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Lokian
United States699 Posts
What will the Koreans think? I'm more interested in that since there must be some bad gossip about BW after this is announced. It is no doubt having BW excluded in WCG will decrease BW popularity even in Korea. And I don't see WCG drawing in less people this year with SC2 even if BW fans don't like it. I must've missed it somewhere, but what happened with samsung sponser denying all blizzard game? | ||
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Sephy90
United States1785 Posts
On March 09 2011 06:24 Conversion wrote: + Show Spoiler + You definitely did not read a substantial part of this thread, and you probably haven't read most of the huuuuuuuge Kespa vs. Blizzard threads either. Most BroodWar fans actually gave SC2 a try. Why the fuck wouldn't we watch something that we looked forward to? Something that might have succeeded BW, an amazing game that lasted for 10-11 years? We have a pessimistic view because SC2 is GARBAGE compared to BROODWAR. If you have the same amount of knowledge for both games, you are objective, and you STILL can say that the average quality of a SC2 game > average quality of a BW game, then great. Each to his own. And yes, this is pretty much why we hate SC2. Aside from Blizzard trying to shove it down Korea's throat and killing off BW, we are deeply, deeply disappointed with the crap Blizzard released as the successor of such a great RTS game. And don't give me any of that "oh BW had 12 years" shit. If you really think that point wasn't addressed about a billion times, you really haven't been around TL when things were really heated. And this is coming from a guy who joined in 2010. It can get pretty annoying when people start flaming BW, and it's also disappointing when people who love BW flame SC2. Come on keep your ragefilled opinions to yourselves and actually have a nice discussion instead of all this hate towards each other. I myself actually dislike SC2 a lot and I've actually slipped up here and there but I figure there is no point in getting so angry at something. A lot of the people that I've asked that watch SC2, "Do like BW at all? Did you ever watch the proscene?" They respond with a no and say "Nah BW is too buggy and the graphics are ugly." I can't even begin to understand that... if you like SC2 then you should definitely like BW as well, but people don't try and think that pretty graphics = better gameplay. On March 09 2011 05:17 Zisc wrote: + Show Spoiler + I enjoy the classic happy face emoticon when replying to 'trolls' as to say, "you guys cant get to me! I typed a colon and a capital D ha ha ha!" (side note it appears trolling is a lost art on TL as anyone voicing an opposing opinion is a troll now? lol?) Anyways what you say is true. SK = SC. SC = starcraft. Stracraft 2 = starcraft. SC2 = SK/USA/Europe/SEA. Globalized Baby. It's coming... edit: League of Legends as a title? LOL. what the fuck is all I have to say about that. I understand why they removed BW from WCG. It's very sad, it really is. But to add League of Legends to it's roster? Fucking lol is all I have to say about that. Riot is all about making a character every 2 weeks with new skins, also with actually balancing the game at the bottom of its list. Just lol is all that is. Anyway is HoN even in WCG? | ||
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IamBach
United States1059 Posts
On March 09 2011 08:14 Lokian wrote: WCG hosted in South Korea? And no Brood War? This is a big blow to brood war IMO. If it was another country, I would understand, but SK? That's just hard to wrap your brain around honest. What will the Koreans think? I'm more interested in that since there must be some bad gossip about BW after this is announced. It is no doubt having BW excluded in WCG will decrease BW popularity even in Korea. And I don't see WCG drawing in less people this year with SC2 even if BW fans don't like it. I must've missed it somewhere, but what happened with samsung sponser denying all blizzard game? Samsung isn't sponsoring any more and I doubt it will decrease BW's popularity. Thats like saying playing soccer in the USA decreases football's popularity. | ||
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Lokian
United States699 Posts
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Rafael
Venezuela182 Posts
Also this is very important to SC2, because this will boost it's popularity a bit (by forcing it nonetheless). BW is just alive in Korean for what I've seen, Europe and Americo is all SC2. Long live Starcraft in general thought  | ||
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Mindflow
