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I found it very funny that people are comparing progamers to doctors when almost all of them have zero experience with either profession. As somebody who did some research into North American medical school, it is my personal opinion that whoever says becoming a doctor in North America is far easier than becoming a progamer is pulling shit out of his ass.
One thing that I WILL agree with is that it is much harder to be a SUCCESSFUL progamer than being a successful doctor. How many progamers that we actually care about? 10? 15? How many progamers are there? Hundreds! How many progamers make the same amount of money as your average run of mill doctor? I'd say about 3 or 4.
But whoever thinks that becoming a doctor is just like entering any other profession knows shit.
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Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
On December 29 2009 03:14 cz wrote:
I think becoming a progamer, definitely an A-team progamer, would be harder a less likely job to achieve with similar amounts of dedication and work ethic.
Think about it this way: There are two 15-year-old kids, both know nothing about progaming and medicine. One is told he is going to become a progamer, the other is told he is going to become a doctor. They both want to become what they are told to become. Who has the higher LIKELIHOOD of becoming the profession they are told/want to become?
Becoming a doctor is just a higher probability field. If you put in the work, and there is a ton of it over a long period of time, you will make it. I don't think the same is true for becoming a progamer. There are too many people also putting in the work that you have to be better than.
Apples to oranges, who cares?
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On December 29 2009 03:10 1984 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 02:59 ghostWriter wrote:
Really Chill? You agree with that moron?
It might be hard to make a name for yourself in progaming, but there is no way that progaming is even close to being as competitive as medicine is. Ok, I really hope you're not mentally deficient, otherwise it's pointless to continue. Drop-out rate at medical schools is less than 10%, actually 10% was a major concern somewhere so it's usually even lower (you can google it). And then compare it to hordes of koreans who try to become progamers but very few of them succeed.
Right except that medical schools weed out candidates based on whether or not they think that people will succeed. They also go out of their way to make sure that the people who want to go to medical school actually have a passion for it. This less than 10% comes from the people who claimed to have a passion for medicine AND showed that they have the ability to learn and keep up with the material during their college years. The 10% would be comparing the number of people who dropped out of medical school with the number of people who were on A team but didn't have many televised games yet and decided to quit playing or something like that.
It's not even a parallel situation. The right one would be comparing the hordes of Koreans who try to become progamers to the hordes of students that try to get into medical school but don't succeed (most people drop the premed program of study because they can't even handle the college courses, never mind the classes that they would take in medical school), mostly because of low grades or a low test score.
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On December 29 2009 03:17 tree.hugger wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:14 cz wrote:
I think becoming a progamer, definitely an A-team progamer, would be harder a less likely job to achieve with similar amounts of dedication and work ethic.
Think about it this way: There are two 15-year-old kids, both know nothing about progaming and medicine. One is told he is going to become a progamer, the other is told he is going to become a doctor. They both want to become what they are told to become. Who has the higher LIKELIHOOD of becoming the profession they are told/want to become?
Becoming a doctor is just a higher probability field. If you put in the work, and there is a ton of it over a long period of time, you will make it. I don't think the same is true for becoming a progamer. There are too many people also putting in the work that you have to be better than. Apples to oranges, who cares?
People were comparing apples to oranges, I weighed in.
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On December 29 2009 03:14 cz wrote:
I think becoming a progamer, definitely an A-team progamer, would be harder a less likely job to achieve with similar amounts of dedication and work ethic.
Think about it this way: There are two 15-year-old kids, both know nothing about progaming and medicine. One is told he is going to become a progamer, the other is told he is going to become a doctor. They both want to become what they are told to become. Who has the higher LIKELIHOOD of becoming the profession they are told/want to become?
Becoming a doctor is just a higher probability field. If you put in the work, and there is a ton of it over a long period of time, you will make it. I don't think the same is true for becoming a progamer. There are too many people also putting in the work that you have to be better than.
You realize that the whole discussion is pointless or not even?
Becoming better than Jaedong is harder than being a standart doctor, being a top brain specialist is harder than being a B team progamer.
Geez!
