BWcoach Release! - Page 5

SoMuchBetter

Australia10606 Posts

March 20 2004 19:35 GMT

#81

when does your money go up? when you're busy doing something else
when does it go back down? when you're done doing whatever you were doing

with people of lower skill levels, it's different. Their money goes up when they have 5 zealots queued on their 2 gateways, so its telling them to spend it. They also don't build supply buildings/lords until the game tells them they have hit the limit. You should have gotten into the habit of building depots in time with your production by now anyway.

SuGoSu

Turkey109 Posts

March 20 2004 20:00 GMT

#82

--- Nuked ---

Yarertz

Djibouti1891 Posts

March 20 2004 21:08 GMT

#83

there is a bug in bwchart that i cannot export BO
on 30 tries only once i could... ;/

LumberJack

United States3355 Posts

March 20 2004 21:31 GMT

#84

well, im not going to make a huge post with cool paragraphs that have numbers. I will say however that bwcoach, imo, is not just for newbs. For someone that wants to learn other b/o's better, more efficeintly it would be extremely ideal. Most players have like 4-5 strats memorized per mu that they like to do. Most players keep its very basic, and then adjust off their opponent, and then just 'play'. With this though, u can really originalize your game, with some interesting early/mid game strats and tactics. Like with crazy b/os, like the early expo/cannon -> sair/reaver. Or the nal_ra 6plyon/7gate fake rush -> dual sair with +1 air/temp expo. Crazy shit that u dont really know off hand, but u know would prolly do pretty good against an unsuspecting opponent. Strats/bo's are like tools, and you just wield them how you desire, all this is doing is modernizing you filing system and making it much easier to process your data. I find it rather distracting, and it does seem to be off some, going to fast, etc. I think there are some bugs in that, but overall, very good program with alot of custom ability, that makes it ideal for people wanting to improve their game. Unless you really think its ok to be doing the same 5strats for the last 4yrs... but w/e continue to cry and flame if that makes u feel better

Physician

United States4146 Posts

March 20 2004 23:08 GMT

#85

stimey ~ all depends on who the training files are made by. STill its an ethical point ~with map hack u (not 'u' persoannly ~ generally speaking) are actually cheating unless u told ur opponent and he agreed to it.

sunshine, siggy ~ u have another god dam point!! grrrhhh jeje. Its a matter of skill level ~ I guess an ultra newbie could beat another newbie if he used the zeal rush gate training file. I guess those reminders can be considered as cheating help.

STILL ~ the distinction is a fine one. BWcoach is clearly intended as a teaching tool ~ a fun one too. If somebody decides to use it as a cheat it is a very clumsy, ineffective tool for those ends and it will benefit a very small group. APM live also makes warnings that you could consider they were helping you ~ and yet very few consider it as cheating.

BWcoach has the potential to help each individual get BETTER and NOT AT THE EXPENCE OF YOUR OPPONENTS WEAKNESS like a map hack. BWcoach was not designed to help you 'cheat' ~ nor was APM live ~ they both do help the player using them but in a different way than a map hack. Its an ethical issue ~ legally yes ~ its a third party program and thus something that blizzard could decide to ban or turn the blind eye as it has done to so many other third party programs not made by Jca
(~ bots, ~ filter.)

BWcoach does far more GOOD than it will ever cause harm ~ try it and you will understand how crappy it is as a hacking tool and how trully fantastic it is as a teaching tool ~

SunShine

Netherlands787 Posts

March 20 2004 23:41 GMT

#86

sunshine, siggy ~ u have another god dam point!! grrrhhh jeje. Its a matter of skill level ~ I guess an ultra newbie could beat another newbie if he used the zeal rush gate training file. I guess those reminders can be considered as cheating help.

i dont care about the build order help etc. im worried about the warning it gives u when ur cash is high during an attack wich every player sometimes forgets no matter what skill level and im worried about the supply thingie for the same reason. even pro's forget these things sometimes and with this program u would not forget wich is part of the game so its taking away a part of the game

error

Germany36 Posts

March 20 2004 23:41 GMT

#87

its a 3.party prog which gives u an advantage against ur opponent
so its hack

and dont tell me its not an advantage if u get told that u re low on supply
even realy gosu player can forget an pylon in midgame

i personally hope that evryone using this programm will be banned by blizzard cause of using 3.party prog ( unfortunatly i dont think that ll happen)

btw: i had less probs with it if it wpuld send a msg at start of like
player: hello i am using bwcoach version 1.1c

now we juist need lasgos KI prog and we ve got wc3 with shitty graphics

excellent

sry 4 bad eng

hf

MPXMX

Canada4309 Posts

March 21 2004 00:23 GMT

#88

Ok, dudes, let me try to settle your dispute

I have had this idea to put "post-it" (C) notes on the side of my monitor that would attract my attention once in a while. Something like this

BUILD SUPPLY, FUCKING IDIOT!
WTF NO SCOUTING?
YO FASTER PLZ, OK?
LOOK AT MINIMAP MORE OFTEN, LOSER!?

Ok, would you consider this hacking? Because that is essentially exactly what BWChart does, only a tiny little bit easier.