Korea (South)320 Posts
On March 07 2011 11:46 GTR wrote: Most logical choice from WCG. Approved, So true though. | ||
Selith
United States238 Posts
On March 09 2011 08:14 Lokian wrote: What will the Koreans think? I'm more interested in that since there must be some bad gossip about BW after this is announced. It is no doubt having BW excluded in WCG will decrease BW popularity even in Korea. Koreans are posting by large, similar comments as seen from here: "Bit sad, but it was expected" | ||
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chenchen
United States1136 Posts
BW doesn't need the rest of the world to flourish. The rest of the world can do whatever it wants (switch to SC2, stick with BW) . . . the BW scene in Korea is STILL many many many times bigger than any esports scene for any game in the entire world (even, it's still many times bigger than SC2). | ||
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Mellon
Sweden917 Posts
On March 07 2011 11:53 Release wrote: Watching sc2 is so much less exciting than watching sc1. I can see that they chose sc2 because of the more players, but the spectators will suffer. I was hoping for one more year so Jaedong or Flash would make it to the hall of fame. Find it to be quite the opposite! SC2 is just so much more fun to observe than sc2, it is to me the greatest spectator game that i've ever seen. Even while taking breaks from sc2 it's just so much fun to follow games, especially with foreigners actually being fairly succesful, but thats off the point. Doubt they would ever reverse that change, hopefully the sc:bw pro's will move to sc2 instead! Sephy69 wrote: I understand why they removed BW from WCG. It's very sad, it really is. But to add League of Legends to it's roster? Fucking lol is all I have to say about that. Riot is all about making a character every 2 weeks with new skins, also with actually balancing the game at the bottom of its list. Just lol is all that is. Anyway is HoN even in WCG? I agree, would rather see HoN or even Dota than LoL... | ||
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white_horse
1019 Posts
On March 09 2011 09:22 chenchen wrote: I swear most of these SC2 newcomers have no idea how big BW is in Korea. I would say that a lot of the misunderstandings from SC2 players is because of this. I don't think a lot of them understand that BW e-sports in Korea has become a mature industry like any other industry, like carmaking or retail. | ||
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CallMeFoZz
Canada1 Post
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Kahuna.
Canada196 Posts
On March 09 2011 06:24 Conversion wrote: You definitely did not read a substantial part of this thread, and you probably haven't read most of the huuuuuuuge Kespa vs. Blizzard threads either. Most BroodWar fans actually gave SC2 a try. Why the fuck wouldn't we watch something that we looked forward to? Something that might have succeeded BW, an amazing game that lasted for 10-11 years? We have a pessimistic view because SC2 is GARBAGE compared to BROODWAR. If you have the same amount of knowledge for both games, you are objective, and you STILL can say that the average quality of a SC2 game > average quality of a BW game, then great. Each to his own. And yes, this is pretty much why we hate SC2. Aside from Blizzard trying to shove it down Korea's throat and killing off BW, we are deeply, deeply disappointed with the crap Blizzard released as the successor of such a great RTS game. And don't give me any of that "oh BW had 12 years" shit. If you really think that point wasn't addressed about a billion times, you really haven't been around TL when things were really heated. And this is coming from a guy who joined in 2010. Well, first and foremost, I apologize if you're not a fan of the date on which I joined TL. Perhaps, it will make you slightly happier to know that I purchased SC/BW at the age of 11; I am now 21. I grew up wishing I could play like NaDa, BoxeR, savior, July-Zerg, Xellos, Yellow, Nal_rA, Reach and iloveoov (some of the great players that I can remember off the top of my head). But, if we may get back to what we're REALLY talking about. Why are you calling the successor crap? What specifically about the game makes it so horrible to you? I mean some of the major figures we've admired as BW players have moved on. Day9's dailies are now SC2... Artosis has moved on to covering and commentating the SC2 scene... IdrA, who was at the peak of his career in BW before switching to SC2 has also moved onto the succesor game... the TL community has increased as a result of SC2... there