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On December 29 2009 03:13 GreEny K wrote:But isn't that the same thing idrA did when he was in US? He just played all day or am I wrong? That is just what I hear and it seems logical to me..
Anyway, what's going on with ret? How is it his fault that the koreans don't want to play him, they don't think they should waste their time playing him because they are better yet they want to play REAL pros and learn from them... just doesn't make sense to me how they think. I want to get better so ima play better people but I dont want to give a worse player that same chance... Just stupid. One last thing, how the hell DID IdrA get on CJ, I never heard that story. And for people who think he can put in a good word for ret and get him over to CJ rek said it perfectly, "they don't give a fuck what idra thinks."
Right. Hmmm I want to be a known progamer and get a chance to play a televised game. I want to improve myself and I am competing against hundreds of other players who have the exact goal as me. Should I help out some kid who I can't even communicate with and will hypothetically take my spot and limit my options if he turns out to be better than me or should I attempt to better myself by seeking out better opponents and learning from their experience and skills?
Yes, how stupid of them. -
Sarcasm doesn't work on the internet don't you know that? And if anything you just proved my point, try thinking about what you post. They are in the same situation that ret is in, they want help from teh better pros but receive it then they turn around and neglect to do the same for ret. If everyone had their mentality there would be a few good players who flew solo and did not help anyone else.
I dunno, I laid it on there pretty thick. It's hard to miss. And why don't you try thinking about what I posted. They're competing against one another, why would they want to help someone out that could take their spot? Everyone DOES have that mentality and why should the good ones help out the new players? The new players aren't going to be televised, whether or not they do well is irrelevant to the success of the team, unless they have the talent to actually be televised in which case they will be able to improve perfectly well without being babied.
On December 29 2009 03:14 cz wrote:
I think becoming a progamer, definitely an A-team progamer, would be harder a less likely job to achieve with similar amounts of dedication and work ethic.
Think about it this way: There are two 15-year-old kids, both know nothing about progaming and medicine. One is told he is going to become a progamer, the other is told he is going to become a doctor. They both want to become what they are told to become. Who has the higher LIKELIHOOD of becoming the profession they are told/want to become?
Becoming a doctor is just a higher probability field. If you put in the work, and there is a ton of it over a long period of time, you will make it. I don't think the same is true for becoming a progamer. There are too many people also putting in the work that you have to be better than.
Becoming an A-team progamer would be comparable to becoming a neurosurgeon or an anesthesiologist, who study the most and get paid the most. You're comparing all doctors with the best progamers when it should be all doctors and all progamers/the top doctors and the top progamers, assuming that the parallel is valid in the first place.
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On December 29 2009 03:18 ghostWriter wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:10 1984 wrote:On December 29 2009 02:59 ghostWriter wrote:
Really Chill? You agree with that moron?
It might be hard to make a name for yourself in progaming, but there is no way that progaming is even close to being as competitive as medicine is. Ok, I really hope you're not mentally deficient, otherwise it's pointless to continue. Drop-out rate at medical schools is less than 10%, actually 10% was a major concern somewhere so it's usually even lower (you can google it). And then compare it to hordes of koreans who try to become progamers but very few of them succeed. Right except that medical schools weed out candidates based on whether or not they think that people will succeed. They also go out of their way to make sure that the people who want to go to medical school actually have a passion for it. This less than 10% comes from the people who claimed to have a passion for medicine AND showed that they have the ability to learn and keep up with the material during their college years. The 10% would be comparing the number of people who dropped out of medical school with the number of people who were on A team but didn't have many televised games yet and decided to quit playing or something like that. It's not even a parallel situation. The right one would be comparing the hordes of Koreans who try to become progamers to the hordes of students that try to get into medical school but don't succeed (most people drop the premed program of study because they can't even handle the college courses, never mind the classes that they would take in medical school), mostly because of low grades or a low test score.
Perhaps you could make the argument that the two things are different skill sets and thus cannot be compared a la apples to oranges, but what you're claiming now is just wrong.
Ie. I know several friends who are in med school now who scored over 90 percentile on their MCATs and LOVE SC and play it religiously yet are absolutely horrendous.
