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I'll use this as some statistical evidence.
Sorry, but I think this is going to be really weak evidence. People who vote in polls and people who don't vote in polls are not equal demographics. You can't assume that people who vote in polls are representative of the large number of people who don't, let alone people who read threads with this title, let alone people who visit the BW forum or TL at all.
SC2 turned me completely away from WATCHING BW
This option is especially useless. How many people who have been turned away from watching BW by SC2 are still reading the BW forum? As much as I love the idea of rigging polls to make BW look good, it's simply too biased. To make an effective online survey, we would have to make the poll mandatory to write for everyone who logs in, and even then we're not getting the lurkers. What I'm saying is... polls on this site are for fun, they're not really viable statistical evidence. After accounting for criticisms and flaws, there isn't too much that can be said. The best you could say is that you have a tally of users who've moved to BW from SC2, to show evidence that it is happening, but the comparison to your other options would still be invalid.
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On June 26 2011 23:50 Chef wrote:Sorry, but I think this is going to be really weak evidence. People who vote in polls and people who don't vote in polls are not equal demographics. You can't assume that people who vote in polls are representative of the large number of people who don't, let alone people who read threads with this title, let alone people who visit the BW forum or TL at all. This option is especially useless. How many people who have been turned away from watching BW by SC2 are still reading the BW forum? As much as I love the idea of rigging polls to make BW look good, it's simply too biased. To make an effective online survey, we would have to make the poll mandatory to write for everyone who logs in, and even then we're not getting the lurkers. What I'm saying is... polls on this site are for fun, they're not really viable statistical evidence. After accounting for criticisms and flaws, there isn't too much that can be said. The best you could say is that you have a tally of users who've moved to BW from SC2, to show evidence that it is happening, but the comparison to your other options would still be invalid.
The issue of pertinence is exactly that (moved to BW from sc2). That's like 95 percent of the reason why i want this poll, to show that sc2 can potentially create a new field of BW watchers by introducing them to the concept of RTS where they may have previously been oblivious.
All your other concerns are 100 percent warranted. This won't be like the basis of whatever argument i'm presenting, just a small informal part i want to add on the peripheral.
Note: in terms of real statistical evidence, or at least an attempt at one, I will be attending BW matches and (if I can get permission) distribute a poll that will attempt to classify what demographics are going to watch live BW games, namely female vs male and BW players vs non players. If i do this and get some solid data i will share that with u
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No effect, did convince me what i should be watching though
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if i need sleep fast i watch sc2 stream, sleep so ez 
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On June 26 2011 23:55 d_so wrote:Show nested quote +On June 26 2011 23:50 Chef wrote:I'll use this as some statistical evidence. Sorry, but I think this is going to be really weak evidence. People who vote in polls and people who don't vote in polls are not equal demographics. You can't assume that people who vote in polls are representative of the large number of people who don't, let alone people who read threads with this title, let alone people who visit the BW forum or TL at all. SC2 turned me completely away from WATCHING BW This option is especially useless. How many people who have been turned away from watching BW by SC2 are still reading the BW forum? As much as I love the idea of rigging polls to make BW look good, it's simply too biased. To make an effective online survey, we would have to make the poll mandatory to write for everyone who logs in, and even then we're not getting the lurkers. What I'm saying is... polls on this site are for fun, they're not really viable statistical evidence. After accounting for criticisms and flaws, there isn't too much that can be said. The best you could say is that you have a tally of users who've moved to BW from SC2, to show evidence that it is happening, but the comparison to your other options would still be invalid. The issue of pertinence is exactly that (moved to BW from sc2). That's like 95 percent of the reason why i want this poll, to show that sc2 can potentially create a new field of BW watchers by introducing them to the concept of RTS where they may have previously been oblivious. All your other concerns are 100 percent warranted. This won't be like the basis of whatever argument i'm presenting, just a small informal part i want to add on the peripheral.
this poll has 0 statistical relevance
the only 2 relevant responses should be:
SC2 induced me into watching BW
SC2 did not induce me into watching BW
(with your target demographic being people who start off watching SC2 but not BW)
the 3rd option (SC2 has had no efffect on my watching BW) just skews the percentage scales because the targeted demographic (people who are watching BW and not SC2) is completely different from the first one. If you really want to include this option you should instead create two separate polls:
One asking SC2 watchers whether SC2 induced them into watching BW and the other asking BW watchers whether SC2 induced them into watching SC2 over BW..
As of now the three options are creating a more than 100% response rate with the 3rd option, which only applies to BW spectators, skewing the percantages.
In any case posting this in the Broodwar forum is useless since people who have been watching only SC2 all along will not click on this thread in the first place.
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yes sc2 introduced me to watch bw, and get into that seen, know the 10 year old history of bw proleague in korea, reading so much about the different players and bonjwas over the time. I find the bw skill still greater than sc2 so it's more impressive to watch over a game that has evolved over so many years. Watching hyung joon becomes a pro gamer made me even a bigger bw fan and huge fan of MBC Game hero.
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I've started watching some broodwar, mostly MSL and OSL. I never actually played BW, only SC2, so I'm not nearly as knowledgable of BW as I am of SC2, but I still enjoy watching it.