is now a Liquipedia 2. If the game was as "crap" as you claim it to be then why would all of these things be happening. BW was and is an absolutely fantastic game... it would be amazing to see its succesor become even more successful; not just live up to it, but surpass it. Every game that is made should strive to be as successful as BW is. SC2 is on pace to doing that. And we should all be happy about that, especially since in spirit they are the same game... one is a sequel to the former. Nevertheless, if you truly do think it is a piece of "crap", a view to which you are completely and fully entitled, you should at least explain/justify why you think that rather than just say "SC2 is GARBAGE compared BW". Saying this makes you just as bad as those are trolling this thread with ignorant hate remarks toward BW for no other reason, other than their newfound love for SC2. | ||
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IamBach
United States1059 Posts
On March 09 2011 10:27 Kahuna. wrote: Well, first and foremost, I apologize if you're not a fan of the date on which I joined TL. Perhaps, it will make you slightly happier to know that I purchased SC/BW at the age of 11; I am now 21. I grew up wishing I could play like NaDa, BoxeR, savior, July-Zerg, Xellos, Yellow, Nal_rA, Reach and iloveoov (some of the great players that I can remember off the top of my head). But, if we may get back to what we're REALLY talking about. Why are you calling the successor crap? What specifically about the game makes it so horrible to you? I mean some of the major figures we've admired as BW players have moved on. Day9's dailies are now SC2... Artosis has moved on to covering and commentating the SC2 scene... IdrA, who was at the peak of his career in BW before switching to SC2 has also moved onto the succesor game... the TL community has increased as a result of SC2... there is now a Liquipedia 2. If the game was as "crap" as you claim it to be then why would all of these things be happening. BW was and is an absolutely fantastic game... it would be amazing to see its succesor become even more successful; not just live up to it, but surpass it. Every game that is made should strive to be as successful as BW is. SC2 is on pace to doing that. And we should all be happy about that, especially since in spirit they are the same game... one is a sequel to the former. Nevertheless, if you truly do think it is a piece of "crap", a view to which you are completely and fully entitled, you should at least explain/justify why you think that rather than just say "SC2 is GARBAGE compared BW". Saying this makes you just as bad as those are trolling this thread with ignorant hate remarks toward BW for no other reason, other than their newfound love for SC2. Here is a thread that discusses these questions civilly! http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=199610 | ||
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Conversion
United States3308 Posts
On March 09 2011 10:27 Kahuna. wrote: Well, first and foremost, I apologize if you're not a fan of the date on which I joined TL. Perhaps, it will make you slightly happier to know that I purchased SC/BW at the age of 11; I am now 21. I grew up wishing I could play like NaDa, BoxeR, savior, July-Zerg, Xellos, Yellow, Nal_rA, Reach and iloveoov (some of the great players that I can remember off the top of my head). But, if we may get back to what we're REALLY talking about. Why are you calling the successor crap? What specifically about the game makes it so horrible to you? I mean some of the major figures we've admired as BW players have moved on. Day9's dailies are now SC2... Artosis has moved on to covering and commentating the SC2 scene... IdrA, who was at the peak of his career in BW before switching to SC2 has also moved onto the succesor game... the TL community has increased as a result of SC2... there is now a Liquipedia 2. If the game was as "crap" as you claim it to be then why would all of these things be happening. BW was and is an absolutely fantastic game... it would be amazing to see its succesor become even more successful; not just live up to it, but surpass it. Every game that is made should strive to be as successful as BW is. SC2 is on pace to doing that. And we should all be happy about that, especially since in spirit they are the same game... one is a sequel to the former. Nevertheless, if you truly do think it is a piece of "crap", a view to which you are completely and fully entitled, you should at least explain/justify why you think that rather than just say "SC2 is GARBAGE compared BW". Saying this makes you just as bad