And btw, getting into a top tier MFA Creative Writing program is literally 10x harder than getting into a top tier medical school by the acceptance/rejection ratio.
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On December 29 2009 03:21 ghostWriter wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:13 GreEny K wrote:But isn't that the same thing idrA did when he was in US? He just played all day or am I wrong? That is just what I hear and it seems logical to me..
Anyway, what's going on with ret? How is it his fault that the koreans don't want to play him, they don't think they should waste their time playing him because they are better yet they want to play REAL pros and learn from them... just doesn't make sense to me how they think. I want to get better so ima play better people but I dont want to give a worse player that same chance... Just stupid. One last thing, how the hell DID IdrA get on CJ, I never heard that story. And for people who think he can put in a good word for ret and get him over to CJ rek said it perfectly, "they don't give a fuck what idra thinks."
Right. Hmmm I want to be a known progamer and get a chance to play a televised game. I want to improve myself and I am competing against hundreds of other players who have the exact goal as me. Should I help out some kid who I can't even communicate with and will hypothetically take my spot and limit my options if he turns out to be better than me or should I attempt to better myself by seeking out better opponents and learning from their experience and skills?
Yes, how stupid of them. -
Sarcasm doesn't work on the internet don't you know that? And if anything you just proved my point, try thinking about what you post. They are in the same situation that ret is in, they want help from teh better pros but receive it then they turn around and neglect to do the same for ret. If everyone had their mentality there would be a few good players who flew solo and did not help anyone else.
I dunno, I laid it on there pretty thick. It's hard to miss. And why don't you try thinking about what I posted. They're competing against one another, why would they want to help someone out that could take their spot? Everyone DOES have that mentality and why should the good ones help out the new players? The new players aren't going to be televised, whether or not they do well is irrelevant to the success of the team, unless they have the talent to actually be televised in which case they will be able to improve perfectly well without being babied. Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:14 cz wrote:
I think becoming a progamer, definitely an A-team progamer, would be harder a less likely job to achieve with similar amounts of dedication and work ethic.
Think about it this way: There are two 15-year-old kids, both know nothing about progaming and medicine. One is told he is going to become a progamer, the other is told he is going to become a doctor. They both want to become what they are told to become. Who has the higher LIKELIHOOD of becoming the profession they are told/want to become?
Becoming a doctor is just a higher probability field. If you put in the work, and there is a ton of it over a long period of time, you will make it. I don't think the same is true for becoming a progamer. There are too many people also putting in the work that you have to be better than. Becoming an A-team progamer would be comparable to becoming a neurosurgeon or an anesthesiologist, who study the most and get paid the most. You're comparing all doctors with the best progamers when it should be all doctors and all progamers/the top doctors and the top progamers, assuming that the parallel is valid in the first place.
But really good pros DO help out their teammates, which is why the people who are being helped should follow that same mentality and help foreigners instead of shunning them.
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On December 29 2009 03:24 StorkHwaiting wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:18 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:10 1984 wrote:On December 29 2009 02:59 ghostWriter wrote:
Really Chill? You agree with that moron?
It might be hard to make a name for yourself in progaming, but there is no way that progaming is even close to being as competitive as medicine is. Ok, I really hope you're not mentally deficient, otherwise it's pointless to continue. Drop-out rate at medical schools is less than 10%, actually 10% was a major concern somewhere so it's usually even lower (you can google it). And then compare it to hordes of koreans who try to become progamers but very few of them succeed. Right except that medical schools weed out candidates based on whether or not they think that people will succeed. They also go out of their way to make sure that the people who want to go to medical school actually have a passion for it. This less than 10% comes from the people who claimed to have a passion for medicine AND showed that they have the ability to learn and keep up with the material during their college years. The 10% would be comparing the number of people who dropped out of medical school with the number of people who were on A team but didn't have many televised games yet and decided to quit playing or something like that. It's not even a parallel situation. The right one would be comparing the hordes of Koreans who try to become progamers to the hordes of students that try to get into medical school but don't succeed (most people drop the premed program of study because they can't even handle the college courses, never mind the classes that they would take in medical school), mostly because of low grades or a low test score. Perhaps you could make the argument that the two things are different skill sets and thus cannot be compared a la apples to oranges, but what you're claiming now is just wrong. Ie. I know several friends who are in med school now who scored over 90 percentile on their MCATs and LOVE SC and play it religiously yet are absolutely horrendous. And btw, getting into a top tier MFA Creative Writing program is literally 10x harder than getting into a top tier medical school by the acceptance/rejection ratio.