T_T

Vatican City State593 Posts

March 21 2004 00:31 GMT

#89

we're talking about "software" here, not about some stuff that affects your play from the "real world" around you.

error

Germany36 Posts

March 21 2004 00:36 GMT

#90

On March 21 2004 09:23 MPXMX wrote:
Ok, dudes, let me try to settle your dispute

I have had this idea to put "post-it" (C) notes on the side of my monitor that would attract my attention once in a while. Something like this

BUILD SUPPLY, FUCKING IDIOT!
WTF NO SCOUTING?
YO FASTER PLZ, OK?
LOOK AT MINIMAP MORE OFTEN, LOSER!?

Ok, would you consider this hacking? Because that is essentially exactly what BWChart does, only a tiny little bit easier.

indeed good point
just try to think next time

post-it notes re rly good software..yea

Physician

United States4146 Posts

March 21 2004 00:47 GMT

#91

Its funny though ~lol MPXMX

~lol

Pacifist

Israel1683 Posts

March 21 2004 01:01 GMT

#92

post it notes aren't third party program

also, its not like BWCoach where when your minerals are high it says "high minerals," when your APM is low it says "play faster," when u need supply it says "build supply." Post it notes lack the perfect timing of BWCoach, the one quality which makes BWCoach such an unfair hack

MannerLess_

Brazil535 Posts

March 21 2004 02:04 GMT

#93

Post it notes don't know when your gas/mins/apm count is low -_-;;

MadduX

United States515 Posts

March 21 2004 02:07 GMT

#94

Physician:
Do you agree that BWCoach gives the person using it an advantage over someone who is not using it?

Then how can you say it is fair to use in leagues and ladders, where things like maphacks are banned, because they do the same thing: give one player an advantage over another.

MiniRoman

Canada3953 Posts

March 21 2004 02:32 GMT

#95

I would like to say this to everyone who hates this program.

Learn to beat a gundam rush and stfu.

The persons overall skill determines how helpful this will be. If they are already good they wont have any of those stupid alerts flashing in the corner and they wont need to use any stupid carbon copy build order. If they suck then they wont be able to use the alerts to their fullest and it will only hurt them by distracting them.

Sliggy and Maddux, you guys are afraid of a person who can macro. Go play pubbies.

And sliggy,

On March 20 2004 23:19 Sliggy wrote:

2) not just 1 person, but eventually people will get pissed off that everyone seems to play flawlessly with this program. Imagine playing 10 1v1 and you lost every one of them because some guy spent his money, which usually he would not have been able to do. Its only helping people to improve? So do steroids, but they are banned.

ROFL.

MadduX

United States515 Posts

March 21 2004 02:36 GMT

#96

Roman, go play against all maphackers, unless you are scared of people knowing what you are doing.

MiniRoman

Canada3953 Posts

March 21 2004 02:49 GMT

#97

I keep obs around me for a reason. I wouldn't consider this a map hack.
It's not my fault your stupid.

MannerKiss

United States2398 Posts

March 21 2004 03:09 GMT

#98

I have to agree that bw coach is a hack on the point that it shows supplys and tells you to spend...I just now played a game, 20 min standard zvt on temple. I raped him pretty hard(some random dude from hyo-, not that great).

But I had a pretty hard scare, because at one point, I build 2 overlords, because I had a tad extra money, but I didnt notice that he killed one. This put me behind in supply that I didnt pay attention to, and thus, at one point he broke out of my light contain, and I go back to find my new units, just to find it giving me the you need more overlords message. Right here, bw coach could have told me a while before that I needed overlords, as it does right when you lose one. Had I seen this, I would have had plenty of units, to just break him right then and there.

Secondly thanks to this whole thing, I wasnt spending well and got up to 1600 before I noticed....this means to me, that I can freely expand again, tech to hive, and still build plenty of units from everyhatchury...had I noticed this before, I would have had an even easier time.

Anyway, even though I was already going to win the game, this all means that even though I'm a 200-220 APM zerg, and I dont consider myself "newbie" (by no means great mind you) it could have helped me pull of a pure rape game.

And in Responce to the post about posted notes...BWCoach gives sounds, and flashes on your game screen. I could easily get focused on my game, and not see the posted notes sitting outside my monitor. Bwcoach puts them right where im looking, hard to miss that way.

And as much as I think BWCoach is a hack, im not to terribly worried about it. I played a game with it, and the build orders sucked, plus all the little screens and numbers and shit just get destracting.

I say thanks to JCA for BWchart, RWA, but not for BWcoach, im very disapointed that he couldnt see this.

LumberJack

United States3355 Posts

March 21 2004 03:20 GMT

#99

tai-shu, ur 15 wtf do you know. Its just putting ur own thoughts in a better format, u can't really use it at tournaments, no, and by that alone is ALMOST considered a hack. But if its considered a hack, why dont just go ahead and hack and get ALL THE INFO? Wouldn't there be a difference from that, to bwchart? All bwchart is doing, is spitting back at you, the information you put in it, in the .trn file, if ur playing a game, and microing, the little message flashy at the top, isn't really gonna make you a better player, making you more aware, will however. Its about helping players play, how they already know how to play, but better. And stop boasting about some pub win plz...

MannerKiss

United States2398 Posts

March 21 2004 03:28 GMT

#100

Im not boasting whatsoever, I'm just useing the game to show what happens, for all the people that dont consider this a hack. Had I used it, and say been against a much better player, one who could hvae beat me at the point this guy broke out, I could have ended up with easily 9 more hydras, which could have made a major diffrence.

Now seeing that you probably meant bwCoach, and no, It wont make you much better, however, if a good player is much more aware,it can completely change things.

And no god damnit, im not trying to say that I am a good player! Im just useing it as an example

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