as those are trolling this thread with ignorant hate remarks toward BW for no other reason, other than their newfound love for SC2. I came off here as an enraged, senseless poster. I apologize for that. My hate for SC2, though not completely similar, compares to my hate for Bisu in a stange way. I somewhr dislike SC2 because of its fans; I somewhat dislike Bisu because of his fans. However, if you really want me to regurgitate what every BW fan has expressed, I really cannot. I'll just come off as an inflammatory, idiotic troll. And success does not constitute a good game. SC2 has problems, face it. The hard counter mechanism sucks. Ball vs ball, one battle wins aren't exciting. You occasionally get the top notch game that's super aggressive or very multitask heavy, but those are rare gems. Yes, Idra, day[9], artosis, teamliquid, and many other foreigner sites moved to SC2. They did not do this because it was going to be a "good" game. They (Idra, Ret, Day[9], etc.) move because that's where the money was going in the foreigener scene. Teamliquid moved to cover SC2 so it could quickly grasp the new market as the leading Starcraft II news/community site. I remember, though vaguely, when an admin said it would have been stupid to NOT move teamliquid towarss SC2. While I would like to believe that SC2 succeede broodwar, it simply has not lived up to how hyped up it was. Granted, that's either our fault or Blizzard's fault (shitty maps an patching ftw?), but it still isn't up there. I'm going to stop before I sound like even more of an idiot, but that's just my general opinion. | ||
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McMonty
Canada379 Posts
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On March 09 2011 01:24 FrostyTreats wrote: BW doesn't make any sense in the WCG anymore. Koreans have been long dominating and now that there is NO top Foreigners who continue to play bw.... it doesn't really fit the scene at all. You really want to see koreans stomp computers? whats the point Do you see "WCG" mentioned in my post or in the post I was replying to? So don't put words in my mouth. I was replying to the statements by KevinIX in which he argued that BW fans don't like watching SC2 because they are biased. Next time read a post carefully before you jump in to criticize. | ||
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Utinni
Canada1196 Posts
I remember reading this earlier in the week... and the comparisons are so similar it's scary. Yahoo Answers: Comparison of Cricket to Baseball. + Show Spoiler + Why cricket is better than baseball? they wear gloves in baseball while they don't in cricket.. ( cricket ball is much harder ) cricket can be played anywhere ( even in a corridor of a building ) while baseball needs big grounds etc the ball bounces b4 reaching the batsman while it doesn't in baseball.. u can bowl anywhere in cricket..while in baseball u cant bowl on the batsman's body. which sux bowling is harder than pitching..cuz in bowling u cannot bend your arm while u can in baseball cricketers are much more athletic...baseball players are just a bunch of fat ppl.. cricket is popular almost everywhere except the states.where baseball is popular only in the states.. the batsman in cricket have to place the ball b/w the fielders, play according to the situation etc. while in baseball u just have to swing your bat like a retard.. the funniest part is, Adam Gilchrist, a former cricket batsman was He was approached in early 2005 by the US baseball franchise, the Boston Red Sox WHICH HE REJECTED!!! this clearly shows that cricketers can play baseball but baseball players cant play cricket.. only reason why u guys say that cricket is harder than baseball is that the bat is round, making it difficult to hit the ball..buts that's also crap... watching a game of T20 cricket is definitely better than a Yankees vs red sox.. or Wat Eva.. cuz there's more excitement in it..also it gets over in less than 3 hrs you can mention some stuff why baseball mite be better than cricket,, lets see who wins (That was the posters question which was followed by answers in the form of flames and constructive feedback.) Either way, I believe it was too early to pull the plug on BW. I, a SC2 player, still do appreciate BW as an entertaining game to watch. Both games should be able to co-exist. | ||
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Assymptotic
United States552 Posts