acceptance/rejection ratio isn't the whole story, since you have to see what kinds of students are applying. And most people that know for a fact that they won't be accepted don't bother applying.
Your little anecdote proves nothing, nor does your affirmative statement. Who cares if they play sc religiously? Playing something for fun is vastly different from playing something as your job, which you get paid for.
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On December 29 2009 03:26 GreEny K wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:21 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:13 GreEny K wrote:But isn't that the same thing idrA did when he was in US? He just played all day or am I wrong? That is just what I hear and it seems logical to me..
Anyway, what's going on with ret? How is it his fault that the koreans don't want to play him, they don't think they should waste their time playing him because they are better yet they want to play REAL pros and learn from them... just doesn't make sense to me how they think. I want to get better so ima play better people but I dont want to give a worse player that same chance... Just stupid. One last thing, how the hell DID IdrA get on CJ, I never heard that story. And for people who think he can put in a good word for ret and get him over to CJ rek said it perfectly, "they don't give a fuck what idra thinks."
Right. Hmmm I want to be a known progamer and get a chance to play a televised game. I want to improve myself and I am competing against hundreds of other players who have the exact goal as me. Should I help out some kid who I can't even communicate with and will hypothetically take my spot and limit my options if he turns out to be better than me or should I attempt to better myself by seeking out better opponents and learning from their experience and skills?
Yes, how stupid of them. -
Sarcasm doesn't work on the internet don't you know that? And if anything you just proved my point, try thinking about what you post. They are in the same situation that ret is in, they want help from teh better pros but receive it then they turn around and neglect to do the same for ret. If everyone had their mentality there would be a few good players who flew solo and did not help anyone else.
I dunno, I laid it on there pretty thick. It's hard to miss. And why don't you try thinking about what I posted. They're competing against one another, why would they want to help someone out that could take their spot? Everyone DOES have that mentality and why should the good ones help out the new players? The new players aren't going to be televised, whether or not they do well is irrelevant to the success of the team, unless they have the talent to actually be televised in which case they will be able to improve perfectly well without being babied. On December 29 2009 03:14 cz wrote:
I think becoming a progamer, definitely an A-team progamer, would be harder a less likely job to achieve with similar amounts of dedication and work ethic.
Think about it this way: There are two 15-year-old kids, both know nothing about progaming and medicine. One is told he is going to become a progamer, the other is told he is going to become a doctor. They both want to become what they are told to become. Who has the higher LIKELIHOOD of becoming the profession they are told/want to become?
Becoming a doctor is just a higher probability field. If you put in the work, and there is a ton of it over a long period of time, you will make it. I don't think the same is true for becoming a progamer. There are too many people also putting in the work that you have to be better than. Becoming an A-team progamer would be comparable to becoming a neurosurgeon or an anesthesiologist, who study the most and get paid the most. You're comparing all doctors with the best progamers when it should be all doctors and all progamers/the top doctors and the top progamers, assuming that the parallel is valid in the first place. But really good pros DO help out their teammates, which is why the people who are being helped should follow that same mentality and help foreigners instead of shunning them.
You know, something interesting to see is Flash's TLFE.
He mentions in there that Nada never helped him out because it was very difficult to ask a senior progamer for games. He did say that pepe and others took the initiative to help him on their own though.
So it shows that this is obviously not racism (as Ret said), it's just the culture of Koreans. Even a prodigy like Flash, who'd been on another team, and already made a splash in amateur tournies etc, couldn't get no attention from the senior players. And the reason a few players had mercy on him and helped him out probably had a lot to do with Flash being able to speak with them AND the fact that he was already a prodigy at that time. And with all that, only the lowest of B-teamers gave him a chance.