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United Arab Emirates1141 Posts
On June 27 2011 00:08 Copymizer wrote:
yes sc2 introduced me to watch bw, and get into that seen, know the 10 year old history of bw proleague in korea, reading so much about the different players and bonjwas over the time. I find the bw skill still greater than sc2 so it's more impressive to watch over a game that has evolved over so many years. Watching hyung joon becomes a pro gamer made me even a bigger bw fan and huge fan of MBC Game hero. Now if only all of the TL posters in SCII forums would think like you  there would be so much more peace and less BW v SCII flame wars.
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SC2 introduced me to TL, which in turn introduced me to ESPORTS. I'd been playing BW for years, so it was easy to get into, I simply did not realize it existed up until then.
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I wonder if there are any other people in my particular situation.
Played a bit of BW as a child and upon hearing about sc2's development went to find out some info, and stumbled upon korean proBW. Became completely absorbed in BW ever since. This all happened during about mid 2009. Played sc2 during beta. Not worth 60 bucks...
In the end i have almost 3k posts and i can say with confidence over 90% are in the BW subforum.
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On June 27 2011 00:07 nufcrulz wrote:Show nested quote +On June 26 2011 23:55 d_so wrote:On June 26 2011 23:50 Chef wrote:I'll use this as some statistical evidence. Sorry, but I think this is going to be really weak evidence. People who vote in polls and people who don't vote in polls are not equal demographics. You can't assume that people who vote in polls are representative of the large number of people who don't, let alone people who read threads with this title, let alone people who visit the BW forum or TL at all. SC2 turned me completely away from WATCHING BW This option is especially useless. How many people who have been turned away from watching BW by SC2 are still reading the BW forum? As much as I love the idea of rigging polls to make BW look good, it's simply too biased. To make an effective online survey, we would have to make the poll mandatory to write for everyone who logs in, and even then we're not getting the lurkers. What I'm saying is... polls on this site are for fun, they're not really viable statistical evidence. After accounting for criticisms and flaws, there isn't too much that can be said. The best you could say is that you have a tally of users who've moved to BW from SC2, to show evidence that it is happening, but the comparison to your other options would still be invalid. The issue of pertinence is exactly that (moved to BW from sc2). That's like 95 percent of the reason why i want this poll, to show that sc2 can potentially create a new field of BW watchers by introducing them to the concept of RTS where they may have previously been oblivious. All your other concerns are 100 percent warranted. This won't be like the basis of whatever argument i'm presenting, just a small informal part i want to add on the peripheral. this poll has 0 statistical relevance the only 2 relevant responses should be: SC2 induced me into watching BW
SC2 did not induce me into watching BW(with your target demographic being people who start off watching SC2 but not BW) the 3rd option ( SC2 has had no efffect on my watching BW) just skews the percentage scales because the targeted demographic (people who are watching BW and not SC2) is completely different from the first one. If you really want to include this option you should instead create two separate polls: One asking SC2 watchers whether SC2 induced them into watching BW and the other asking BW watchers whether SC2 induced them into watching SC2 over BW..
The only problem i have is that I don't think BW broadcasts are comparable to SC2 broadcasts, mainly because of quality, time and language. That is why i'm only interested in the extremes: fans wholly introduced to bw froms c2, and fans compeltely turned off because of sc2.
i don't like the third option much either... but i hope that with it i can clump all viewers, whether it be BW or SC2, to one total. I don't want to differentiate between the two in the middle ground because of the confounding variables, especially language.
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I had no interest in BW before playing SC2 but started following the BW scene loosely for a while after that, although my interest has declined somewhat since then. I read up on the history of BW and still keep up with results but I very rarely watch it (which I was doing a bit, for a while).
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Papua New Guinea1059 Posts
Was never into BW, when SC2 came out I did not start watching BW. I do read some news, know some basics but I'm not interested enough to watch the actual games.
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On June 27 2011 00:49 cuppatea wrote:
I had no interest in BW before playing SC2 but started following the BW scene loosely for a while after that, although my interest has declined somewhat since then. I read up on the history of BW and still keep up with results but I very rarely watch it (which I was doing a bit, for a while).
just out of curiousity, do u think having proleague games professionally broadcast in english + consistently translated interviews would have helpd maintain ur interest in pro BW?
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It's a bit difficult for me to vote on this poll. For me, watching BW was what led me to watching SC2. However, now since i'm watching and playing SC2, I don't watch BW anymore. The only BW I watch would be the high profile matches (e.g. MSL and OSL finals), while I would watch as many SC2 tournaments as possible.
But I guess the closest poll option for me is this: SC2 turned me completely away from WATCHING BW
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SC2 got me into TL which got me into watching BW. Thank god though, BW is the best esport to watch.
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Back in 2008, yes. I wanted to get some practice in for sc2 so I started watching BW and playing BW.
And fell in love with it
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Been watching some of the big BW finals since 2005 on youtube. But not that often. I watch alot of sc2 tho.
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Watching only SC2. BW scene is too small and BW won't most likely grow.
SC2 is new, fresh and exciting and it can only get bigger with the expansions which is the reason I watch it. Also it has a big foreign scene.
BW is more nostalgia and has some epic moments which I can go back and watch. But thats about it.
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Netherlands45349 Posts
Although I have been watching BW for a long time, I came to Teamliquid for SC2.
It made me appericiate the beauty of BW so much more. On top of that it made me realize that SC2 is such an inferior spectatorship game to BW.
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EPT