On March 09 2011 06:12 Kahuna. wrote: Reading a lot of these comments, I get the feeling that a lot of players who are still in love with BW are in denial that SC2 is capable of reaching the level of BW. All I see is pessimistic remarks about the new game due to a permanent love for its predecessor. I don't know how others feel, but my pessimism towards SC2 stems from the fact that SC1 is the only game to have broken the social stigma of playing games professionally and become a household name, all without a hype machine; this is quite a monumental achievement, and indeed it took a good deal of luck. In contrast, people are hyping SC2 and pumping money into it like no tomorrow, but it's not even close to being a household name. Only the most dedicated of nerds/geeks/gamers are even aware of it at a professional level. Just for a simple anecdote, my friend's ex-girlfriend just laughed when we brought up video games as a 'sport.' Compare that to Bisu's screaming fan girls. I'll withhold judgment until HotS is released (the time between SC1's release and the first OSL should be about the time span between SC2:WoL's release and the release of SC2:HotS). When all 3 of the expansions are released, if SC2 is a game known by your mom, your sister, your uncle, your dad, and your girlfriend, then I will give it the acknowledgment it deserves. Until then, I expect nothing. BW was a great game... it always will be... that doesn't mean that we have to hate SC2. SC2 is just as exciting to watch... and at its current rate it will surpass its predecessor. Playing SC2 is pretty fun. Watching it, not so much. As a spectator sport, I don't find SC2 great due to: A) Balls. The best example IMO is watching zealots ball up in SC2; it isn't as cool as watching a dozen SC1 zealots charge out of gateways in a menacing line, something about their stride in SC1 is so much more intimidating. B) Dull audio - listen to zerglings dying in SC1 (also take note of the bloody mess they make!) and compare it to how they die in SC2, or listen to the sound of a zealot's attack in SC1 and compare to their attack sound in SC2, the list goes on and on - in short, the sounds of battle in SC1 are loud and hectic, thus making it more intense and fun to watch. C) The level of mechanics needed to perform in SC2 don't make me drop my jaw. The insanity of macro is greatly decreased by MBS, blah blah blah, this point has been beaten to death, no need to extrapolate it here. D) The commentators aren't fantastic. No offense to Tastosis, they're solid announcers, but I'd rather listen to shouts of CHOGULING, STORRRMMuuuuu, MINE DAEBAK, etc...it's much more dramatic. For some reason, I don't see any western announcers getting that crazy on television, just watch ESPN or game show hosts on the major television networks if you're not sure where I'm coming from. Dramatic announcers seem to be in the realm of Asian television. | ||
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By.Fantasy
Thailand123 Posts
On March 09 2011 08:14 Lokian wrote: WCG hosted in South Korea? And no Brood War? This is a big blow to brood war IMO. If it was another country, I would understand, but SK? That's just hard to wrap your brain around honest. What will the Koreans think? I'm more interested in that since there must be some bad gossip about BW after this is announced. It is no doubt having BW excluded in WCG will decrease BW popularity even in Korea. And I don't see WCG drawing in less people this year with SC2 even if BW fans don't like it. I must've missed it somewhere, but what happened with samsung sponser denying all blizzard game? WCG isn't even that (whats the word for it?) Prestigious[?] in Korea.. Its not that big of a blow if you think about it. OSL/MSL/Proleague is where BW really is.. If those 3 stop then thats a big blow. Edit: I barely watched any games in WCG except the Korean qualifiers..... The rest are Foreigners getting roflstumpled by Koreans... Hell if my country joins WCG a simple D+ might qualify on WCG xD | ||
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Kahuna.
Canada196 Posts
C'mon guys, it's been out for a year and I know some of you detest many aspects of the game... but it is only a matter of time before some of the players in those training houses in Korea shock us with things we've never seen before. God knows how long it took for the first jaw-dropping moment in SC/BW to take place. There is still balancing to be done, new units to be introduced, new spells, new maps to arrive... I think it's best to approach this in a "let's wait and see what SC2 has in store for us" kinda way... rather than a "SC2 sucks! Long live BW!" sort of way. But, whether you choose to play BW or SC2, and whether you tune in to WCG anymore or not, happy gaming and happy spectating nonetheless! | ||
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