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On December 29 2009 03:27 ghostWriter wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:24 StorkHwaiting wrote:On December 29 2009 03:18 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:10 1984 wrote:On December 29 2009 02:59 ghostWriter wrote:
Really Chill? You agree with that moron?
It might be hard to make a name for yourself in progaming, but there is no way that progaming is even close to being as competitive as medicine is. Ok, I really hope you're not mentally deficient, otherwise it's pointless to continue. Drop-out rate at medical schools is less than 10%, actually 10% was a major concern somewhere so it's usually even lower (you can google it). And then compare it to hordes of koreans who try to become progamers but very few of them succeed. Right except that medical schools weed out candidates based on whether or not they think that people will succeed. They also go out of their way to make sure that the people who want to go to medical school actually have a passion for it. This less than 10% comes from the people who claimed to have a passion for medicine AND showed that they have the ability to learn and keep up with the material during their college years. The 10% would be comparing the number of people who dropped out of medical school with the number of people who were on A team but didn't have many televised games yet and decided to quit playing or something like that. It's not even a parallel situation. The right one would be comparing the hordes of Koreans who try to become progamers to the hordes of students that try to get into medical school but don't succeed (most people drop the premed program of study because they can't even handle the college courses, never mind the classes that they would take in medical school), mostly because of low grades or a low test score. Perhaps you could make the argument that the two things are different skill sets and thus cannot be compared a la apples to oranges, but what you're claiming now is just wrong. Ie. I know several friends who are in med school now who scored over 90 percentile on their MCATs and LOVE SC and play it religiously yet are absolutely horrendous. And btw, getting into a top tier MFA Creative Writing program is literally 10x harder than getting into a top tier medical school by the acceptance/rejection ratio. acceptance/rejection ratio isn't the whole story, since you have to see what kinds of students are applying. And most people that know for a fact that they won't be accepted don't bother applying. Your little anecdote proves nothing, nor does your affirmative statement. Who cares if they play sc religiously? Playing something for fun is vastly different from playing something as your job, which you get paid for.
So you think being a doctor is easier than getting on the New York Times Bestseller list with an original work of fiction?
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On December 29 2009 03:30 StorkHwaiting wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:27 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:24 StorkHwaiting wrote:On December 29 2009 03:18 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:10 1984 wrote:On December 29 2009 02:59 ghostWriter wrote:
Really Chill? You agree with that moron?
It might be hard to make a name for yourself in progaming, but there is no way that progaming is even close to being as competitive as medicine is. Ok, I really hope you're not mentally deficient, otherwise it's pointless to continue. Drop-out rate at medical schools is less than 10%, actually 10% was a major concern somewhere so it's usually even lower (you can google it). And then compare it to hordes of koreans who try to become progamers but very few of them succeed. Right except that medical schools weed out candidates based on whether or not they think that people will succeed. They also go out of their way to make sure that the people who want to go to medical school actually have a passion for it. This less than 10% comes from the people who claimed to have a passion for medicine AND showed that they have the ability to learn and keep up with the material during their college years. The 10% would be comparing the number of people who dropped out of medical school with the number of people who were on A team but didn't have many televised games yet and decided to quit playing or something like that. It's not even a parallel situation. The right one would be comparing the hordes of Koreans who try to become progamers to the hordes of students that try to get into medical school but don't succeed (most people drop the premed program of study because they can't even handle the college courses, never mind the classes that they would take in medical school), mostly because of low grades or a low test score. Perhaps you could make the argument that the two things are different skill sets and thus cannot be compared a la apples to oranges, but what you're claiming now is just wrong. Ie. I know several friends who are in med school now who scored over 90 percentile on their MCATs and LOVE SC and play it religiously yet are absolutely horrendous. And btw, getting into a top tier MFA Creative Writing program is literally 10x harder than getting into a top tier medical school by the acceptance/rejection ratio. acceptance/rejection ratio isn't the whole story, since you have to see what kinds of students are applying. And most people that know for a fact that they won't be accepted don't bother applying. Your little anecdote proves nothing, nor does your affirmative statement. Who cares if they play sc religiously? Playing something for fun is vastly different from playing something as your job, which you get paid for. So you think being a doctor is easier than getting on the New York Times Bestseller list with an original work of fiction?
