doing for scbw (as people are organizing/running/casting foreigner tournaments.)
As far as coordinating with the amateur korean teams dont think you'll have much results there.
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On April 28 2012 13:07 9heart wrote:
BW is alive and well. Take a look under the tournament subforum and check out everything that is happening there. Even today hacklebeast had over 500 viewers in the GC finals...I think this is the best thing people can be doing for scbw (as people are organizing/running/casting foreigner tournaments.)
As far as coordinating with the amateur korean teams dont think you'll have much results there.
You'll improve your play....how is that not getting results?
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On April 28 2012 12:25 BLinD-RawR wrote:why don't we raise money to run something like this again..
How in the hell did I forget about this tourney??? I remember reading about and being absurdly excited to see it but somehow I completely forgot about it between this post and the actual tourney. Thank you for the reminder. I think this would be an awesome first step (or second since this has already happened?). Now I need to go find some VODs and watch this tourney.
On April 28 2012 12:42 Starburst wrote:
I'm actually going into my third semester of Korean, so I can speak a decent amount if that helps.
When it comes to community efforts even the tiniest bit can be a huge help, but what you're offering is actually instrumental to this idea so tyvm sir. :D
On April 28 2012 13:07 9heart wrote:
BW is alive and well. Take a look under the tournament subforum and check out everything that is happening there. Even today hacklebeast had over 500 viewers in the GC finals...I think this is the best thing people can be doing for scbw (as people are organizing/running/casting foreigner tournaments.)
As far as coordinating with the amateur korean teams dont think you'll have much results there.
You're quite right, but I think it would be a really good thing to get the Koreans and the rest of the world together. Can you imagine a Gambit Cup (or something similar) with the by clan participating?? Maybe that's not what people want and if that's the case please post your feelings/concerns.
I'll be updating the OP shortly.
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On April 28 2012 12:55 EchOne wrote:
I'd be happy to see something like TSL 1 or 2 again but I suppose that'd require a sponsor.
You should check out ISL tomorrow then.
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On April 28 2012 12:55 EchOne wrote:
I'd be happy to see something like TSL 1 or 2 again but I suppose that'd require a sponsor.
Like This?
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Updated OP. I would greatly appreciate more feedback. Am I taking this in the right direction?
On April 28 2012 15:13 Game wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2012 12:55 EchOne wrote:
I'd be happy to see something like TSL 1 or 2 again but I suppose that'd require a sponsor. Like This?
The OP now starts off with a disclaimer so that people don't get the wrong idea. I'm sure EchOne wasn't the only one. My original OP was terrible and confusing. The new one is slightly less so i hope.
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As far as foreign and Korean collaboration, I'm sure a few people who work with me can confirm (without details obviously) that I am in the process of acquiring the funds to do that right now. Not the same as the OP, but along the lines.
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Australia1064 Posts
Before trying to do anything with the Koreans, you have to accept that you're never going to get them off Afreeca entirely. The main reason for this is that the return per viewer on Afreeca, by way of the balloon donation system, is so much greater than that of Twitch or its competitors.
For example, HiyA broadcasts to an average audience of 500-600 people 5-6 nights a week. By the standards of an SC2 or LoL stream on Twitch, this is small potatoes. However, HiyA receives enough donations from this relatively small viewer base to earn a decent living. This is the case for any number of other ex-pro broadcasters who also rarely attract more than 600 viewers but are still able to make streaming Starcraft their full time occupation.
Obviously, there are possible compromises. In the past, Nada has dual broadcasted to Afreeca and Twitch by running Xsplit and the Afreeca Broadcasting software in tandem. This is a decent alternative as it would allow the players to earn something from their foreign audience through Twitch ad revenue without cutting them off from their normal Korean audience. The effort to get something like that set up could potentially be a barrier for entry, as well as actually finding someone to show these guys how to set everything up.
Something that is probably a little bit more straightforward is simply having them come to us. A few hundred thousand won (ie. a few hundred USD) is a normal prize pool for a 1-2 day event featuring all the top ex and semi pro players. For a longer ISL scale event two million won (a bit less than two thousand USD) has been a rough average for the tournaments I've seen in the past six months. Obviously these aren't small amounts of money for just one person to be stumping up but they're not that different to the prize pools that we see in foreign events, so with a mix of sponsorship and donations it might be possible.
The logistics involved in organising a tournament with mainly or all Korean players has a lot of difficulties and not just those related to the language barrier. Simply having the connections to get in contact with the players you want to invite has its potential difficulties, as well as organising a way for the games to be played at a time that is reasonable for both the players and the audience. Replay casts are very uncommon in the Korean amateur tournaments I've seen and keeping the results of games private until the broadcast would be especially difficult given the fact that almost every player streams their FPV during tournament games.
Simply put, it is easily within the power of the existing BW community to put together something worthy of the absolute best that the Korean amateur scene has to offer. The difficulty is in actually making the connection and having them know (and care) that we're here.
+ Show Spoiler [Shield Clan League] +On April 28 2012 10:50 Kergy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2012 08:34 maltey wrote:
IMO the Korean clans(n.Die, Neo.G, sea, shield, white, by, etc) are going to be the key to keeping extremely high quality BW going if KeSPA completely switches to SC2. (Though I'm still hoping that doesn't happen) Does anyone know what the Korean clans are planning? Shield is already playing SC2. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=309945 Shield is still an active BW clan and have run two West clan leagues this year. There are even VODs!
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I'm in. I'll help however I can as long as it doesn't screw with my classes. Nice update, btw. 
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Sweet!
I'd love to help. I'd definitely be willing to donate prize pool money for an event featuring top korean amatuers and/or foreigners!
Also, for a big event I could make a cool teaser/intro video (I'm a 3d artist/animator). Think TSL4 teaser, or something in that vein. I could also help with other types of graphics, if needed.
BW 4 life!
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maltey you are a starter of an amazing cause, great timing man! :D
I like the idea with 10 min delayed stream tournaments and camera to the players and i think our community is big enough to support this, the thing is that we must act together and give full support to it.
My personal opinion is that the first priority is to inform koreans and the world about us and our plans and to start working together, before all the clans switch to sc2 (lol). Anyways im sure there will be the same ideas from Korean bw community and i think they will be better organised, so if we manage to work together we can be real strength! If we let bw proscene to go completely down it will be much harder to rise again so there is no time for delay.
Also i suggest contacting some people like Day9 and other famous bw veterans, i bet they still has bw in their hearts and they can cause great impact on the idea.
Thats my first thoughts, hope its not too dumb and people be sure of one thing WE CAN DO THIS!
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Would love to see more collaboration between us foreigners and the korean amateur scene! Just having some korean streams showing up in the right sidebar would be a step in the right direction!
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EPT