So you think that getting on the New York Times Bestseller list with an original work of fiction is easier than creating a new method for a surgical procedure?
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On December 29 2009 03:30 StorkHwaiting wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:27 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:24 StorkHwaiting wrote:On December 29 2009 03:18 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:10 1984 wrote:On December 29 2009 02:59 ghostWriter wrote:
Really Chill? You agree with that moron?
It might be hard to make a name for yourself in progaming, but there is no way that progaming is even close to being as competitive as medicine is. Ok, I really hope you're not mentally deficient, otherwise it's pointless to continue. Drop-out rate at medical schools is less than 10%, actually 10% was a major concern somewhere so it's usually even lower (you can google it). And then compare it to hordes of koreans who try to become progamers but very few of them succeed. Right except that medical schools weed out candidates based on whether or not they think that people will succeed. They also go out of their way to make sure that the people who want to go to medical school actually have a passion for it. This less than 10% comes from the people who claimed to have a passion for medicine AND showed that they have the ability to learn and keep up with the material during their college years. The 10% would be comparing the number of people who dropped out of medical school with the number of people who were on A team but didn't have many televised games yet and decided to quit playing or something like that. It's not even a parallel situation. The right one would be comparing the hordes of Koreans who try to become progamers to the hordes of students that try to get into medical school but don't succeed (most people drop the premed program of study because they can't even handle the college courses, never mind the classes that they would take in medical school), mostly because of low grades or a low test score. Perhaps you could make the argument that the two things are different skill sets and thus cannot be compared a la apples to oranges, but what you're claiming now is just wrong. Ie. I know several friends who are in med school now who scored over 90 percentile on their MCATs and LOVE SC and play it religiously yet are absolutely horrendous. And btw, getting into a top tier MFA Creative Writing program is literally 10x harder than getting into a top tier medical school by the acceptance/rejection ratio. acceptance/rejection ratio isn't the whole story, since you have to see what kinds of students are applying. And most people that know for a fact that they won't be accepted don't bother applying. Your little anecdote proves nothing, nor does your affirmative statement. Who cares if they play sc religiously? Playing something for fun is vastly different from playing something as your job, which you get paid for. So you think being a doctor is easier than getting on the New York Times Bestseller list with an original work of fiction?
Just stop arguing with him, ive given up on it. He seems pretty hell-bent on being right and not accepting any other view.
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Thanks, insightful and an eye opener!
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becoming a doctor isn't that bad -.- once you get into med school you are pretty much done as long as you can grind it out and getting into med school isn't too bad as long as you have focussed during undergrad
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On December 29 2009 03:34 ghostWriter wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:30 StorkHwaiting wrote:On December 29 2009 03:27 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:24 StorkHwaiting wrote:On December 29 2009 03:18 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:10 1984 wrote:On December 29 2009 02:59 ghostWriter wrote:
Really Chill? You agree with that moron?
It might be hard to make a name for yourself in progaming, but there is no way that progaming is even close to being as competitive as medicine is. Ok, I really hope you're not mentally deficient, otherwise it's pointless to continue. Drop-out rate at medical schools is less than 10%, actually 10% was a major concern somewhere so it's usually even lower (you can google it). And then compare it to hordes of koreans who try to become progamers but very few of them succeed. Right except that medical schools weed out candidates based on whether or not they think that people will succeed. They also go out of their way to make sure that the people who want to go to medical school actually have a passion for it. This less than 10% comes from the people who claimed to have a passion for medicine AND showed that they have the ability to learn and keep up with the material during their college years. The 10% would be comparing the number of people who dropped out of medical school with the number of people who were on A team but didn't have many televised games yet and decided to quit playing or something like that. It's not even a parallel situation. The right one would be comparing the hordes of Koreans who try to become progamers to the hordes of students that try to get into medical school but don't succeed (most people drop the premed program of study because they can't even handle the college courses, never mind the classes that they would take in medical school), mostly because of low grades or a low test score. Perhaps you could make the argument that the two things are different skill sets and thus cannot be compared a la apples to oranges, but what you're claiming now is just wrong. Ie. I know several friends who are in med school now who scored over 90 percentile on their MCATs and LOVE SC and play it religiously yet are absolutely horrendous. And btw, getting into a top tier MFA Creative Writing program is literally 10x harder than getting into a top tier medical school by the acceptance/rejection ratio. acceptance/rejection ratio isn't the whole story, since you have to see what kinds of students are applying. And most people that know for a fact that they won't be accepted don't bother applying. Your little anecdote proves nothing, nor does your affirmative statement. Who cares if they play sc religiously? Playing something for fun is vastly different from playing something as your job, which you get paid for. So you think being a doctor is easier than getting on the New York Times Bestseller list with an original work of fiction? So you think that getting on the New York Times Bestseller list with an original work of fiction is easier than creating a new method for a surgical procedure?
Lol. You must not know much about writing. You need to make the NYT's to even quit your day job to become a writer. You made a fail analogy. NYT's is not the pinnacle. It's a standard. That's what you gotta do to even come close to seeing the bank that your average doctor gets.
Average book advance nets you maybe 10-15K, maybe 25K if you're in the literary genre.
TBH though, I'm just trolling you. You need to realize how dumb your argument is and let it go.
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On December 29 2009 03:35 GreEny K wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:30 StorkHwaiting wrote:On December 29 2009 03:27 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:24 StorkHwaiting wrote:On December 29 2009 03:18 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:10 1984 wrote:On December 29 2009 02:59 ghostWriter wrote:
Really Chill? You agree with that moron?
It might be hard to make a name for yourself in progaming, but there is no way that progaming is even close to being as competitive as medicine is. Ok, I really hope you're not mentally deficient, otherwise it's pointless to continue. Drop-out rate at medical schools is less than 10%, actually 10% was a major concern somewhere so it's usually even lower (you can google it). And then compare it to hordes of koreans who try to become progamers but very few of them succeed. Right except that medical schools weed out candidates based on whether or not they think that people will succeed. They also go out of their way to make sure that the people who want to go to medical school actually have a passion for it. This less than 10% comes from the people who claimed to have a passion for medicine AND showed that they have the ability to learn and keep up with the material during their college years. The 10% would be comparing the number of people who dropped out of medical school with the number of people who were on A team but didn't have many televised games yet and decided to quit playing or something like that. It's not even a parallel situation. The right one would be comparing the hordes of Koreans who try to become progamers to the hordes of students that try to get into medical school but don't succeed (most people drop the premed program of study because they can't even handle the college courses, never mind the classes that they would take in medical school), mostly because of low grades or a low test score. Perhaps you could make the argument that the two things are different skill sets and thus cannot be compared a la apples to oranges, but what you're claiming now is just wrong. Ie. I know several friends who are in med school now who scored over 90 percentile on their MCATs and LOVE SC and play it religiously yet are absolutely horrendous. And btw, getting into a top tier MFA Creative Writing program is literally 10x harder than getting into a top tier medical school by the acceptance/rejection ratio. acceptance/rejection ratio isn't the whole story, since you have to see what kinds of students are applying. And most people that know for a fact that they won't be accepted don't bother applying. Your little anecdote proves nothing, nor does your affirmative statement. Who cares if they play sc religiously? Playing something for fun is vastly different from playing something as your job, which you get paid for. So you think being a doctor is easier than getting on the New York Times Bestseller list with an original work of fiction? Just stop arguing with him, ive given up on it. He seems pretty hell-bent on being right and not accepting any other view.
This. >_>
Especially considering that being a doctor is hard more so due to the monopolistic field and barrier for entry via med-school than the talent needed for becoming a doctor.
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I'm not considering B level progamers when I talk about this. Maybe that's the point of confusion. But talking about how hard your life is doing residencies for 80 hours is really irrelevant. What does that have to do with talent? Yeah, it sucks, and yeah, most people won't want to do that. But again, nothing to do with talent. The talent I see involved with being a doctor is simply having a good memory. How much your life sucks doing residency or having to endure the boredom of memorizing stuff is really irrelevant.. I already said it requires more effort (indeed it requires a ton of effort).
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I am pretty sure 80% of the people have the intelligence to become a doctor. How is it hard? You have to memorize a ton of stuff. But it's light on math. Yeah it will take a lot of hours of studying. But most people could spend the hours and do it.
But yeah you need to be both a progamer and a doctor to have a valid opinion on this.
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On December 29 2009 03:35 GreEny K wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2009 03:30 StorkHwaiting wrote:On December 29 2009 03:27 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:24 StorkHwaiting wrote:On December 29 2009 03:18 ghostWriter wrote:On December 29 2009 03:10 1984 wrote:On December 29 2009 02:59 ghostWriter wrote:
Really Chill? You agree with that moron?
It might be hard to make a name for yourself in progaming, but there is no way that progaming is even close to being as competitive as medicine is. Ok, I really hope you're not mentally deficient, otherwise it's pointless to continue. Drop-out rate at medical schools is less than 10%, actually 10% was a major concern somewhere so it's usually even lower (you can google it). And then compare it to hordes of koreans who try to become progamers but very few of them succeed. Right except that medical schools weed out candidates based on whether or not they think that people will succeed. They also go out of their way to make sure that the people who want to go to medical school actually have a passion for it. This less than 10% comes from the people who claimed to have a passion for medicine AND showed that they have the ability to learn and keep up with the material during their college years. The 10% would be comparing the number of people who dropped out of medical school with the number of people who were on A team but didn't have many televised games yet and decided to quit playing or something like that. It's not even a parallel situation. The right one would be comparing the hordes of Koreans who try to become progamers to the hordes of students that try to get into medical school but don't succeed (most people drop the premed program of study because they can't even handle the college courses, never mind the classes that they would take in medical school), mostly because of low grades or a low test score. Perhaps you could make the argument that the two things are different skill sets and thus cannot be compared a la apples to oranges, but what you're claiming now is just wrong. Ie. I know several friends who are in med school now who scored over 90 percentile on their MCATs and LOVE SC and play it religiously yet are absolutely horrendous. And btw, getting into a top tier MFA Creative Writing program is literally 10x harder than getting into a top tier medical school by the acceptance/rejection ratio. acceptance/rejection ratio isn't the whole story, since you have to see what kinds of students are applying. And most people that know for a fact that they won't be accepted don't bother applying. Your little anecdote proves nothing, nor does your affirmative statement. Who cares if they play sc religiously? Playing something for fun is vastly different from playing something as your job, which you get paid for. So you think being a doctor is easier than getting on the New York Times Bestseller list with an original work of fiction? Just stop arguing with him, ive given up on it. He seems pretty hell-bent on being right and not accepting any other view.
Yes because you not being a progamer nor a doctor gives you the ability to make qualitative judgments on both careers.
On December 29 2009 03:42 errol1001 wrote:
I'm not considering B level progamers when I talk about this. Maybe that's the point of confusion. But talking about how hard your life is doing residencies for 80 hours is really irrelevant. What does that have to do with talent? Yeah, it sucks, and yeah, most people won't want to do that. But again, nothing to do with talent. The talent I see involved with being a doctor is simply having a good memory. How much your life sucks doing residency or having to endure the boredom of memorizing stuff is really irrelevant.. I already said it requires more effort (indeed it requires a ton of effort).
B level progamers are progamers too and you can't just discount them. The point about residencies was just to point out that the average doctor puts in many more hours than the average progamer into his profession. And what does talent have to do with progaming? For medicine, it's about problem solving, finding out what is actually wrong with the patient and curing them. Progaming is mostly about doing the same things over and over again, learning the counters to different build orders for different maps. Where's the talent in knowing that 12hatch is better than 12pool? This kind of knowledge comes from hours of playing games, repeating the same build orders over and over again to perfect them and seeing what counters them and what doesn't.
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EPT
